Ilunga

Jump out of a plane from 25,000 feet with out a parachute and land in some catching nets ? No probs for Luke Aikins

If you have presented your arguments in a rational logical manner and they are not accepted, insulting the other does not change anything. It will only compound the divide. I have always known, and the events of the last few years of my life, have really reinforced the fact that the only thing we can take to the grave with us is being true to who we are. Being true to myself is treating others the way I wish to be treated and treating those less fortunate than me with compassion and empathy. Shit, treat everyone with compassion and empathy, especially those you don't agree with. You're a good person at heart. Like me you are passionate about what you believe in, I respect that, even if we don't agree on somethings. I believe we agree on the most important thing of all, that people everywhere should respect each other.

Why ? I feel passionately about the injustice not just visited upon the Isreali and Palestinian people but all injustice everywhere. I never feel the urge to insult or belittle others just because they don't agree with me. First off that just hurts me more than it hurts them. Secondly how do you get people to respect your beliefs if you insult them. Thirdly as JJR noted " Insults are the arguments employed by those who are in the wrong "

You, as I have always treated others the way you want to be treated yourself, with dignity and respect. We don't agree all the time however I have so much respect for you, you have the one essential quality I look for in a person, a good heart.

The IDF might not be a terrorist organisation however they support Isreali settlers who commit acts of terror. Don't believe me, how about Israel's staunchest ally, the US state department. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/sharpened-censure-us-calls-suspected-israeli-settler-attack-terrorism-2023-08-06/ Or maybe former Isreali defence minister Benny Ganz " We are faced with the evolution of a dangerous Jewish nationalist terrorism "

Why do you believe extra terrestrial life avoids contact with us ? If I was a member of a rational, logical species, I would take one look at us, hit the warp drive, and get the fuck out of this solar system.

I don't trust social media sources much myself. Even conventional media, one has to have their bullshit detectors on full alert. This seems pretty definitive. I don't kinda get how people can defend a regime that has openly admitted that they are oppressing another group of people. Of course this does not excuse or give them the right to use violence against the Isrealis, that just continues the circle of hatred and in the case of the October the 7th attacks, many of the people they tortured and killed were sympathetic to the Palestinians cause. As has been noted, most of the victims of this forever conflict have been innocent of anything, except for being an Isreali or a Palestinian. I so fuckin hate nationalism. This conflict literally would not exist if we didn't divide ourselves into disparate groups/ societies. People talk about being a " proud " insert whatever country you would like to name. I am not even a proud human being. We continually kill each other in pointless wars. We are trashing the very planet we live on. It shames me the legacy we are leaving for my son's generation, and future generations. The greed, 50 percent of the wealth is held by 1 percent of the population. So much for us to be ashamed of at a fundamental level.

He, Netanyahu, sure is admitting something brother " I am proud I blocked a Palestinian state " https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/pm-im-proud-i-blocked-a-palestinian-state-looking-at-gaza-everyone-sees-what-would-have-happened/ And maybe, very probably, if there was a Palestinian state, Hamas wouldn't have the backing of the Palestinian people, and the October the 7th attack would not have happened.

"Every generation blames the one before And all of their frustrations, come beating at your door I know that I'm a prisoner to all that my father held so dear I know that I'm a hostage to all his hopes and fears I wish I could have told him in the living years You say that you don't see it He says it's perfect sense You just can't get agreement In the present tense We all talk a different language Talking in defence So we open up a quarrel Between the present and the past We only sacrifice the future It's the bitterness that lasts "

Thanks for the kind words my friend. Steph has a presence, a kind of " bottled energy/drive ". She reminds me of me, when people gave me the nickname, intense dave. Was telling my oldest friend and Stephs dad your comments about her technique. I gave her a T- shirt I had printed up, I have one as well All you have ever wanted is on the other side of fear Yes that table was a bonus, we had standing tickets, however we knew the guys running security, they promised us if people didn't show up or got kicked out we would get their seats. Total bonus they were ringside. Stoked to hear about your friends son. We were talking about the fact that the quality of boxing fights isn't what it used to be, the talent pool is being diluted by kids choosing MMA. There was a couple of cracking MMA fights last night. My old body was wincing at the impacts, especially the the leg kicks. I believe that your friends son " indomitable spirit" or fire and drive will take him further than talent alone. It's when you combine the both that you get that very rare individual who stands so high above the rest in their chosen endeavour. Tell your friends son from intense dave, if he gives 100 percent, believes in himself 100 percent, he can achieve anything he puts his mind to. In regards to BJJ, I posted up Carlos Gracie's 12 commandments in a reply to a post of yours on the old board. Tell him about those as well. Hope you have a wonderful Saturnalia and a fantastic 2024, lots of good health and happiness for you and those you love. You are always in my thoughts.

I respect your compassion for the Palestinian people though I am not much for propaganda games. I have seen enough evidence to make me believe Hamas fighters did horrendous things on October the 7th and during the days after. Families lost people they love to brutal acts of violence. That to me is what the matters the most, though I feel for all the Isreali families that lost loved ones in that attack. I also feel the same way for innocent Palestinian people who have lost loved ones. What I find absolutely mindboggling is the fact that people in this thread don't accept the fact that Isreal practices arpartheid. The international community states this, humanitarian bodies both inside and outside of Isreal say this, many prominent Isrealis, and Isrealis themselves say this. The fact that arpartheid exists on this planet in the 21st century illustrates the fact we are going backwards. How can any civilised person accept that one group of people can treat another group of people like second class people ? What if you guys were born and raised in Gaza ? How would you feel ? What if you lived in the west bank ? How would you feel when your land is being stolen from you ? If your family was burned alive in a settler attack.

You are so right @bishopshodan Stupid species On that side note Steph was so clinical. Knocked her opponent down in the first, twice in the second and a TKO in the third. No chicken wings tonight, kept her elbows closer to her body. Bunch of dudes who had paid a fortune for a ringside table got into a punch on just before her fight. They got kicked out and we got their table. Stephanie Lee Cutting is now an Australasian Champ. Fuckin good times.

First thank you for the detailed reply. I should have been more specific, innocent women and children. As for woman with a gun, was just stat checking and came up with The IDF has the highest percentage of women in their armed forces, 34 percent. It used to be only men were stupid enough to fight pointless wars over bits of land, now women are doing it to. And it is more likely, ratio wise, percentage of population, to be an Isreali women. Personally speaking I would take wounds before I would kill a women. I would go to great lengths not to even hit a woman. I was once " glassed " by a women when I was fighting with her partner, he started the fight, I did not retaliate against her. I had to get ten stitches, head wounds piss out blood. Wether or not you believe the issue of arpartheid is relevant or not to Gaza, and it is, don't you believe that fact that arpartheid exists on our planet in the 21st century is wrong ? Don't you think this burns in the heart of all Palestinians ? I don't bother with social media either, the videos I am referring to were posted in this thread. Showing sympathy to people who are victims of this war on both sides indicates what sort of person you are. It might not help them however it gives one an insight into your character. As polls are indicating Isreals response is engendering more support for Hamas and just as importantly more condemnation from the civilised world. So to effectively wipe out Hamas, most of the 2.5 million people of Gaza have to be killed, would you be happy with that ? At what line do we draw a ratio of killing civilians, women and children, to killing actual terrorists, 1- 1, 2- 1, 10 - 1, ? 1- 1 is too many IMO. Macro, Micro my example holds the same weight. What if those kids had guns and rocket launchers and refused to let you hand them over to the other town. Don't you believe the majority of Palestinians are trying to be Neutral ? There isn't any real chance for them to get out of the way. Isreal states Hamas has 30,000 members https://apnews.com/article/hamas-gaza-palestinian-authority-israel-war-ed7018dbaae09b81513daf3bda38109a I have read other reports stating 20 - 25,000, so your figure of 50,000 is way off the mark. So over 1,000 Isrealis being killed in the October the 7th attack is an injustice, and it is, yet thousands of Palestinians who are not members off Hamas who have been killed since Isreal has attacked Gaza is not an injustice ? Subjectively speaking ? As I have already stated I have seen no compassion for the thousands of innocent Palestinian victims from most of the regular posters. Compassion seems to be a one way street in this thread apart from @Super19, though I wish he would express empathy and compassion for the Isreali victims as I have. What I know for a fact is that while the majority of people think like you, and are able to rationalise the deaths of innocent people, our species will continue to fight these pointless wars/ conflicts. Killing, injuring and maiming each other, for fuckin stupid reasons.

I understand what you are saying, what I am pointing out is causation not just effect. You are only discussing the effects not wanting to deal with the causation. The only thing that really offends me is injustice. In some of your posts you seem to justify injustice. There is no justification for the killing of women and children full stop... Ever ! Posters here posting videos of some Palestinian kids saying horrible things about the Isrealis as if they represent all Palestinians. Same with the video of the Isreali kids singing a hateful song about the Palestinians. I have yet to see any of the regular posters expression compassion for the innocent Palestinian victims. And no they are not all Hamas supporters. As I have posted in the past, some Palestinians have protested against Hamas risking their lives in doing so. If you can't see how what Isreal is doing, is and will create more extremists like Hamas in the future then respectfully I don't know what to say to you. Just saying, a few radical kids in your town killed some people, did some terrible things to people in another town,would you be okay with people from that town blowing the shit out of your town, and killing people in your town, that had nothing to do with hurting the other town ?

Seriously ? You don't know why I am bringing up the fact that the Palestinian people are victims of arpartheid, and what that means in the context of this dispute that has been going on for 80 odd years. You talk about people attacking people, Isreali settlers and armed forces have been attacking and killing Palestinians for decades. The settlers even dress up as " soldiers " beating, urinating on them, sexually them. https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231020-israel-soldiers-and-settlers-blindfold-beat-urinate-sexually-assault-palestinian-activists-in-west-bank/ I could post dozens of articles that illustrate other events like this. Who is choosing violence here ? Probably don't deserve to die ? There is never a reason for killing women and children that have nothing to do with the conflict. Now here is the thing, put yourself in the Palestinian peoples shoes, after all this has happened to you, your land is slowly getting stolen you, how would you feel. I feel compassion and empathy for those people. They need a Mandela or Ghandi like figure to rally the international community behind them. Unfortunately ATM they are stuck with really bad examples of human beings as their leaders. Was listening to an interview with a guy, Josh Paul, from the US state department that was responsible for military aid to other countries. He quit in protest not long after the October 7th attacks because he feels Isreal in not held to the same account as other nations in regards to receiving US military aid. He pointed out they are the occupying power and how there is lot more bipartisan support for Isreal as an occupying power than there now is for Ukraine who is being occupied. https://abcnews.go.com/US/former-state-department-official-explains-resigned-us-military/story?id=104173231 There is basically two different sets of rules/conditions for US military aid to other countries, Isreals, and everyone else's. Throwing around euphemisms like life isn't fair ? Even though I am going through the worst time of my life, my life is fair compared to the families of the Isreali and Palestinian victims.

You are one of, if not the most intelligent poster on this board. The breadth of your knowledge is amazing my friend. More importantly you have so much compassion and empathy. On a side note. Steph won her last 2 fights. Going to watch her fight for an Australasian title tonight. She has stepped up to 63kg because the girl that holds the 58kg Aussie title has been dodging her.

Very brave thoughts sitting in your safe country, where it's a safe environment to raise your family. You haven't got people with guns threatening you. Nobody is stealing your land from you. Where it's a struggle just to raise your family. Where even members of the people who are oppressing you state they an arpartheid regime. http://www.btselem.org/publications/fulltext/202101_this_is_apartheid Ex Isreali PM's and other prominent Isrealis https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/05/amnesty-israel-apartheid-israeli-politicians-agree Former Mossad chief https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/sep/06/israel-imposing-apartheid-on-palestinians-says-former-mossad-chief I could go on if you want. Who cares about this right ? The international community has turned a blind eye to this for decades. Do you care about the fact that arpartheid still exists in the 21st century ? I have already quoted the man, an Israeli, whose work at the Nuremberg war trials formed the basis for international law, Ben Ferenc " You cannot kill an entrenched ideology with a gun " " You have to teach compassion and tolerance at a young age " And just because it's seems mandatory to state the obvious, I condemn Hamas, their ideology, and the way the want to initiate change. They are terror organisation that should be neutralized. The events on October the 7th horrified me. I am also horrified at the number of Palestinian women and children that have been killed since those attacks. I am also saddened by the fact that people on this board that I thought were good people seem to think that the killing of women and children is justified. People like this are exactly why feuds and circles of hatred continue to exist on this planet.

Thanks for hosting a great game SV. I wish I could have participated more however I think I know why the SK took me out. I was the only one to question her in round one. Thanks to all my mafia team mates and thanks to every one else. I hope you all have a wonderful Christmas with your families and a fantastic 2024. Cherish the little things my friends..... .

For starters where did I ask anyone to do anything in that post ? As for what we did to or indigenous people that was in cololainism. Captain Cook didn't shoot people in the name of God. You would have been better off pointing out our stolen generations, though the indigenous stolen generation was more due to racism, not acting in the name of a God. My stolen generation, the one I am a member of was religiously motivated. As I stated neither of our countries have gone to war in the name of a god. As for what you highlighted, are you calling me a liar ? I admit I grew up with religious people around me, most of them were/ are really good people. Frankly what I ask people to do in many of posts is what I do, treat others the way I want to be treated and treat those less fortunate with compassion and empathy.

I have explained several times OP. Iran had a democratically elected government that was overthrown by a CIA and British backed coup. That democratically elected government was ahead of it's time, giving women rights they didn't have in our countries until 20 years later. Then in the 90's when Iran experienced the Tehran Spring under the reformist government of Mohammad Khatami, it was Bush's axis of evil comments that allowed the hardliners to put the focus back on the west. All this is easy to research. As for Kim Jong Un, I have no fear of him using nukes on us here in Aus. I don't believe he is crazy enough to use them against the US either. He leads a great life as a dictator of his country.

How do you know where you are going if you don't know where you have been. Along with Hamas being neutralized, Isreals illegal settlements have to stop as well. That land has to be given back, especially the farmland. That's one of the few resources the Palestinians have. As I have pointed out my friend, Isrealis and Palestinians are basically blood brothers, they share the same genetic heritage. I am talking about a future where both sides recognise this.

It doesn't work because there are too many people that won't let it work. Apathy and despair. Where did I state Isrealis are not allowed in the west bank ? If they acquire the land by legal means people can live wherever they want. Blah blah blah Iran boogey man. The boogey man western interventionism created and perpetuates.

It would be place where everyone is equal. Screw governments, they're mostly corrupt, as is the case with Isreals government, and the series of governing bodies the Palestinians have been forced to live with. Like the Athenians I believe a sortition to be a better democratic tool than elections. They had specially built allotment machines called kleroteria. They were used to avoid corrupt practices used by oligarchs to buy their way into power. As for Isreals " right " to occupy the west bank, the international community doesn't believe this, they deem it against international law. As my post above yours indicates, international/ humanitarian law was founded on the work Ben Ferenc and his fellow prosecutor did at the Nuremberg war trials. And again for the third time I will post this. Please read it. http://www.btselem.org/publications/summaries/200205_land_grab Doest seem like justice is being served does it.

@Optimist Prime Just watched Prosecuting Evil, the story of Ben Ferenc. The write up for the program describes him as " one of the holocausts most heroic figures " He was one of the 2 chief prosecutors at the Nuremberg trials. This is a must see program. Even though he exposed so many of the mass murderers he took no joy in their deaths. Most of the papers/ records he discovered and used to convict these people didn't use the word murder, they used the word exterminate. The work he and his fellow prosecutor did laid the groundwork for international law. The work he went on to do in the States afterwards is also legendary. Bens life is truly an example of a person being a hero. A true humanitarian. You cannot kill an entrenched ideology with a gun " " You have to teach compassion and tolerance at a young age " Ben Ferenc