Myers… does he get traded?

[RWMc1]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

I'd imagine they'd have something lined up yes, hence my points about guys like Pysyk and Bear, or trades for Pesce, Peeke, Lyubushkin etc.

"Probably not. That helps make my point though. Our right side depth is our weakest position right now. That's why I believe that unless we have a replacement lined up already, I doubt we trade Myers."

This is my post that you originally quoted. So you pretend to dispute my point then reiterate it.

[tas]

1 minute ago, qwijjibo said:

Just like Matthews was definitely bolting for Arizona and PLD was definitely going to Montréal 

not like those things at all. both of those cases are 100% fan and media speculation with no basis.

both bear and canucks management are on record. not to mention the lengths they went to to trade for him in the first place, the fact that his wife is from here, he wants to live here, etc. 

[Jess]

Am I crazy for thinking that Myers might be better than Bear? Would seem weird to pay big money/assets to move Myers only to replace him with a guy who's no better.

[Coconuts]

Didn't make sense to qualify Bear, he wasn't worth his qualifying offer and he honestly doesn't have a whole lot of leverage between how last season went and his injury. He should make bottom pairing money, he hasn't earned more than that. Doesn't make sense for Canucks brass to throw more money than he's capable of negotiating at him just because they like him. 

I'm indifferent as to whether he comes back, but leaning more towards preferring we go with someone else. We have prospects and fringe guys who are already in the system who could likely perform whatever role Bear does for less, I'd rather give them a shot. Hell, some of them likely have more potential than Bear, who I peg as a bottom pairing guy. Your bottom pairing is where you have quite a bit of flex regarding what kind of player you want there, Bear isn't a need for this club. Could be an arrangement of convenience but I wouldn't give him more than a one year deal. 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Coconuts

[Ghostsof1915]

1 minute ago, -AJ- said:

Am I crazy for thinking that Myers might be better than Bear? Would seem weird to pay big money/assets to move Myers only to replace him with a guy who's no better.

Hands you a flak jacket for the incoming missiles headed your way.

[Coconuts]

4 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

Am I crazy for thinking that Myers might be better than Bear? Would seem weird to pay big money/assets to move Myers only to replace him with a guy who's no better.

Nope, Myers is a fringe top four guy who has a history of playing larger minutes and playing on both special teams. He brings a unique element of size and he's demonstrated a willingness to mix it up in scrums and play physical. He's not a terrible passer, his shot is rather hard, and he's already a known quantity and an established presence in the room. 

Myers at 6M isn't good, he's just not worth that and he gets flack largely because of his contract. Myers at say.. 2.5M is a lottttt more palatable and he'd likely get less grief. 

Myers is fine on your bottom pairing, you'd likely get fair value out of him as a vet. His play may not be top four level anymore but he could likely step up in a pinch. 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Coconuts

[Rekker]

6 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

I'm indifferent as to whether he comes back, but leaning more towards preferring we go with someone else.

Ya. I'd prefer someone with a legit role over Myers. Be it a physical shut down guy or PK, something. Myers really doesn't fit any one role well. All for a grand six million dollar cap hit. Ugg.  

[Alflives]

Just now, Rekker said:

Ya. I'd prefer someone with a legit role over Myers. Be it a physical shut down guy or PK, something. Myers really doesn't fit any one role well. All for a grand six million dollar cap hit. Ugg.  

Was that one of Benning’s biggest problems; he didn’t understand the importance of guys filling roles? Myers is fine, but not in the role Benning paid him to play. 

[Coconuts]

5 minutes ago, Rekker said:

Ya. I'd prefer someone with a legit role over Myers. Be it a physical shut down guy or PK, something. Myers really doesn't fit any one role well. All for a grand six million dollar cap hit. Ugg.  

There's space for generalists as well, most bottom pairing guys are players who have gaps somewhere in their game anyway. The stakes are lower on the bottom pairing as well, as these players generally play fewer minutes. 

It's also worth considering who you'd be playing him with, because roles matter on a pairing. 

As for the cap hit, it's better to just ride it out, this season is likely to be a transitional season anyway. Either we make the playoffs or land somewhere in no-man's land again. 

I'm not married to extending Myers but he does suffer from being a local whipping boy to some degree. 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Coconuts

[aGENT]

17 minutes ago, RWMc1 said:

"Probably not. That helps make my point though. Our right side depth is our weakest position right now. That's why I believe that unless we have a replacement lined up already, I doubt we trade Myers."

This is my post that you originally quoted. So you pretend to dispute my point then reiterate it.

My point was that it's relatively easy to shore that up. There's also upcoming waiver claims. There's very little actual obstacles to moving Myers, from a depth perspective.

[Rekker]

1 minute ago, Coconuts said:

There's space for generalists as well, most bottom pairing guys are players who have gaps somewhere in their game anyway. The stakes are lower on the bottom pairing as well, as these players generally play fewer minutes. 

It's also worth considering who you'd be playing him with, because roles matter on a pairing. 

As for the cap hit, it's better to just ride it out, this season is likely to be a transitional season anyway. Either we make the playoffs or land somewhere in no-man's land again. 

I still think addition by substraction with Myers. Maybe bottom pairing where he can be sheltered and then dealt at the deadline. I'm just done with him.

[Coconuts]

Just now, Rekker said:

I still think addition by substraction with Myers. Maybe bottom pairing where he can be sheltered and then dealt at the deadline. I'm just done with him.

Possibly, but I'm not interested in giving up assets to move out short term headaches because some folks are impatient. I'd rather hold on to picks and prospects, ride out the contract, and continue to grow our organizational depth via the draft. 

It's one year, I doubt he's going to make or break the season for the Canucks the way some folks say he will. 

[RWMc1]

3 minutes ago, aGENT said:

My point was that it's relatively easy to shore that up. There's also upcoming waiver claims. There's very little actual obstacles to moving Myers, from a depth perspective.

It's relatively easy to shore up the RHD position? Good to know.

[aGENT]

17 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

Am I crazy for thinking that Myers might be better than Bear? Would seem weird to pay big money/assets to move Myers only to replace him with a guy who's no better.

At this point, they're both probably 4B/5A D, albeit with vastly different tools/skill sets.

Myers has more size, harder shot, more offense but is also older, more expensive and has lower hockey IQ.

Bear's better at moving the puck, better defensively, higher IQ and should come in around $1-$1.5m dollars (and prorated potentially), younger etc. And while he's certainly not a long term answer, we know he can at least fill in next to Hughes (Myers can not).

[aGENT]

3 minutes ago, RWMc1 said:

It's relatively easy to shore up the RHD position? Good to know.

Depth RHD, absolutely.

[RWMc1]

10 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Depth RHD, absolutely.

Let's hope it's as easy as you say it is.

[madrigal77]

On 9/16/2023 at 3:38 PM, Coconuts said:

Re-sign 6x6M

Beginning is not GM anymore...

[aGENT]

5 minutes ago, RWMc1 said:

Let's hope it's as easy as you say it is.

It is, just look at our roster the last few years. Full of depth, bottom pair D, including RHD. Signed Schenn for near league min. Traded for Bear WITH retention for a measly 5th. Signed Irwin (can/has played RHD) this year for near league min. Added Johannsson and McWard for league min. Signed Burroughs for league min. Never mind all the guys on waivers/traded we didn't pick up.

That's just the last ~ year, just the Canucks. This happens with all 32 teams. Depth D are easy to find/acquire/develop. RH'd or otherwise. It's the top 4 RHD that are unicorns.

[Screw]

Makes no sense to trade him now.   If they miss the playoffs he would be a deadline darling for sure.

[RWMc1]

3 minutes ago, aGENT said:

It is, just look at our roster the last few years. Full of depth, bottom pair D, including RHD. Signed Schenn for near league min. Traded for Bear WITH retention for a measly 5th. Signed Irwin (can/has played RHD) this year for near league min. Added Johannsson and McWard for league min. Signed Burroughs for league min. Never mind all the guys on waivers/traded we didn't pick up.

That's just the last ~ year, just the Canucks. This happens with all 32 teams. Depth D are easy to find/acquire/develop. RH'd or otherwise. It's the top 4 RHD that are unicorns.

There was still almost a 5 minute a night difference between Schenn and Myers. We would still need to replace those minutes. Not only that but we would once again be relying on young players based on popularity. Rathbone all over again.

[Rekker]

45 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Possibly, but I'm not interested in giving up assets to move out short term

Absolutely, I'm dead against that as well. 

[aGENT]

7 minutes ago, RWMc1 said:

There was still almost a 5 minute a night difference between Schenn and Myers. We would still need to replace those minutes. Not only that but we would once again be relying on young players based on popularity. Rathbone all over again.

Hronek and Cole/Soucy are going to eat up the lion's share of those minutes. Myers will be playing in a reduced role. We've already replaced those minutes. All we need to do is replace 3rd pair minutes now. And again...PTO's like Pysyk, injured guys like Bear, guys on waivers (teams like Nashville may have to waive a guy like Carrier or Fabbro). There's also the possibility a Juulsen/Woo/Johansson/McWard "blows the doors off" at camp to be viable options there. Maybe we play Irwin on the right with a Wolanin/Irwin pair. We have literally tonnes of options to replace 3rd pair D minutes. It's not a concern.

Edited September 19, 2023 by aGENT

[RWMc1]

5 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Hronek and Cole/Soucy are going to eat up the lion's share of those minutes. Myers will be playing in a reduced role. We've already replaced those minutes. All we need to do is replace 3rd pair minutes now. And again...PTO's like Pysyk, injured guys like Bear, guys on waivers (teams like Nashville may have to waive a guy like Carrier or Fabbro). There's also the possibility a Juulsen/Woo/Johansson/McWard "blows the doors off" at camp to be viable options there. Maybe we play Irwin on the right with a Wolanin/Irwin pair. We have literally tonnes of options to replace 3rd pair D minutes. It's not a concern.

I still say that giving away a good asset in a position of weakness is a mistake. You already have guys playing on their weak side. A few injuries could compound our problems on both sides. At least we know that Myers can handle the physicality and can play 20 plus minutes a night if called upon.

 

 

[Win2024]

Jim Benning- the gift that keeps giving 

[aGENT]

3 minutes ago, RWMc1 said:

I still say that giving away a good asset in a position of weakness is a mistake. You already have guys playing on their weak side. A few injuries could compound our problems on both sides. At least we know that Myers can handle the physicality and can play 20 plus minutes a night if called upon.

 

 

Not if you sign a guy like Bear/Pysyk...pluck a solid young guy off waivers, or make a trade for a Pese/Peeke/Lyubushkin etc, etc, etc....

 

You don't need to be scared about losing Myers