(PGT) Canucks at Sharks

[Ballisticsports]

 

10 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

Do you factor in the human element at all?

 

Schedules, injuries, etc.? yes, they're playing .500 hockey right now but that happens at times....they've given themselves a bit of a cushion and can (will) adjust. Road trip wasn't a complete wash...playing back to backs in different cities isn't as easy as some here would pencil it in.

 

Not excuses - things that deplete a team at times. No team just sails through unscathed and without hitting a few bumps along the road. Petey being off is huge for this team but that won't last forever.

I would be ok if we never fell below 50% in 10 game intervals, and were able to increase % in other 10's

 

Old habits take time and so does acquiring the right mix of players

I heard the Canucks have been in on 50% of league trades(really)? goes to show how hard it is to move right now

The Canucks have on staff very good former players who can teach them habits to manage a long schedule 

 

As long as the effort is there, you cannot ask for more

[TheGuardian]

1 minute ago, Nucker67 said:

 

Kuzy will be back next game. Tocchet only scratched him last game because they beat SEA and he figured they were onto something, but then lost to the bottom feeding Sharks.

 

So, it's back to the drawing board for this team. Staples. 

 

1 minute ago, -dlc- said:

Game by game. The team doesn't pencil in wins and losses and we probably shouldn't either.

 

6 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

Do you factor in the human element at all?

 

Schedules, injuries, etc.? yes, they're playing .500 hockey right now but that happens at times....they've given themselves a bit of a cushion and can (will) adjust. Road trip wasn't a complete wash...playing back to backs in different cities isn't as easy as some here would pencil it in.

 

Not excuses - things that deplete a team at times. No team just sails through unscathed and without hitting a few bumps along the road. Petey being off is huge for this team but that won't last forever.

 

You were writing the team off in October but I think that's on you, not them. People trying to somehow prove their agenda are premature in doing so. Patience, then we'll really see where we're at. This team hasn't been a write off but sure, some here think we're not there yet. I think they have time to prove that they are. It could go either way and the past has jaded some so they just throw in the towel. I'm glad the team doesn't.

Possibly they are doing the best they can?

2 minutes ago, Nucker67 said:

 

Kuzy will be back next game. Tocchet only scratched him last game because they beat SEA and he figured they were onto something, but then lost to the bottom feeding Sharks.

 

So, it's back to the drawing board for this team. Staples. 

I think Kuzmenko got the shaft because that line has been a sieve. He gets the blame for the goals against. That and Tocchet doesn't want that kind of player, he wants a boards guy. 

1 minute ago, -dlc- said:

Game by game. The team doesn't pencil in wins and losses and we probably shouldn't either.

The odds makers kind of do that all the time, estimating who has not only the best chance of winning but they alos have to add odds of winning to entice bettors to bet on perceived losers. They pay less for favoured teams. Being pros at it there is something to being good at figuring out winners and losers.

 

Time after time I hear "Staples" from Tocchet I also hear "playoff teams don't do ......" If Tocchets statements are to be taken seriously then he doesn't appear to believe this is a playoff team.

 

Kuzmenko could also be because this group is NOT his team, not the team he wants.

 

 

[Joe King]

23 minutes ago, Ballisticsports said:

One of those chickens, looks like a giraffe 

I think it's supposed to be Myers.

And the farmer is Patrik Allvin. 

Edited November 26, 2023 by Joe King

[Rip The Mesh]

1 hour ago, Nucker67 said:

 

When?  Only Petey beating I saw was when he was getting the Daniel Sedin treatment while in discussion with the opponent after the whistle.

 

Petey can lay out a nice hit once in a while, I must say, but they're usually hits he catches the opponents off guard with. Like that hit last night.

 

Petey needs to score.

Guess I watched a different game.  ---- https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/video/chaos-ensues-between-canucks-and-sharks-after-massive-blind-side-hit-on-pettersson/

Edited November 26, 2023 by Rip The Mesh

[Canuck You]

Shark attacks happen sometimes, Luckily we didn't lose a limb..still swimming high on the radar.

[nergish]

No guaranteed wins in this league!

Tough one to lose, but at least our powerplay looked downright magical at times.

Loved seeing Bieksa gush about it during the intermission.

 

Petey is obviously dealing with something, he looked timid and Bambi-legged like he's a Rookie again...

But Huggy and Hronek are absolutely dialed-in right now. I think we've seen enough of Fil now to say he's for real.

JT is a horse. I apologize for ever wanting to trade this guy away.

I hope the rest of the league is paying attention, there have been some truly awful takes regarding this guy over the last few years. He's a stud, and he's ours.

[-dlc-]

6 minutes ago, nergish said:

No guaranteed wins in this league!

Tough one to lose, but at least our powerplay looked downright magical at times.

Loved seeing Bieksa gush about it during the intermission.

 

Petey is obviously dealing with something, he looked timid and Bambi-legged like he's a Rookie again...

But Huggy and Hronek are absolutely dialed-in right now. I think we've seen enough of Fil now to say he's for real.

JT is a horse. I apologize for ever wanting to trade this guy away.

I hope the rest of the league is paying attention, there have been some truly awful takes regarding this guy over the last few years. He's a stud, and he's ours.

I, too, loved Juice's enthusiasm over our pp and the quick puck movement. It's SO noticeable to me....JT and Quinn being the main players in how they shift around out there and get different looks/angles. Petey used to use very subtle moves but he's clearly not "on" right now. Glad he was taking a few shots at least.

 

Re JT: I hope the rest of the members are paying attention and using how wrong they were about JT to adjust premature assessments moving forward. But some just move forward...on to the next target. Give this team some breathing room then see what we've truly got. Right now, we've seen both sides but you can't ignore that they ARE tired and a bit beat up. Depleted. Don't JUST assess them then, that's hardly fair.

 

Good points you've made! +

 

 

[Canadian_Kanga]

oof...

 

You can't win them all...

 

But there's some you should win.

 

Though...you can't win them all

 

*loop*

[Dr. Crossbar]

Not the end of the world but - like Cole said - because he knows - we need to get back into the win column asap. Good teams don't stay down for too long. 

 

We can't give up too much ground to the King's in the standings. Have to stay right with them.

 

I've said all season, we need to be winning most games when DeSmith plays. Those games will be the difference of getting into the playoffs. 

[JeremyCuddles]

1 hour ago, stawns said:

 

Whataboutism is crutch for the insecure, imo.  That said, I do see your point that Seattle is the team chasing them, so it does matter to a degree 

 

They're lucky that the Pacific isn't great beyond La and LV or else they'd be fighting "for" a wild card spot instead of fighting to stay "out" of a wild card spit 

The point is we are overreacting to a rough stretch when others are having just as rough a stretch. Gotta look over our shoulders for Seattle cause we have gone .500 over a tough stretch travel wise? They are doing worse than us. The season is 82 games. Not 10. We have 7 home games in the next 3 weeks. We are 7-1-1 at home this season. The year is filled with ebbs and flows. I don't think you press the panic button in November just like you don't plan the parade after our October. If this team is still playing middling hockey midway through December, then I'll start reaching for the panic button.

[stawns]

5 minutes ago, JeremyCuddles said:

The point is we are overreacting to a rough stretch when others are having just as rough a stretch. Gotta look over our shoulders for Seattle cause we have gone .500 over a tough stretch travel wise? They are doing worse than us. The season is 82 games. Not 10. We have 7 home games in the next 3 weeks. We are 7-1-1 at home this season. The year is filled with ebbs and flows. I don't think you press the panic button in November just like you don't plan the parade after our October. If this team is still playing middling hockey midway through December, then I'll start reaching for the panic button.

 

I disagree........I'm reacting to a return to a  style of play we've seen from this team consistently over the last 2.5 years.  And no one is hitting the panic button, just trying to have objective discussions with other Canuck fans without the getting shouted down for seeing things a little more objectively from fans who are obviously a little insecure about their team

[Dumb Nuck]

The sky is falling, it’s the end of the world, the seasons over……..

 

……..oops, sorry, thought I was on the Oilers forum.

[Miss Korea]

24 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

I, too, loved Juice's enthusiasm over our pp and the quick puck movement. It's SO noticeable to me....JT and Quinn being the main players in how they shift around out there and get different looks/angles. Petey used to use very subtle moves but he's clearly not "on" right now. Glad he was taking a few shots at least.

 

Re JT: I hope the rest of the members are paying attention and using how wrong they were about JT to adjust premature assessments moving forward. But some just move forward...on to the next target. Give this team some breathing room then see what we've truly got. Right now, we've seen both sides but you can't ignore that they ARE tired and a bit beat up. Depleted. Don't JUST assess them then, that's hardly fair.

 

Good points you've made! +

 

Well, you have an exceptionally unique perspective on Miller not usually seen on this forum.  Most of us wouldn't carry a "marry me!" poster to a game.

 

Miller drove me nuts last game, and he typically plays that way.  He is the personification of a double-edged sword.  Always wants the game on his stick.  Has the skillset and work ethic to be pretty good at it too.  But sometimes he is guilty of trying to do too much.  It gets him in penalty trouble or he just makes the wrong decision.  Last night he got one shot through on goal.  Why keep throwing clappers when you've already got 3 assists!??

[Goal_thecup]

10 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

I think it's a matter of giving the guy credit where it's due. When he ISN'T scoring, at least he's trying to make a difference. He's struggling and we need him on the scoresheet for sure. But how about we let go of the past a bit and see that these guys are playing more physical...Petey really isn't expected to and it's a nice surprise. Teams target him and so the fact that he doesn't shy away makes him slightly less vulnerable out there.

 

I'd like Myers to maybe throw a hit or two every now and then instead of playing back up goaltender. Can we just focus there?

I love having a PGT-after-a-loss-on-a-Sunday; many of the doom posters post from work, and are away from their computers.

There's a handful of entrails-gazers here who want to rant and spew their Brainiac Work; they think people give a Marchand about their ideas.

 

Ragging on Pettersson, coach should have done this or that.  Krikey, anybody can say bad things about anything; it is a matter of attitude.

I feel great today and I still love this team and everybody on it, prospects, coaches, Abby, management, heck, to me, even Frankie is ok to good.

 

Tuesday can't come soon enough; looking forward to a good tilt against perhaps the worst-named franchise in the league, the (Sitting) Ducks.

But for now, we have a couple days off, the team has a day off or so I hope, and then Coaches Tocchet, Foote, and Gonchar will get them moving.

 

Hope everybody has a great day, or at least a better day if you're suffering somehow, and Cheers Everyone!  GCG!

Connor Garland practicing to be on top of the opposition next game instead of under them like last game:

(3 times he was smothered and no call.)

 

[-dlc-]

16 minutes ago, Miss Korea said:

 

Well, you have an exceptionally unique perspective on Miller not usually seen on this forum.  *Most of us wouldn't carry a "marry me!" poster to a game.

 

Miller drove me nuts last game, and he typically plays that way.  He is the personification of a double-edged sword.  Always wants the game on his stick.  Has the skillset and work ethic to be pretty good at it too.  But sometimes he is guilty of trying to do too much.  It gets him in penalty trouble or he just makes the wrong decision.  Last night he got one shot through on goal.  Why keep throwing clappers when you've already got 3 assists!??

*Please don't do that ("marry me poster"). 

 

Diminish what I saw in Miller that most didn't (a handful of us did).

 

Women can see things in players that are completely relevant to their skill and attitude and it isn't just fangirl stuff. Yes, that too but I saw what kind of player he was early on and my honing in on him as a favourite orignated there, in how he played the game (I love power forwards). What people pegged as negative was what drives him in a positive way in a double edged sword. That he, himself, has spoken of. You can't be a placid player that switches that kind of passion/fuel on and off. It's there or it's not. I saw it in Burr early on too. Bieksa (when people were screaming to get rid of him).

 

I'd rather have a player guilty of doing too much than not enough. Why keep throwing clappers? Because they're effective and can move players out of the way too. He nearly tied up the game. I wouldn't question his play....I think he's proven it well enough. He was banged up last night (and tired)....not at his absolute best maybe but I think we can excuse him at this point. He contributed.

 

All players have "moments" and take penalties. I think we have some other guys who you could be putting under the microscope.

 

My eye for good players isn't based on how they look, it's how they play. That goes way back and I do have a pretty good track record. 

 

 

[Blue]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

The way Allvin was able to get Hronek was brilliant. I just don’t know if there’s another Hronek level D man who we can get for that price now. Hronek was only 25 and clearly great. But we definitely need one more top four guy. With Myers coming off the books at the end of this year msybe Allvin will allocate those cap dollars to a UFA D man? 

I still contend that we are getting a little greedy and unappreciative of what we do have when healthy. 

 

How many other teams have a far better D than us now ..? Honest question. I don't know 

Edited November 26, 2023 by Blue

[Coconuts]

12 hours ago, Darius said:

They hadn’t lost to these guys since 2019. It’s the nhl, the other team is trying to win too.

i don’t know how realistic it is to expect this team to go from poor team to consistently dominant in one season. Overall they are doing great considering all  these road games and the thinned out D.   They need to shed a couple unfavourable contracts, bolster the defence, and add a little more size on the wing. Prob another 1-2 yr process. 
 

Need to concentrate on the positives here. It’s not like they need to fill the most difficult positions (1c,1d, great goalie) . The foundation is in. They are closer than they have been in at least 10 yrs and can still be one of the better teams in the west. 

 

Not very, I can't emphasize how much the Canucks still have to prove after the past decade or so. A hot start is great and this season has been a step forward, but they need to learn to put things together consistently, injuries and tough schedules or not. Our travel is worse but every other team has to deal with these things too to some degree.

 

They also need to shed cap and have most of their contracts be good value.

 

It's a stepping stone season, it's why I hope management is hesitant to make any large moves that don't have longer term roster impacts. I want to retain our assets if possible, particular high picks. 

 

Maybe after making the playoffs a few season they can start thinking about being contenders, but not til then. Most teams have to beat their heads against playoff walls before even getting a sniff at a conference final, let alone a cup final. Lots left to prove, lots for management to sort out.

 

It's been a better start then the past couple seasons, take that for what it is.

Edited November 26, 2023 by Coconuts

[-dlc-]

25 minutes ago, stawns said:

 

I disagree........I'm reacting to a return to a  style of play we've seen from this team consistently over the last 2.5 years.  And no one is hitting the panic button, just trying to have objective discussions with other Canuck fans without the getting shouted down for seeing things a little more objectively from fans who are obviously a little insecure about their team

LOL, this just reeks of "I know the mostest".

 

I don't know that you do though (I'll keep defaulting to your absolute conviction Miller was gone and the inability to be critical of officials when warranted).

 

Objective is seeing that they ARE on a grind with back to backs on the road and factoring that in. Injuries too.

 

Again, those words to belittle others do little to prove your point. Please understand you're not the be all to end all and that we are all experts in our own minds. 

 

The style of play right now is....depleted and sloppy. But if you look beyond that objectively, you won't be so insecure about it all. You'll know that the past 2.5 years are in the past and we can face forward any time now. That you have to factor in how they've played throughout, not just in stretches that overlook the good parts.

 

Back to ignore.

[Gawdzukes]

38 minutes ago, stawns said:

 

I disagree........I'm reacting to a return to a  style of play we've seen from this team consistently over the last 2.5 years.  And no one is hitting the panic button, just trying to have objective discussions with other Canuck fans without the getting shouted down for seeing things a little more objectively from fans who are obviously a little insecure about their team

 

Yeah it's a little concerning. We're seeing some bad hockey creep back in. The team was very complacent and looked like they were going through the motions and hoping to get the W. The top line players were also a little sloppy and lacked the killer instinct. A lot of possession and opportunity but the finish wasn't there.

 

After a bit of a tough and busy schedule travel wise we have a stretch at home now. Hopefully the can get back to basics, get some practices in and prepare for this next 10 game stretch. The Flames have been looking a lot better, Seattle is heating up, don't forget Anaheim turning the corner, and the Oilers may eventually put it together. It's an important stretch for the team.

 

One major area of concern is Kuzmenko and the sophomore slump. Between him and Petey playing so unlike himself our top 6 has dried up, besides the PP, and we're relying on our bottom 6 to keep us in games. It also looks like teams are keying in our defence and recognizing we are weak back there when Hughes and Hronek are not on the ice. Myers, Juulsen, and Friedman haven't been bad but we're getting back into that territory where they are blackholes as far as positively pushing the play.
 

Of course there will be all those insecure fans that don't want to discuss any shortcomings the team may have. That's how you get better. Not patting yourself on the back repeatedly for the things you may have done right.

Edited November 26, 2023 by Gawdzukes

[Miss Korea]

1 minute ago, -dlc- said:

*Please don't do that ("marry me poster"). 

 

Diminish what I saw in Miller that most didn't (a handful of us did).

 

Women can see things in players that are completely relevant to their skill and attitude and it isn't just fangirl stuff. Yes, that too but I saw what kind of player he was early on. What people pegged as negative was what drives him in a positive way in a double edged sword. That he, himself, has spoken of. You can't be a placid player that switches that kind of passion/fuel on and off. It's there or it's not. I saw it in Burr early on too. Bieksa (when people were screaming to get rid of him).

 

I'd rather have a player guilty of doing too much than not enough. Why keep throwing clappers? Because they're effective and he nearly tied up the game. I wouldn't question his play....I think he's proven it well enough. He was banged up last night (and tired)....not at his best maybe but I think we can excuse him at this point.

 

All players have "moments" and take penalties. I think we have some other guys who you could be putting under the microscope.

 

I'm not trying to reduce you to the most basic fangirl but I also believe you don't think Miller can do any wrong.  There were moments when Miller was lazy on the backcheck.  There were moments when Miller was embarrassingly shouting at his own teammates (even the goalie).  And there were moments when he took some really bad penalties.  Miller being a highly determined and emotional player doesn't excuse him from those mistakes.  It explains it.

 

The question is whether he has the willingness to make the necessary adjustments to his game to become a more effective player.  He's not yelling at teammates anymore and he's doing work on defense, but when someone wants to put the game on his stick the way he does, he deserves as much criticism for losses as he does credit for wins.  I'm sure he's pissed at his own performance last night, even if he did get 3 assists.

 

Classic slap shots (not one-timers) are practically dead in today's NHL.  It is increasingly rare to see players load up and fire from distance.  Technology has allowed players to fire wristers upwards to 90 mph and snap shots even harder.  Miller threw about 5 or 6 slap shots all game last night and got one shot through on goal.  The one golden scoring chance he had was also not a slap shot.

[-dlc-]

1 minute ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

Of course there will be all those insecure fans that don't want to discuss any shortcomings the team may have.

The other take?

 

"Or course there will be all those insecure fans who immediately panic when the team looks tired, depleted and beat up. Rather than exercising patience"

[-dlc-]

4 minutes ago, Miss Korea said:

 

I'm not trying to reduce you to the most basic fangirl but I also believe you don't think Miller can do any wrong. 

Only reading to here because you won't change my mind on Miller. 

 

I supported when he sat...you may have missed that.His emotions were getting the best of him and he needed to reel it in. And did.

 

He can do wrong but it's never because he's lazy/doesn't care/etc. Usually he's gassed and, last night, was pretty banged up on a back to back on the road. 

 

He doesn't do much wrong...so why would I find fault in him? I feel that others are stuck on the "AHA, TOLD YOU SO" moments and are almost hoping for him to fail so all the stuff they thought about him could be proven.

 

Miller's one of our best players....so that's mostly where my stance comes from. He's earned my support (and probably yours too at this point). I'm sure there are other targets more worthy to zero in on.

[Elias Pettersson]

6 hours ago, Drakrami said:

 

What does Pettersson not playing well for the past 3 weeks have anything to do with Matthew's point totals over 7 games? 

 

lul. 

 

 

Because it shows that all players are human and can go through slumps. Even McDavid is down almost 50% in production from last year. 
 

Petey is 8th in scoring in the NHL. He’s ahead of his pace from last season. Is he supposed to keep at a 150 point pace all season long?  
 

Petey had a good game yesterday. Better than Miller. He had lots of chances offensively, played well defensively and even knocked some guys out with hits. He was even 62% in the faceoff circle. He is a complete player. 

[DrJockitch]

3 minutes ago, Miss Korea said:

 

I'm not trying to reduce you to the most basic fangirl but I also believe you don't think Miller can do any wrong.  There were moments when Miller was lazy on the backcheck.  There were moments when Miller was embarrassingly shouting at his own teammates (even the goalie).  And there were moments when he took some really bad penalties.  Miller being a highly determined and emotional player doesn't excuse him from those mistakes.  It explains it.

 

The question is whether he has the willingness to make the necessary adjustments to his game to become a more effective player.  He's not yelling at teammates anymore and he's doing work on defense, but when someone wants to put the game on his stick the way he does, he deserves as much criticism for losses as he does credit for wins.  I'm sure he's pissed at his own performance last night, even if he did get 3 assists.

 

Classic slap shots (not one-timers) are practically dead in today's NHL.  It is increasingly rare to see players load up and fire from distance.  Technology has allowed players to fire wristers upwards to 90 mph and snap shots even harder.  Miller threw about 5 or 6 slap shots all game last night and got one shot through on goal.  The one golden scoring chance he had was also not a slap shot.

Miller has made huge adjustments over the last year. 
Do emotions get the best of him sometimes yeah. Does he respond to frustration a little more negatively than would like at times, again yeah sometimes. 
‘But no player is perfect and he has improved leaps and bounds over even a year or two ago. If he is showing no emotion and going about his business he is Bo. 

[-dlc-]

Geesh, some people really need to learn the that was then this is now concept and apply it to hockey in order to move forward.

 

If you try to predict the future based on the past it's basically called generalized anxiety. I know because I have it and have worked hard on it. Along with the "what abouts" are the "what if's" (which is how GA is pinpointed).

 

The past can't predict the future so live in the moment. It's way more fun.

 

If things play out and we do regress and go back to old habits, "it is what it is". Enjoy the ride and the games that DO give us entertainment (and wins). Take out of life what you will. COVID taught me that.

 

Anyhow, I'm going in circles and y'all know how I feel about my team. I support them when they win and lose. Some, it seems, just wait for losses so they can pounce. It's a little premature to hit the panic button.