[Report/Rumour] Elias Pettersson Contract Talks

[Bob Long]

27 minutes ago, van_can_fan said:

 

 

I, for one, absolutely want the Canucks to continue applying pressure--even ramp it up. Petey needs to be clear with Van about what's next for him.

 

The only lever management has is the threat of a trade, which won't happen, at least not until the offseason.

[Sativika]

Man. A player of Petey's ilk doesn't come around often for our club. He can be the face of this franchise if he chooses. Well, one of the faces. 

 

I'm torn regarding a big money long termer or a shorter term for less money. There's logic to both scenarios for sure. In the long term, the core won't be together. Factors beyond our control be the reason:

 

- JT Miller. Will he be effective, ala Pavelski, as he reaches his mid 30s?

- Is Demmer our man in our quest for Lord Stanley?  I mean many goalies in the past have had years of success as they aged; Hasek, Vernon, Brodeur, Flower....

- Is Huggy gonna be our Drew Doughty for years to come?

 

I believe that if Stanley Cup success doesn't come soon, then this core as it gets older is questionable. Most certainly the talent is there. And we've got effective young assets that'll factor in along with the core. But I digress.

 

The above questions are factors to me, that make me believe a contract for Petey oughta' be for a shorter term and for less money. With the concerns of the OEL buyout factoring in, as well as the need to extend key players on the roster......to me this is the logical thing to do. 

 

I  mean, if we're successful in a Cup Championship in the 4 or 5 years we sign Petey for, then perhaps we can fork out the dough for him if he chooses to stay. OR.........

We trade him and get players that'll ensure future SC success.

 

Who knows. We might get lucky and a dark horse emerges in our present and/or future prospects. It could happen!

[NoCupSyndrome]

11 hours ago, van_can_fan said:

 

 

I, for one, absolutely want the Canucks to continue applying pressure--even ramp it up. Petey needs to be clear with Van about what's next for him.

 

 

Agreed, some clarity is needed. If EP isn't going to sign or is really on the fence, that is fine but provide a straight answer so that the Canucks can go all in at the 2024 TDL. They can then trade EP in the summer to recoup some of those assets and hopefully add an up and coming center.

 

If EP wants to be on a winning team, let Mgmt plan long-term so that they can build for sustainable success.

 

 

[Coconuts]

16 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

I think it's more as time goes on, it's potentially less likely he signs long term. In that case it might be better to look at a trade. 

 

I doubt it, depends on the term he's looking for. I have a hard time seeing us coming out as winners in a Pettersson trade if the goal is to contend sooner than later. 

 

16 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Makar is signed at 9 million for three more years after this one, Dahlin got 11 because he has to play in Buffalo. 

 

Yeah, I actually touched on that in my post. Makar has the remainder of this season and three others, four seasons. And the Dahlin got x because he plays in Buffalo bit is lazy, Dahlin put up 73 points in 78 games last season and currently has 35 in 43. Dahlin got paid top D dollars because he's one of the top young D in the league, factor in multiple offseasons of cap increases and yes, Hughes likely commands more. 

 

18 hours ago, Coconuts said:

 

I genuinely believe Hughes will probably end up getting more than Pettersson, as a D no less. I've seen some folks argue he's generational or in the same bracket as Makar, this year he certainly looks it. Makar signed his current deal in July 2021, right before going on to blow up with 86 points in 77 games, and win a Norris, Conn Smythe, and Stanley Cup. What number would he be looking at four seasons down the road? It's gonna be a big jump from his current 9M and Hughes is his most direct comparison. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 16 by Coconuts

[van_can_fan]

32 minutes ago, NoCupSyndrome said:

 

 

Agreed, some clarity is needed. If EP isn't going to sign or is really on the fence, that is fine but provide a straight answer so that the Canucks can go all in at the 2024 TDL. They can then trade EP in the summer to recoup some of those assets and hopefully add an up and coming center.

 

If EP wants to be on a winning team, let Mgmt plan long-term so that they can build for sustainable success.

 

 

Exactly. And as much as I HATE to even think this way, the Tkachuk option is way better than the Gaudreau option….

[Bob Long]

49 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

I doubt it, depends on the term he's looking for. I have a hard time seeing us coming out as winners in a Pettersson trade if the goal is to contend sooner than later. 

 

 

Yeah, I actually touched on that in my post. Makar has the remainder of this season and three others, four seasons. And the Dahlin got x because he plays in Buffalo bit is lazy, Dahlin put up 73 points in 78 games last season and currently has 35 in 43. Dahlin got paid top D dollars because he's one of the top young D in the league, factor in multiple offseasons of cap increases and yes, Hughes likely commands more. 

 

 

 

We could likely never immediately recover Peteys current value unless it was for someone like Brady Tkachuk 

[Coconuts]

12 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

We could likely never immediately recover Peteys current value unless it was for someone like Brady Tkachuk 

 

Agreed, and finding an equivalent fit wouldn't be easy

 

Not impossible, but def not easy

 

For example, Ottawa doesn't need Pettersson, they have a 1C in Stutzle locked in long term at 8.3M

 

The other wrinkle is it'd have to be a team Pettersson would be willing to extend with or you may as well scrap the whole idea

Edited January 16 by Coconuts

[Bure_Pavel]

If he wants a 4 year deal or under, sign and trade him to Columbus for David Jiricek and Boone Jenner before his NMC kicks in.

[Diamonds]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

We could likely never immediately recover Peteys current value unless it was for someone like Brady Tkachuk 

Yep, the only way we would come close to directly recuperating Pettersson's value would be by trading him to a team looking to shake things up. For example, if Carolina gets bounced first round they might be willing to entertain an Aho for Petey deal to shake things up if Petey is a sign and trade. But, the likelihood of a trade like that happening is pretty slim.

 

If it comes down to having to trade Pettersson it's much more likely that the key piece in the return is a high end young player with a lot of potential still (an Adam Fantilli type) with other supporting pieces like draft picks and depth players to round it out. Obviously in the immediate future it would be a downgrade but the return theoretically has the ability to be as good as Pettersson, just much more of a gamble.

[spook007]

You just don't trade Petey... His camp knows that and JR/PA knows that.... they are doing a little tit for tat, trying to make the contract as favourable for Canucks as longs as Petey's wishes are met.

 

I'm sure Petey wants to see, where this run takes us... He has just been through the Benning tenure, with all ups and downs. Sacking of Bruce, whom they all liked. OEL chucked out as well as L.E. both players, who seemed to be liked by Petey, so he want's to make sure, he is getting, what he wants.

Most likely a 3-4 year deal at good money, thus being able to choose himself, whether he likes the route, the club is taking....

The fact he can get an even bigger slice once they see what the cap will be in 3-4 years, + the team getting to the other side of the OEL cap hell, before signing a 7-8 year end of career contract somewhere. be it Vancouver or else where.

 

I think he likes it here, but they all know, it is a business.

 

Sedins at the height of their powers also didn't sign to the off season at the end of their c contract. And Petey didn't mind leaving it late last time around.

 

[Coconuts]

38 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

If he wants a 4 year deal or under, sign and trade him to Columbus for David Jiricek and Boone Jenner before his NMC kicks in.

 

Do you genuinely believe Pettersson would sign in Columbus? Isn't he on record stating that he wants to be part of a competitive team? 

 

Columbus could certainly user a top notch center, but it seems farfetched that Pettersson would sign there long term if he isn't willing to do that on a better team in Vancouver. 

[wai_lai416]

7 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

Do you genuinely believe Pettersson would sign in Columbus? Isn't he on record stating that he wants to be part of a competitive team? 

 

Columbus could certainly user a top notch center, but it seems farfetched that Pettersson would sign there long term if he isn't willing to do that on a better team in Vancouver. 

No he wants to sign ep and then trade him mid season. Ep will refuse to report and force his way out of Columbus and Columbus will not recoup what they traded lol. So basically 0 chance of that happening. Not to mention no players would sign with Vancouver after this fiasco tricking a player to sign and then trade him

[Coconuts]

4 minutes ago, spook007 said:

You just don't trade Petey... His camp knows that and JR/PA knows that.... they are doing a little tit for tat, trying to make the contract as favourable for Canucks as longs as Petey's wishes are met.

 

I'm sure Petey wants to see, where this run takes us... He has just been through the Benning tenure, with all ups and downs. Sacking of Bruce, whom they all liked. OEL chucked out as well as L.E. both players, who seemed to be liked by Petey, so he want's to make sure, he is getting, what he wants.

Most likely a 3-4 year deal at good money, thus being able to choose himself, whether he likes the route, the club is taking....

The fact he can get an even bigger slice once they see what the cap will be in 3-4 years, + the team getting to the other side of the OEL cap hell, before signing a 7-8 year end of career contract somewhere. be it Vancouver or else where.

 

I think he likes it here, but they all know, it is a business.

 

Sedins at the height of their powers also didn't sign to the off season at the end of their c contract. And Petey didn't mind leaving it late last time around.

 

 

Yeah, the organization hasn't been a playoff regular during Petey's Canucks tenure, I can see why he'd take the wait and see approach. He's only made the playoff once as a Canuck, this is season number six. 

 

Didn't Gillis fly to Sweden to meet with the twins too? 

 

I think it's just a tough negotiation, but I do believe it'll get done one way or another. I think Pettersson will probably come out the bigger winner in negotiations, but I also see the Canucks as winners if they're able to get him on at least a 3-4 year deal. Even if that puts Pettersson in a position to cash in again, so be it.

 

One of the strengths going forward for the Canucks is their lack of long term contracts on the books. Miller and Hughes are the only two players right now who have more than three years remaining on their current deals, it's not as if the Canucks won't be able to pay Pettersson again in a few years if it comes to that. 

 

Hronek probably gets longer term, could see Boeser getting medium term, Demko too. Although I could see Demko getting more term than Boeser. I don't imagine anyone else currently on the roster gets more than 3-4 years. I don't think Zadorov's done enough as a Canuck to garner 5-6 years. 

[HKSR]

Trade him to Detroit for Dylan Larkin and Simon Edvinsson. 

[Grandmaster]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

We could likely never immediately recover Peteys current value unless it was for someone like Brady Tkachuk 

Rather get Jack Hughes 

[wai_lai416]

2 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

Yeah, the organization hasn't been a playoff regular during Petey's Canucks tenure, I can see why he'd take the wait and see approach. He's only made the playoff once as a Canuck, this is season number six. 

 

Didn't Gillis fly to Sweden to meet with the twins too? 

 

I think it's just a tough negotiation, but I do believe it'll get done one way or another. I think Pettersson will probably come out the bigger winner in negotiations, but I also see the Canucks as winners if they're able to get him on at least a 3-4 year deal. Even if that puts Pettersson in a position to cash in again, so be it.

 

One of the strengths going forward for the Canucks is their lack of long term contracts on the books. Miller and Hughes are the only two players right now who have more than three years remaining on their current deals, it's not as if the Canucks won't be able to pay Pettersson again in a few years if it comes to that. 

 

Hronek probably gets longer term, could see Boeser getting medium term, Demko too. Although I could see Demko getting more term than Boeser. I don't imagine anyone else currently on the roster gets more than 3-4 years. I don't think Zadorov's done enough as a Canuck to garner 5-6 years. 

How much you predict ep at 3-4 year deal? Matthew at 13.25 4 years. I honestly don’t see less than 12 or the 10 ppl are throwing out.. he’s not going to sign for 25% less than matthews. If he’s going for the short 3-4 so he can cash in again for more money.. then why would he be signing for less than market on a short term? Ep is not matthews but he’s prolly just around 10% less than a matthews. The fans here can trash ep all they want when he struggled, but the guy is still leading the team in WAR and GAR.. look at all the recent loss Canucks have.. when ep doesn’t produce the team lose when QH doesn’t produce the team still wins.

[DeNiro]

9 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Trade him to Detroit for Dylan Larkin and Simon Edvinsson. 

No.

[Coconuts]

11 minutes ago, Grandmaster said:

Rather get Jack Hughes 

 

When healthy Jack Hughes is one of the best bargains in the league, why would Jersey move him?

 

7 minutes ago, wai_lai416 said:

How much you predict ep at 3-4 year deal? Matthew at 13.25 4 years. I honestly don’t see less than 12 or the 10 ppl are throwing out.. he’s not going to sign for 25% less than matthews. If he’s going for the short 3-4 so he can cash in again for more money.. then why would he be signing for less than market on a short term? Ep is not matthews but he’s prolly just around 10% less than a matthews. The fans here can trash ep all they want when he struggled, but the guy is still leading the team in WAR and GAR.. look at all the recent loss Canucks have.. when ep doesn’t produce the team lose when QH doesn’t produce the team still wins.

 

Probably something closer to 11, it'd be less cap hit in return for less term

 

Maybe the high 10's at best, he's not gonna be a bargain on a shorter term deal imo, but I don't think any Pettersson deal is going to be a bargain at the end of the day

 

I think that's probably the sensible compromise 

 

Could see it being closer to 12 too on a shorter term deal too though, I don't think the Canucks have much leverage

Edited January 16 by Coconuts

[spook007]

5 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

Yeah, the organization hasn't been a playoff regular during Petey's Canucks tenure, I can see why he'd take the wait and see approach. He's only made the playoff once as a Canuck, this is season number six. 

 

Didn't Gillis fly to Sweden to meet with the twins too? 

 

I think it's just a tough negotiation, but I do believe it'll get done one way or another. I think Pettersson will probably come out the bigger winner in negotiations, but I also see the Canucks as winners if they're able to get him on at least a 3-4 year deal. Even if that puts Pettersson in a position to cash in again, so be it.

 

One of the strengths going forward for the Canucks is their lack of long term contracts on the books. Miller and Hughes are the only two players right now who have more than three years remaining on their current deals, it's not as if the Canucks won't be able to pay Pettersson again in a few years if it comes to that. 

 

Hronek probably gets longer term, could see Boeser getting medium term, Demko too. Although I could see Demko getting more term than Boeser. I don't imagine anyone else currently on the roster gets more than 3-4 years. I don't think Zadorov's done enough as a Canuck to garner 5-6 years. 

Agree on each point...

 

Especially the fact we have the majority on 2-3 years contract makes it good.

A lot of folks will worry about losing players along the way, and we will without doubt, but it also gives us flexibility, in case a player doesn't work out, or we have issues cap wise. Especially after seeing Allvin pulling rabbit after rabbit out the hat (they did the same in Pittsburg, with only Crosby, Malkin, Letang and Fleury being long term contracts).

 

I don't mind players like Miller on his long term contract, as there were no way we'd get him signed to a short term contract at that cap.

Same with Hughes, Petey and Demko, but the rest are replaceable over time.

 

And yes I believe they he did fly to Sweden to negotiate with the Sedins... 

 

In the end Petey and Hughes are the lights on this train and together with Miller an Demko are the core.

 

PS. Yes also expect Hronek to come in on a long term contract... both to keep term down, to show ambition to Hughes and finally because RHDs are so hard to get hold of.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tank]

30 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

Do you genuinely believe Pettersson would sign in Columbus? Isn't he on record stating that he wants to be part of a competitive team? 

 

Columbus could certainly user a top notch center, but it seems farfetched that Pettersson would sign there long term if he isn't willing to do that on a better team in Vancouver. 

we can sign and trade easily

[Coconuts]

3 minutes ago, spook007 said:

Agree on each point...

 

Especially the fact we have the majority on 2-3 years contract makes it good.

A lot of folks will worry about losing players along the way, and we will without doubt, but it also gives us flexibility, in case a player doesn't work out, or we have issues cap wise. Especially after seeing Allvin pulling rabbit after rabbit out the hat (they did the same in Pittsburg, with only Crosby, Malkin, Letang and Fleury being long term contracts).

 

I don't mind players like Miller on his long term contract, as there were no way we'd get him signed to a short term contract at that cap.

Same with Hughes, Petey and Demko, but the rest are replaceable over time.

 

And yes I believe they he did fly to Sweden to negotiate with the Sedins... 

 

In the end Petey and Hughes are the lights on this train and together with Miller an Demko are the core.

 

PS. Yes also expect Hronek to come in on a long term contract... both to keep term down, to show ambition to Hughes and finally because RHDs are so hard to get hold of.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Short to medium term deals are the way to go moving forward, long term should be reserved for top guys

 

Precisisely because it allows for more flexibility 

 

Pettersson and Hughes will be the engines going forward, they'll top out as Miller is declining imo, and I do expect him to decline 

 

At what rate is anyone's guess, but most players decline 

 

Hronek makes sense on a longer term deal, they finally found an RD who works

[Tank]

22 minutes ago, wai_lai416 said:

No he wants to sign ep and then trade him mid season. Ep will refuse to report and force his way out of Columbus and Columbus will not recoup what they traded lol. So basically 0 chance of that happening. Not to mention no players would sign with Vancouver after this fiasco tricking a player to sign and then trade him

if EP doesn't report, he will not make a dime in NHL and will probably back to SHL.

[Coconuts]

9 minutes ago, Tank said:

we can sign and trade easily

 

Sign and trades don't happen much, particularly in season. 

 

Signing Pettersson under the pretense of his staying in Vancouver and then flipping him would be operating in bad faith, I can't imagine that looking all that great to players and agents around the league. 

 

A Tkachuk style sign and trade is rare. Devils just signed and traded Severson to Columbus, but that happened in the offseason.

 

The key piece to both deals is the players were on board with it. If Pettersson signs a deal in good faith and we flip him that's going to be a black mark on the Canucks organization if Pettersson's team hasn't okayed such a move. 

Edited January 16 by Coconuts

[Grandmaster]

16 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

When healthy Jack Hughes is one of the best bargains in the league, why would Jersey move him?

 

Petey is the better player and we can add a pick to offset the Cap implications 

[Coconuts]

7 minutes ago, Grandmaster said:

Petey is the better player and we can add a pick to offset the Cap implications 

 

Maybe, but Hughes hit 99 points last season during his 21-22 season. 45 points in 32 games thus far this season, so on pace to do it again if he'd stayed healthy. 

 

Factor in his 8M cap hit, so tentatively 4M less than Pettersson, and I don't know. If I were the Devil's GM I wouldn't do it, Jack's done more at a younger age and is locked in on a bargain of a deal considering how the cap will rise. 6 more seasons left on Jack's deal after this one, his contract allows them to fit in other pieces which is more valuable to the Devil's than the difference between Pettersson and Hughes imo. 

 

They also have a defensive savant in Hischier backing him up, Hischier is a Selke conversation player when healthy. 

 

If the cap didn't exist I'd take Pettersson every time, but the cap does exist. 

Edited January 16 by Coconuts