[Report/Rumour] Elias Pettersson Contract Talks

[LillStrimma]

21 minutes ago, HKSR said:

I think the person was going off his qualifying offer of $8.8M.  Problem is Petey is arbitration eligible, and if he goes to arbitration, it'll be $10M to $11M easily. 

Ok

Not my problem, it’s cheaper than 14 mill anyway. 

[Elias Pettersson]

30 minutes ago, LillStrimma said:

So you don’t want to sign the Alien for 8 years then? 
Cementing the new core in Petey, Silovs, Lekkerimäki, Willander with Miller as the tough vet and hopefully Demko as Silovs compadre.

If Hughes choose to stay we have a shot at the cup til Petey and Hughes is around 35.

But if Hughes leave we can hope Willander can take over.

But the most important piece is Petey.

This is the player that is instrumental going forward.

We can always go for the tougher, cheaper D but we can’t find that kind of alien offensive quality through drafting that Petey is.

We have to deliberately tank for a few years just to have a chance of such player and then I mean tank. Literally be the worst team a few years in a row.

Who wants that when we can be a powerhouse for ten years…

Luck seldom strikes twice.

 

 

 

If you win 2 cups in a row then your luck has probably run out.  How many teams have won more than 2 cups in the last 30 years? Also, those teams went to the bottom afterwards because their star players got old before they traded them.  Chicago won 3 cups but now they have to start over again from scratch.  They got lucky with Bedard, but you can't bet on your future based on luck. They literally got nothing in return for their best players who won them 3 cups.  Imagine if they traded all those players when their value was still high?

 

If we win 2 cups in a row then there is no reason to sign Petey to a massive extension.  Even Edmonton won a cup without Gretzky after they traded him.  Is Petey better than Gretzky?

[LillStrimma]

48 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

If you win 2 cups in a row then your luck has probably run out.  How many teams have won more than 2 cups in the last 30 years? Also, those teams went to the bottom afterwards because their star players got old before they traded them. 
 

 

So you think Petey and Hughes are old when they are around 27? 

48 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Chicago won 3 cups but now they have to start over again from scratch.  They got lucky with Bedard, but you can't bet on your future based on luck.

 

Exactly, don’t factor in luck in decisions.

Trade away Petey and it might take 20-30 years before sych player is with the Canucks again.

You don’t trade away a player like that.

48 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

They literally got nothing in return for their best players who won them 3 cups.  Imagine if they traded all those players when their value was still high?

 

So if they did trade their best players away when they were around 25 years they would have been better? 

 

48 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

If we win 2 cups in a row then there is no reason to sign Petey to a massive extension.  Even Edmonton won a cup without Gretzky after they traded him. 
 

So Edmonton had a cap limit. Interesting, I didn’t know that or are you making a false comparision? 

48 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Is Petey better than Gretzky?

No, but he sure can be around top ten in NHL history if he reach next level.

 

[Elias Pettersson]

20 minutes ago, LillStrimma said:

So you think Petey and Hughes are old when they are around 27? 

 

Exactly, don’t factor in luck in decisions.

Trade away Petey and it might take 20-30 years before sych player is with the Canucks again.

You don’t trade away a player like that.

 

So if they did trade their best players away when they were around 25 years they would have been better? 

 

So Edmonton had a cap limit. Interesting, I didn’t know that or are you making a false comparision? 

No, but he sure can be around top ten in NHL history if he reach next level.

 

 

The players you get from trading Petey and Hughes in their prime should be enough to have the Canucks start another window.  If we win 2 cups we should be automatically planning our next window, not signing two players to massive $13-14 million deals like Toronto.  If you trade Petey for someone like Leo Carlsson then I don't think you need to wait 20 years to have another player like Petey.  No, they are not old at age 27, but they will be at their highest value at that age.  What age was Gretzky when he was traded?

 

Petey will not be a top 10 player in NHL history unless he reaches a level of 130+ points on a consistent level and wins multiple Hart trophy awards.  You are talking about Gretzky, Lemieux, Howe, Orr, Bossy, Messier, Bourque, Roy, Jagr, Crosby, Ovechkin, McDavid.  Do you think Petey will be in that category in 10 years?

 

Doesn't matter whether Edmonton had a cap limit or not.  The fact they didn't should have been even easier to keep their players.  But they didn't.  Tampa will be letting Stamkos walk for free this year because they can't afford him any more.  That's because they need to pay their younger players and start a new window.  

Edited January 22 by Elias Pettersson

[LillStrimma]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

The players you get from trading Petey and Hughes in their prime should be enough to have the Canucks start another window.  If we win 2 cups we should be automatically planning our next window, not signing two players to massive $13-14 million deals like Toronto.  If you trade Petey for someone like Leo Carlsson then I don't think you need to wait 20 years to have another player like Petey.  No, they are not old at age 27, but they will be at their highest value at that age.  What age was Gretzky when he was traded?

 

Petey will not be a top 10 player in NHL history unless he reaches a level of 130+ points on a consistent level and wins multiple Hart trophy awards.  You are talking about Gretzky, Lemieux, Howe, Orr, Bossy, Messier, Bourque, Roy, Jagr, Crosby, Ovechkin, McDavid.  Do you think Petey will be in that category in 10 years?

 

Doesn't matter whether Edmonton had a cap limit or not.  The fact they didn't should have been even easier to keep their players.  But they didn't.  Tampa will be letting Stamkos walk for free this year because they can't afford him any more.  That's because they need to pay their younger players and start a new window.  

Ok, top 20 then…

 

I believe that the Canucks will be another Kraken if trade away the top players. They can never get back those players again without tanking.

That Petey fell so much in the draft was pure luck. Likewise with Hughes. 

 

Your way will only lead to mediocracy or/and tanking as the end result. 

My way is to use the luck and run with it as long as long possble. 
2 14 mill contracts over 8 year isn’t much at the final 4 years of those contracts…

[Sapper]

7 minutes ago, LillStrimma said:

Ok, top 20 then…

 

I believe that the Canucks will be another Kraken if trade away the top players. They can never get back those players again without tanking.

That Petey fell so much in the draft was pure luck. Likewise with Hughes. 

 

Your way will only lead to mediocracy or/and tanking as the end result. 

My way is to use the luck and run with it as long as long possble. 
2 14 mill contracts over 8 year isn’t much at the final 4 years of those contracts…

It's business

 

We like every other team can only afford  a couple players making 10mill plus a year and remain competitive 

 

I'm all.for keeping Hughes and Petty in that group but it means we will have to trade a couple of players in the next tier ( miller , Brock ) to be able to keep the.top 2 and Demko

 

If we do that To remain competitive we need a few entry level contracts of players contributing in the top 6 ... Otherwise we fall.back into another rebuild

 

If it looks like signing Petty is going to put us in that position then it's good to look at what trades might produce ....... It's best to weigh all options including what we would look like the next 3 years as a team paying the money vs what the team could look like with assets from a trade 

 

I hope Petty stays as I really feel that with a spark added to his line he could take the next step and out second line could once more return to scoring ....

 

If their is common ground I hope he is signed soon 

[MattJVD]

3 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

The players you get from trading Petey and Hughes in their prime should be enough to have the Canucks start another window.  If we win 2 cups we should be automatically planning our next window, not signing two players to massive $13-14 million deals like Toronto.  If you trade Petey for someone like Leo Carlsson then I don't think you need to wait 20 years to have another player like Petey.  No, they are not old at age 27, but they will be at their highest value at that age.  What age was Gretzky when he was traded?

 

Petey will not be a top 10 player in NHL history unless he reaches a level of 130+ points on a consistent level and wins multiple Hart trophy awards.  You are talking about Gretzky, Lemieux, Howe, Orr, Bossy, Messier, Bourque, Roy, Jagr, Crosby, Ovechkin, McDavid.  Do you think Petey will be in that category in 10 years?

 

Doesn't matter whether Edmonton had a cap limit or not.  The fact they didn't should have been even easier to keep their players.  But they didn't.  Tampa will be letting Stamkos walk for free this year because they can't afford him any more.  That's because they need to pay their younger players and start a new window.  

If Petey, Hughes, et al win the Canucks 2 Cups I'd give them whatever contract they wanted and not even care if we never made a SCF again in their career. They would have already accomplished what everyone else in this franchise could not in 54 years of trying. Twice.

 

I would continue adding and subtracting complementary players and making new runs with that core, until that core declined to the point they couldn't make the playoffs anymore. Then rebuild. And I probably keep one or two of the core until retirement even through the rebuild to have some championship pedigree around to help develop the next core.

[Tusk]

1 hour ago, Sapper said:

It's business

 

We like every other team can only afford  a couple players making 10mill plus a year and remain competitive 

 

I'm all.for keeping Hughes and Petty in that group but it means we will have to trade a couple of players in the next tier ( miller , Brock ) to be able to keep the.top 2 and Demko

 

If we do that To remain competitive we need a few entry level contracts of players contributing in the top 6 ... Otherwise we fall.back into another rebuild

 

If it looks like signing Petty is going to put us in that position then it's good to look at what trades might produce ....... It's best to weigh all options including what we would look like the next 3 years as a team paying the money vs what the team could look like with assets from a trade 

 

I hope Petty stays as I really feel that with a spark added to his line he could take the next step and out second line could once more return to scoring ....

 

If their is common ground I hope he is signed soon 

To be honest (FAIR) i have seen some discusions about trading our whole future for one maybe two pieces we need right now. for rentals.

 

"- Lekkerimaki if getting young, under contract forward 

- Vasily Podkolzin, Aatu Raty, Linus Karlsson, Hunter Brzustewicz and/or lesser prospects

- One of Ilya Mikheyev/Andrei Kuzmenko "

 

To be honest, I would rather trade Petey and get the 4 or 5 pieces rather than giving up the above. And our cap issues for 4 years resolved.

[Elias Pettersson]

1 hour ago, MattJVD said:

If Petey, Hughes, et al win the Canucks 2 Cups I'd give them whatever contract they wanted and not even care if we never made a SCF again in their career. They would have already accomplished what everyone else in this franchise could not in 54 years of trying. Twice.

 

I would continue adding and subtracting complementary players and making new runs with that core, until that core declined to the point they couldn't make the playoffs anymore. Then rebuild. And I probably keep one or two of the core until retirement even through the rebuild to have some championship pedigree around to help develop the next core.

If you don’t care if we win another cup then what does it matter if we keep them or not?  Do you want to be like Pittsburgh trading all your picks and prospects for one more shot?  Or Tampa where they have to let their captain walk?  
 

The current team doesn’t have any champions teaching them how to win other than the coaches. So we don’t need this current core teaching any of our future stars either. 
 

If you are wanting to keep the current core until they are no longer good players anymore then you are looking at a hard rebuild because you aren’t getting anything of value for a 36 year old Petey and Hughes. It would be the exact situation as the Sedins. 
 

This situation is great for the current fans but it won’t be so great for the new generation of fans who will watch their team suck for a decade or more after a hard rebuild. 

[MattJVD]

21 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

If you don’t care if we win another cup then what does it matter if we keep them or not?  Do you want to be like Pittsburgh trading all your picks and prospects for one more shot?  Or Tampa where they have to let their captain walk?  
 

The current team doesn’t have any champions teaching them how to win other than the coaches. So we don’t need this current core teaching any of our future stars either. 
 

If you are wanting to keep the current core until they are no longer good players anymore then you are looking at a hard rebuild because you aren’t getting anything of value for a 36 year old Petey and Hughes. It would be the exact situation as the Sedins. 
 

This situation is great for the current fans but it won’t be so great for the new generation of fans who will watch their team suck for a decade or more after a hard rebuild. 

Yes, I 100% want the Canucks to be like those teams. Who wouldn't want back-to-back Championships?

[Elias Pettersson]

2 minutes ago, MattJVD said:

Yes, I 100% want the Canucks to be like those teams. Who wouldn't want back-to-back Championships?

FYI my entire post was based on the premise that we have already won back to back championships just like those teams. My argument is what to do after the fact. I was saying hey maybe we should sell high and get top assets for our 2 stars. You were saying no, let’s just keep them around like Pittsburgh and Tampa and keep trading all of our picks and prospects for one more shot at glory. Then get rid of them when they are old and gray and have zero value. 
 

So we are both on the same page in terms of trying to win back to back championships with this core. Our differences come in terms of what to do with them after the fact. 

[wai_lai416]

2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

FYI my entire post was based on the premise that we have already won back to back championships just like those teams. My argument is what to do after the fact. I was saying hey maybe we should sell high and get top assets for our 2 stars. You were saying no, let’s just keep them around like Pittsburgh and Tampa and keep trading all of our picks and prospects for one more shot at glory. Then get rid of them when they are old and gray and have zero value. 
 

So we are both on the same page in terms of trying to win back to back championships with this core. Our differences come in terms of what to do with them after the fact. 

i would love for us to win 1 or 2 cups in the next 2 years.. but honestly until we have 3 lines we can roll out in the playoff.. i think that's a really tough ask.. right now we have 2.. a 1st line and a 3rd line.. i honestly wouldn't touch the 3rd line and let it continue matched up against the other teams 3rd line and dominate them.. but if they were elevated to the 2nd line and other teams start playing their 2nd line and 2nd pairing defenceman against them i dunno if they'll have the same success.. hence it's imparative we find a 2nd line that will work or some what work.

[MattJVD]

1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said:

FYI my entire post was based on the premise that we have already won back to back championships just like those teams. My argument is what to do after the fact. I was saying hey maybe we should sell high and get top assets for our 2 stars. You were saying no, let’s just keep them around like Pittsburgh and Tampa and keep trading all of our picks and prospects for one more shot at glory. Then get rid of them when they are old and gray and have zero value. 
 

So we are both on the same page in terms of trying to win back to back championships with this core. Our differences come in terms of what to do with them after the fact. 

Yeah I think that sums it up!

[Viking]

Wouldn’t it be nice that when EP signs a new contract he decides to stay long term for 8yrs but he also agrees to a 10m cap hit for a 8yrs 88m contract .

 

EP would say JT makes 8m and we are both elite now, but age is on my side but shouldn’t be worth nearly 1m per yr so he says 10m cap hit is fair and sets a cap for the team as the years go by Hughes gets 10m and Demko might be close to that.

 

also, if he wants more than Nylander and he does deserve more if you looked at their stats. My big issue is this is a Laff player,.NOT a real comparable…they overpay their forwards and have 1 playoff series win to show all this time….Epic fail and I LOVE IT!!!!

 

basically if we copy the Tampa Bay model, where Multiple players make 9.5m, leaving them a contender year after year and winning back to back Stanley Cups. The Canucks cap hit limit would likely be over 10m but let’s say under 11m so 10.5m?

 

so adjust my earlier contract and now it’s an 8yr 84m contract with a 10.5m cap hit. Hughes and Demko could follow that contract model. Miller is a Stamkos comparable earning less cap hit wise due to being older but still very good.

 

im excited with our team, but I’m not a we win cup this year person. Like Tampa prior to them winning, I’m thinking 3-4yrs we could win a Cup. We still need to find a good top 4 D pairing, we have improved the D immensely just need Myers gone! He has been better but still not near worth 6m. For what he does he is worth under 3m I’d only keep him if he did 1yr 1m full NMC NTC deals. He doesn’t want to leave, lives in Kelowna as do I. Iif I was him I’d take a massive pay cut to stay as close to home as possible….kinda like Giordano signing a 2yr league minimum deal with Laffs or something!?

 

i dunno just spitballing while I am awake at midnight due to a work injury leaving me in constant pain.

 

cheers

 

 

 

[Viking]

I wonder if the Canucks do a trade with Anaheim….

 

Canucks possibly send to Anaheim in trade are: Kuzmenko, Myers, Mikheyev, 2024 1st round pick, Danila Klimovich, Rathbone, Woo

 

Anaheim possibly sends to Vancouver:

 

Henrique, Vatrano, Silfverberg, Lybushkin, McGinn, Lindstrom(Swedish RHD was PPG last year NCAA), Hagg(depth gritty slow lhd D…???, mid-late 2024 pick 

 

 

[Pears]

On 1/22/2024 at 4:50 PM, Elias Pettersson said:

If you don’t care if we win another cup then what does it matter if we keep them or not?  Do you want to be like Pittsburgh trading all your picks and prospects for one more shot?  Or Tampa where they have to let their captain walk?  
 

The current team doesn’t have any champions teaching them how to win other than the coaches. So we don’t need this current core teaching any of our future stars either. 
 

If you are wanting to keep the current core until they are no longer good players anymore then you are looking at a hard rebuild because you aren’t getting anything of value for a 36 year old Petey and Hughes. It would be the exact situation as the Sedins. 
 

This situation is great for the current fans but it won’t be so great for the new generation of fans who will watch their team suck for a decade or more after a hard rebuild. 

To be fair was that any different than what we went through from 2013 until now?

[Elias Pettersson]

Petey sucks pucks right now.  Give him $7.9 million, just under Miller, for 4 years...

[IBatch]

On 1/22/2024 at 4:41 PM, LillStrimma said:

Ok, top 20 then…

 

I believe that the Canucks will be another Kraken if trade away the top players. They can never get back those players again without tanking.

That Petey fell so much in the draft was pure luck. Likewise with Hughes. 

 

Your way will only lead to mediocracy or/and tanking as the end result. 

My way is to use the luck and run with it as long as long possble. 
2 14 mill contracts over 8 year isn’t much at the final 4 years of those contracts…

Not to break up a good dialogue, both making good points, CHI's window closed shut the moment the ink dried on Toews and Kanes massive deals, Seabrooks and the UFA paydays coming in.    If we have to pay QHs and EP 14 x 8, we are also likely done for.    The only reason we'd have a window is also because of them too, but we could easily bung up our cap.   EPs too old to be paying for potential now, what you see, is more or less what you get.    We could hope for a couple boffo seasons, but they might not come.    If he's having a hard time playing with the likes of Miller, Brock, Kuzmenko and Mikheyev, what do you think is going to happen by almost doubling his salary, and where is that money coming off the roster?    EPs might not even be  a top ten forward in the league at the moment let alone a top ten all-time.      

 

He's done enough to warrant a double digit pay-day.    Would be fine with 12 x 8 even.    That's maxed out though and we'd need him to score 100 or more points every year to compete. 

[NoCupSyndrome]

Agreed, basically means Mgmt needs to go for it this year and be prepared to move on over the summer if his salary demands are counter to what is best for the team.

[DeNiro]

6 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Petey sucks pucks right now.  Give him $7.9 million, just under Miller, for 4 years...

One week he’s worth 12 the next week he’s worth under 8. 

 

Fans in this market are so fickle.

[Coconuts]

13 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

One week he’s worth 12 the next week he’s worth under 8. 

 

Fans in this market are so fickle.

 

I think he's poking fun, but you're not wrong

[Strawbone]

7 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Petey sucks pucks right now.  Give him $7.9 million, just under Miller, for 4 years...

 

[IBatch]

48 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

One week he’s worth 12 the next week he’s worth under 8. 

 

Fans in this market are so fickle.

If he wins us a cup and gets the Conn Smythe, give him the max and don't care if he never plays again.    Until then - well let's be reasonable.   Reasonably, he's put his name into a conversation as a top ten forward.     So paying him like a top ten forward is ok.   That's double digits.      But it's not Mckinnon, and it's not McDavid.    Or even Mathews, because he hasn't won a Richard, or an Art Ross.   Or a Pearson or a Hart.  Or one first or second string all-star berths (rightly so) either.   This is his year to prove he belongs.   So far, a mixed bag this year as well.     He's not even necessarily the best center on our own team.    So 7.8-18 seems to be the range!

Edited January 26 by IBatch

[N4ZZY]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

If he wins us a cup and gets the Conn Smythe, give him the max and don't care if he never plays again.    Until then - well let's be reasonable.   Reasonably, he's put his name into a conversation as a top ten forward.     So paying him like a top ten forward is ok.   That's double digits.      But it's not Mckinnon, and it's not McDavid.    Or even Mathews, because he hasn't won a Richard, or an Art Ross.   Or a Pearson or a Hart.  Or one first or second string all-star berths (rightly so) either.   This is his year to prove he belongs.   So far, a mixed bag this year as well.     He's not even necessarily the best center on our own team.    So 7.8-18 seems to be the range!

I think he ends up being paid like the best player on the team. Fans can argue that Miller is better, but Petey is 6 years younger, and producing almost at about the same points as JT this season. It's obvious that if he's getting paid as a top player on the team, it's looking towards the future. With that being said, I don't know if I expect Petey to commit to the team. Might be scarred by Benning's idiocy, and has a distrust with Canucks management and ownership moving forward? 

 

There's no other reason why he wouldn't sign now. 

 

Team's winning. He's producing (I guess that depends on whether he's in one of his droughts). 

 

He's either greedy, or he doesn't want to remain a Canuck...

 

Is it that simple? 

 

[MattJVD]

29 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

I think he ends up being paid like the best player on the team. Fans can argue that Miller is better, but Petey is 6 years younger, and producing almost at about the same points as JT this season. It's obvious that if he's getting paid as a top player on the team, it's looking towards the future. With that being said, I don't know if I expect Petey to commit to the team. Might be scarred by Benning's idiocy, and has a distrust with Canucks management and ownership moving forward? 

 

There's no other reason why he wouldn't sign now. 

 

Team's winning. He's producing (I guess that depends on whether he's in one of his droughts). 

 

He's either greedy, or he doesn't want to remain a Canuck...

 

Is it that simple? 

 

I think he just wants to be able to use award nominations and play-off performance in negotiations this summer. He believes in himself and thinks he'll produce in the playoffs (as he did in the bubble) so he wants that on his resume before he signs a deal.

Edited January 26 by MattJVD