[Report/Rumour] Elias Pettersson Contract Talks

[ronning4center]

5 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Isn't Nylander the most recent signing? Can you use 1-2 years previous contracts to gauge the current pay? I'd love to see Petey at $10 Million. But I just don't think it's happening. 

Miller is fantastic at $8 million, but he's older. You can use those other examples all you want, that's why it's a negotiation. But if it's for a low cap hit, the term won't be long. And pretty sure Petey then is going bye bye once he's UFA.

Yes he's older but damn.  Jt could keep this up for 4 more years.

[flickyoursedin]

2 minutes ago, ronning4center said:

I'll preface this.  I thought panarin had more goals.  My bad.  And I was referring to 25 year old panarin.  

I think Pettersson needs to stick at center if I’m going to be comfortable paying him that much! So if he plays center then he’d be better then both 25 year old Tkachuk and Panarin.

[Elias Pettersson]

33 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

 

Panarin has never sniffed 50 goals, his career high is 32. I'd take Petey over Panarin just because of age, but other than age they are similar players.

 

Tkachuk I take over Petey because of the intangibles but with that said, Petey gets more points so they are probably around the same value.

Panarin and Petey aren’t similar players. Petey is a 102 point two way centre who plays in all situations. Panarin is a 96 point one dimensional winger who can’t play defence and doesn’t kill penalties. 

[ronning4center]

3 hours ago, flickyoursedin said:

I think Pettersson needs to stick at center if I’m going to be comfortable paying him that much! So if he plays center then he’d be better then both 25 year old Tkachuk and Panarin.

Oooo panarin maybe...and that contract is not aging well.  Tkachuk can take over a game and lead the players.  Thr next 25 games and a play off round or two will help shape my opinion.  Right now I see a guy whi tries hard but bumbles a lot of plays...stick handles the puck away and spends a lot of time cleaning the ice.  He can capitalize on opportunities very well if he has excellent linemates but the fact that we keep talking about finding players to play with him so he's noticeable is a red flag.  Dude has played with half the team and still cant lead a line.  I think coaching has realized this.   Just don't see him as a leader.

Edited February 25 by ronning4center

[Coconuts]

12 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

At least unlike Toronto and Edmonton, we are putting money into solid defencemen.

 

I don't disagree, but there's a good chance he wins a Norris this season and that'll only drive up the price

 

Interestingly enough Hughes and Makar will be due for extensions at the same time, watch em both get 12M+

 

Pettersson, Hughes, my take is you're better off paying market value for your stars and trying to find deals for your bottom six as Allvin appears to have done

 

The cost of success is having to pay guys, but also having to replace guys as cap forces turnover

 

Pettersson likely gets signed, but I wouldn't expect a discount from him

Edited February 25 by Coconuts

[Ghostsof1915]

3 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

 

The cap has only raised 2 million in the last 5 years so even if you take a percentage of total cap they are all comparable. Out of those that I listed Panarin is probably the least comparable because he was signed as a UFA.

Agree to disagree. But I won't surprised what the amount will be. It's just how things change year to year in the NHL.

The GM's seem to have no self-control, despite the controls and rules the NHL puts in place.

I'm not going to blame PA. I'm blaming the market, specifically that idiot in Toronto.

[Dom]

To Buffalo:

Elias Pettersson

 

To Vancouver

Cozens or Mittelstadt

Tuch

1st 2024 

 

Too much? Not enough? 

[ronning4center]

3 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Agree to disagree. But I won't surprised what the amount will be. It's just how things change year to year in the NHL.

The GM's seem to have no self-control, despite the controls and rules the NHL puts in place.

I'm not going to blame PA. I'm blaming the market, specifically that idiot in Toronto.

I think Rutherford won't be pushed around.  Of all the GMs especially a hall of famer might just be saying...your not gonna slow play me kid.   Hey Bo horvat....you're gonna run me up?  OK have fun at the Allstar game .  I'm gonna trade your ass and make you wear the wrong jersey in public.  Have fun missing the playoffs

Edited February 25 by ronning4center

[Heretic]

I am surprised that agents haven't negotiated for a percentage of the cap instead of fixed amounts.

So, say Pettersson got a contract that is 13% of the team cap, every year that the cap goes up - so does his wage for that year.

 

[ronning4center]

6 minutes ago, Dom said:

To Buffalo:

Elias Pettersson

 

To Vancouver

Cozens or Mittelstadt

Tuch

1st 2024 

 

Too much? Not enough? 

Not terrible imo.  I figured elias godderson might get us 2 firsts. It's funny but the closer we get to the play offs the more I'd almost rather have tuch in our line up over a petey like player.  His ppg were amazing up till a few weeks ago.  Let's say he plays at an annual 50 point pace when games are hard and intense.  Are we still thinking he's worth 12?

Edited February 25 by ronning4center

[higgyfan]

14 minutes ago, Dom said:

To Buffalo:

Elias Pettersson

 

To Vancouver

Cozens or Mittelstadt

Tuch

1st 2024 

 

Too much? Not enough? 

 

I think it would be way too much of a gamble for the Sabres.  I don't see EP signing a new

contract with Buffalo.

[Drakrami]

18 minutes ago, Heretic said:

I am surprised that agents haven't negotiated for a percentage of the cap instead of fixed amounts.

So, say Pettersson got a contract that is 13% of the team cap, every year that the cap goes up - so does his wage for that year.

 

lol agents probably already do negotiate as a percentage of cap for premium players. As for your second point, it's probably against the rules to have increasing wages on a yearly basis. 

[canucks curse]

28 minutes ago, Dom said:

To Buffalo:

Elias Pettersson

 

To Vancouver

Cozens or Mittelstadt

Tuch

1st 2024 

 

Too much? Not enough? 

I would do that trade 

Imho it’s even ish

 

i would trade Petey in the offseason tho, I really think he is conserving energy for the playoffs where he will go bananas in an effort to sky rocket his price to Mathews mackinnon territory 

 

this will also raise his trade value 

 

I would trade him in offseason 

I would ship to Chicago for beddard or whomever has 1st OA for macklin - I am sure JR and PA have considered that 

[Coconuts]

34 minutes ago, Heretic said:

I am surprised that agents haven't negotiated for a percentage of the cap instead of fixed amounts.

So, say Pettersson got a contract that is 13% of the team cap, every year that the cap goes up - so does his wage for that year.

 

 

Good point, players would love this

[qwijjibo]

1 hour ago, Coconuts said:

 

There's a solid chance Hughes actually ends up making more than Pettersson by the time his deal is up for renewal

Absolutely 

[qwijjibo]

16 minutes ago, canucks curse said:

I would do that trade 

Imho it’s even ish

 

i would trade Petey in the offseason tho, I really think he is conserving energy for the playoffs where he will go bananas in an effort to sky rocket his price to Mathews mackinnon territory 

 

this will also raise his trade value 

 

I would trade him in offseason 

I would ship to Chicago for beddard or whomever has 1st OA for macklin - I am sure JR and PA have considered that 

Chicago wouldn't touch Pettersson for Bedard. 

[iinatcc]

59 minutes ago, Dom said:

To Buffalo:

Elias Pettersson

 

To Vancouver

Cozens or Mittelstadt

Tuch

1st 2024 

 

Too much? Not enough? 

 

Getting Tuch would be amazing for the future memes alone 

 

[NoCupSyndrome]

1 hour ago, ronning4center said:

I found that strange too.  Elliot is legit though.  Maybe Rutherford and alvin know something we don't. Maybe peteys agent is putting g out feelers.   Guy hasn't signed and he has a blank cheque.  I'm trying to remember ever seeing this in my 35 years of hockey watching.  Every hold out has been for a certain dollar value.  EP is flat out saying no.  We might need to consider everything.

 

Agree that everything has to be on the table. Just laying out a rant in that post haha

 

End of the day, nothing can be done until the summer so hopefully local fans and media just drop it (as much as possible). 

 

EP is betting on himself, and potentially the team to do well in the playoffs, so can't fault him at all.

 

[ronning4center]

15 minutes ago, NoCupSyndrome said:

 

Agree that everything has to be on the table. Just laying out a rant in that post haha

 

End of the day, nothing can be done until the summer so hopefully local fans and media just drop it (as much as possible). 

 

EP is betting on himself, and potentially the team to do well in the playoffs, so can't fault him at all.

 

Unfortunately we are passionate and so long as petey holds out its going to be a topic.  The last time I was upset about a deal was when Kessler said I'm not resigning because I want to play for a winner.  I think that's the issue for most.

[Hammertime]

Pete needs to play with aggression. When he does he is elite. This season there were 13 games where he registered 3 or more hits. In those games he put up 18 points. In the games where he went ham and registered 4 or more hits (7) he put up 12 points. There is a direct correlation between Pete hitting and Pete scoring. 

[Screw]

1 hour ago, Dom said:

To Buffalo:

Elias Pettersson

 

To Vancouver

Cozens or Mittelstadt

Tuch

1st 2024 

 

Too much? Not enough? 

Horrible for Van

[Curmudgeon]

Petey is currently 10th overall in NHL scoring, yet there are still posters around here who would rather trade him than pay him anything in excess of $10M. Those folks should maybe look at the cold, heard reality of how much it costs for top players in the NHL. Here are the top ten scorers as of noon on February 25. Note that the two lowest cap hits in the top ten are JT Miller and Petey. Source: CapFriendly

 

1 Nikita Kucherov, Tampa Bay, Cap hit $9.5 Actual salary $10

2 Nathan MacKinnon, Colorado cap hit $12.6 Actual salary $16.5

3 Connor McDavid, Edmonton Cap hit Cap hit $12.5 Actual salary $11

4 David Pastrnak, Boston Cap hit $11.25 Actual salary $13 

5 J.T. Miller, Vancouver Cap hit $8 Actual salary $9.5

6 William Nylander, Toronto  Cap hit $11.5  Actual salary $13.5 (New contract)

7 Artemi Panarin, NY Rangers Cap hit $11.642. Actual salary $14

8 Auston Matthews, Toronto Cap Hit $13.25 Actual salary $16.7  (New contract)

9 Mikko Rantanen, Colorado Cap Hit $9.25  Actual salary $12

10 Elias Pettersson, Vancouver Cap Hit $7.5 Actual Salary $10.25 (New contract pending)

 

So unless he goes on a prolonged slump and puts up only another half dozen points this season, does anybody seriously believe Petey will sign for anything less than $12.5M?

[EdgarM]

11 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Miller is our best forward hands-down now, he carried this team against Boston when all hope looked lost. That's what you get for 12-13M. Petey was invisible, lost the puck a bunch of times, barely did anything. He's our 2nd line center, has been for a while and probably will be for another year or so. How can he justify making 4-5M more than Miller then?

 

The same goes for Lindholm - he's a checking defensive center who's scoring at what, a 50-60 point pace? How can he justify making 8M which is Miller money who's essentially a monster two-way 100pt top line (on a top team) center? I know JT took quite a discount and we signed him before he popped off, but look around the league, at their roles and points. Lindholm is playing like a 2.5C. Petey a 2C. Miller a 1C. People saying that Petey and Lindholm want a combined 20M is why Toronto is so top-loaded and will never do well. If these guys want that sort of money, trade them or let them walk and we focus on other guys.

 

I wouldn't give Petey any more than 11M at this rate. Sure, let's wait for the end of the season and playoffs to really decide. If he hits 100pts and scores at a PPG in the playoffs, pay the man 12M. If he ends up at 90pts and like 0.5PPG in the playoffs, he doesn't deserve much more than 10.5M.

 

As for Lindholm, I'd offer him 6M. Some dumb team will pay him 7-8M and let them go for him, he must be the most over-rated player I've heard of in a while. Everyone's still living in delusion from his single 40G season with Gaudreau but he's nowhere near that impactful nowadays and hasn't been for a while. Right now he looks like Manny Malhotra out there. You want at least 70-80pts from an 8M player.

 

Big decisions for PA this post-season, especially because we know JT isn't going to play like this forever and it honestly might be his last or second last solid >PPG year, but we can't be throwing our money and cap away if it's not justified.

This is what I have been saying for awhile now, if we are building  a TEAM, Miller is #1C and Lindholm is #2 C according to their play. Petey has a hard time even playing Center on a full time basis and he hasnt been able to gel with anyone lately. I thought Lindholm would help but nothing has come of it yet.

If we are looking at a #2 C, I would choose Lindholm over Petey, as he seems to do better with the tighter checking. I totally agree though, he is over rated and he would have to come in at a reasonable salary or we move on from him too. We need to stay far away from the Toronto Model of building a Contender at all costs.

[Diamonds]

2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Panarin and Petey aren’t similar players. Petey is a 102 point two way centre who plays in all situations. Panarin is a 96 point one dimensional winger who can’t play defence and doesn’t kill penalties. 

 

Panarin is also a Hart finalist and one-time 1st Team All-star and two-time 2nd Team All-star. While Panarin might be more one-dimensional than Petey, those are accolades that Petey doesn't have and earn a big paycheck. He also signed as a UFA which tends to command a bigger paycheck.

 

2 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

  Whether we like it or not. (And I don't) But Toronto has screwed us by giving Nylander $11.5. He and Petey have similar production right now, and Petey has gotten to the 100 point mark already. EP40 is over a point a game pace for his career. I can't see Petey taking less than $11.5 Million. And he's a better player overall than Nylander.

Unless Petey is of the mindset if he leaves a little on the table, that's a better chance to keep winning I'd consider it lucky if he got him at $11 Million.

Personally I don't think anyone on Toronto can be used as a comparable. Toronto has been forced to overpay their stars since they overpayed Tavares as a free agent and it has wrecked their internal cap structure. Nylander should have been in the $9.5M-$10M range but since he was driving their offense to start the year Toronto was forced to pay him a contract to match Tavares/Marner.

[EdgarM]

3 hours ago, Maniwaki Canuck said:

I feel like he was that player 3+ years ago but hasn't been since, or at least often enough.  It isn't "his" team any longer and there's something off about him attitude-wise. 

I thought he was at a good trajectory a couple years ago too, I thought he would get stronger, be able to stay on his feet and be more dominant in the corners. I felt the same about Bo too though, his trajectory was good, until it wasn't and at some point, he is what he is.