[Report/Rumour] Elias Pettersson Contract Talks

[Gurn]

22 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Do we really care about 5 years from now?

Yes, I expect to still be alive, and the Canucks to still be playing hockey, so I care.

[Coconuts]

Are we there yet

[gwarrior]

5 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

Those guys just trying to amplify their platform by making ridiculous rumours. They know the Vancouver market will respond. But with the actual rumour. Eh, hearing that Nylander is already in talks with extension with the Leafs. If EP40 has been concerned with how the Canucks are organized and whether they're going to be a contender or not moving forward, why would he go to the Blackhawks, who are not only a shady organization for sexual misconduct and abuse within, but also they're going to suck for a few more years. EP40 and Nylander will get them to be an exciting team with Bedard, but how are they going to keep the puck out of the net with that defense and goaltender? It's just more losing for Petey, and he hates that as it is now. 

 

I call bullshit. 

 

This shit kind of reminds me of when the Rangers, back in the day, went out and spent like drunken sailors, and iced a top line of Theo Fleury, Lindros, and Bure. I've read Fleury's book a few times, it's a good read by the way, but in his book he said that top line should have been dynamite. But they had ZERO chemistry. So if Nylander and Pettersson want to play with Bedard in Chicago, and it actually happens, I would get SO much pleasure if it fell flat on it's face.

[NHL97OneTimer]

4 hours ago, HKSR said:

I'm with @Jester13. I'm thinking it'll be between 10 and 11m.

Should be $9M/yr if we remove all bias.  Pretty tough to build a winner with a figure north of that amount as well.  Next Quinn will want $12 and then we're hooped.

[Alflives]

20 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Should be $9M/yr if we remove all bias.  Pretty tough to build a winner with a figure north of that amount as well.  Next Quinn will want $12 and then we're hooped.

Petey will sign 9.5 x 4 years. The empties have chimed this for many debauches. 
Now join Alf in honouring the greatness of the empties. 

Edited December 29, 2023 by Alflives

[LaBamba]

I hope he wants to go to the Blackhawks. The compensation would far outweigh EP40. 

[N4ZZY]

3 hours ago, gwarrior said:

This shit kind of reminds me of when the Rangers, back in the day, went out and spent like drunken sailors, and iced a top line of Theo Fleury, Lindros, and Bure. I've read Fleury's book a few times, it's a good read by the way, but in his book he said that top line should have been dynamite. But they had ZERO chemistry. So if Nylander and Pettersson want to play with Bedard in Chicago, and it actually happens, I would get SO much pleasure if it fell flat on it's face.

 

but thing is, what if it doesn't fall flat on its face? I'd be torn apart to see Chicago rebuild that fast with our franchise player that we drafted. Ugh. 

 

With that being said, I think it's just that, unsubstantiated rumours. 

 

[N4ZZY]

2 hours ago, LaBamba said:

I hope he wants to go to the Blackhawks. The compensation would far outweigh EP40. 

 

No way Allvin lets him go. 

 

[N4ZZY]

3 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Should be $9M/yr if we remove all bias.  Pretty tough to build a winner with a figure north of that amount as well.  Next Quinn will want $12 and then we're hooped.

 

Quinn definitely deserves a lot more than what he's making right now. That's a value contract right now. 

 

I love Petey, but I'm not sure that he deserves to be making McDavid kind of money. I wonder what the hold up is. He was concerned about playing for a winner, and Allvin and Rutherford to this point, has proven that they're committed to at the very least, building a winner. So it has to be the dollars, doesn't it? 

 

[Diamonds]

9 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

don't care, he wasn't signed for the back end, the window is now plus a few more years. 

The issue with that being the OEL cap penalty that rises to $2.35M next season then jumps to $4.67M for the next two seasons after that. Obviously Miller's playing incredibly well right now and well over his $8M cap hit, but if the idea was that our contention window is roughly the first 4 years of his contract before he likely starts an age related decline then having to deal with almost $5M of dead cap really hurts that contention window.

 

I'm really enjoying a lot of what PA and JR have done, and the team finally seems to be well balanced for the first time in a decade where we are no longer trying to endlessly fit square pegs in round holes. But, I'm still not convinced the OEL buyout was the correct decision. I've started to treat Miller's cap hit as his contract + OELs buyout penalty. So this season Miller's an $8.1M cap hit (well worth it), next season he's a $10.3M cap hit (likely closer to his true value), and the two years following he's a $12.7M cap hit (likely a bit overpaid unless the cap rises quite significantly). Obviously Miller isn't being paid OEL's money, but it's hard to ignore the dead cap.

 

 

Regarding Petey, overall he's still having a strong season. However, he's certainly cooled off after a red-hot start and has been much more inconsistent lately. If Petey keeps up his current on again off again routine then he's probably playing himself down to Sebastian Aho's contract rather than up to MacKinnon's contract.

[R3aL]

15 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Bisonette or one of his guests?

Wasn’t biz

[wai_lai416]

9 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

 

Quinn definitely deserves a lot more than what he's making right now. That's a value contract right now. 

 

I love Petey, but I'm not sure that he deserves to be making McDavid kind of money. I wonder what the hold up is. He was concerned about playing for a winner, and Allvin and Rutherford to this point, has proven that they're committed to at the very least, building a winner. So it has to be the dollars, doesn't it? 

 

Mcdavid money? We all know mcdavid next contract will be in the 15-16mil range.. ppl need to stop using other contract signed years ago as comparison ffs.. mcdavid when signed was 16.6% of the entire teams cap. So how the hell is ep getting mcdavid money? Is he signing for 16-17% of the teams cap? Not sure what part of salary cap goes up = new contract goes up don’t people understand. Cap going up only benefits existing contracts and not yet to signed contracts. If mcdavid is up for renewal today is he going to be 12.5mil??

 

we might as well say most of these guys shouldn’t be getting more than Crosby money .. how dare they make more money than Crosby did in his career. 

[Jester13]

1 hour ago, wai_lai416 said:

Mcdavid money? We all know mcdavid next contract will be in the 15-16mil range.. ppl need to stop using other contract signed years ago as comparison ffs.. mcdavid when signed was 16.6% of the entire teams cap. So how the hell is ep getting mcdavid money? Is he signing for 16-17% of the teams cap? Not sure what part of salary cap goes up = new contract goes up don’t people understand. Cap going up only benefits existing contracts and not yet to signed contracts. If mcdavid is up for renewal today is he going to be 12.5mil??

 

we might as well say most of these guys shouldn’t be getting more than Crosby money .. how dare they make more money than Crosby did in his career. 

Percentage of cap is what we should be focusing on. Is Petey at McD/Matthews levels of 15-16%? The answer is simply no. Petey should be around the Point/Tkachuk level of 11.5-12.5%, and even that is arguably generous.

 

If Petey thinks he's better than he is, then trade him now for a haul and move on. We want talent who are also smart and know what it takes to build a championship team, not selfish players (e.g. Marner, Matthew's, Leafs) who care about making top dollar at the expense of their teammates and fans. 

 

The big question is: which Petey doe we have? 

[Attila Umbrus]

15 hours ago, Alflives said:

Petey will sign 9.5 x 4 years. The empties have chimed this for many debauches. 
Now join Alf in honouring the greatness of the empties. 

I hope your right Alf that’s a good contract right there! 
 

But you may want to sober up because I don’t see Petey signing for less than 10 unfortunately…

 

Here have a sandwich, it will help dilute the alcohol in your stomach and make you think straight.

[wai_lai416]

20 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

Percentage of cap is what we should be focusing on. Is Petey at McD/Matthews levels of 15-16%? The answer is simply no. Petey should be around the Point/Tkachuk level of 11.5-12.5%, and even that is arguably generous.

 

If Petey thinks he's better than he is, then trade him now for a haul and move on. We want talent who are also smart and know what it takes to build a championship team, not selfish players (e.g. Marner, Matthew's, Leafs) who care about making top dollar at the expense of their teammates and fans. 

 

The big question is: which Petey doe we have? 

so what players out there are not about making top dollars may I ask? Please don’t give me the QH or the JT example. QH signed to what was a gamble on both side coming off a horrendous defensive campaign. Miller maybe took 500k less than what was projected and his contract starts when he’s in his 30 and guaranteed he won’t be in his prime for the duration of it. Literally no player in this league in their prime didn’t go for money. All the so call cap friendly contracts were gambles by the team and players where the team won.. wasn’t because the player thought oh I’m going to try and win a cup here so I’ll sign for below market.. I still dunno where all the nonsense of he’s looking for mcdavid money coming from.. is he looking for 15-16% of the cap is he looking for 13+mil? Point and MT is literally going to be making the same as anyone in the 12-13mil range in half the cities in the nhl again terrible example they’ll literally make almost an extra year worth of income after tax than anyone else signed to the same cap hit.. yes low tax team will always have a massive cap advantage whether you like it or not. NHL players are not like nba mlb player where an average joe will make as much as ur top players on the nhl so the tax does matters. 
 

if you think ep is asking for too much or not worth the amount that’s fine go trade him. But don’t expect this team to be able to recoup equal value back and think we can still ice a team capable of making the playoff. This team on forward it’s literally ep and miller.. if either of them struggles the team struggles especially ep. 

[The Duke]

2 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

so what players out there are not about making top dollars may I ask? Please don’t give me the QH or the JT example. QH signed to what was a gamble on both side coming off a horrendous defensive campaign. Miller maybe took 500k less than what was projected and his contract starts when he’s in his 30 and guaranteed he won’t be in his prime for the duration of it. Literally no player in this league in their prime didn’t go for money. All the so call cap friendly contracts were gambles by the team and players where the team won.. wasn’t because the player thought oh I’m going to try and win a cup here so I’ll sign for below market.. I still dunno where all the nonsense of he’s looking for mcdavid money coming from.. is he looking for 15-16% of the cap is he looking for 13+mil? Point and MT is literally going to be making the same as anyone in the 12-13mil range in half the cities in the nhl again terrible example they’ll literally make almost an extra year worth of income after tax than anyone else signed to the same cap hit.. yes low tax team will always have a massive cap advantage whether you like it or not. NHL players are not like nba mlb player where an average joe will make as much as ur top players on the nhl so the tax does matters. 
 

if you think ep is asking for too much or not worth the amount that’s fine go trade him. But don’t expect this team to be able to recoup equal value back and think we can still ice a team capable of making the playoff. This team on forward it’s literally ep and miller.. if either of them struggles the team struggles especially ep. 

 

Yeah. If we do trade Petey it’s going to be very hard to maintain the current success, let alone build on it.
 

Sometimes I wonder if people genuinely think 9 mil is fair value or they’re playing pretend GM and, like, that would be their opening offer.
 

Ok, Petey’s agent laughs at 9 mil. The agent points out he’s a 100 point player with Selke consideration.  1C on a top team.  He’s signing away 1 year of RFA plus the prime years of his career - age related decline is unlikely even on a max term deal… and the cap is finally going up again.  The agent asks for Matthews money  - taking a small haircut and going an extra year in good faith.  13 x 5.
 

Now what? 

Edited December 29, 2023 by The Duke

[Jester13]

4 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

so what players out there are not about making top dollars may I ask? Please don’t give me the QH or the JT example. QH signed to what was a gamble on both side coming off a horrendous defensive campaign. Miller maybe took 500k less than what was projected and his contract starts when he’s in his 30 and guaranteed he won’t be in his prime for the duration of it. Literally no player in this league in their prime didn’t go for money. All the so call cap friendly contracts were gambles by the team and players where the team won.. wasn’t because the player thought oh I’m going to try and win a cup here so I’ll sign for below market.. I still dunno where all the nonsense of he’s looking for mcdavid money coming from.. is he looking for 15-16% of the cap is he looking for 13+mil? Point and MT is literally going to be making the same as anyone in the 12-13mil range in half the cities in the nhl again terrible example they’ll literally make almost an extra year worth of income after tax than anyone else signed to the same cap hit.. yes low tax team will always have a massive cap advantage whether you like it or not. NHL players are not like nba mlb player where an average joe will make as much as ur top players on the nhl so the tax does matters. 
 

if you think ep is asking for too much or not worth the amount that’s fine go trade him. But don’t expect this team to be able to recoup equal value back and think we can still ice a team capable of making the playoff. This team on forward it’s literally ep and miller.. if either of them struggles the team struggles especially ep. 

JT is worth more than what he signed for. Much more. He's on pace for around 109 points. He's a 10-11 million dollar player but took 8 because of his age. 

 

The reason why I say use percentage of cap is because some people think Petey is worth 12+ million per year, simply because the cap is going up. Well, Petey had 102 points last year (his first time) and on pace for less than 98 points this year. He's a 10 million dollar player due to his age - if he was Millers age then hes an 8 million dollar player. Since the cap is going up 4 million, some people think you add on a couple million for him, but that's ludicrous since 12% of the increase is 480k. Why would anyone think he should get 50%+ of the cap increase when the cap is to build an entire team? 

 

I think he'll get signed for 10-11. Anything more than that and Allvin is simply overpaying a little just to get it done and over with. 

 

Also, pretty sure the tax argument has been debunked before. 

[Hairy Kneel]

They're playing him more physical.  He's slowly getting dragged into a knuckle dragging style. That's not his game.

Instead of creating offensive chances he's looking for hits. Fk the hits Petie! Use your magical sedinery bro!!

[Lemon Face]

5 minutes ago, Hairy Kneel said:

They're playing him more physical.  He's slowly getting dragged into a knuckle dragging style. That's not his game.

Instead of creating offensive chances he's looking for hits. Fk the hits Petie! Use your magical sedinery bro!!

But coach love thugs.EP and Kuz and Mik are not.Maybe that is the reason for rumors circulating around????????

[Hairy Kneel]

3 minutes ago, Lemon Face said:

But coach love thugs.EP and Kuz and Mik are not.Maybe that is the reason for rumors circulating around????????

 

[Rekker]

3 hours ago, The Duke said:

The agent asks for Matthews money  - taking a small haircut and going an extra year in good faith.  13 x 5.

Man I love EP, but if that is their number, take it or leave it? Bye, bye. I'm ok with anything in the 10 range, especially long term.

[The Duke]

14 minutes ago, Rekker said:

Man I love EP, but if that is their number, take it or leave it? Bye, bye. I'm ok with anything in the 10 range, especially long term.

I’m just having fun playing devil’s advocate.  
 

If people are lowballing at 9, that’s what I’d be replying with if i were his agent. 
 

If you’re trading him, when?  Blow up the season at the trade deadline or wait until summer?
 

What if the agent leaks that he’ll only re-sign if traded to a contender, lowering his value and potential trade partners?  I think we’d still get a good haul but the C replacement would be older or younger.. and not as good.  With Miller’s age it’ll be very tough to replace what Petey should be able to do for the next 8 years.
 

IMO 10 mil you can probably get him for 1, 2, maaaybe 3 years? - but I don’t know why he’d sign for 2 or 3 when he can just threaten to take his 1 year of RFA and it’s straight to UFA bank at that point. 
 

FWIW I don’t think he gets 13, probably more 11.5 - 12 range - and I think he puts down roots here and goes 8 years.  I’d take that, easily. But who knows?  He’s a tough guy to read and publicly he’s been fairly guarded about his future.

[Rekker]

1 minute ago, The Duke said:

He’s a tough guy to read and publicly he’s been fairly guarded about his future

This is so true. He's a very serious young man. I'm a huge fan and I hope he extends max length. 

[Grandmaster]

20 hours ago, LaBamba said:

I hope he wants to go to the Blackhawks. The compensation would far outweigh EP40. 

An offer sheet would be 10.7M or higher which would give us the maximum 4 first round picks. I doubt we get another player as good as Petey in those first rounds and also we are not a team that will rebuild. That offer sheet would be matched.

 

However, if his intent is on leaving town then he obviously doesn’t are about “winning” like he earlier said. We may have not won a Cup yet but we are a bonafide top team in the NHL. If a player doesn’t want to be here then so be it, let him go. 

I this gossip of him wanting to go to Chicago is true, I would do my best to get Bedard. I doubt he will sign a long term there anyways once his ELC is over with (he is on the record of wanting to play here).

 

If Petey doesn’t sign by end of season, then:

 

Petey, 1st and Johnathan L for Bedard.  This would be a fair deal in my opinion. 
 

Allow them to negotiate a contract for Petey prior to the trade. 
 

 

Edited December 30, 2023 by Grandmaster

[wai_lai416]

17 minutes ago, Grandmaster said:

An offer sheet would be 10.7M or higher which would give us the maximum 4 first round picks. I doubt we get another player as good as Petey in those first rounds and also we are not a team that will rebuild. That offer sheet would be matched.

 

However, if his intent is on leaving town then he obviously doesn’t are about “winning” like he earlier said. We may have not won a Cup yet but we are a bonafide top team in the NHL. If a player doesn’t want to be here then so be it, let him go. 

I this gossip of him wanting to go to Chicago is true, I would do my best to get Bedard. I doubt he will sign a long term there anyways once his ELC is over with (he is on the record of wanting to play here).

 

If Petey doesn’t sign by end of season, then:

 

Petey, 1st and Johnathan L for Bedard.  This would be a fair deal in my opinion. 
 

Allow them to negotiate a contract for Petey prior to the trade. 
 

 

lol blackhawks is not going to offer sheet 10.7.. they will offer 8.5 1year for a 1st 2nd 3rd Canucks either forced to not match and take the 3 picks.. or they match and won’t be allowed to trade ep for the year and watch him walk to ufa or give him whatever he wants.. so  if the rumours are true then they can run that by ep play 1 year for 8.5 either for the Canucks or hawks and then we sign u to the massive deal u want. The Canucks are screwed up the ass if the hawks do the 8.5mil offer.. and sure the Canucks can retaliate later with bedard.. but that would require A to have the cap space and B Chicago taking their time and let bedard reach rfa.