[PGT] Canucks at Flames - F*** CBC Edition

[-dlc-]

12 hours ago, CanuckFanForever said:

My assessment of this team would be taken serious if this team started to slip out of the playoffs and below .500  

It would be really great if you'd take a wait and see approach instead of slagging a team that won. No matter how pretty/ugly it was.

 

"If's" and "buts".

[Hairy Kneel]

Love that stat

[-dlc-]

On 11/22/2023 at 8:37 PM, CanuckFanForever said:

So far the Canucks have proven they are ready to compete with the team like the Avs despite the refs

Also, this was exactly 10 days ago. So maybe pace yourself and don't decide on an ever changing basis each game. Big picture.

 

"Despite the refs" contradicts your new stance because you clearly recognized (a week and a half ago) that we were up against it with the refs.

 

Reactionary stuff that changes on each win/loss gets tiring. Be consistent. Sure, opinions change over time but...pick a side and enjoy the ride. 

[Sergiomomesso]

Just now, -dlc- said:

Also, this was exactly 10 days ago. So maybe pace yourself and don't decide on an ever changing basis on each game. Big picture.

 

"Despite the refs" contradicts your new stance because you clearly recognized (a week and a half ago) that we were up against it with the refs.

 

Reactionary stuff that changes on each win/loss gets tiring.

We have a winner folks. 
 

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, Mordekai said:

Exactly! So if god forbids anything happens to hronek or bear. I rather see Myers over juulsen or friedman as the second pair rhd.

anyway no way allvin trades Myers without two more rhd replacement not named friedman or juulsen since juulsen is painful to watch and shouldn’t be a top 6 for this team

Yup. We might even hear about a Myers’ extension prior to the TDL. Not too sure if fair value for him but something like 2-3 mil x 3 years could be in order. In the right role (bottom pairing, second unit PK, 18 minutes and he’s fine. 

[JamesB]

51 minutes ago, Heretic said:

Didn't get to watch the game, how was Zadorov?  

1. Zadorov was very good. He played close to 18 minutes, allowing Hughes to play on 22 minutes, which is a big help.

 

2. His advanced stats were excellent. As a summary measure his on-ice expected goals percentage was 70%, which is excellent.

 

3. He did not have a lot of "hits" but he was a significant physical presence.

 

4. He looked good to me by the eye test. I did not see any evidence of "chaotic" play.

 

5. He made the key play on the empty net goal that turned out to be the game-winner.

 

It is quite possible that the Zadorov trade made the difference in this game. He provides a lot of value for the Canucks who were very thin at LD with Soucy out before bringing in Z.  Great move by JRPA. 

[Rip The Mesh]

23 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

They mentioned him battling something and I really believe there is/was something. My guess was groin but he also was seen taping his wrist. He takes a bit of a beating out there so there's no reason to think he didn't have something "bugging" him but not enough to keep him out of the lineup. He's missed games in the past and I feel like h likely gets to weigh in, at least to some degree, on if he plays or sits. Especially as he's entering negotiations...want to keep him happy (and healthy).

That makes sense, particularly a wrist scenario. could be groin too I suppose. Either way would surely cause grimace in his facial expressions. Hockey

players, the best of the best so to speak, tend to not let on except to their trainers. 

He can't not be thinking about his next contract or extention, but I wouldn't think that would show on the ice. I might be wrong, all superstars are different  

[spook007]

11 hours ago, Darius said:

Looked like one of Mikheyev's better games.  No training camp, off of major surgery.  Hopefully he keeps this up. It was a good move to put Lafferty on that line, he can win some board battles and charge the net.  Kuz on BB/JT's line is a good mix too.

He's got the speed too... They can all move... baby steps, but looking good so far...

[Barnstorm]

6 minutes ago, Sergiomomesso said:

We have a winner folks. 
 

 

12 hours ago, Barnstorm said:

 

I think he capitulated here. 

[Mordekai]

8 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Yup. We might even hear about a Myers’ extension prior to the TDL. Not too sure if fair value for him but something like 2-3 mil x 3 years could be in order. In the right role (bottom pairing, second unit PK, 18 minutes and he’s fine. 

2.5 x 3 would be fair for 3rd pair but because guddy got $4mil in the open market that agents will use his contract as a comparable for bottom pair rhd

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

14 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

Also, this was exactly 10 days ago. So maybe pace yourself and don't decide on an ever changing basis each game. Big picture.

 

"Despite the refs" contradicts your new stance because you clearly recognized (a week and a half ago) that we were up against it with the refs.

 

Reactionary stuff that changes on each win/loss gets tiring. Be consistent. Sure, opinions change over time but...pick a side and enjoy the ride. 

The Avs game was their best game in all of Nov. 

 

That should first tell you for me it is not about wins and loses. If you recall the Canucks lost that game.

 

Second it should also tell you and all fans that really watch the game that is a problem. The problem is their motivation is wrong. If they only truly compete against the players on the other side Maker vs Hughes and MacKinnon Vs Petey that's an issue. They should play every team at most 2/3 of the games like that. The motivation should be to compete against every team not the ones they choose to compete against. Tired or not the Canucks wanted to show fight. Where is the fight in the other games. That is on Tocchet to have them prepared every game. Losing to Vegas isn't the issue not being prepared to fight is. Winning against Cal ok good but where was the fight to keep the lead. Instead they sat back on a hope and a prayer that they would keep the lead

Edited December 3, 2023 by CanuckFanForever

[kilgore]

2 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

The Avs game was their best game in all of Nov. 

 

That should first tell you for me it is not about wins and loses. If you recall the Canucks lost that game.

 

Second it should also tell you and all fans that really watch the game that is a problem. The problem is their motivation is wrong. If they only truly compete against the players on the other side Maker vs Hughes and MacKinnon Vs Petey that's an issue. They should play every team at most 2/3 of the games like that. The motivation should be to compete against every team not the ones they choose to compete against. Tired or not the Canucks wanted to show fight. Where is the fight in the other games. That is on Tocchet to have them prepared every game. Losing to Vegas isn't the issue not being prepared to fight is. Winning against Cal ok good but where was the fight to keep the lead. Instead they sat back on a hope and a prayer that they would keep the lead

 

[Kragar]

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

The Avs game was their best game in all of Nov. 

 

That should first tell you for me it is not about wins and loses. If you recall the Canucks lost that game.

 

Second it should also tell you and all fans that really watch the game that is a problem. The problem is their motivation is wrong. If they only truly compete against the players on the other side Maker vs Hughes and MacKinnon Vs Petey that's an issue. They should play every team at most 2/3 of the games like that. The motivation should be to compete against every team not the ones they choose to compete against. Tired or not the Canucks wanted to show fight. Where is the fight in the other games. That is on Tocchet to have them prepared every game. Losing to Vegas isn't the issue not being prepared to fight is. Winning against Cal ok good but where was the fight to keep the lead. Instead they sat back on a hope and a prayer that they would keep the lead

[-dlc-]

12 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

The problem is their motivation is wrong. The motivation should be to compete against every team not the ones they choose to compete against. Tired or not the Canucks wanted to show fight. Where is the fight in the other games. That is on Tocchet to have them prepared every game. Losing to Vegas isn't the issue not being prepared to fight is. Winning against Cal ok good but where was the fight to keep the lead. Instead they sat back on a hope and a prayer that they would keep the lead

You dumb it down and don't realize....it's tough in the NHL. Good teams lose, bad teams win. Happens. Don't panic.

 

That's exactly what I mean up there by a "game by game" basis that you decide on and change, drastically, in your opinion. 

 

Again...maybe wait and see what develops. At the first signs of imperfections don't default to projecting doom and gloom. Based on previous history and
"if" stuff.

 

You won't always see "the fight" in their game. Like when Miller's blocked a blast of a slapshot but comes back despite it...he may look a little off but that's not due to lack of fight or what some see as laziness. Actually, it proves the opposite....they do fight (through things at times). They're human beings and not robots. There are things factoring in for them each time they hit the ice. Some days they're better than others...all players experience that. Stuff hurts out there at times and can linger. All teams. Don't read it as lack of motivation or fight. Petey's been off...matters. Once he regains his form things look quite different. In the meantime, we're managing ok.

 

Armchair players have to understand that it is a grind at times. It's ok to have off games and not slay it and have convincing wins every game. If you can manage to regroup and take points when you need to, that counts.

 

Anyhow....if you don't see that they're motivated and fighting for this season, you're not looking hard enough.

 

Is it perfect? Nope, not even close. Are they in a pretty good spot right now? Yep. So live in the moment instead of trying to figure out what will happen in January. 

 

It's ridiculous to think they "choose" not to compete at times. If you know anything about human dynamics and what we've seen in their personalities, that's hardly the case. They want to win as badly as you want them to....it's just not as easy as you think it is.

 

 

[coolboarder]

3 hours ago, JayDangles said:

I understand math.. but your counting your chickens too early my friend. Only scenario where winning percentage gets you into the playoffs is if another pandemic happens.

Until then LA needs to win those games in hand, and they will need to do it with a tougher schedule than they've had.

If even if the Canucks sweep LA in season series, those 5 games in hand will not matter.  They may gain 2 more points by playing some team they beat and we didn't at the end of season.  That is why being concerned about games in hand is that you need to win those games for then to pass us and they will be fatigued and eventually lose those games.  We just went through tough schedule and passed the test with a .500 hockey without us giving them any points by OT for any wins.  This is more important than OT wins.  Islanders game don't really matter with loser point that they earned in the standing.  What it matters is that regulation wins don't give them a chance to stay closer to us.  It allows us to leap them for any tiebreaker scenario while other teams earned some points via the OT/SO losses.

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

1 minute ago, -dlc- said:

You dumb it down and don't realize....it's tough in the NHL. Good teams lose, bad teams win. 

 

That's exactly what I mean up there by a "game by game" basis that you decide on and change, drastically, in your opinion. 

 

Again...maybe wait and see what develops. At the first sings of imperfections some here immediately project doom and gloom. Some based on previous history and that's their (your) deal. "If" stuff.

 

You won't always see "the fight" in their game. Like when Miller's blocked a blast of a slapshot but comes back despite it...he may look a little off but that's not due to lack of fight or what some see as laziness. Actually, it proves the opposite....they do fight (through things at times). They're human beings and not robots. There are things factoring in for them each time they hit the ice. Some days they're better than others...all players experience that. Stuff hurts out there at times and can linger. All teams. Don't read it as lack of motivation or fight.

 

Armchair players have to understand that it is a grind at times. It's ok to have off games and not slay it and have convincing wins every game. If you can manage to regroup and take points when you need to, that counts.

 

Anyhow....if you don't see that they're motivated and fighting for this season, you're not looking hard enough.

 

Is it perfect? Nope, not even close. Are they in a pretty good spot right now? Yep. So live in the moment instead of trying to figure out what will happen in January. 

 

It's ridiculous to think they "choose" not to compete at times. 

 

 

It was 1 good game is the month of November. How much larger sample size do you need to realize the structure isn't there 

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

It was 1 good game is the month of November. How much larger sample size do you need to realize the structure isn't there 

[Nucker67]

Recorded the game, as I was at the Abby Canucks game last night. btw, Wolanin played and looked good.

 

I just watched the VAN-CGY game and I'm here to report the Canucks dominated the entire game. The score was closer than what actually happened. Calgary's mistakes were constant and it cost them. The Flames suck, but they did get a couple of lucky bounces past Demko. At no time were the Canucks in trouble of losing this game.

 

I'm looking forward to when this roster gels and gets rolling. It's going to be fun.

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by Nucker67

[-dlc-]

8 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

It was 1 good game is the month of November. How much larger sample size do you need to realize the structure isn't there 

 

They won 9 of 15 games in November. I'm ok with that even if you aren't.

 

Again...points aren't awarded for "good" performances....they're awarded for wins. So your asterisks are meaningless in that "big picture" way that I speak of. As a matter of fact, the fact that "the structure isn't there" but they're winning regardless shows that they've figured out HOW to win games that they maybe have no business winning. They have a coach who's helping them along the way and provides the insight they need.

 

Something's there if they get the wins. I don't care if it's chakras and sage cleansing that helps them get the points....I care that they get them. 

 

Get to the playoffs...learn along the way. That's what I see happening. A work in progress but they're showing some good signs. 

[Alflives]

Just now, -dlc- said:

 

They won 9 of 15 games in November. I'm ok with that even if you aren't.

 

Again...points aren't awarded for "good" performances....they're awarded for wins. So your asterisks are meaningless in that "big picture" way that I speak of.

 

Something's there if they get the wins. I don't care if it's chakras and sage cleansing that help them get the points....I care that they do.

[Mordekai]

7 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

It was 1 good game is the month of November. How much larger sample size do you need to realize the structure isn't there 

Just lower your expectation to a 90-95 points team as most of the nhl prognosticators did at the beginning of the season 

[Alflives]

Just now, Mordekai said:

Just lower your expectation to a 90-95 points team as most of the nhl prognosticators did at the beginning of the season 

We are getting 105 points. The same number that Quinn Hughes puts up this year. 

[coolboarder]

3 hours ago, stawns said:

 

The system they play suggests otherwise.......in their own end anyway.

They are aggressive when it comes to other team's breakouts which seems to be more effective and once they gained into our D zone and did not get the puck back via the broken neutral zone play, they collapse to ensure that perimeter shot which is easier to stop and is a low percent play.  You do not want to give up a danger-chance shots by being aggressive and that is why there's a chance of defensive breakdown if we are too aggressive in the D-zone.  PK aggression was a good example of a goal against.  The opponents seems to have a hard time gaining the zone when we are leading by dumping the puck and aggression is high at opponents end zone and they couldn't get it going until a broken play in the neutral zone helps them to have a faint scoring chance for we do have goaltending to help with that.  Once there's a save made, they get to collapse and control their defensive structure with perimeter is the best strategy for now until we get key players back.

[Nucker67]

Juulsen had a bit of unlucky puck luck, but I don't think he was terrible. He'll be good depth once they bring in another D. I'm assuming that will be Bear, with him, I believe, currently training in Kelowna, getting ready to play again.

 

When everyone's healthy?

 

Hughes - Hronek

Soucy - Cole

Zadorov - Myers

Bear

 

That's a pretty great D

 

Anyone else notice in the game when Petey was talking with Markstrom after the whistle, and it looked like Markstrom basically told him to f*** off out of his crease. I think that pissed Petey off a bit. He celebrated pretty hard in front of Markstrom after they scored.

 

Markstrom is mentally weak. Get in his face/head and rattle his cage and his whole game will be off.