[PGT] Canucks at Flames - F*** CBC Edition

[Silent Man]

34 minutes ago, Barnstorm said:

 

I think he capitulated here. 

Not quite it seems.

[Chon derry]

13 hours ago, CanuckFanForever said:

My assessment of this team would be taken serious if this team started to slip out of the playoffs and below .500  

 

 

Your assessment is just negative period !  Of the 1350 members on this site you’d be lucky to find a few, like maybe 5 That take you serious. Criticism of something that’s happened is one thing, but your projecting your criticism into the future (hasn’t happened yet) and suggesting only then after failure would posters agree with you. I’m sorry but if you yourself can’t see that this is taking your negativity to the next level without realizing it. then your in denial. 

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

15 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

 

They won 9 of 15 games in November. I'm ok with that even if you aren't.

 

Again...points aren't awarded for "good" performances....they're awarded for wins. So your asterisks are meaningless in that "big picture" way that I speak of. As a matter of fact, the fact that "the structure isn't there" but they're winning regardless shows that they've figured out HOW to win games that they maybe have no business winning. They have a coach who's helping them along the way and provides the insight they need.

 

Something's there if they get the wins. I don't care if it's chakras and sage cleansing that helps them get the points....I care that they get them. 

 

Get to the playoffs...learn along the way. That's what I see happening. A work in progress but they're showing some good signs. 

all it looks like to me is you agree with me the Structure isn't there and the good players are winning despite Tocchet's system. I agree but it is not sustainable long term and that is the big picture 

 

Big Picture,

 

Is making the playoffs but being 1 and done considered success in you mind when we currently have 5 of the top 25 leading scorers

[Gurn]

Is it just me, or has the amount of gatekeeping increased at our new location?

The dogpiling seems up as well.

Multiple person, unable to read someone else's post, and just move on. Or simply put a poster on ignore.

Nope-reply after reply, all complaining about the redundancy of someone else's post.

 

[aGENT]

 

 

@Smashian Kassian, ayyup Clark has tune-up work to do.

 

 

[Steamer4GM]

11 hours ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

 

Greg Millen?  He's only giving props to Markström because he was a goalie once upon a time himself.  As for his suitability for doing live hockey broadcasts, he should go the way of Bob Cole - into retirement - because he made so many gaffes during the game, like when Juulsen blocked a shot and then at the whistle, Millen said, "and there he goes to the bench....uhhhhhhhhhhh [dead air for 5 seconds]" while Juulsen was trying to skate it off first (didn't head to the bench after the whistle for at least 10 seconds).

Or when he said that Zadorov might have gotten his stick on our 3rd goal (it was Mikheyev - Z wasn't even on the ice)? lol

[Alflives]

Just now, CanuckFanForever said:

all it looks like to me is you agree with me the Structure isn't there and the good players are winning despite Tocchet's system. I agree but it is not sustainable long term and that is the big picture 

 

Big Picture,

 

Is making the playoffs but being 1 and done considered success in you mind when we currently have 5 of the top 25 leading scorers

Why are we not winning in the playoffs too? We have an elite core, and a phenomenal goalie. That’s a winning recipe in playoffs. 

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

1 minute ago, Chon derry said:

Your assessment is just negative period !  Of the 1350 members on this site you’d be lucky to find a few, like maybe 5 That take you serious. Criticism of something that’s happened is one thing, but your projecting your criticism into the future (hasn’t happened yet) and suggesting only then after failure would posters agree with you. I’m sorry but if you yourself can’t see that this is taking your negativity to the next level without realizing it. then your in denial. 

But it is happening game in game out the Canucks are not showing the compete level of a sustainable playoff team

[Steamer4GM]

Just now, aGENT said:

 

 

@Smashian Kassian, ayyup Clark has tune-up work to do.

 

 

Definitely not looking his stellar Snatcher self on that one

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Gurn said:

Is it just me, or has the amount of gatekeeping increased at our new location?

The dogpiling seems up as well.

Multiple person, unable to read someone else's post, and just move on. Or simply put a poster on ignore.

Nope-reply after reply, all complaining about the redundancy of someone else's post.

 

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

Just now, Alflives said:

Why are we not winning in the playoffs too? We have an elite core, and a phenomenal goalie. That’s a winning recipe in playoffs. 

because sustainable playoff teams don't have have to constantly out score their mistakes they minimize those mistakes.

 

Didn't Tocchet even say we needed to learn to win games 2-1 in the beginning of the season. That requires a defensive structure game that Tocchet seems to not be able to teach 

[Smashian Kassian]

3 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

 

@Smashian Kassian, ayyup Clark has tune-up work to do.

 

 

 

And once he lost it there was no coming back, right leg maybe caught up on the post or something. I'm sure they'll get that cleaned up.

[kilgore]

4 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

It was 1 good game is the month of November. How much larger sample size do you need to realize the structure isn't there 

 

Where did it go?

Is structure something that a person or even a team, just loses? In a couch cushion?

Tocchet's...and his assistant coaches...have greatly improved our defensive structure.  Lately, it hasn't been as effective. This can be because of a lot of small reasons combined.  A lot of games in a short period of time. Less practice.  Key injuries and their rookie replacements. Bad reffing. And of course, the Chaos Giraffe factor.

 

Sometimes its just because the other team is better on that night. Like the Vegas game.  I may be in the minority but I don't think they played a terrible game in that one. I just think it was the only game this season that....during the course of the game.... they lost faith that they could beat them.  Every other game this season, whether they won or lost, they looked like the better team, the team that had faith they COULD win the game, even if they didn't that night.  The Vegas game was the first one that it was clear half ways through, that they were playing a much superior built team that they'd need some puck luck to defeat.  I think it took a toll on a few of the top players in their confidence as the game wore on. But in the end, it was a good thing to know just what it will take to defeat the top tier teams of the league.

 

That structure has been learned. But they need the consistent practice time, plus in games, with new players to keep it nailed down. Since Tocchet came in the record speaks for itself. No reason to panic that we've completely lost our structure/system at this point in the season. Its close, right behind them. Just pull that cushion up and find it again for the next game.

[-dlc-]

1 minute ago, CanuckFanForever said:

I agree but it is not sustainable long term and that is the big picture 

 

Big Picture,

 

Is making the playoffs but being 1 and done considered success in you mind when we currently have 5 of the top 25 leading scorers

1. You can't state what's sustainable or not. It's proven when it is or isn't. They're finding ways to win...that gives them options. We have many pieces in place that will help sustain success.

 

2. You're projecting again. If we make the playoffs we'll see what they do then/there. We DO have 5 of the leading scorers...that gives us some good footing and a reason to believe we may be ok. Also, goaltending (Demko was a little off last night but generally isn't).

 

Anyhow, you can keep waiting for failure and dismissing the success. I celebrate when I can and tend to wait and see what happens in along range forecast way. I'm much happier doing it that way.

[-dlc-]

3 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

But it is happening game in game out the Canucks are not showing the compete level of a sustainable playoff team

So tell me which teams are. And give examples of how they are.

[DeNiro]

6 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

 

@Smashian Kassian, ayyup Clark has tune-up work to do.

 

 

Meh that happens.

 

He had to slide across to stop the potential one timer but once you commit to that you’re out of position.

 

It was a nice play by the Calgary player to hold it and out wait him.

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by DeNiro

[Alflives]

Just now, CanuckFanForever said:

because sustainable playoff teams don't have have to constantly out score their mistakes they minimize those mistakes.

 

Didn't Tocchet even say we needed to learn to win games 2-1 in the beginning of the season. That requires a defensive structure game that Tocchet seems to not be able to teach 

[stawns]

1 minute ago, DeNiro said:

Meh that happens.

 

He had to slide across to stop the potential one timer but once you commit to that you’re out of position.

 

It was a nice play by the Calgary player to hold it and out wait him.

 

 

That's how I saw it.......he pushed off hard to stop the one timer and Lindholm just made a good play outwaiting him.

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

Just now, kilgore said:

 

Where did it go?

Is structure something that a person or even a team, just loses? In a couch cushion?

Tocchet's...and his assistant coaches...have greatly improved our defensive structure.  Lately, it hasn't been as effective. This can be because of a lot of small reasons combined.  A lot of games in a short period of time. Less practice.  Key injuries and their rookie replacements. Bad reffing. And of course, the Chaos Giraffe factor.

 

Sometimes its just because the other team is better on that night. Like the Vegas game.  I may be in the minority but I don't think they played a terrible game in that one. I just think it was the only game this season that....during the course of the game.... they lost faith that they could beat them.  Every other game this season, whether they won or lost, they looked like the better team, the team that had faith they COULD win the game, even if they didn't that night.  The Vegas game was the first one that it was clear half ways through, that they were playing a much superior built team that they'd need some puck luck to defeat.  I think it took a toll on a few of the top players in their confidence as the game wore on. But in the end, it was a good thing to know just what it will take to defeat the top tier teams of the league.

 

That structure has been learned. But they need the consistent practice time, plus in games, with new players to keep it nailed down. Since Tocchet came in the record speaks for itself. No reason to panic that we've completely lost our structure/system at this point in the season. Its close, right behind them. Just pull that cushion up and find it again for the next game.

I don;t think the structure was ever taught to them.

 

The team just preformed offensively higher in Oct then anyone one would have expected and that any team could maintain. Nov showed to be more reality for the Canucks and there. Is 2 parts of every season. Before Christmas and after Christmas. Less penalties will be called there for less opportunities for our PP to outscore their problems. Even our PP is coming back to reality. But the PK is still as bad as it always was 

[-dlc-]

4 minutes ago, CanuckFanForever said:

because sustainable playoff teams don't have have to constantly out score their mistakes they minimize those mistakes.

 

Didn't Tocchet even say we needed to learn to win games 2-1 in the beginning of the season. That requires a defensive structure game that Tocchet seems to not be able to teach 

The other thing is....you have to be flexible and adaptable. Sure, on paper stuff...yes. Important. But you have to also consider the pieces in place and not ignore the scoring prowess you have in the line up. To have "a" formula in place seems rather limiting....learning structure WHILE allowing players to still be creative is probably a good recipe for success.

 

There's a balance to be struck and I think that's what they're working toward. 

 

You do have to outscore...your opponents. So there's that.

 

Also, have you not heard the coach refer to the fact that they don't always get a lot of practice time in? That's when they "learn" stuff. We've had a schedule that hasn't allowed for that as much as they'd like, but now things are easing up. 

 

LOL Tocchet isn't able to teach it but....you are?

[aGENT]

2 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Meh that happens.

 

He had to slide across to stop the potential one timer but once you commit to that you’re out of position.

 

It was a nice play by the Calgary player to hold it and out wait him.

 

Even when he slides over, normally he remains pretty square to the shooter. He was fucking turned sideways there.

[DeNiro]

Just now, aGENT said:

Even when he slides over, normally he remains pretty square to the shooter. He was fucking turned sideways there.

It’s a reaction play, it’s not always gonna be perfect.

 

You could tell at the end of the game he wasn’t happy with his game. I’m sure he’ll work on it.

[Tocchet.A.Hockey.God]

Just now, -dlc- said:

The other thing is....you have to be flexible and adaptable. Sure, on paper stuff...yes. Important. But you have to also consider the pieces in place and not ignore the scoring prowess you have in the line up. To have "a" formula in place seems rather limiting....learning structure WHILE allowing players to still be creative is probably a good recipe for success.

 

There's a balance to be struck and I think that's what they're working toward. 

 

You do have to outscore...your opponents. So there's that.

Again you agree with me the balance has to be struck. Where we disagree is it's not improving it doesn't look like they are working at it. It looks to me the team is regressing. 

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, DeNiro said:

It’s a reaction play, it’s not always gonna be perfect.

 

You could tell at the end of the game he wasn’t happy with his game. I’m sure he’ll work on it.

Oh I agree, hell work on it. I'm not particularly worried. It's very uncharacteristic. Stands out even more because of it. He looked especially, uncharacteristically bad last night.

[-dlc-]

Edition 57 of "What's Myers Doing?"

 

I rarely rag on our players and have earned my homer status quite rightfully. But sometimes I just go "wth is he thinking?". Petey tackle, Highsticking Miller. How many strikes before you're out? I HATE how he tries to play in front of Demko....I feel he'd be MUCH more effective clearing guys out from the front of the net rather than....trying to be goaltender #1 with Demko backing him up. He gets in the damn way more than anything.