[RUMOUR] Adam Larsson on the trade block

[T. Demko]

20 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

 

Yea, I'm loathe to part with our first round pick for a 31 year old defenseman. 

 

If the RHD is someone younger, then I'd be a little more open to it, but not for a guy who's on the wrong side of 30. 

 

If he is 31, he is definitely on the right side of 30!

[CanucksJay]

On 12/10/2023 at 5:57 PM, DeNiro said:

Yep can’t be thinking that short term.

 

Our window should really be opening a few years from now.

I don't know if I agree with this. We are currently in 3rd place out of 30 teams after a brutal November. 

Miller Hughes Demko Hronek, Petterson, Boeser are all outperforming their contracts by a wide margin. 

Thats 6 stars and members of this core that are producing above their contract rates which is really rare.

We then have the middling guys also punching above their contracts (Hogz, Joshua, Lafferty, Suter, Bleuger) 

Only bad contract is Myers. 

Questionable are Kuz, Mik, Garland. 

 

This will change next year with Petey and Hronek getting raises. That'll be followed by Brock (if he stays). 

This is the year we have our most important players in the most efficient contracts all at the same time.

If we wait to contend, there's a cascading effect. Contracts will start escalating again. 

Miller will be older and might not be able to take the hard matchups which means Petey will. Our offense will suffer as a result if Miller loses a step. 

I would say go for it this year and know that we can retool in 2-3 years with guys like Podz, Raty, Bains, Willander, D Petey, Hirose coming up to provide value contracts while we reload and build around Miller, Petey, Hogz, Hughes, Hronek and Demko. 

 

To me it makes no sense not to go for it this year. 

 

[spook007]

18 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

I don't know if I agree with this. We are currently in 3rd place out of 30 teams after a brutal November. 

Miller Hughes Demko Hronek, Petterson, Boeser are all outperforming their contracts by a wide margin. 

Thats 6 stars and members of this core that are producing above their contract rates which is really rare.

We then have the middling guys also punching above their contracts (Hogz, Joshua, Lafferty, Suter, Bleuger) 

Only bad contract is Myers. 

Questionable are Kuz, Mik, Garland. 

 

This will change next year with Petey and Hronek getting raises. That'll be followed by Brock (if he stays). 

This is the year we have our most important players in the most efficient contracts all at the same time.

If we wait to contend, there's a cascading effect. Contracts will start escalating again. 

Miller will be older and might not be able to take the hard matchups which means Petey will. Our offense will suffer as a result if Miller loses a step. 

I would say go for it this year and know that we can retool in 2-3 years with guys like Podz, Raty, Bains, Willander, D Petey, Hirose coming up to provide value contracts while we reload and build around Miller, Petey, Hogz, Hughes, Hronek and Demko. 

 

To me it makes no sense not to go for it this year. 

 

Agree... 

Its more likely there will be two windows... one now, and one in a few years, when Willander, Lekkerimaki etc comes up on their cheap contracts, provided they continue their progress....

Problem will start already this summer with not only Petey and Hronek, but a lot of the support players like Zadorov, Cole, Lafferty, Joshua and DeSmith ready for better deals...

[CanucksJay]

26 minutes ago, spook007 said:

Agree... 

Its more likely there will be two windows... one now, and one in a few years, when Willander, Lekkerimaki etc comes up on their cheap contracts, provided they continue their progress....

Problem will start already this summer with not only Petey and Hronek, but a lot of the support players like Zadorov, Cole, Lafferty, Joshua and DeSmith ready for better deals...

 

Yes I didn't mention the support players needing new contracts. 

We've worked with Joshua for over a year to get him to finally be playing the way we want him to play. It took a lot of efforts in coaching as well as buy in from Joshua to be at his level today. It would suck to lose him and take on another project in hopes that he can be as good as Joshua. 

Z has already made the D a lot tougher to play against.

Lafferty has been a pleasant surprise and is now playing on a line with Petey. Desmith has been the best backup we've had in a long time. 

 

Everyone is deserving a raise but won't get one and will probably leave the team. 

 

Hence I agree with you. This team likely has 2 windows. Now and in 2-3 years. 

[spook007]

4 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

 

Yes I didn't mention the support players needing new contracts. 

We've worked with Joshua for over a year to get him to finally be playing the way we want him to play. It took a lot of efforts in coaching as well as buy in from Joshua to be at his level today. It would suck to lose him and take on another project in hopes that he can be as good as Joshua. 

Z has already made the D a lot tougher to play against.

Lafferty has been a pleasant surprise and is now playing on a line with Petey. Desmith has been the best backup we've had in a long time. 

 

Everyone is deserving a raise but won't get one and will probably leave the team. 

 

Hence I agree with you. This team likely has 2 windows. Now and in 2-3 years. 

This is axactly how I see it panning out as well except I think its now and next year and the next 3-4 years once the worst of OEL cap has vanished and the new players have settled properly into this team (likely still on ELCs or the 1st contract after ELCs).

[CanucksJay]

On 12/13/2023 at 1:09 AM, Elias Pettersson said:

We probably don’t need another Dman once Soucy is back.  Juulsen is playing well enough that he is a capable 6/7 guy.  If Kuzy can start scoring again then I think our next priority should be another Rick Tocchet type forward. Someone who is big and nasty and can play up and down the lineup…

I think to truly contend, we need a solid 2-3D.

We have 1 and 2 D (Hughes and Hronek) and then a bunch of 4Ds and 5Ds

Against a deep team, our 2nd pairing isn't strong enough. 

[N4ZZY]

15 hours ago, spook007 said:

Agree... 

Its more likely there will be two windows... one now, and one in a few years, when Willander, Lekkerimaki etc comes up on their cheap contracts, provided they continue their progress....

Problem will start already this summer with not only Petey and Hronek, but a lot of the support players like Zadorov, Cole, Lafferty, Joshua and DeSmith ready for better deals...

 

I wonder if players are getting the sense that something special is building here, and there's tangible movement towards that. When teams are good, players tend to take less to either remain with the club, or sign here. Thoughts? Do you think the current group of players see something special brewing here? We're 2nd in the entire league after tonight's win against the Panthers, and if not to the injuries to Soucy and Suter, we might even have been first in the league. 

 

Out of the players on that list, Petey and Hronek gotta come back no doubt about that. Zadorov, Lafferty, Joshua and DeSmith I think all gotta come back next season. Those guys have demonstrated that they are good depth pieces, but of course, it really depends on what they're asking for right? If they're asking for too much, then gotta find other players to replace them. I like Blueger and Suter too, to come back until one of the prospects can push them out. 

 

[N4ZZY]

8 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

I think to truly contend, we need a solid 2-3D.

We have 1 and 2 D (Hughes and Hronek) and then a bunch of 4Ds and 5Ds

Against a deep team, our 2nd pairing isn't strong enough. 

 

To me, that's not going to be this year. Even if we added Bear, would he have been that 2-3D? 

 

[NHL97OneTimer]

14 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

 

Yes I didn't mention the support players needing new contracts. 

We've worked with Joshua for over a year to get him to finally be playing the way we want him to play. It took a lot of efforts in coaching as well as buy in from Joshua to be at his level today. It would suck to lose him and take on another project in hopes that he can be as good as Joshua. 

Z has already made the D a lot tougher to play against.

Lafferty has been a pleasant surprise and is now playing on a line with Petey. Desmith has been the best backup we've had in a long time. 

 

Everyone is deserving a raise but won't get one and will probably leave the team. 

 

Hence I agree with you. This team likely has 2 windows. Now and in 2-3 years. 

The cap will go up 5% and Myers contract comes to an end.  Cole and Blueger I expect will be question marks but hope that something can work out.  Garland and Miheyev will be trade considerations but fantastic if they can stay.  I think there will be a fair amount of money to sign most guys.....the question is how much of that pie does EP want?  EP really has a lot of the team's future fortunes hanging with his decision.  If he signs a team-friendly deal (thinking $8-8.5M/yr), PA and JR are in good shape.  If he demands $11M/yr, good role players will be cut.  When you have a team built with a lot of $2.5-4M/yr players and no $10+M/yr players, good things happen.

[Elias Pettersson]

8 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

I think to truly contend, we need a solid 2-3D.

We have 1 and 2 D (Hughes and Hronek) and then a bunch of 4Ds and 5Ds

Against a deep team, our 2nd pairing isn't strong enough. 

 

I believe if JR thinks we are close this year then Allvin will pull the trigger at the deadline. No way they are going to screw up a magical season.  If they feel we can beat Vegas and Colorado with a couple more additions then they will do it.  Larsson will be a trade target at the deadline as I don’t see Seattle making the playoffs.  A large two way forward up front would also be nice for the playoffs.  

 

We are only two pieces away from being a true contender. You add Adam Larsson to the defence and a guy like Yakov Trenin up front and we can beat Vegas IMO…

[CanucksJay]

4 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

 

To me, that's not going to be this year. Even if we added Bear, would he have been that 2-3D? 

 

No that's why I'm glad we didn't add Bear. He's another 5-6D

Although yesterdays performance by Z and Myers made me rethink whether they are a good enough 2nd pairing. I'd love to see them continue to gel and go up against vegas again. 

 

[CanucksJay]

3 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

I believe if JR thinks we are close this year then Allvin will pull the trigger at the deadline. No way they are going to screw up a magical season.  If they feel we can beat Vegas and Colorado with a couple more additions then they will do it.  Larsson will be a trade target at the deadline as I don’t see Seattle making the playoffs.  A large two way forward up front would also be nice for the playoffs.  

 

We are only two pieces away from being a true contender. You add Adam Larsson to the defence and a guy like Yakov Trenin up front and we can beat Vegas IMO…

Great post. 

Yesterday's performance by Myers and Z confuses things a bit for me though. 

They had a really solid game against a good team. Their size, speed, reach and physicality made me feel like they weren't ever really in danger yesterday. They seemed really dialed in and I wonder if they will only get better the more they gel. 

Is this a mirage and will they look shaky in other games or is this a sign of things to come? 

If they can continue to play like they did yesterday and Soucy comes back after injury, it would be a luxury to have Juulsen as the 7. 

We would need to trade Myers and his 6m cap hit along with a pick and a prospect if we wanted to get a 8-9m true 2-3D but I'm starting to wonder if it's necessary.. 

Luckily we have until tdl to find out. 

 

[Boudrias]

1 hour ago, CanucksJay said:

Great post. 

Yesterday's performance by Myers and Z confuses things a bit for me though. 

They had a really solid game against a good team. Their size, speed, reach and physicality made me feel like they weren't ever really in danger yesterday. They seemed really dialed in and I wonder if they will only get better the more they gel. 

Is this a mirage and will they look shaky in other games or is this a sign of things to come? 

If they can continue to play like they did yesterday and Soucy comes back after injury, it would be a luxury to have Juulsen as the 7. 

We would need to trade Myers and his 6m cap hit along with a pick and a prospect if we wanted to get a 8-9m true 2-3D but I'm starting to wonder if it's necessary.. 

Luckily we have until tdl to find out. 

 

I agree with you. Meyers and Zad are a dream pairing if they can limit their breakdowns. They have been reasonably solid to date. Of course my reservation is with Meyers. Last night in the 2nd he centered the puck in front of Demko forcing a needless save.  What is really intriguing is how Soucy plays when he returns.  

[aGENT]

7 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

The cap will go up 5% and Myers contract comes to an end.  Cole and Blueger I expect will be question marks but hope that something can work out.  Garland and Miheyev will be trade considerations but fantastic if they can stay.  I think there will be a fair amount of money to sign most guys.....the question is how much of that pie does EP want?  EP really has a lot of the team's future fortunes hanging with his decision.  If he signs a team-friendly deal (thinking $8-8.5M/yr), PA and JR are in good shape.  If he demands $11M/yr, good role players will be cut.  When you have a team built with a lot of $2.5-4M/yr players and no $10+M/yr players, good things happen.

 

Assuming we come to terms with Zadorov, Cole is as good as gone IMO. That money needs to go towards a Tanev/Larsson/Jensen etc.

 

6 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

I believe if JR thinks we are close this year then Allvin will pull the trigger at the deadline. No way they are going to screw up a magical season.  If they feel we can beat Vegas and Colorado with a couple more additions then they will do it.  Larsson will be a trade target at the deadline as I don’t see Seattle making the playoffs.  A large two way forward up front would also be nice for the playoffs.  

 

We are only two pieces away from being a true contender. You add Adam Larsson to the defence and a guy like Yakov Trenin up front and we can beat Vegas IMO…

 

I'd love to add Trenin but here's a better fit in the bottom 6, not top. That said, if we can somehow swap Garland for him...

[CanucksJay]

4 hours ago, Boudrias said:

I agree with you. Meyers and Zad are a dream pairing if they can limit their breakdowns. They have been reasonably solid to date. Of course my reservation is with Meyers. Last night in the 2nd he centered the puck in front of Demko forcing a needless save.  What is really intriguing is how Soucy plays when he returns.  

 

Yes I saw that Myers gaffe  but even Hughes turned it over in his own zone yesterday. 

I think every D will make mistakes every game unless they are a superstar. It's more so, how do you react once you turn it over? How fast can you get back into systems and defend properly and keep it outside and win back possession? 

I see a big improvement lately when Myers is paired with Z. He doesn't turn into chaos mode after a turnover. They simply get back to proper zone coverages, fight and work to get the puck back. 

As long as they do this, he is an asset. 

Edited December 15, 2023 by CanucksJay

[Elias Pettersson]

2 hours ago, aGENT said:

 

Assuming we come to terms with Zadorov, Cole is as good as gone IMO. That money needs to go towards a Tanev/Larsson/Jensen etc.

 

 

I'd love to add Trenin but here's a better fit in the bottom 6, not top. That said, if we can somehow swap Garland for him...

Kuzy is back. So we don’t need to acquire a top 6 forward any longer. Put Kuzy back with Petey and add Trenin and have him play with Suter and Lafferty and our forward group is complete. 
 

Another player I really like is Alexey Toropchenko. 6’6” Russian that plays for St. Louis. If Allvin can pry him out of St. Louis then I will build the Allvin statue myself. 
 

Larsson is more of a luxury right now depending on how Zadorov and Myers play together. If they can keep things steady then Cole and Juulsen can rotate on the 3rd pairing and we could be good to go for the playoffs. 

[CanucksJay]

7 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Kuzy is back. So we don’t need to acquire a top 6 forward any longer. Put Kuzy back with Petey and add Trenin and have him play with Suter and Lafferty and our forward group is complete. 
 

Another player I really like is Alexey Toropchenko. 6’6” Russian that plays for St. Louis. If Allvin can pry him out of St. Louis then I will build the Allvin statue myself. 
 

Larsson is more of a luxury right now depending on how Zadorov and Myers play together. If they can keep things steady then Cole and Juulsen can rotate on the 3rd pairing and we could be good to go for the playoffs. 

I hope kuzy is back. I'd love to see a little bit more. I'm definitely rooting for the guy. 

It looks like RT was working on fixing Hogz and he did. Now he's moved on to Kuz. If Kuz can be a split second faster processing the system, he'll get to the puck faster where his skill and creativity can take over. I think RT is trying to get him to that point. He's trying to get Kuzy into better positions faster so that he'll be around the puck more as a result. I hope Kuz doesn't get discouraged and continues to work hard. The rewards / gains from this will set him up for a career of stardom. 

 

Also I would never have thought we'd even be considering swapping Cole and Juulsen between 6D and 7D... Shows how far along Juulsen has come. This isn't an indictment of Cole's play but more so how Juulsen has elevated his play

Edited December 15, 2023 by CanucksJay

[Coconuts]

6 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Kuzy is back. So we don’t need to acquire a top 6 forward any longer. Put Kuzy back with Petey and add Trenin and have him play with Suter and Lafferty and our forward group is complete. 
 

Another player I really like is Alexey Toropchenko. 6’6” Russian that plays for St. Louis. If Allvin can pry him out of St. Louis then I will build the Allvin statue myself. 
 

Larsson is more of a luxury right now depending on how Zadorov and Myers play together. If they can keep things steady then Cole and Juulsen can rotate on the 3rd pairing and we could be good to go for the playoffs. 

 

You may need to change your name to that of a Russian player at this point.. 

[aGENT]

2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Kuzy is back. So we don’t need to acquire a top 6 forward any longer. Put Kuzy back with Petey and add Trenin and have him play with Suter and Lafferty and our forward group is complete. 
 

Another player I really like is Alexey Toropchenko. 6’6” Russian that plays for St. Louis. If Allvin can pry him out of St. Louis then I will build the Allvin statue myself. 
 

Larsson is more of a luxury right now depending on how Zadorov and Myers play together. If they can keep things steady then Cole and Juulsen can rotate on the 3rd pairing and we could be good to go for the playoffs. 

I disagree, we could still "ideally" use another mucker in the top 6. Whichever line Mikheyev isn't on still needs a guy that keeps Lafferty, Hoglander and PDG in the bottom 6 if we want to be considered a contender.

 

Except neither Cole or Myers should be considered long term pieces. If not this TDL, this summer Myers needs to be replaced with a top 4 capable RHD that complements Zadorov and can hold the fort until Willander is ready for that role.

[flickyoursedin]

Been liking the last couple drafts by the Kraken let’s do a Kuzmenko and Friedman for Larsson and prospect David Goyette (2022 2nd round pick C prospect) or Lukas Dragicevic (2023 2nd round RHD prospect)!

[Elias Pettersson]

4 hours ago, aGENT said:

I disagree, we could still "ideally" use another mucker in the top 6. Whichever line Mikheyev isn't on still needs a guy that keeps Lafferty, Hoglander and PDG in the bottom 6 if we want to be considered a contender.

 

Except neither Cole or Myers should be considered long term pieces. If not this TDL, this summer Myers needs to be replaced with a top 4 capable RHD that complements Zadorov and can hold the fort until Willander is ready for that role.

After paying Petey and Hronek we will only have around $14 million next season to sign 7 guys. Ideally, we would want to bring back Joshua, Lafferty, Blueger (unless Raty is ready), Zadorov, DeSmith. Then you still need to replace Cole and Myers if they aren’t signed. Don’t think we will be able to fit a Larsson or Zub unless other pieces are moved. 
 

I disagree about Höglander. I think he’s a perfect fit on the Miller line. If you want another top 6 forward it’s going to cost us our 1st round pick. Don’t think Allvin is going to do that. 

[aGENT]

2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

After paying Petey and Hronek we will only have around $14 million next season to sign 7 guys. Ideally, we would want to bring back Joshua, Lafferty, Blueger (unless Raty is ready), Zadorov, DeSmith. Then you still need to replace Cole and Myers if they aren’t signed. Don’t think we will be able to fit a Larsson or Zub unless other pieces are moved. 
 

I disagree about Höglander. I think he’s a perfect fit on the Miller line. If you want another top 6 forward it’s going to cost us our 1st round pick. Don’t think Allvin is going to do that. 

Cole is already replaced by Zadorov. Myers we need a ~$4-5m replacement to play with Zadorov. Garland would need to move to upgrade the top 6 as per that "ideal"

 

Hoglander is great. Been one of the few people "shaming" posters for trying to trade him. We're a good team with him on the Miller line. We'd be a great team with him on the third line.

[Elias Pettersson]

5 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Cole is already replaced by Zadorov. Myers we need a ~$4-5m replacement to play with Zadorov. Garland would need to move to upgrade the top 6 as per that "ideal"

 

Hoglander is great. Been one of the few people "shaming" posters for trying to trade him. We're a good team with him on the Miller line. We'd be a great team with him on the third line.

Ideally if you want a Stanley Cup contender we would add Lawson Crouse and Artem Zub. We’d probably be the favourites with those 2 acquisitions. The problem is the cost would be sky high. And we don’t have the cap room to fit them in anyways unless you are moving Myers entire $6 million contract, which would cost even more assets. 
 

I did the calculation for next season. We don’t have the room to add another $4-5 million Dman, assuming we re-sign Zadorov, unless we move out other pieces. Garland or Kuzmenko or even Boeser would have to be moved out. 
 

Speakimg of Boeser, he’s on pace for 50+ goals. Even if he only hits 40 he will command an 8x8 contract extension. That is going to be an interesting negotiation. Even Jannik Hansen said Boeser is not a part of our core. It’s not inconceivable that we trade him and not Kuzmenko after he has a career year. Similar to Horvat. 

[aGENT]

51 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Ideally if you want a Stanley Cup contender we would add Lawson Crouse and Artem Zub. We’d probably be the favourites with those 2 acquisitions. The problem is the cost would be sky high. And we don’t have the cap room to fit them in anyways unless you are moving Myers entire $6 million contract, which would cost even more assets. 
 

I did the calculation for next season. We don’t have the room to add another $4-5 million Dman, assuming we re-sign Zadorov, unless we move out other pieces. Garland or Kuzmenko or even Boeser would have to be moved out. 
 

Speakimg of Boeser, he’s on pace for 50+ goals. Even if he only hits 40 he will command an 8x8 contract extension. That is going to be an interesting negotiation. Even Jannik Hansen said Boeser is not a part of our core. It’s not inconceivable that we trade him and not Kuzmenko after he has a career year. Similar to Horvat. 

 

I've done the math, we can afford a $4m D.

 

I'd move Kuzmenko before Boeser in a year + personally. Let Lekkerimaki score goals on an ELC.

Edited December 16, 2023 by aGENT

[The Duke]

On 12/14/2023 at 8:42 AM, spook007 said:

Agree... 

Its more likely there will be two windows... one now, and one in a few years, when Willander, Lekkerimaki etc comes up on their cheap contracts, provided they continue their progress....

Problem will start already this summer with not only Petey and Hronek, but a lot of the support players like Zadorov, Cole, Lafferty, Joshua and DeSmith ready for better deals...

This is an interesting take and I can see what you’re saying. 
 

We almost have a weird little mini-window this season - as unlikely as a cup run seems - where we have some pretty good depth pieces we likely can’t afford past this year.  Maybe next as well.

 

Then Lekkerimaki, Willander and others like (obviously not all) Pods, Bains, Brzustewicz, Raty, etc. are coming of age.  
 

Can they outpace on their ELC’s the depth players we’ll have to jettison? It’s not out of the realm of possibility. But it certainly does seem like 2 separate “windows” probably separated by the 2 seasons of 4 mil OEL buyout penalties.