[RUMOUR] Jonatan Berggren on the trade block

[Sophomore Jinx]

2 minutes ago, PureQuickness said:

 

Hronek was originally a 2nd round pick and developed.

 

The Canucks traded a 1st round pick AND a 2nd round pick.

 

It's not a fleece by that definition.

WTF does the bolded have to do with anything? When acquired, he was a 25 year old RHD, averaging 42 points per season. That is what is relevant.

 

And I'm still waiting for your reply to my question that you conveniently avoided.

 

[CaptainCanuck12]

3 hours ago, Jeremy Hronek said:

 

Why is Detroit shopping him given all of his positive attributes?  

Because they have realized that filling their top 9 with forwards who have size, grit and 2-way ability is crucial to having playoff success??  Maybe.  And if to so, hopefully Allvin realizes this too and steers way clear of this guy.

[Coryberg]

12 hours ago, Sophomore Jinx said:

If you don't think so, what would your offer be for a coveted D like Hronek? Raymond, Ballard, and a 2nd??? 

Good question. @PureQuickness 

If we traded Hronek tomorrow with a 4th round pick for the a mid round 1st and 2nd would you be happy with the return? 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Coryberg

[Elias Pettersson]

10 hours ago, CaptainCanuck12 said:

Because they have realized that filling their top 9 with forwards who have size, grit and 2-way ability is crucial to having playoff success??  Maybe.  And if to so, hopefully Allvin realizes this too and steers way clear of this guy.

 

Didn't Detroit trade for a winger who is only 5'7"?  

[Sophomore Jinx]

The Wings are fooked right now, just put some key players on IR

 

 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Sophomore Jinx

[Bure_Pavel]

Offensive winger who struggles defensively, not a good fit for us. 

[Viking_10]

a player with some size on a bad team is Mackenzie Entwistle, I wonder if Chicago could use a russian who scored 39g last year...we could clear some cap space and get something back for Kuz.

 

Seattle can't score either, Larsson would be a nice fit with Hughes moving Hronek to 2nd pair permanently, where he belongs imo but I would put him back on PP1 with Kuz gone in a trade...we need a good hard slap shot threat from the point on the PP and Hronek brings that

[PureQuickness]

22 hours ago, Sophomore Jinx said:

WTF does the bolded have to do with anything? When acquired, he was a 25 year old RHD, averaging 42 points per season. That is what is relevant.

 

And I'm still waiting for your reply to my question that you conveniently avoided.

 

 

I'm not conveniently avoiding anything. I have been setting up the parameters of what it means to "fleece" in a trade. However, it ISN'T a fleece if we are objectively looking at the situation (not hindsighting). For the record, I agree that the trade has worked out for us - and as it stands, Detroit is not entirely losing sleep from the trade either.

 

Here is exactly what happened. Hronek was picked as a 2nd rounder and developed by Detroit. It is because of their ability to develop their player that they were able to extract a 1st round pick AND a 2nd round pick. 

 

How is it a fleece by that account? Answer that question.

 

Let me rephrase this again: we traded a 1st round pick (NYI) AND a 2nd round pick for a 2nd round pick.

 

It's not a fleece, period. It's a trade that worked out.

[Sophomore Jinx]

1 minute ago, PureQuickness said:

 

I'm not conveniently avoiding anything. I have been setting up the parameters of what it means to "fleece" in a trade. However, it ISN'T a fleece if we are objectively looking at the situation (not hindsighting). For the record, I agree that the trade has worked out for us - and as it stands, Detroit is not entirely losing sleep from the trade either.

 

Here is exactly what happened. Hronek was picked as a 2nd rounder and developed by Detroit. It is because of their ability to develop their player that they were able to extract a 1st round pick AND a 2nd round pick. 

 

How is it a fleece by that account? Answer that question.

 

Let me rephrase this again: we traded a 1st round pick (NYI) AND a 2nd round pick for a 2nd round pick.

 

It's not a fleece, period. It's a trade that worked out.

Thanks for the fucking history lesson Skippy, you're the best.

 

And no, you don't need to rephrase anything, I'm done with your bullshit nonsense, go troll somewhere else.

[PureQuickness]

22 minutes ago, Sophomore Jinx said:

Thanks for the fucking history lesson Skippy, you're the best.

 

And no, you don't need to rephrase anything, I'm done with your bullshit nonsense, go troll somewhere else.

 

Huh? I'm not sure who pissed you off tonight, but I'm not amused with this. I understand that the forum is trusting people to be an adult, but I don't see how allowing something like this would be conducive to a discussion.

 

I'm going to be taking an indefinite break from this forum until posters like you learn some posting etiquette from the admins. Yes, your post was reported.

[Sophomore Jinx]

5 minutes ago, PureQuickness said:

 

Huh? I'm not sure who pissed you off tonight, but I'm not amused with this. I understand that the forum is trusting people to be an adult, but I don't see how allowing something like this would be conducive to a discussion.

 

I'm going to be taking an indefinite break from this forum until posters like you learn some posting etiquette from the admins. Yes, your post was reported.

And I'm not amused at your insistence to keep on "discussing" the topic at hand, ad nauseum, when I clearly wasn't interested in your illogical rantings about Hronek's draft position etc.

 

No need to respond, but I know you will. 

Edited December 12, 2023 by Sophomore Jinx

[Willander the Great]

On 12/10/2023 at 11:04 PM, PureQuickness said:

 

Hronek was originally a 2nd round pick and developed.

 

The Canucks traded a 1st round pick AND a 2nd round pick.

 

It's not a fleece by that definition.

When a player is drafted has zero relevance. All that matters is what they become. And Hronek has become a stud. 
 

Having said that, the player that the Red Wings drafted with that first rounder, ASP, could go on to have a solid career, so it’s way too early to tell who won that trade. Nonetheless, we absolutely needed to give Huggy Bear a proper RHD to play with, and we also needed to show guys like Pettersson that we’re serious about winning with them. This trade did both of that. 

[N4ZZY]

1 hour ago, Willander the Great said:

When a player is drafted has zero relevance. All that matters is what they become. And Hronek has become a stud. 
 

Having said that, the player that the Red Wings drafted with that first rounder, ASP, could go on to have a solid career, so it’s way too early to tell who won that trade. Nonetheless, we absolutely needed to give Huggy Bear a proper RHD to play with, and we also needed to show guys like Pettersson that we’re serious about winning with them. This trade did both of that. 

 

They needed to make a move. This team, because of some of the moves Benning made, has put this team in win now mode. The rebuild (if there ever was one) is done. This is our core moving forward, Allvin's and Rutherford's job is to surround the current core so that the team can contend now. 

 

Our core is not as good as the Avs, Vegas, etc., but it is what it is, I suppose. 

 

[canuck73_3]

On 12/10/2023 at 5:20 PM, AlwaysACanuckFan said:

Sounds great but why would the Wings trade someone with that scouting report 

They traded Hronek 

[canuck73_3]

On 12/10/2023 at 11:04 PM, PureQuickness said:

 

Hronek was originally a 2nd round pick and developed.

 

The Canucks traded a 1st round pick AND a 2nd round pick.

 

It's not a fleece by that definition.

Where he was drafted is entirely irrelevant to where his value is as an NHLer. if that were even remotely true we would have got a 1st back for Juolevi instead of Lammikko and Juulsen... 

[Sophomore Jinx]

3 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said:

Where he was drafted is entirely irrelevant to where his value is as an NHLer. if that were even remotely true we would have got a 1st back for Juolevi instead of Lammikko and Juulsen... 

Yup, but buddy couldn't seem to grasp that simple concept, and when I let my frustrations get the better of me, he reported me haha.

 

By his logic, Rick Tocchet would have only been worth a 6th rounder, that being where his draft position was

[R3aL]

On 12/10/2023 at 4:48 PM, Elias Pettersson said:

Red Wings reportedly shopping upside prospect (msn.com)

 

The Red Wings have been shopping 2018 second-round pick Jonatan Berggren in recent trade discussions, David Pagnotta of The Fourth Period reports. After scoring 15 goals in his rookie campaign last season, Berggren has been ferried between Detroit and AHL Grand Rapids this year and has played just four games for the Red Wings.

 

Jonatan Berggren Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #33 - Last Word On Hockey (lastwordonsports.com)

 

Berggren is an outstanding skater. He is very fast, and reaches top speed in just a few strides. This can create breakaways and other odd man rushes. He is dangerous taking a defender wide on the rush. He also gets in quickly on the forecheck. Berggren has a low centre of gravity, and is difficult to move off the puck as a result. Despite his size, he is effective in board battles and in front of the net. His agility and edgework are also strong. Berggren is able to beat defenders with quick movements and cuts.

 

Berggren may be small, but he plays a heavy game. He is a torpedo on the forecheck, getting in quickly on opposing defenders and forcing them to turn the puck over. He also battles hard on the boards and gets to the front of the net and causes havoc. Berggren is not afraid to take a hit to make a play, or to take abuse in front of the net. He scores most of his goals in tight to the net. He has the soft hands to finish on breakaways that he generates with his speed. Berggren also has the hand-eye coordination and quickness to pounce on rebounds.

 

This guy is Nils Hoglander only a much better skater.  He literally can fly on the ice.  And he's Swedish too.  I'd be all over getting Berggren.  He could be a fit with Petey...

I remember when he was drafted I hadn't seen much of him at all but lots of people were saying he was a sneaky steal.

[Odjickwillkillyou]

15 hours ago, Sophomore Jinx said:

Thanks for the fucking history lesson Skippy, you're the best.

 

And no, you don't need to rephrase anything, I'm done with your bullshit nonsense, go troll somewhere else.

 

 

[JayDangles]

2 hours ago, Sophomore Jinx said:

Yup, but buddy couldn't seem to grasp that simple concept, and when I let my frustrations get the better of me, he reported me haha.

 

By his logic, Rick Tocchet would have only been worth a 6th rounder, that being where his draft position was

Who are you being reported to? I was under the impression there are no mods or admins on this forum. Thats its basically the Thunderdome 

[Attila Umbrus]

3 minutes ago, JayDangles said:

Who are you being reported to? I was under the impression there are no mods or admins on this forum. Thats its basically the Thunderdome 

….Who runs barter (CFF) town?

 

We got some great 80’s/90’s movie references goin on today and I’m loving it lol

 

[Sophomore Jinx]

3 minutes ago, JayDangles said:

Who are you being reported to? I was under the impression there are no mods or admins on this forum. Thats its basically the Thunderdome 

I thought so too haha

[flickyoursedin]

Maybe Kuzmenko for Berggren++ we get some salary cap and recoup some picks

[Odjickwillkillyou]

JB has two goals in two games since being called up so maybe they will have 2nd thoughts on this lol. Or maybe it was just a way to light a fire under his ass since he was being called up. Either way, he looks nice and could fit in well if the Kuz situation does not improve. 

[WHL rocks]

On 12/10/2023 at 9:59 PM, Snoop Hogg said:

Nice prospect with upside. Too small. We need to get bigger upfront. No thanks. 

This right here 

Thank you

[Drakrami]

On 12/11/2023 at 10:42 AM, PureQuickness said:

 

Not sure how the trade is seen as a fleece. It's a 1st round pick AND a 2nd round pick (high pick because of Vancouver's low standings) for Hronek a 2nd round pick. This is by definition selling high. At best, it's a fair trade that's working well for both teams.

 

 

It is not a fleece, we paid above what the market (other teams would pay) for Hronek. Market price probably somewhere between 2014 1st + 3rd or 2 2nds (There is a premium to 2023 1st rounders). The great thing is Hronek is playing well for us. 

 

There is a difference between market price at the time, and how well the player develop/plays afterwards.