PeteyBOI Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 6 minutes ago, Playoff Beered said: I don't think this at all, like not even a little bit. so whats the issue? we can all think for ourselves why must you impose yourself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 43 minutes ago, Playoff Beered said: Yeah just a coincidence the schools were run by the church. I don't know the story in Canada however I am well acquainted with both stolen generations here in Aus, I am a member of one. It was not just the Catholic church in involved, the State, government, holds blame as well. Unless you are a member of a stolen generation, you have no idea how it feels to be told about this. To feel you were unwanted. As I have stated things have changed, I actually did a ski hire for the school that is situated where the orphanage I came from was. The teachers were great people. They were nuns. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playoff Beered Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 9 minutes ago, Dankmemes187 said: so whats the issue? we can all think for ourselves why must you impose yourself? I'm not sure what you mean. I have not claimed to have an issue and I don't see myself imposing on anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 1 hour ago, Playoff Beered said: Some good questions about religion... If a hundred different religions have to be wrong for yours to be right, does this show that people from all over the world like to invent gods that don’t exist? If your parents had belonged to a different religion, do you think you would belong to that religion too? If people from the five major religions are told conflicting information by their respective gods, should any of them be believed? Why are Churches filled with riches when Jesus asked his followers to give their wealth away? Should an instruction to convert to your religion upon the threat of eternal torture in hell be met with anything other than hostility? Can a mass murderer go to heaven for accepting your religion, while a kind doctor goes to hell for not? Did the mass murdering Crusaders and Inquisitors make it into the Christian heaven? I think those questions are pretty provocative, with respect, bordering on the absurd. As for the first one, I used to tell mum that the Catholic allegories were based on the Egyptian allegories. Virgin Birth, Resurrection all the other common themes. All the biggies have them. As for the rest of your questions what do you think the rational, logical answers to them are ? I am guessing the same as me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playoff Beered Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 17 minutes ago, Dankmemes187 said: it was the government that stole these children, the church was just tasked with the prison/school ... many who would have been in their position would have likely abused them in some form of manner... i hate to say it but people of power who held people against their will in a prison like area all abuse their captors... this is true of jails, mental instituitions, old folks homes and these old "conversion schools/jails " all of them hold them against their will in some way of form and many people are murdered no matter if they are religious or not... So the church should get a pass because others would have done bad things too? Maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyBOI Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 Stanford prison experiment - Wikipedia Watch The Stanford Prison Experiment | Prime Video (amazon.com) i just want yo to think for a second, about these poor children, these people in mental instituitions for sometimes no apparent reason, an old man or woman who or even a prisoner(you may choose to hate how they are bunched in this list, but its not the moral)... now imagine them fighting kicking punching and screaming fighting for their right to be with their loved ones, their freedoms, a frickin chance to stay up and watch the rest of the movie, the right to privacy... and no imagine getting punched kicked screamed at every day and tell me you act perfectly like a saint... tell me all of you, that you are perfect and would never get angered when hit with a chair over the head... every single day? bad shit happens when you hold them against their will and good people turn bad... please watch the video if you do not believe me... if you dont have a prime account ill email you the money to watch it... trust me it will open your eyes 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playoff Beered Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Dankmemes187 said: Stanford prison experiment - Wikipedia Watch The Stanford Prison Experiment | Prime Video (amazon.com) Seen it many years ago. Edited September 22, 2023 by Playoff Beered 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 10 hours ago, RWMc1 said: This one talks about time in relation to creation. I don't blindly accept stuff, but I don't blindly reject either. A true open mind at least considers possibilities. https://www.stjohnsarlingtonva.org/Customer-Content/saintjohnsarlington/CMS/files/EFM/Bereshit_Commentary.pdf Totally Brother. So well said. An open mind is a good thing, coupled with the ability to think critically. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 1 hour ago, cripplereh said: At first myself laying there. After I felt the presence of family that past on and had a feeling I had more to do here and opened my eyes. Thanks for posting this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyBOI Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 19 minutes ago, Playoff Beered said: I'm not sure what you mean. I have not claimed to have an issue and I don't see myself imposing on anyone. well if you dont feel that way, i believe you... but i felt that you were, im sorry if i misunderstood your message 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyBOI Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 what confuses you about my post @Playoff Beered how they relate to each other? my poor grammar, i know its terrible and it get worse the older i get... i'd like the chance to clarify Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playoff Beered Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Dankmemes187 said: what confuses you about my post @Playoff Beered how they relate to each other? my poor grammar, i know its terrible and it get worse the older i get... i'd like the chance to clarify Using it as a justification for what happened in the school's. Edited September 22, 2023 by Playoff Beered 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 2 hours ago, Gurn said: Or joy and merely happy. Like really brother ? You don't believe that what we define as good and bad are concomitants of each other ? Most of my life has been what I describe as very good times punctuated by some really bad times. Do you honestly believe we can live a long life were we don't experience these different emotions ? How about when loved ones die, apart from what I am going through now they have been the worst times of my life. However this is a part of life, we eat, sh!t, breathe and eventually die. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 1 hour ago, 4petesake said: Here in Canada you are outnumbered 54% to 46%. It gets much worse for you in Sweden at 82% to 18%! So at least in these two countries it’s on you to prove that Tink is real by this logic. Meh, that's why I left Sweden, too many non-believers really... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 2 minutes ago, Ilunga said: Like really brother ? You don't believe that what we define as good and bad are concomitants of each other ? Most of my life has been what I describe as very good times punctuated by some really bad times. Do you honestly believe we can live a long life were we don't experience these different emotions ? How about when loved ones die, apart from what I am going through now they have been the worst times of my life. However this is a part of life, we eat, sh!t, breathe and eventually die. This is in relation to the idea that without bad, we would not have good. or we can't appreciate the good times without the bad times. I think we would appreciate the good times without bad times, as long as there is a 'meh' time to compare it too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 1 hour ago, Jester13 said: This is called an "argumentum ad populum" fallacy, also known as the "appeal to popularity" or "bandwagon fallacy." This fallacy occurs when someone argues that a belief or claim is true or valid solely because a large number of people believe it or because it's popular. To argue that the minority position must prove the non-existence of something simply because they are outnumbered is unreasonable. The burden of proof should be on the people making the positive claim. If you disagree, can you explain why you disagree? Well it looks like we can go around in circles here. You claim God doesn't exist but you don't want to present any evidence to actually show that. I just need to take your word for it. The "burden of proof" is on you to prove God doesn't exist. The reason why is because God and religion is entrenched in our society going back thousands of years. Billions of people on this earth believe in a higher being. If God didn't actually exist then why all the religions and the churches? Where did the Bible come from? Is it a work of fiction? If so, who wrote it? Where is the evidence that it is a work of fiction? The Bible exists and proves that there is a God. Same with the Quran. Nobody has ever produced any evidence that these books are fake. So, unless you can do that then these books are real and they prove a God does exist... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playoff Beered Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: The Bible exists and proves that there is a God. Same with the Quran. Nobody has ever produced any evidence that these books are fake. So, unless you can do that then these books are real and they prove a God does exist... Good argument for believing in the Marvel universe. Edited September 22, 2023 by Playoff Beered 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cripplereh Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 Just now, Elias Pettersson said: Well it looks like we can go around in circles here. You claim God doesn't exist but you don't want to present any evidence to actually show that. I just need to take your word for it. The "burden of proof" is on you to prove God doesn't exist. The reason why is because God and religion is entrenched in our society going back thousands of years. Billions of people on this earth believe in a higher being. If God didn't actually exist then why all the religions and the churches? Where did the Bible come from? Is it a work of fiction? If so, who wrote it? Where is the evidence that it is a work of fiction? The Bible exists and proves that there is a God. Same with the Quran. Nobody has ever produced any evidence that these books are fake. So, unless you can do that then these books are real and they prove a God does exist... Netflix has a documentary can't remember the guys name but the oldest writing we have in every musium has them .Him and 200 others can decifer them.He said would take over 200 years. Things I got from it and he wrote books about it,is that this is the third telling of Jesus.First was over 6000 years ago.Plus they knew of planet X in our solar system back then. So was Jesus real?No records of it from the Romans who were thourow. Our bible now is NOT the first telling and that is fact. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey God Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyBOI Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 1 minute ago, Playoff Beered said: Using it as a justification for what happened in the school's. no its not a justification, its terrible and never should have happened... all those situations ii explained are terrible... the point of the thought process was to understand and show that good people can make bad mistakes, they do not intend to do this, but eventually they might just suffer enough abuse and crack... members of the church are not inherently bad people... like sexual abuse, all people of authority will be more prone to commit sexual abuse against anyone but especially vunerable people... its a thing of phycology if given the chance to do something you are more likely to make this choice... it is true their are certain sick individual that gravitate to these jobs just to exploit. the job has nothing to do with their actions like religion also does not, its the people making these decisions... it is said that roughly 20% of marriages have at least one partner who commits adultery, why does this happen? are 1-7 people bad people? or do they just make mistakes when they find themselves in bad situations? it has been shown that 50% of people have cheated in a video game and 11- 20% do it habitually.. reasons people cheat #1 reason they think everyone cheats... # 2 they only cheat to punish other cheaters, but they must decide from their infinite wisdom who and who not is a cheater... people just make bad decisions all the time... and it doesnt matter if the decision is serious or not, if you are in a bad situation or believe you are in a bad situation people will act poorly... there was a recent college where 33% of the students got caught for cheating in a certain class... but the teacher did something remarkable, they forgave the class as long as they admitted to their mistake, with zero punishment... but over half the students chose not to confess and were expelled... people make mistakes... think for another moment at this... if i everyday came up to you and said your an a$$hole and i hate you, just kidding... how long before would that piss you off? now imagine i hit you on the arm everyday you got pissed off, and i said lighten up im just kidding... this is nowhere the same but you may consider yourself a person that is a pacifist, but you likely would not stay a pacifist for long... likely you would retaliate. along time ago it was normal to beat children, my parents were beat and their brothers and sisters often, by many adults including school teachers, coaches and many other adults in charge of them including priests and maybe even nuns... i say maybe because i have not heard of nuns beating children... now imagine these children crying for their parents, trying to escape, yelling and getting angry, maybe even plotting against you... what do you do? do you quit? most people wont quit! most people are scared of challenging the authority or quitting for various reasons..... have you heard of the milgrams experiment? anyways end rant... sorry for verbal diarrheas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 26 minutes ago, Gurn said: This is in relation to the idea that without bad, we would not have good. or we can't appreciate the good times without the bad times. I think we would appreciate the good times without bad times, as long as there is a 'meh' time to compare it too. Maybe, however that is not reality. Reality is bad things happen to good people. My oldest, dearest friend is the best person I know, he has done things we all believe we would do, however we have never been put in those situations. For the last four or five years his life has been hell. I have heard him say things, in relation to despair I never thought I would hear coming from him. Why is this happening to him ? There is no answer to this. It drives me nuts. I am going over to his house shortly, the last few Friday nights the Melbourne Storm have been on the telly in the finals of the NRL, and we have been supporting each other. This is where good comes from bad, until recently I have been reluctant to interact with people, one gets tired of only having bad news to relate to them, he has felt the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyBOI Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 31 minutes ago, Gurn said: This is in relation to the idea that without bad, we would not have good. or we can't appreciate the good times without the bad times. I think we would appreciate the good times without bad times, as long as there is a 'meh' time to compare it too. no, this is not necessarily true... when was the last time you took a major pain medication? and if you take them regular this thought experiment won't work... for me i never felt better, i was so relaxed and fell asleep a few minutes later... without the constant pain i would never feel that good i would just feel normal, people get used to normal and they get used to pain... but happiness is something you have to work on everyday to feel good... happiness and joy are measured against each other... if only i had a car like johnson i would be happy... if only i had more money i would be happy... if only my anxiety would go away i would be happy... if i lost ten more pounds i would be happy... but happiness is a short term feeling, our instincts are to be cautious and non trusting why? our instincts predate religion... because if we trusted everything and lived carefree and happy we would die quickly... you might say in a non evil world there would be no poisonous things or animals that attack, but that is not how life works even at the cell level or bacteria level... life must consume other life... so we must not trust other life because it might be wanting to kill us and eat us.. or be poisonous... one of the most amazing instincts we possess is sympathetic vomiting, we learned to trust our tribe members that if they are sick i must be too... its the same as when a friend brings a stranger to your home you will have more trust, but if a random asked you if they could join your party you's tell them to f off... but why cant we trust all humans? because there was a time we had to fight for food, hunting grounds, fishing grounds because they were the only place to feed the clan... so we cant be happy because we cant trust anything because the moment we lose our ability to recognize danger we will die... so we must be sad... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arrogant Worms Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 @Elias Pettersson So is there room in your belief structure for a soul to live multiple lives? Gain multiple experiences? It might help your theory, as it would allow the soul to experience multiple good and bad lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrayDog Posted September 22, 2023 Share Posted September 22, 2023 7 hours ago, UnkNuk said: Clearly God has incarnated Itself as you in order to experience what it is like to be a skeptic. Actually, I have no idea whether this theory is true or not. One advantage that it has, though, is that it explains the problem of evil: it's just God doing it to Itself. One other thing: if there actually is a God, aren't we being a bit arrogant in expecting that we could ever understand Its nature? Perhaps that's true. Or perhaps my nature is to be skeptical. Evil is man's creation, and man excels at it. Just as there are times man can excel at good. If there is a god, I don't feel it's arrogant to try to understand its nature; I would rather try to understand something than blindly follow it. If trying to learn about anything is arrogance, then Arrogance be my name. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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