The God Thread

[StrayDog]

7 hours ago, cripplereh said:

Why in the world has there been more deaths by religion then all else combined???

I'd be willing to bet that Disease has religion beat by miles on this one.

[Master Mind]

5 hours ago, Gurn said:

This is in relation to the idea that without bad, we would not have good.

or we can't appreciate the good times without the bad times.

 

I think we would appreciate the good times without bad times, as long as there is a 'meh' time to compare it too.

That would mean the reaction to the death of a loved one would be 'meh'.

 

In this suggested reality, it would be the same reaction as spilling your drink, or any other minor inconvenience.

 

That sounds so lifeless.

[Jester13]

6 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Well it looks like we can go around in circles here.  You claim God doesn't exist but you don't want to present any evidence to actually show that.  I just need to take your word for it.  The "burden of proof" is on you to prove God doesn't exist.  The reason why is because God and religion is entrenched in our society going back thousands of years.  Billions of people on this earth believe in a higher being.  

 

If God didn't actually exist then why all the religions and the churches?  Where did the Bible come from?  Is it a work of fiction?  If so, who wrote it?  Where is the evidence that it is a work of fiction?  The Bible exists and proves that there is a God.  Same with the Quran.  Nobody has ever produced any evidence that these books are fake.  So, unless you can do that then these books are real and they prove a God does exist...

EP, would you be open to learning why this is faulty logic?

[MeanSeanBean]

8 hours ago, Ilunga said:

 

I am one of those stolen children you are talking about.

It wasn't just religious people who frowned on young unmarried teenage girls having babies, it was the societal norm.

And guess what times have changed, people have evolved.

 

Ever heard of Primae Noctis ?

That was nothing to do with religion, that was one nation, the English - king Edward - trying to breed out the Scots, for control/ political reasons.

 

I am not trying to change your mind, I am having a discussion with you.

 

I can see there really is no point as you have a closed mind on this subject.

 

 

You started this discussion by replying to my original post. I asked several questions I was legitimately curious about and eager to have a discussion about. You ignored all those questions and decide to instead lecture me about the semantics of one phrase I said in passing. So no, you aren't going to change my mind on anything because you didn't even bother addressing any of the questions I was actually curious about. Instead you decided to hyper focus on a passing remark and ignore the things I did want to talk about. Not really a recipe for success for a conversation.

 

It's the exact same type of technique's used by professional "debaters". They ignore the actually subject at hand and try to turn the conversation into something they are interested and knowledgeable in stead of the original subject. Do I give a hoot about Primae Noctis or the semantics between colonialism and it's relation to religion in conflict. Nope, not at all. That's why it wasn't the subject of my post. I laid out several questions I would have been interested in hearing an answer to though, which were all ignored.

 

So yes, you hyper focusing on religion causing war was indeed entirely pointless.

[Foamys Ghost]

12 hours ago, Alflives said:

Or maybe they did write those words and we don’t know for sure? It seems like it’s up in the air, no? 
If these are first hand accounts that (IMHAO) doesn’t support there is a God. It’s just good stories. 

We're pretty sure they weren't written by their eponymous apostles because the apostles didn't speak or write Koine Greek, which is the original language in which the gospels were written.  There are entire books written by historians on this subject if you'd like to know more.

[bishopshodan]

If good and evil during our lives is an overall good thing (  as it provides dynamics? ), then why do so many desire the peace and love of an eternal existence with god in heaven?

[Foamys Ghost]

11 hours ago, Dankmemes187 said:

i am actually impressed people once treated with respect can have a normal conversation

well thats a association fallacy aka non-sequitor which means the conclusion does not follow the two premices... just because he cant prove tinkerbell exists doesnt have any correlation to how god does or does not exist.

No it isn't.  It is an example of the burden of proof fallacy.  When Christians say you can't prove God doesn't exist it is a cop out.  The burden of proof in that discussion is on the one making the positive assertion.  There is as much evidence for Tinkerbell as there is for God.  If you think this is wrong, provide the evidence that God exists.

[Elias Pettersson]

3 hours ago, Cold said:

@Elias Pettersson So is there room in your belief structure for a soul to live multiple lives? Gain multiple experiences? It might help your theory, as it would allow the soul to experience multiple good and bad lives. 

Yes, I personally believe in reincarnation but I know alot of people who don’t. Religion isn’t perfect, there are many religious with different teachings. At the end of the day there is really only one God, and one afterlife. We all have free will to do what we want and believe what we believe. 

[bishopshodan]

13 minutes ago, Foamys Ghost said:

No it isn't.  It is an example of the burden of proof fallacy.  When Christians say you can't prove God doesn't exist it is a cop out.  The burden of proof in that discussion is on the one making the positive assertion.  There is as much evidence for Tinkerbell as there is for God.  If you think this is wrong, provide the evidence that God exists.

Thank you.

It's the silliest thing i have heard in a while.

 

Poor Rup yesterday must had been hitting his head agains the wall. 

[Elias Pettersson]

24 minutes ago, Foamys Ghost said:

No it isn't.  It is an example of the burden of proof fallacy.  When Christians say you can't prove God doesn't exist it is a cop out.  The burden of proof in that discussion is on the one making the positive assertion.  There is as much evidence for Tinkerbell as there is for God.  If you think this is wrong, provide the evidence that God exists.

The Bible, the Quran and other literature clearly state that God exists. So now it’s on you to prove these books are fake…

[Elias Pettersson]

2 hours ago, Jester13 said:

EP, would you be open to learning why this is faulty logic?

Sure.

[Cold]

8 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Yes, I personally believe in reincarnation but I know alot of people who don’t. Religion isn’t perfect, there are many religious with different teachings. At the end of the day there is really only one God, and one afterlife. We all have free will to do what we want and believe what we believe. 

Kudos to you for modifying your belief structure into something that works for you.

While abortion is always going to be a hot button issue, at least within your belief structure, ( correct me if I’m wrong) that includes elements of predestination and reincarnation abortion “could” be looked at as a preordained event, with the fetus experiencing the mother’s emotional reaction.

[Jester13]

5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Sure.

Okay, great. I'll try to answer in sequences with as many yes or no questions as possible to make it as clear as possible.

 

You mentioned that "You claim God doesn't exist but you don't want to present any evidence to actually show that."

 

This shows that you understand that to be able to prove something, someone needs to provide evidence, correct?

[Bob Long]

44 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

If good and evil during our lives is an overall good thing (  as it provides dynamics? ), then why do so many desire the peace and love of an eternal existence with god in heaven?

 

its the christian fallacy that you must suffer now to "earn" something in the afterlife. It serves folks that want to have some control over your life, if you bite hard on that one. 

[Rip The Mesh]

If he or she; truly does exist; The Canucks would get the bounces far more often. 

The other team Nada. They will have no substance injuries. Get to the fourth round and probably win it. I say probably because

there's always the possible some moron the yells his son's name far too often during a game. Even when there's a small line -up

at a concession stand! So for ---- sakes, do your part and lets win this fu   oops / thing. 

[Elias Pettersson]

21 minutes ago, Cold said:

Kudos to you for modifying your belief structure into something that works for you.

While abortion is always going to be a hot button issue, at least within your belief structure, ( correct me if I’m wrong) that includes elements of predestination and reincarnation abortion “could” be looked at as a preordained event, with the fetus experiencing the mother’s emotional reaction.

That is a possibility. I could be open to that. However, a major problem with abortion is the fact that some women use it as a form of birth control, they have “many” abortions without regard for human life. They don’t see the fetus as human with a living soul inside of it. 
 

So then how do you explain the recklessness of these women who feel that they can do whatever they want with their bodies and don’t care how many abortions they have?  Is a Roman Catholic like myself supposed to be okay with that and just believe that is what all of those souls wanted?  
 

If a fetus dies while in the womb because the woman was in a car accident, or because she had a miscarriage, etc, then that is not a choice made by the woman. The choice was made by the soul to die that way and have the woman experience the pain. Souls can die in order to help other souls. This is not the case in an abortion. The soul that is in the womb is being forced to die, so it’s not really helping the woman experience anything. 

[Elias Pettersson]

19 minutes ago, Rip The Mesh said:

If he or she; truly does exist; The Canucks would get the bounces far more often. 

The other team Nada. They will have no substance injuries. Get to the fourth round and probably win it. I say probably because

there's always the possible some moron the yells his son's name far too often during a game. Even when there's a small line -up

at a concession stand! So for ---- sakes, do your part and lets win this fu   oops / thing. 

God doesn’t choose who wins the Stanley Cup. He/She doesn’t play favourites. 

[Elias Pettersson]

33 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

Okay, great. I'll try to answer in sequences with as many yes or no questions as possible to make it as clear as possible.

 

You mentioned that "You claim God doesn't exist but you don't want to present any evidence to actually show that."

 

This shows that you understand that to be able to prove something, someone needs to provide evidence, correct?

Sure. The Bible proves that God does exist. It is a book that has never been proven to be fake. It has withstood the test of time. 

[Cold]

8 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

That is a possibility. I could be open to that. However, a major problem with abortion is the fact that some women use it as a form of birth control, they have “many” abortions without regard for human life. They don’t see the fetus as human with a living soul inside of it. 
 

So then how do you explain the recklessness of these women who feel that they can do whatever they want with their bodies and don’t care how many abortions they have?  Is a Roman Catholic like myself supposed to be okay with that and just believe that is what all of those souls wanted?  

You don’t have to be ok with that, but their bodies are their bodies. And perhaps it is what those souls wanted. It is also preordained that the woman is going to do this. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Cold

[MeanSeanBean]

9 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

So then how do you explain the recklessness of these women who feel that they can do whatever they want with their bodies and don’t care how many abortions they have?  Is a Roman Catholic like myself supposed to be okay with that and just believe that is what all of those souls wanted?  
 

 

 

In your opinion, would this scenario be the majority, minority, or somewhere in the middle? To me it feels like the overwhelming minority of abortions would be woman " being reckless and doing whatever they want". Further more, what would the upside of forcing someone who is young and reckless to have a child? feels like an increased risk that the mother wouldn't be capable to raising and caring for a little one, to me.

[bishopshodan]

18 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

So then how do you explain the recklessness of these women who feel that they can do whatever they want with their bodies and don’t care how many abortions they have?  Is a Roman Catholic like myself supposed to be okay with that and just believe that is what all of those souls wanted?  

 

You don't have to be ok with it but it's not your body.

 

These reckless women have the right to do what ever they want. If they are wiping out souls, then they will answer for it in front of god, or not if there isn't one. Either way, not your business. The majority of people in Canada believe that abortions should be legal so therefore it is 'fact' that it is the right thing for it to be allowed. Thats how it works right?

[Elias Pettersson]

6 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

You don't have to be ok with it but it's not your body.

 

These reckless women have the right to do what ever they want. If they are wiping out souls, then they will answer for it in front of god, or not if there isn't one. Either way, not your business. The majority of people in Canada believe that abortions should be legal so therefore it is 'fact' that it is the right thing for it to be allowed. Thats how it works right?

Sure. People will eventually pay for their sins. Whether in this life or the afterlife. 

[bishopshodan]

13 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Sure. People will eventually pay for their sins. Whether in this life or the afterlife. 

 

Is time the same in the afterlife?

 

I have always wondered about hell in that regard. If you torture a person long enough, I would think they would go crazy? Are they still suffering for eternity if they start to crack? which poses another question, can the soul.. lose mental functions?

 

I'm thinking about the Palahniuk book 'Damned'. Great read, it's like the breakfast club in hell. Anyway, some of the chacters had been ripped apart by demons so many times that they had got used to it. They became a group of Karens that decided to march towards the center of hell to talk with the manager. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by bishopshodan
not Doomed, that was the 2nd book

[Bob Long]

37 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Sure. The Bible proves that God does exist. It is a book that has never been proven to be fake. It has withstood the test of time. 

 

No one has proved Scientology is fake. God could be named Ron. 

[Elias Pettersson]

31 minutes ago, MeanSeanBean said:

 

In your opinion, would this scenario be the majority, minority, or somewhere in the middle? To me it feels like the overwhelming minority of abortions would be woman " being reckless and doing whatever they want". Further more, what would the upside of forcing someone who is young and reckless to have a child? feels like an increased risk that the mother wouldn't be capable to raising and caring for a little one, to me.

I don’t have any stats in front of me so I couldn’t comment on it. I know that abortion due to rape or incest is quite low, probably at less than 1%. There are lots of people of faith who feel that these scenarios should be made as an exception for abortion and I agree with that. It serves no purpose to force a woman to have a child through rape or incest. 
 

As for young women being reckless, that is a situation that happens when you lack knowledge, your environment that you grew up in, your parents, friends etc. There are many ways that can prevent a woman from getting pregnant. Condoms, birth control, the morning after pill. We are all taught to use “protection” to avoid diseases. So these women are also being reckless in that regard. Aren’t sexually transmitted diseases on the rise?  I could be wrong. 
 

There is no upside to a young woman having a child that she cannot take of. Although I do know many young women who have had children as teenagers and the children have gone on to have a great life. 
 

Whenever the issue of abortion comes up, I always tell the other person, aren’t you glad that your mother didn’t have an abortion?  I’m sure you are happy to be alive and enjoying life. A lot of souls unfortunately were robbed of that opportunity. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Elias Pettersson