tas Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 1 minute ago, HKSR said: You really are arrogant enough to think you know better than advanced statistics huh? So much so that you go off plus minus stats to define a player's defensive ability. I even pointed out Kucherov's measly +9 on a stacked team and you just choose to ignore it and sling personal attacks instead. You've lost all credibility son. oh buddy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 I love these guys who could be convinced the sky is orange if a spreadsheet told them so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 1 minute ago, tas said: oh buddy. Best ya got? OK case closed. Have a good evening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 1 minute ago, bishopshodan said: and where in there did I even hint that I might go back if I fail in my goal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 2 minutes ago, tas said: and where in there did I even hint that I might go back if I fail in my goal? Oh you'll fail at your nonsense like I failed at reading. Because what you are doing is annoying good fans that want to have reasonable conversations. Nobody wants to be brutally policed by you. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 7 minutes ago, HKSR said: You really are arrogant enough to think you know better than advanced statistics huh? So much so that you go off plus minus stats to define a player's defensive ability. I even pointed out Kucherov's measly +9 on a stacked team and you just choose to ignore it and sling personal attacks instead. You've lost all credibility son. coming from the guy arrogant enough to think the stats he got from some nobody on twitter know better than the organization that is the talk of the league for their success this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 Just now, bishopshodan said: Oh you'll fail at your nonsense like I failed at reading. Because what you are doing is annoying good fans that want to have reasonable conversations. Nobody wants to be brutally policed by you. Well said man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 1 minute ago, bishopshodan said: Oh you'll fail at your nonsense like I failed at reading. Because what you are doing is annoying good fans that want to have reasonable conversations. Nobody wants to be brutally policed by you. you've stumbled across the whole point. congrats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 (edited) Just a quick note here... Before we speak about coaches who are great, good or dog shit, can we just agree, that the ultimate measuring stick is winning the Stanley Cup? I feel there are bad vibes send towards coach Tocchet, just because he make decisions we may/may not agree with, in this case Kuzmenko. Nobody here has a freaking clue, why Tocchet sits Kuzmenko in the press box. It could be for tactical reasons, for punishment, fitness issues, a lifted finger to anyone not starting the season in pristine condition, or it could be something entirely different none of us knows about. This is one of the best, if not the best start start to a season in the history of the Canucks, and as soon as he makes decisions that can be baffling, we are starting to question his ability. Now I may be in the minority here, but if Tocchet leads Canucks to the championship, I could care less, how he gets his players to perform, as long as its neither immoral or illegal... Its starting to sound as if the treatment of Kuzmenko is more important, than getting the team to play a system, which the coach is trying to implement. Kuz scored 39 goals during last season mainly under Bruce Boudreau's pond hockey... at the time it was reported regularly, that Kuzmenko was scoring at an unsustainably shooting %, but it was great to see... What wasn't great to see was the team sinking like a rock yet again in the standings until Tocchet took over in the spring 2023. JR was adamant that Tocchet was his preferred choice as coach, so he must believe in, what Tocchet is trying to. achieve, and the way he goes about his business... so far, he has done good. Maybe better than most expected at the start of the season, so JRs trust seems justified. Now a few changes were made, which made the team better, but the team still had to be adjusted, so it would win games regularly. I suggest Tocchet has done that, and more... Now, if the coach preaches something to his team and one of these issues are accountability, he might find it extremely annoying/disappointing were some of his players not playing accordingly... You may find room to individuals, if those are big time players, but in general the coach may lose the room, if players start to do as they please... Now I don't know if this is the case, but Kuz's play remind me a lot of Boesers the last few seasons, which wanted people to see the back of him. Kuzmenko is a fabulous player and likeable into the extreme with his winning smile... 39 goal Kuz will be an asset to any team, but 39 goals + defensive responsibility will be a far bigger asset, and maybe that is, what Tocchet is trying to achieve. If for any reason it's a clash of personalities, or Tocchet can get to grips with Kuz, Kuz will be traded, as nobody wins by having $5M in the press box. Nevertheless, I think they believe the can improve Kuz, as otherwise he would have been traded last summer. Edited January 6 by spook007 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_Hawk Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 20 minutes ago, tas said: that's what they're doing by teaching him. he's learning a new system, new language, new country all at the same time. being in the press box isn't punishment, it's an opportunity to learn. I think this whole topic is just gone off the rails...its pretty simple: A 40 goal scorer is sitting up in the box for MULTIPLE games learning how to play right, while they move a 4th line player to the first to be ineffective so that he can show the 40 goal scorer how to play right. Meanwhile, guys from the AHL come up and play a less effective role on 4th line. Net outcome: the teams 1st and 4th lines are worse. Is that a winning formula? Takeaways: - Isn't that the job of the training and coaching staff to work with the players outside of games to improve their play and conditioning? - Don't we have video coaches to watch games with Kuzy and discuss ways to play certain situations? - If his game and/or conditioning is that broken, why not move him to Abby for a stint; then bring up a Baines or Podz to see how their development is coming along? - Wouldn't it be better to showcase his skills in games rather than erode his trade value? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captkirk888 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 7 hours ago, BC_Hawk said: But Boeser never got the treatment; he just got consistently placed in top6 with minimal effort. He by no means earned it or showed signs of improvement last year. To be honest, the Boeser we have seen the last 5 or so games looks the same way; lazy, no back check, minimal effort in the boards, floating..... Just because his scoring has cooled down doesn’t make this true. I watch all the games and the eye test is telling me he is still working hard in all the areas you said he isn’t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 3 minutes ago, tas said: you've stumbled across the whole point. congrats. And mine is that you are making this place less enjoyable. i dont mind you going at folk but you have self admitted you are on a warpath, that you are brutal, and condescending. Your words. Try a different approach, you might get more results. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 2 minutes ago, BC_Hawk said: I think this whole topic is just gone off the rails...its pretty simple: A 40 goal scorer is sitting up in the box for MULTIPLE games learning how to play right, while they move a 4th line player to the first to be ineffective so that he can show the 40 goal scorer how to play right. Meanwhile, guys from the AHL come up and play a less effective role on 4th line. Net outcome: the teams 1st and 4th lines are worse. Is that a winning formula? Takeaways: - Isn't that the job of the training and coaching staff to work with the players outside of games to improve their play and conditioning? - Don't we have video coaches to watch games with Kuzy and discuss ways to play certain situations? - If his game and/or conditioning is that broken, why not move him to Abby for a stint; then bring up a Baines or Podz to see how their development is coming along? - Wouldn't it be better to showcase his skills in games rather than erode his trade value? this is on kuz. the path of least resistance is cutting bait. the team is doing him a massive favour by helping him along. this isn't some kid we're talking about but a longtime pro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 We have multiple Kuzy complaint threads. I wonder which one will get less attention? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_Hawk Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Just now, Captkirk888 said: Just because his scoring has cooled down doesn’t make this true. I watch all the games and the eye test is telling me he is still working hard in all the areas you said he isn’t. His play the last 4-5 games has really fallen off; visible signs of lack of effort. The polar opposite would be Miller; his play has been exceptional (faceoff % aside) even though this scoring has cooled off. Boeser is no longer skating full out nor battling hard for pucks; appears to float for stretches again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 2 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: And mine is that you are making this place less enjoyable. less enjoyable for the people who deserve less enjoyment because all they do is steep in negativity. I'm trying to make it more enjoyable for supporters of the team by getting the other clowns to pipe down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 3 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: And mine is that you are making this place less enjoyable. i dont mind you going at folk but you have self admitted you are on a warpath, that you are brutal, and condescending. Your words. Try a different approach, you might get more results. I'm very happy with the approach I've chosen. I'm taking my team back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_Hawk Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 1 minute ago, tas said: this is on kuz. the path of least resistance is cutting bait. the team is doing him a massive favour by helping him along. this isn't some kid we're talking about but a longtime pro. How do you cut bait? He is signed for 11m for 2 years...this isn't the NFL. The team is doing him no favors by eroding his value sitting in the pressbox. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captkirk888 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Just now, BC_Hawk said: His play the last 4-5 games has really fallen off; visible signs of lack of effort. The polar opposite would be Miller; his play has been exceptional (faceoff % aside) even though this scoring has cooled off. Boeser is no longer skating full out nor battling hard for pucks; appears to float for stretches again. Again, I disagree. I still see Boeser forechecking hard and coming back fast to back check. Oh well, agree to disagree. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 3 minutes ago, BC_Hawk said: I think this whole topic is just gone off the rails...its pretty simple: A 40 goal scorer is sitting up in the box for MULTIPLE games learning how to play right, while they move a 4th line player to the first to be ineffective so that he can show the 40 goal scorer how to play right. Meanwhile, guys from the AHL come up and play a less effective role on 4th line. Net outcome: the teams 1st and 4th lines are worse. Is that a winning formula? Takeaways: - Isn't that the job of the training and coaching staff to work with the players outside of games to improve their play and conditioning? - Don't we have video coaches to watch games with Kuzy and discuss ways to play certain situations? - If his game and/or conditioning is that broken, why not move him to Abby for a stint; then bring up a Baines or Podz to see how their development is coming along? - Wouldn't it be better to showcase his skills in games rather than erode his trade value? Do we know, this haven't been done? Fact is we don't know jack.... Also believe they can't move him to Abby... I may be wrong on that, but seem to recall that being discussed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 1 minute ago, BC_Hawk said: How do you cut bait? He is signed for 11m for 2 years...this isn't the NFL. The team is doing him no favors by eroding his value sitting in the pressbox. by trading him? it's not like he's some toxic contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 1 minute ago, tas said: less enjoyable for the people who deserve less enjoyment because all they do is steep in negativity. I'm trying to make it more enjoyable for supporters of the team by getting the other clowns to pipe down. Nah, less enjoyable for most i would think. they have to read all this crap i am now dancing through with you your approach is failing. Just now, tas said: I'm very happy with the approach I've chosen. I'm taking my team back. It was never yours. It's all of ours. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Just now, bishopshodan said: Nah, less enjoyable for most i would think. they have to read all this crap i am now dancing through with you your approach is failing. It was never yours. It's all of ours. tell that to the countless upvotes I've received over the last 3 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 3 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: Nah, less enjoyable for most i would think. they have to read all this crap i am now dancing through with you your approach is failing. It was never yours. It's all of ours. Pretty sure he's on a lot of ignore lists at this point. I just put him on mine. Just not worth it. Even stawns has more constructive arguments than this guy. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 3 minutes ago, tas said: tell that to the countless upvotes I've received over the last 3 months. My rep to post ratio is better than yours. So zip it back up and put the mouse back in the house. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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