[Signing] Jason Dickinson re-sign with Blackhawks

[RakuRaku]

On 1/16/2024 at 10:38 AM, kettlevalley said:

I dont get it.  We cap dump Dickinson at 2.65 and they sign him to 4.25 one year later?  Shaking head all day.  

well.... any sucky teams still gotta make the cap floor!!!

[filthy animal]

On 1/16/2024 at 9:54 AM, PureQuickness said:

 

Pearson was not overpaid at all. He provided RELIABLE points for his pay. People were just expecting him to be a 40 or 50 goal scorer, which is unrealistic.

 

Something to note about the Benning regime: Pearson and Dickinson are both doing well AWAY from the team. There was just something about how Benning assembled his team that didn't flow. Yes, keeping Green was a BIG mistake.

 

Yup, and our propects took bigger steps after Benning/Cull were here. Benning was just interested in collecting players and not really figuring out that a team needed to be built. He got pieces in free agency that didnt fit the puzzle

[PureQuickness]

37 minutes ago, filthy animal said:

 

Yup, and our propects took bigger steps after Benning/Cull were here. Benning was just interested in collecting players and not really figuring out that a team needed to be built. He got pieces in free agency that didnt fit the puzzle

 

People took Benning for granted with respect to the drafting and developing prospects. Not all of them were hits, of course, but compared to the Gillis regime, it was really a night and day difference. Gillis was absolutely AWFUL with drafting and developing, but there will always be excuses for his poor selections. Yes, he brought us playoff runs, but he sold the farm many times over during the process while failing to make good selections with the few picks that he did have. The track record was terrible and no one should be defending that.

Edited January 18 by PureQuickness

[filthy animal]

1 hour ago, PureQuickness said:

 

People took Benning for granted with respect to the drafting and developing prospects. Not all of them were hits, of course, but compared to the Gillis regime, it was really a night and day difference. Gillis was absolutely AWFUL with drafting and developing, but there will always be excuses for his poor selections. Yes, he brought us playoff runs, but he sold the farm many times over during the process while failing to make good selections with the few picks that he did have. The track record was terrible and no one should be defending that.

 

Playoff runs and trying to win the cup is the only thing that matters. 

 

Sold the farm many times? Like you mean trading 2 top 40 picks for OEL? That was jimbo .Let me get this straight, ur a fan of a guy that trades picks out the door like candy JUST to crawl to the playoffs rather than a guy that trades to win the cup? 

 

 

Edited January 18 by filthy animal

[Tower102]

2 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Yup, and our propects took bigger steps after Benning/Cull were here. Benning was just interested in collecting players and not really figuring out that a team needed to be built. He got pieces in free agency that didnt fit the puzzle

This is a decent assessment. I feel like Benning did fairly well at bringing in more talent then what left... but the puzzle pieces didn't fit well (similar to how the Leafs have been fairly stacked but just can't get it done). Alvin has been able to do fringe work but with the right fitting puzzle pieces and its been a drastic difference. Moves that in theory should have worked and been good value exchanges (3rd for Schmidt, 3rd for Dickinson as just a couple examples) didn't fit properly and thus ended up lowering the value of the players and shipping them out for a loss. 

[PureQuickness]

18 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Playoff runs and trying to win the cup is the only thing that matters. 

 

Sold the farm many times? Like you mean trading 2 top 40 picks for OEL? That was jimbo .Let me get this straight, ur a fan of a guy that trades picks out the door like candy JUST to crawl to the playoffs rather than a guy that trades to win the cup? 

 

 

 

No, I was assessing the ENTIRETY of Gillis. Playoff runs aren't the only thing that matters. While I credited Gillis for finding the right supplementary players for the team, his drafting and developing was GARBAGE. Look at those draft pick selections. A good GM must be able to do everything. Benning was lacking in some areas, and so was Gillis.

 

By the end of Gillis' tenure, our farm was dogshit. I'm sorry. Gillis had two high first round picks and those were the ONLY players that he could ever draft. The other first rounders, second rounders, and everyone lower than this NEVER succeeded. That is crap. You need to find value in other rounds. If your best depth drafted player is Hutton, that is a serious issue.

Edited January 19 by PureQuickness

[Wiggums]

3 minutes ago, PureQuickness said:

 

No, I was assessing the ENTIRETY of Gillis. Playoff runs aren't the only thing that matters. While I credited Gillis for finding the right supplementary players for the team, his drafting and developing was GARBAGE. Look at those draft pick selections. A good GM must be able to do everything. Benning was lacking in some areas, and so was Gillis.

 

By the end of Gillis' tenure, our farm was dogshit. I'm sorry. Gillis had two high first round picks and those were the ONLY players that he could ever draft. The other first rounders, second rounders, and everyone lower than this NEVER succeeded. That is crap. You need to find value in other rounds. If your best depth drafted player is Hutton, that is a serious issue.

 

In 8 years of Bottom feeding and supposed retooling Benning found Demko and Hoglander in the later rounds and that's it.  Hardly impressive 

[PureQuickness]

Just now, Wiggums said:

 

In 8 years of Bottom feeding and supposed retooling Benning found Demko and Hoglander in the later rounds and that's it.  Hardly impressive 

 

You've got a franchise goaltender and a VERY serviceable forward. Gillis couldn't find a single goaltender or defenseman (not named Hutton) in ALL his years combined. He had first rounders and second rounders. Benning had players like Rathbone (who Allvin later traded to get another player).

 

Gillis gave no such flexibility with his draft picks. They were just devaluated or nonexistent assets.

 

And don't get me started on the waste of a 2nd rounder in Alex Mallet. TERRIBLE TERRIBLE pick. Overage that wasn't even on anyone's board. He threw that 2nd rounder like candy, along with the rest of the 2nd round picks he ever had. The man could not draft.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/canucks-draft-history-breaking-best-worst-years/

The Worst Drafts

2007
Usually, when you look at a team’s draft list from a certain year and see no NHL games-played, it is because that draft occurred recently and the players selected are still hopeful and churning their way towards the big league. But unless Patrick White comes out of retirement having spent the last several years bathing in the holy water at Lourdes, we’re pretty sure the Canucks are never getting anything out of this black hole of a draft.

Nonis, who homered in his first draft after replacing Burke in 2004, struck out completely in 2007 by choosing six players who never saw a minute in the NHL. Now, only two of the picks were in the first four rounds. But White at 25th overall (ahead of David Perron) and defenceman Taylor Ellington at 33rd (ahead of P.K. Subban)? At least Gillis eventually packaged White in a trade for San Jose defenceman Christian Ehrhoff.

2010
While we’re on the subject of Gillis, a couple of his drafts were candidates for worst-ever, but we’re going with 2010 for the “totality” of the former GM’s work at and before that draft. Gillis picked only five players that day and it wasn’t a complete whiff because undersized centre Alex Friesen, a sixth-rounder, did play one game for the Canucks in 2015-16 before taking his career to Europe.

But Gillis’ first selection wasn’t until the fourth round (defenceman Patrick McNally’s most notable hockey achievement was getting thrown out of Harvard in an exam cheating scandal) because he’d traded away his first three picks. The worst move was giving up his first-rounder, and prospect Michael Grabner, to get defenceman Keith Ballard from Florida to replace defenceman Willie Mitchell, who was soon invited to leave Vancouver as a free agent. It turned out OK for Mitchell because he was able to help the Los Angeles Kings win two Cups. It wasn’t a strong draft in 2010 and the incompetent Panthers, who would waive Grabner so he could score 34 goals for the Islanders the next season, selected Quinton Howden at 25th — just before the Washington Capitals took a Russian named Evgeny Kuznetsov.

 

Here is a website that lists all the players that Gillis ever drafted by year:

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/the-transaction-history-of-mike-gillis

First Season: 2008/2009

Mike Gillis started off his tenure at the 2008 NHL Entry Draft.

His picks include:

• Cody Hodgson (round 1, 10th overall)
• Yann Sauve (round 2, 41st overall)
• Prab Rai (round 5, 131st overall)
• Mats Froshaug (round 6, 161st overall)
• Morgan Clark (round 7, 191st overall)

Second Season: 2009/2010

Gillis’ NHL Entry Draft 2009 picks:

• Jordan Schroeder (round 1, 22nd overall)
• Anton Rodin (round 2, 53rd overall)
• Kevin Connauton (round 3, 83rd overall)
• Jeremy Price (round 4, 113th overall)
• Peter Andersson (round 5, 113th overall)
• Joe Cannata (round 6, 173rd overall)
• Steven Anthony (round 7, 187th overall)

Third Season: 2010/2011

Draft day 2010 started with a bang for the Canucks as Gillis had traded another former first round draft choice, Michael Grabner, along with Steve Bernier and the teams 2010 first round draft pick (used to select Quinton Howden) to the Florida Panthers for Keith Ballard and Victor Oreskovich. This meant that the Canucks would not select a player in the draft until the fourth round.

 

Here’s how the 2010 draft went down for the Canucks:

• Patrick McNally (round 4, 115th overall)
• Adam Polasek (round 5, 145th overall)
• Alex Friesen (round 6, 172nd overall)
• Jonathan Iilahti (round 6, 175th overall)
• Sawyer Hannay (round 7, 205th overall)

Fourth Season: 2011/2012

Coming off a disappointing loss in the Stanley Cup Finals, Gillis had a plan of what he wanted to do heading into the draft and the subsequent off-season. It was clear that the Canucks were bullied by the Bruins and Gillis wanted to get bigger and add some toughness to a team that already possessed some of the best skill in the NHL. He started the off – season by drafting a power forward in Nicklas Jensen.

Draft day 2011:

• Nicklas Jensen (round 1, 29th overall)
• David Honzik (round 3, 71st overall)
• Alexandre Grenier (round 3, 90th overall)
• Joseph Labate (round 4, 101st overall)
• Ludwig Blomstrand (round 4, 120th overall)
• Frank Corrado (round 5, 150th overall)
• Pathrik Westerholm (round 6, 180th overall)
•  Henrik Tommernes (round 7, 210th overall)

Fifth Season: 2012/2013

Gillis’ NHL Entry Draft 2012 picks:

• Brendan Gaunce (round 1, 26th overall)
• Alexandre Mallet (round 2, 57th overall)
• Ben Hutton (round 5, 147th overall)
• Wesley Myron (round 6, 177th overall)
• Matthew Beattie (round 7, 207th overall)

That is a big F on drafting and developing. Sure, the man brought playoff runs, but there's another portion of his job that he sucked in.

[Wiggums]

Just now, PureQuickness said:

 

You've got a franchise goaltender and a VERY serviceable forward. Gillis couldn't find a single goaltender or defenseman (not named Hutton) in ALL his years combined. He had first rounders and second rounders. Benning had players like Rathbone (who Allvin later traded to get another player).

 

Gillis gave no such flexibility with his draft picks. They were just devaluated or nonexistent assets.

 

And don't get me started on the waste of a 2nd rounder in Alex Mallet. TERRIBLE TERRIBLE pick. Overage that wasn't even on anyone's board. He threw that 2nd rounder like candy, along with the rest of the 2nd round picks he ever had. The man could not draft.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/canucks-draft-history-breaking-best-worst-years/

The Worst Drafts

2007
Usually, when you look at a team’s draft list from a certain year and see no NHL games-played, it is because that draft occurred recently and the players selected are still hopeful and churning their way towards the big league. But unless Patrick White comes out of retirement having spent the last several years bathing in the holy water at Lourdes, we’re pretty sure the Canucks are never getting anything out of this black hole of a draft.

Nonis, who homered in his first draft after replacing Burke in 2004, struck out completely in 2007 by choosing six players who never saw a minute in the NHL. Now, only two of the picks were in the first four rounds. But White at 25th overall (ahead of David Perron) and defenceman Taylor Ellington at 33rd (ahead of P.K. Subban)? At least Gillis eventually packaged White in a trade for San Jose defenceman Christian Ehrhoff.

2010
While we’re on the subject of Gillis, a couple of his drafts were candidates for worst-ever, but we’re going with 2010 for the “totality” of the former GM’s work at and before that draft. Gillis picked only five players that day and it wasn’t a complete whiff because undersized centre Alex Friesen, a sixth-rounder, did play one game for the Canucks in 2015-16 before taking his career to Europe.

But Gillis’ first selection wasn’t until the fourth round (defenceman Patrick McNally’s most notable hockey achievement was getting thrown out of Harvard in an exam cheating scandal) because he’d traded away his first three picks. The worst move was giving up his first-rounder, and prospect Michael Grabner, to get defenceman Keith Ballard from Florida to replace defenceman Willie Mitchell, who was soon invited to leave Vancouver as a free agent. It turned out OK for Mitchell because he was able to help the Los Angeles Kings win two Cups. It wasn’t a strong draft in 2010 and the incompetent Panthers, who would waive Grabner so he could score 34 goals for the Islanders the next season, selected Quinton Howden at 25th — just before the Washington Capitals took a Russian named Evgeny Kuznetsov.

 

Here is a website that lists all the players that Gillis ever drafted by year:

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/the-transaction-history-of-mike-gillis

First Season: 2008/2009

Mike Gillis started off his tenure at the 2008 NHL Entry Draft.

His picks include:

• Cody Hodgson (round 1, 10th overall)
• Yann Sauve (round 2, 41st overall)
• Prab Rai (round 5, 131st overall)
• Mats Froshaug (round 6, 161st overall)
• Morgan Clark (round 7, 191st overall)

Second Season: 2009/2010

Gillis’ NHL Entry Draft 2009 picks:

• Jordan Schroeder (round 1, 22nd overall)
• Anton Rodin (round 2, 53rd overall)
• Kevin Connauton (round 3, 83rd overall)
• Jeremy Price (round 4, 113th overall)
• Peter Andersson (round 5, 113th overall)
• Joe Cannata (round 6, 173rd overall)
• Steven Anthony (round 7, 187th overall)

Third Season: 2010/2011

Draft day 2010 started with a bang for the Canucks as Gillis had traded another former first round draft choice, Michael Grabner, along with Steve Bernier and the teams 2010 first round draft pick (used to select Quinton Howden) to the Florida Panthers for Keith Ballard and Victor Oreskovich. This meant that the Canucks would not select a player in the draft until the fourth round.

 

Here’s how the 2010 draft went down for the Canucks:

• Patrick McNally (round 4, 115th overall)
• Adam Polasek (round 5, 145th overall)
• Alex Friesen (round 6, 172nd overall)
• Jonathan Iilahti (round 6, 175th overall)
• Sawyer Hannay (round 7, 205th overall)

Fourth Season: 2011/2012

Coming off a disappointing loss in the Stanley Cup Finals, Gillis had a plan of what he wanted to do heading into the draft and the subsequent off-season. It was clear that the Canucks were bullied by the Bruins and Gillis wanted to get bigger and add some toughness to a team that already possessed some of the best skill in the NHL. He started the off – season by drafting a power forward in Nicklas Jensen.

Draft day 2011:

• Nicklas Jensen (round 1, 29th overall)
• David Honzik (round 3, 71st overall)
• Alexandre Grenier (round 3, 90th overall)
• Joseph Labate (round 4, 101st overall)
• Ludwig Blomstrand (round 4, 120th overall)
• Frank Corrado (round 5, 150th overall)
• Pathrik Westerholm (round 6, 180th overall)
•  Henrik Tommernes (round 7, 210th overall)

Fifth Season: 2012/2013

Gillis’ NHL Entry Draft 2012 picks:

• Brendan Gaunce (round 1, 26th overall)
• Alexandre Mallet (round 2, 57th overall)
• Ben Hutton (round 5, 147th overall)
• Wesley Myron (round 6, 177th overall)
• Matthew Beattie (round 7, 207th overall)

That is a big F on drafting and developing. Sure, the man brought playoff runs, but there's another portion of his job that he sucked in.

 

Yeah Gillis drafting sucked, nobody argues that.  I was just pointing out that Benning had 8 years of Bottom place finishes to find gems in the later rounds and he didn't really do that.  I mean, he was advertised as a good drafter, Gillis was not

[PureQuickness]

Just now, Wiggums said:

 

Yeah Gillis drafting sucked, nobody argues that.  I was just pointing out that Benning had 8 years of Bottom place finishes to find gems in the later rounds and he didn't really do that.  I mean, he was advertised as a good drafter, Gillis was not

 

We already have seen people making excuses for poor drafting.

 

Benning WAS the best drafter in recent memory though. If you count the number of drafted players (not in the first rounder), they are still around. Zhukenov (5th rounder) is in the system still and players like Woo and Brisebois (prior to injury with the latter player) are very close to making the NHL.

 

Still a hell of a lot better than what Gillis ever did combined.

[Sapper]

Good in him but this is very bad news for other teams 

 

4,250,000 per year has just screwed other teams as it skyrockets contract costs they will face. Things like this can be used as leverage in salary arbitration and will be used by agents to demand deals that are out of touch

 

If Dickenson is worth over 4 million per .... Does that make our third line all 5 million plus a year players ?  Does this make our second line all 6 mill plus ?

Certainly that makes our Lotto line then worth 10mill plus EACH .... Based on comparable value 

 

Again good on his agent for getting this much but Chicago has just screwed the rest of the leagues teams with setting the value this high 

 

Didn't Brian Burke have.thr same rant a few years back ?

[Wiggums]

1 hour ago, PureQuickness said:

 

We already have seen people making excuses for poor drafting.

 

Benning WAS the best drafter in recent memory though. If you count the number of drafted players (not in the first rounder), they are still around. Zhukenov (5th rounder) is in the system still and players like Woo and Brisebois (prior to injury with the latter player) are very close to making the NHL.

 

Still a hell of a lot better than what Gillis ever did combined.

 

Hard to compare the two when Benning was picking at the top of each round and Gillis picked at the bottom but yeah we can say Benning was a better drafter but he certainly wasn't a good drafter overall.  Canucks are one of the worst drafting teams in NHL history so Benning might be the best of the worst I guess?  

[CanuckMan]

27 minutes ago, Sapper said:

Good in him but this is very bad news for other teams 

 

4,250,000 per year has just screwed other teams as it skyrockets contract costs they will face. Things like this can be used as leverage in salary arbitration and will be used by agents to demand deals that are out of touch

 

If Dickenson is worth over 4 million per .... Does that make our third line all 5 million plus a year players ?  Does this make our second line all 6 mill plus ?

Certainly that makes our Lotto line then worth 10mill plus EACH .... Based on comparable value 

 

Again good on his agent for getting this much but Chicago has just screwed the rest of the leagues teams with setting the value this high 

 

Didn't Brian Burke have.thr same rant a few years back ?

It does screw up the cap dynamics in the league but I think players and agents recognize the situations in which those players sign these contracts. They all know Chicago has money to spare and is going no where close to the playoffs in these 2 years he signed. He’s simply a body to keep the team afloat in the cap minimum and also provides them with a decent center. 

[flat land fish]

2 hours ago, Wiggums said:

 

In 8 years of Bottom feeding and supposed retooling Benning found Demko and Hoglander in the later rounds and that's it.  Hardly impressive 

Arguably all the core pieces were acquired by Benning.

[filthy animal]

3 hours ago, PureQuickness said:

 

No, I was assessing the ENTIRETY of Gillis. Playoff runs aren't the only thing that matters. While I credited Gillis for finding the right supplementary players for the team, his drafting and developing was GARBAGE. Look at those draft pick selections. A good GM must be able to do everything. Benning was lacking in some areas, and so was Gillis.

 

By the end of Gillis' tenure, our farm was dogshit. I'm sorry. Gillis had two high first round picks and those were the ONLY players that he could ever draft. The other first rounders, second rounders, and everyone lower than this NEVER succeeded. That is crap. You need to find value in other rounds. If your best depth drafted player is Hutton, that is a serious issue.

 

Actually, it is the only thing that matters. What the hell do you think GMs sign free agents, draft players, make trades for? To keep the zamboni drivers employed in April May June? The goal is get players to help the team win, whether its any way of the 3 things I mentioned. Nobody is saying Gillis drafted well, but he sure as hell won a lot. Nobody cares whether this team is comprised of 1st 2nd round picks or a bunch of 45 year olds. You make a good playoff run, or hopefully win the cup, people won't give a shit how its done.

 

Benning lacking in some areas? Seriously? Other than his supposed draft prowess he was worst at everything else. Free Agency, trades, cap management, and he didn't have the results to back it up. At least the other guy had that.

 

 

 

 

[filthy animal]

1 hour ago, flat land fish said:

Arguably all the core pieces were acquired by Benning.

 

Those core pieces didn't do squat until Rutherford/Alvin came along

[filthy animal]

1 hour ago, Wiggums said:

 

Hard to compare the two when Benning was picking at the top of each round and Gillis picked at the bottom but yeah we can say Benning was a better drafter but he certainly wasn't a good drafter overall.  Canucks are one of the worst drafting teams in NHL history so Benning might be the best of the worst I guess?  

Benning is the worst Gm in history. His win percentage is a sliver below Mike Milbury, and we all know how bad Milbury was.

[GrammaInTheTub]

I still just don’t get how so many people are dug in on previous regimes lack of winning a cup. That’s it to me. We had various successful seasons but have yet to win it all. People who try and track moves from previous management to now for wins or losses are dorks trying to mathematize an inherently chaotic game with so many variables it’s all moot. 

[PureQuickness]

2 hours ago, Wiggums said:

 

Hard to compare the two when Benning was picking at the top of each round and Gillis picked at the bottom but yeah we can say Benning was a better drafter but he certainly wasn't a good drafter overall.  Canucks are one of the worst drafting teams in NHL history so Benning might be the best of the worst I guess?  

 

Historically we have been bad at drafting, but it doesn't help that Gillis whiffed on so many draft rounds (five of them to count) and we only have three players of note during those years.

 

Gillis deserves credit for his playoff runs. His free agent signings were generally VERY GOOD. We haven't had homeruns like Joshua and Blueger in a LONG while. Benning certainly sucked at them. However, Gillis CANNOT be let off the hook for his poor drafting and development. It's the reason why we started with NOTHING when Benning took over.

 

For all the faults that Benning had, he AT MINIMUM left behind a core that was functioning. When Gillis left, we had declining Twins (all the respect to them), a disgruntled Kesler, Tanev, Markstrom, and not much else.

 

Sorry, that is a farcry from what Benning left behind for Allvin to succeed here.

[PureQuickness]

48 minutes ago, filthy animal said:

 

Actually, it is the only thing that matters. What the hell do you think GMs sign free agents, draft players, make trades for? To keep the zamboni drivers employed in April May June? The goal is get players to help the team win, whether its any way of the 3 things I mentioned. Nobody is saying Gillis drafted well, but he sure as hell won a lot. Nobody cares whether this team is comprised of 1st 2nd round picks or a bunch of 45 year olds. You make a good playoff run, or hopefully win the cup, people won't give a shit how its done.

 

Benning lacking in some areas? Seriously? Other than his supposed draft prowess he was worst at everything else. Free Agency, trades, cap management, and he didn't have the results to back it up. At least the other guy had that.

 

 

 

 

 

Imagine being partly successful at a job and then you overemphasize that one part.

 

Gillis was good at playoff runs, such as signing free agents, managing cap. He wasn't perfect. One of his WORST traits was drafting and developing. You can't make the excuse that he can only be good in one part of the job as a GM. A big part of his job is overseeing the future of the franchise.

 

Gillis sold the farm with sometimes reckless trades. He also had his share of buyouts. He traded for Ballard (worst trade ever arguably) and then bought him out later on.

 

I don't understand why you're making excuses for him. Gillis, like Benning, was successful in SOME areas, but failed in other DUTIES as a GM.

 

Allvin is currently succeeding in all the areas, despite his initially poor first year, where he made a promise to the fanbase that the team would be a playoff team THAT year. This year he has proven himself SO FAR to rival Gillis with regards to making GOOD, SHREWD trades. We are first in the league. Something that hadn't happened in a long while. (To be fair, Benning did succeed in his first year with Desjardins. Everything else went downhill from there).

 

In my eyes, Gillis is overly romanticized for his playoff runs and his failures are downplayed because of it. Hell, even he admits that his drafting and development sucked, which I see as a good thing. He understood his own shortcomings. So why are you making excuses for him?

[filthy animal]

2 minutes ago, PureQuickness said:

 

Imagine being partly successful at a job and then you overemphasize that one part.

 

Gillis was good at playoff runs, such as signing free agents, managing cap. He wasn't perfect. One of his WORST traits was drafting and developing. You can't make the excuse that he can only be good in one part of the job as a GM. A big part of his job is overseeing the future of the franchise.

 

Gillis sold the farm with sometimes reckless trades. He also had his share of buyouts. He traded for Ballard (worst trade ever arguably) and then bought him out later on.

 

I don't understand why you're making excuses for him. Gillis, like Benning, was successful in SOME areas, but failed in other DUTIES as a GM.

 

Allvin is currently succeeding in all the areas, despite his initially poor first year, where he made a promise to the fanbase that the team would be a playoff team THAT year. This year he has proven himself SO FAR to rival Gillis with regards to making GOOD, SHREWD trades. We are first in the league. Something that hadn't happened in a long while. (To be fair, Benning did succeed in his first year with Desjardins. Everything else went downhill from there).

 

In my eyes, Gillis is overly romanticized for his playoff runs and his failures are downplayed because of it. Hell, even he admits that his drafting and development sucked, which I see as a good thing. He understood his own shortcomings. So why are you making excuses for him?

 

Do you know have a problem with reading? I already said that Gillis didn't draft well, what part of that didn't you understand. Ballard the worst trade ever? Thats no where close to as bad as the OEL trade Benning fanboy

[filthy animal]

4 hours ago, PureQuickness said:

 

You've got a franchise goaltender and a VERY serviceable forward. Gillis couldn't find a single goaltender or defenseman (not named Hutton) in ALL his years combined. He had first rounders and second rounders. Benning had players like Rathbone (who Allvin later traded to get another player).

 

Gillis gave no such flexibility with his draft picks. They were just devaluated or nonexistent assets.

 

And don't get me started on the waste of a 2nd rounder in Alex Mallet. TERRIBLE TERRIBLE pick. Overage that wasn't even on anyone's board. He threw that 2nd rounder like candy, along with the rest of the 2nd round picks he ever had. The man could not draft.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/canucks-draft-history-breaking-best-worst-years/

The Worst Drafts

2007
Usually, when you look at a team’s draft list from a certain year and see no NHL games-played, it is because that draft occurred recently and the players selected are still hopeful and churning their way towards the big league. But unless Patrick White comes out of retirement having spent the last several years bathing in the holy water at Lourdes, we’re pretty sure the Canucks are never getting anything out of this black hole of a draft.

Nonis, who homered in his first draft after replacing Burke in 2004, struck out completely in 2007 by choosing six players who never saw a minute in the NHL. Now, only two of the picks were in the first four rounds. But White at 25th overall (ahead of David Perron) and defenceman Taylor Ellington at 33rd (ahead of P.K. Subban)? At least Gillis eventually packaged White in a trade for San Jose defenceman Christian Ehrhoff.

2010
While we’re on the subject of Gillis, a couple of his drafts were candidates for worst-ever, but we’re going with 2010 for the “totality” of the former GM’s work at and before that draft. Gillis picked only five players that day and it wasn’t a complete whiff because undersized centre Alex Friesen, a sixth-rounder, did play one game for the Canucks in 2015-16 before taking his career to Europe.

But Gillis’ first selection wasn’t until the fourth round (defenceman Patrick McNally’s most notable hockey achievement was getting thrown out of Harvard in an exam cheating scandal) because he’d traded away his first three picks. The worst move was giving up his first-rounder, and prospect Michael Grabner, to get defenceman Keith Ballard from Florida to replace defenceman Willie Mitchell, who was soon invited to leave Vancouver as a free agent. It turned out OK for Mitchell because he was able to help the Los Angeles Kings win two Cups. It wasn’t a strong draft in 2010 and the incompetent Panthers, who would waive Grabner so he could score 34 goals for the Islanders the next season, selected Quinton Howden at 25th — just before the Washington Capitals took a Russian named Evgeny Kuznetsov.

 

Here is a website that lists all the players that Gillis ever drafted by year:

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/the-transaction-history-of-mike-gillis

First Season: 2008/2009

Mike Gillis started off his tenure at the 2008 NHL Entry Draft.

His picks include:

• Cody Hodgson (round 1, 10th overall)
• Yann Sauve (round 2, 41st overall)
• Prab Rai (round 5, 131st overall)
• Mats Froshaug (round 6, 161st overall)
• Morgan Clark (round 7, 191st overall)

Second Season: 2009/2010

Gillis’ NHL Entry Draft 2009 picks:

• Jordan Schroeder (round 1, 22nd overall)
• Anton Rodin (round 2, 53rd overall)
• Kevin Connauton (round 3, 83rd overall)
• Jeremy Price (round 4, 113th overall)
• Peter Andersson (round 5, 113th overall)
• Joe Cannata (round 6, 173rd overall)
• Steven Anthony (round 7, 187th overall)

Third Season: 2010/2011

Draft day 2010 started with a bang for the Canucks as Gillis had traded another former first round draft choice, Michael Grabner, along with Steve Bernier and the teams 2010 first round draft pick (used to select Quinton Howden) to the Florida Panthers for Keith Ballard and Victor Oreskovich. This meant that the Canucks would not select a player in the draft until the fourth round.

 

Here’s how the 2010 draft went down for the Canucks:

• Patrick McNally (round 4, 115th overall)
• Adam Polasek (round 5, 145th overall)
• Alex Friesen (round 6, 172nd overall)
• Jonathan Iilahti (round 6, 175th overall)
• Sawyer Hannay (round 7, 205th overall)

Fourth Season: 2011/2012

Coming off a disappointing loss in the Stanley Cup Finals, Gillis had a plan of what he wanted to do heading into the draft and the subsequent off-season. It was clear that the Canucks were bullied by the Bruins and Gillis wanted to get bigger and add some toughness to a team that already possessed some of the best skill in the NHL. He started the off – season by drafting a power forward in Nicklas Jensen.

Draft day 2011:

• Nicklas Jensen (round 1, 29th overall)
• David Honzik (round 3, 71st overall)
• Alexandre Grenier (round 3, 90th overall)
• Joseph Labate (round 4, 101st overall)
• Ludwig Blomstrand (round 4, 120th overall)
• Frank Corrado (round 5, 150th overall)
• Pathrik Westerholm (round 6, 180th overall)
•  Henrik Tommernes (round 7, 210th overall)

Fifth Season: 2012/2013

Gillis’ NHL Entry Draft 2012 picks:

• Brendan Gaunce (round 1, 26th overall)
• Alexandre Mallet (round 2, 57th overall)
• Ben Hutton (round 5, 147th overall)
• Wesley Myron (round 6, 177th overall)
• Matthew Beattie (round 7, 207th overall)

That is a big F on drafting and developing. Sure, the man brought playoff runs, but there's another portion of his job that he sucked in.

 

Seriously why are you even in this forum? Are you interested in winning or just draft picks? This is Canucksfanforum, ie fans that love the Canucks, that want to see them win, win the cup, playoffs and all that. Here I'll do you a favor

 

https://www.nhl.com/coyotes/ <--- click here!

 

They got a fan forum over there, may I suggest some usernames for you? Benningsboyfriend, BenningsNuts, BenningmyMan, Dimbo4Jimbo

 

You're welcome

 

 

 

 

[flat land fish]

2 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Those core pieces didn't do squat until Rutherford/Alvin came along

The current regime is coming in and doing the type of work Gillis did filling in a supporting cast without bias of promoting your own prospects 

[PureQuickness]

9 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Do you know have a problem with reading? I already said that Gillis didn't draft well, what part of that didn't you understand. Ballard the worst trade ever? Thats no where close to as bad as the OEL trade Benning fanboy

 

Did you know that your question was written poorly?

 

Ballard was bought out by Gillis - the same GM who traded one first round pick (+ Grabner - another first round pick). It's a pretty awful trade. It's certainly not better than the OEL trade.

 

It says a lot about you (and your reading comprehension skills) when you accuse me of being a Benning fanboy when a few posts up, I actually criticized Benning for his poor cap management and bad trades.

Edited January 20 by PureQuickness

[PureQuickness]

9 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Seriously why are you even in this forum? Are you interested in winning or just draft picks? This is Canucksfanforum, ie fans that love the Canucks, that want to see them win, win the cup, playoffs and all that. Here I'll do you a favor

 

https://www.nhl.com/coyotes/ <--- click here!

 

They got a fan forum over there, may I suggest some usernames for you? Benningsboyfriend, BenningsNuts, BenningmyMan, Dimbo4Jimbo

 

You're welcome

 

 

 

 

 

There you have it. This poster thinks that drafting and development is not at all important. It's all about cups and playoff pushes! No wonder why you excuse Gillis for poor performance in drafting. This is the type of excuse that is hilarious hypocritical, especially when Benning gets rightfully criticized for a certain part of the GM job.

 

For the record, I once criticized Allvin for being a lame duck GM in his first year. But he sure turned it around. He MIGHT very well surpass Gillis in just his second year. Unlike Gillis who couldn't draft anyone that showed immediate promise (some exceptions: Jensen was okay, and so was Hunter Shinkaruk prior to injury), we are seeing prospects like Lekkerimaki, D-Pettersson (amazing 3rd round pick) flourishing.

 

See, you NEED a GM that can find prospects outside of the 1st round. Benning did that. Gillis did not. Allvin is showing that he is drafting properly, but he's building on the roster that he inherited, similar to how Gillis did it with GOOD players like Lapierre, Rome, etc.

 

Allvin SO FAR is looking like the best of both worlds. It's pretty sad that you're making excuses with Gillis, but won't do the same thing with Benning. It's hypocrisy.