stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 53 minutes ago, IBatch said: The deal that you think we could have got for him. If he was that horrible, we'd put him on waivers. I never said there was any kind of deal, nor did I think they should have moved him at the tdl. What good would putting him on waivers do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 2 hours ago, JayDangles said: Kind of a chicken and egg scenario. I feel like Kuzmenkos below average play was what kicked this off, not mismanagement. I don't personally feel he is or has been mismanaged. I think that's just hockey. Some players adjust, some don't. It's not really related to his play, but how they handled the situation. I'm sure we can all agree about his play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 (edited) 2 hours ago, Bob Long said: OK thats fair. But if in the exit meeting was Kuzy supposed to come back to camp in good shape and hit the ground running, then you wouldn't make that move. You'd expect improvement. Unfortunately he did whatever the hell Bali was. OK this is where I'm still not clear. "find a way". So Tocc has tried a number of things, from benching, to being on the PP, to trying him on several different lines. We know from the numbers that he's a liability defensively on Petey's line, e.g., so he has to be on a more defensively minded line so he's not a -1 or -2 every game. He's still getting PP time. He doesn't have the skill set to close out games. So he's going to get benched late in the 3rd of most games anyway at this point. I mean what else would you do? He hasn't tried a number of things, he's sat him in the pressbox or he's benched him. I guess you could say playing him with players he absolutely does not fit with us something, but just more of the same punishment. They could have put him for extended time in milkers line, they could have put him in front of the net on the PP where he was so successful last year, they could have brought up hogz to play with him and Petey, thereby giving him a skilled guy and dogged forechecker to play with. RT was dead set on kuz playing his style instead of adapting his coaching style to account for kuz being who he is. In my classroom of 28 kids, I do about 8 different lesson plans for every lesson to account for different levels, different learning styles, different attention span, different skills etc. when you're the coach, teacher etc, you have to adapt to the people you're leading. What RT was/is doing with kuz simply is not working and RT isn't adapting to the reality and, in the process, he's killing kuz's value as an asset. If kuz were a marginal player, it's not a big deal, but he has serious value 4 months ago.......like top prospect and 1st rounder value. Edited January 20 by stawns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 6 minutes ago, stawns said: It's not really related to his play, but how they handled the situation. I'm sure we can all agree about his play So, your issue is that they didn't recognize he wouldn't be a fit fast enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 1 minute ago, Bob Long said: So, your issue is that they didn't recognize he wouldn't be a fit fast enough? I think they probably knew that kuz was not an RT kind of player by the end of last season, but thought they could "fix" him by changing his style of play. To me, that's mismanagement. They should have recognized that he simply wasn't going to be a good fit in RT's system and parted ways long before it got to this point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 Just now, stawns said: I think they probably knew that kuz was not an RT kind of player by the end of last season, but thought they could "fix" him by changing his style of play. To me, that's mismanagement. They should have recognized that he simply wasn't going to be a good fit in RT's system and parted ways long before it got to this point Well, I guess they thought he had more in him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 5 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Well, I guess they thought he had more in him. I think they thought they could beat him into submission and get him to play the style they wanted him to play. They were wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 13 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said: Zadorov on tonight’s feistiness: “Some teams want to challenge us but we’re ready to go. Guy is challenging the whole bench so someone’s got to take the fight” We totally needed this. WTG Big Z Sign that man already! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayDangles Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 22 minutes ago, stawns said: It's not really related to his play, but how they handled the situation. I'm sure we can all agree about his play So in your opinion what did they handle wrong? The Bali thing? Well canucks weren't the ones to bring that to the media. I thought they handled that fine. Then Kuz just started the season poorly, but he was given a long leash. He wasnt healthy scratched until what? Game 25ish? I don't know how much longer they could have waited, because as you've said, we can all agree on his Play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 4 minutes ago, JayDangles said: So in your opinion what did they handle wrong? The Bali thing? Well canucks weren't the ones to bring that to the media. I thought they handled that fine. Then Kuz just started the season poorly, but he was given a long leash. He wasnt healthy scratched until what? Game 25ish? I don't know how much longer they could have waited, because as you've said, we can all agree on his Play. Read up a few messages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gawdzukes Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 16 hours ago, Pure961089 said: Out of the numerous trades Alvin has made I'm trying to think of any that have been bad. Not to mention Hronek and Kuzy who was a signing. 1. Lafferty 2. DeSmith 3. Bluegar 4. Zadorov 5. Soucy 6. Cole 7. Zadorov 8. Suter 9. Joshua 10. Aman 11. Mikheyev. I'd have to say Mikheyev hasn't looked nearly as fast as he was before his injury. I haven't seen Tocchet use his speed, but maybe he's just not fast anymore. Other than that all the other trades have been solid to great. It's really amazing as a fan when you can actually just sit back and actually say yeah our GM just made a move we all knew needed to happen, and Voila, it worked. With Benning he just made all these average moves that didn't address the obvious. Not to say Allvin hasn't been spot on because he has, but it's not as hard as Benning made it out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 39 minutes ago, stawns said: I think they thought they could beat him into submission and get him to play the style they wanted him to play. They were wrong That doesn't really fit though with what we've heard from other players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gawdzukes Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 11 hours ago, IBatch said: Yes they shit the bed in acquiring him and then switching coaches. It's all on Kuzmenko. His video of him running up a set of stairs in Bali made me laugh. I'd be impressed if he went back down, then up again, then back down, then back up again etc etc. Our second line is really our 3rd line. Both Ilya Mikheyev, and Kuzemenko, are looking like bad signings right now. Can't score without EP. And for sure we're holding him back. Nobody predicted that. It's not ideal of course. Not sure how much longer, before he's given the heave ho. Exactly, what a freaking joke. I was laughing my ass off. He was clowning around like some hip hopper or influencer trying to be all cool on TikTok, instead of training for his new $11 million dollar job. He should have backed up his cocky showboating with hard work and practice. This is a situation where it's largely on Kuzmenko's back. It's a pity we haven't maximized his value but it's not all about him either. The team was busy working their asses off to get into first place in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 10 minutes ago, Bob Long said: That doesn't really fit though with what we've heard from other players As per my teaching analogy, that's the point. He has to adapt to what works for every player. He hasn't and that reinforces what I said..........they have seen that and acted early, either by putting him in positions to be himself and succeed or by moving him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 Just now, stawns said: As per my teaching analogy, that's the point. He has to adapt to what works for every player. He hasn't and that reinforces what I said..........they have seen that and acted early, either by putting him in positions to be himself and succeed or by moving him. Tbh I don't think what you are saying is accurate, even Kuzys agent said there was a specific plan in place 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Neilsons Towel Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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