Sabrefan1 Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 No idea if this is true or not since I only took interest again in this war when Ukraine started attacking Russia. For all I know, you all have already discussed and hashed this out on it's truth or lack thereof. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoshiyoshi Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Sabrefan1 said: No idea if this is true or not since I only took interest again in this war when Ukraine started attacking Russia. For all I know, you all have already discussed and hashed this out on it's truth or lack thereof. is there a link to the original story it references? If not its probably false Edited August 15 by Yoshiyoshi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 3 minutes ago, Sabrefan1 said: No idea if this is true or not since I only took interest again in this war when Ukraine started attacking Russia. For all I know, you all have already discussed and hashed this out on it's truth or lack thereof. https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/aug/15/ukrainian-team-blew-up-nord-stream-pipeline-claims-report More detail on this above. I definitely think we can't discount this being a Russian false flag with the Putin regime having a long history of conducting this kind of operation. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 1 minute ago, Yoshiyoshi said: is there a link to the original story it references? If not its probably false It's from the Wall Street Journal. Sorry. I forgot to mention that. I'll look in my history to find the link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 Just now, Sabrefan1 said: It's from the Wall Street Journal. Sorry. I forgot to mention that. I'll look in my history to find the link. I found it but it was behind a paywall for me, hence the alternate source. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 Just now, King Heffy said: https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/aug/15/ukrainian-team-blew-up-nord-stream-pipeline-claims-report More detail on this above. I definitely think we can't discount this being a Russian false flag with the Putin regime having a long history of conducting this kind of operation. I haven't read the Guardian yet (thanks for the link), but in the WSJ story, the Germans are also blaming Ukraine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 Just now, King Heffy said: I found it but it was behind a paywall for me, hence the alternate source. Let me see if I can find a link around the paywall for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cusm Posted August 15 Share Posted August 15 1 minute ago, Sabrefan1 said: I haven't read the Guardian yet (thanks for the link), but in the WSJ story, the Germans are also blaming Ukraine. To be more precise: they are accusing three (iirc) Ukrainians, not Ukraine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 Just an FYI: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 5 minutes ago, cusm said: To be more precise: they are accusing three (iirc) Ukrainians, not Ukraine. Good point. They also issued a veiled threat to Ukraine though so I think that they are of the mind that it was the Ukrainian gov't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 (edited) interesting that LMartin is going to uptick production of this weapon as discussions about approving its use for UKRForces has been relevant. The next bump of Various stock from the US to UKR should be announced over the next few days. Edited August 16 by SilentSam 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 12 minutes ago, King Heffy said: I found it but it was behind a paywall for me, hence the alternate source. Try this link. Let me know if it works for you. Sorry it took a good 10 minutes. I couldn't remember the paywall archiver site name at first. https://archive.is/KodqX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kootenay Gold Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 24 minutes ago, Sabrefan1 said: No idea if this is true or not since I only took interest again in this war when Ukraine started attacking Russia. For all I know, you all have already discussed and hashed this out on it's truth or lack thereof. So where did the Wall Street get its info from or is this just speculation on their part? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickenspear Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 18 minutes ago, Sabrefan1 said: I haven't read the Guardian yet (thanks for the link), but in the WSJ story, the Germans are also blaming Ukraine. Just an excerpt from the guardian article: Roderich Kiesewetter, a member of the opposition CDU who serves on the foreign affairs committee of the German parliament, urged caution about the allegations raised in the WSJ report. He told German radio there were “intensive interests” in “letting all the clues lead back to Ukraine”, warning that this could be “part of the disinformation”. He said there continued to be an “extensive amount of murkiness” surrounding the case, and that it could not be ruled out that this was a “false flag” operation – an attempt to push the blame on to Ukraine. He added that the pipelines had only been destroyed “once it was … clear that gas would never flow through them again”. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 Just now, Kootenay Gold said: So where did the Wall Street get its info from or is this just speculation on their part? I don't want to colour your opinion with mine. I'm looking for what other people, who are paying more attention to this all than I am, think. I posted the link above to get around the paywall. Read it and let me know what comes to mind for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 1 minute ago, Chickenspear said: Just an excerpt from the guardian article: Roderich Kiesewetter, a member of the opposition CDU who serves on the foreign affairs committee of the German parliament, urged caution about the allegations raised in the WSJ report. He told German radio there were “intensive interests” in “letting all the clues lead back to Ukraine”, warning that this could be “part of the disinformation”. He said there continued to be an “extensive amount of murkiness” surrounding the case, and that it could not be ruled out that this was a “false flag” operation – an attempt to push the blame on to Ukraine. He added that the pipelines had only been destroyed “once it was … clear that gas would never flow through them again”. I saw that when I did a quick read after I was given the link. It has validity. I know squat about Germany's intelligence agencies beyond WW2. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 Just in the few things posted since my original post about this, it seems that it's still to be determined who was responsible for the sabotage and Germany as well as the Wall Street Journal may or may not have jumped the gun in blaming Ukraine and Zelenskyy for it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kootenay Gold Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 7 minutes ago, Sabrefan1 said: Just in the few things posted since my original post about this, it seems that it's still to be determined who was responsible for the sabotage and Germany as well as the Wall Street Journal may or may not have jumped the gun in blaming Ukraine and Zelenskyy for it. We / they, may never know for sure who blew it up. The positive from it was that it forced many European countries hands into looking for other sources of energy instead of relying on Russia. IMO, Germany was wrong to move away from nuclear power. Had they stayed the course the loss of the pipeline would not have been such a big blow to their energy supply stream. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Optimist Prime Posted August 16 Popular Post Share Posted August 16 I recall poking around the who what when where why how's of that nordstream sabotage: I am of the opinion Ukraine did not have the motive or the means to accomplish this 'unknown' to any larger intel entitities in the world, and as been suggested above: Russia not only had the means and manpower nearby if not directly on site, but a motive in trying to place blame on Ukraine to injure their relationship with Europe proper. If i had to do like yankee tort law and find the balance of probabilities: I would say this was a russian job, at least I am 3/4 convinced of it. 2 1 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted August 16 Author Share Posted August 16 1 hour ago, Sabrefan1 said: Just in the few things posted since my original post about this, it seems that it's still to be determined who was responsible for the sabotage and Germany as well as the Wall Street Journal may or may not have jumped the gun in blaming Ukraine and Zelenskyy for it. The gun was jumped. Just sayin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoshiyoshi Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 (edited) I cant wrap my head around the logic that tries to justify why Ukraine would do it. It just doesnt make sense. You have to jump through so many hoops and twist things around like a conspiracy theory in order to make it connect. If the roles were reversed though it would totally make sense since Russia seems to enjoy that sort of thing Edited August 16 by Yoshiyoshi 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted August 16 Author Share Posted August 16 It’s nonsense. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 Ukraine, a nation with no navy or access to the Baltic or north sea somehow managed to get out there undetected with russian ships and navy literally being pinged in the area by NATO forces without being attacked and managed to pinpoint an 18 to 24 inch with incredible accuracy with an explosive for some unknown reason. Seems legit sure. 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoshiyoshi Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 3 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Ukraine, a nation with no navy or access to the Baltic or north sea somehow managed to get out there undetected with russian ships and navy literally being pinged in the area by NATO forces without being attacked and managed to pinpoint an 18 to 24 inch with incredible accuracy with an explosive for some unknown reason. Seems legit sure. that isnt even the confusing part, the explanation of why Ukraine would do it is what doesnt make sense to me, its like a story that has a planned result that then tries to justify why that shit happened. Ive watched a few shows like that and it really is painful to watch when they are being so serious for such stupid reasons 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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