Catman Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 29 minutes ago, 4petesake said: Weapons manufacturers make big money from wars. In other news water is wet 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBH1926 Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 11 hours ago, RomanPer said: A lot of people that I came across tell me that they are planning to head back home when the war is over. Yes, there's certain percentage that would choose to stay in the new countries, but I think the number of returning refugees will be much higher. Time will tell I guess, we emptied out back home after 4 years of war. Going from 4.4 million population in 1991 to anywhere between 2.7-3 million now. Numbers are contested since government doesn’t want them out, because of shit job they have been doing. Also lot of people that have left, are still counted under their old addresses, inflating the numbers. Talking to my family members, they think that population is below 2.5 million but regardless we lost around 40% of population due to death and migration. You guys had strong education over there, just like lot of other Eastern European countries. Even Europeans are praising how well you have adjusted. Here in Chicago we got around 30k refugees, I see lot of complete and well adjusted families. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 19 minutes ago, Catman said: I dare say John McCain had a better grasp of what Putin was capable of than almost any other. His obvious dismissal of the Euros was also prophetic. They were more than ready to look the other way when Putin invaded Ukraine. It was only Joe Biden who saved Ukraine. Yes, Joe Biden and his for profit weapons. How infantile can thought get to suggest a not for profit industrial base that can produce the USN Gerald Ford carrier group. The very weapon that sailed to the coast of Lebanon and told Hezbollah to stand down last October. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post King Heffy Posted February 27 Popular Post Share Posted February 27 59 minutes ago, Boudrias said: I dare say John McCain had a better grasp of what Putin was capable of than almost any other. His obvious dismissal of the Euros was also prophetic. They were more than ready to look the other way when Putin invaded Ukraine. It was only Joe Biden who saved Ukraine. Yes, Joe Biden and his for profit weapons. How infantile can thought get to suggest a not for profit industrial base that can produce the USN Gerald Ford carrier group. The very weapon that sailed to the coast of Lebanon and told Hezbollah to stand down last October. If Russia attacked us, the same people moaning about the American military industry would be begging for their help. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RomanPer Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 5 hours ago, AatuD2 said: The lady who has lead the charge in pushing Ukraine to its destruction, Victoria Nuland and the head of NATO Jens Stoltenberg have finally cut through the BS and said the real motives abd profiteers off of this war. Money going to Ukraine is going directly to the military industrial complex in the States as stated by Nuland. They recorded the highest ever profits in 2023. Also the true reason for this war is the push to have Ukraine join NATO (known by everyone that's followed the situation for more then 2 years). What an irresponsible and hypocritical stance by US, UK, and Germany. Pretending to care about Ukraine while pushing them into a direct conflict with Russia and leaving their country to be demolished. Lady who pushed Ukraine to its destruction? Reading russian propaganda much? Ukrainian people revolted against corrupt pro-russian president, stop reading russian news in the morning… You seem to be going for a record - bad take in this thread, bad take in Israel thread. And in both smells like russian smelly feet… 1 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Boudrias said: I dare say John McCain had a better grasp of what Putin was capable of than almost any other. His obvious dismissal of the Euros was also prophetic. They were more than ready to look the other way when Putin invaded Ukraine. It was only Joe Biden who saved Ukraine. Yes, Joe Biden and his for profit weapons. How infantile can thought get to suggest a not for profit industrial base that can produce the USN Gerald Ford carrier group. The very weapon that sailed to the coast of Lebanon and told Hezbollah to stand down last October. The Euros looked the other way ? Seriously ? How quickly people forget facts. Dated 4 days after Russia invaded Ukraine. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/2/28/which-countries-are-sending-military-aid-to-ukraine " For the first time in its history the EU is financing the purchase and delivery of arms after leaders agree to transport weapons worth 450 million Euros (502m) to Kyiv) European Countries mentioned in the article that immediately sent military aid to Ukraine include France The Netherlands Germany Sweden Norway Denmark Finland Belgium Portugal Greece Romania Spain Czech Republic Croatia And this chart dated four days ago, covering the period up until January the 15th 2024, illustrates that it is European institutions that have given the largest amount of aid to Ukraine, most of it financial. https://www.statista.com/chart/28489/ukrainian-military-humanitarian-and-financial-aid-donors/ And for all the criticism of Germany, it appears they have provided the second most amount of military aid to Germany, only behind the US. Are seriously suggesting that the American military industrial complex is a non profit group of organisations ? Good Times For the Military Industrial Complex https://diem25.org/good-times-for-the-military-industrial-complex/ " In his nationally televised address Israel - Hamas and Russia - Ukraine wars, US president Joe Biden described the American arms industry in remarkably glowing terms noting that, " just as in WW2, today patriotic American workers are building the arsenal of democracy and serving the cause of freedom ". From a political and messaging perspective the president cleverly focused on the workers involved in producing such weaponry, rather than the giant corporations that profit from arming Israel, Ukraine and other nations at war. But profit they do and, even more strikingly the revenues that flows to those firms is pocketed as staggering executive salaries and stock buy backs that only boost that is only boost shareholders earnings further. The US should certainly provide Ukraine with what it needs to defend itself from Russia. Sending arms alone however without an accompanying diplomatic strategy is a recipe for an endless grinding war ( and endless profits for those arms makers ) that could always escalate into a far more direct and devastating conflict between the US, NATO and Russia. Nevertheless given the current urgent need to keep supplying Ukraine, the sources of the relevant weapons systems are bound to be corporate giants like Raytheon and Lockheed Martin. No surprise here, but keep in mind that they're not doing any of this out of charity. Beyond such direct profits there is a larger here: the way this country's arms lobby is using this war to argue for a variety of favourable actions that go well beyond anything that is needed to support Ukraine. Those include less restrictive, multi year contracts, reductions in protections against price gouging, faster approval of foreign sales, and the construction of new weapons plants Over the years far from being a reliable arsenal of democracy, American arms makers have often helped undermine democracy globally, while enabling even greater repression and conflict - a fact largely ignored in mainstream coverage of the industry. For example in a 2022 report for the Quincy institute, I noted that if the 46 then - active conflicts globally, 34 involved parties armed by the United States. In some cases American arms supplies were modest but in many other conflicts such weaponry was central to the military capabilities of one or more of the warring parties. Nor do such weapons sales promote democracy over autocracy, a watch word of the Biden's adminstration's approach. In 2021 the most recent year for which full statistics are available, the US armed 31 nations that Freedom House a non - profit that tracks global trends in democracy, political freedom and human rights designated as not free. " I, like the article support the United States support of Ukraine, however to suggest that the American industrial military complex is a not for profit industrial base is ludicrous. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJVD Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 12 hours ago, AatuD2 said: The lady who has lead the charge in pushing Ukraine to its destruction, Victoria Nuland and the head of NATO Jens Stoltenberg have finally cut through the BS and said the real motives abd profiteers off of this war. Money going to Ukraine is going directly to the military industrial complex in the States as stated by Nuland. They recorded the highest ever profits in 2023. Also the true reason for this war is the push to have Ukraine join NATO (known by everyone that's followed the situation for more then 2 years). What an irresponsible and hypocritical stance by US, UK, and Germany. Pretending to care about Ukraine while pushing them into a direct conflict with Russia and leaving their country to be demolished. Time for our weekly absolutely brain-dead take in this thread. The reason for the war is Russian expansionism. Ukraine did not chose to be invaded, NATO did not chose for Ukraine to be invaded, Russia did chose to invade. That's it. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimist Prime Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 A candid moment between two leaders. Prime Minister Trudeau was in Kyiv lately. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 5 hours ago, Ilunga said: The Euros looked the other way ? Seriously ? How quickly people forget facts. Dated 4 days after Russia invaded Ukraine. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/2/28/which-countries-are-sending-military-aid-to-ukraine " For the first time in its history the EU is financing the purchase and delivery of arms after leaders agree to transport weapons worth 450 million Euros (502m) to Kyiv) European Countries mentioned in the article that immediately sent military aid to Ukraine include France The Netherlands Germany Sweden Norway Denmark Finland Belgium Portugal Greece Romania Spain Czech Republic Croatia And this chart dated four days ago, covering the period up until January the 15th 2024, illustrates that it is European institutions that have given the largest amount of aid to Ukraine, most of it financial. https://www.statista.com/chart/28489/ukrainian-military-humanitarian-and-financial-aid-donors/ And for all the criticism of Germany, it appears they have provided the second most amount of military aid to Germany, only behind the US. Are seriously suggesting that the American military industrial complex is a non profit group of organisations ? Good Times For the Military Industrial Complex https://diem25.org/good-times-for-the-military-industrial-complex/ " In his nationally televised address Israel - Hamas and Russia - Ukraine wars, US president Joe Biden described the American arms industry in remarkably glowing terms noting that, " just as in WW2, today patriotic American workers are building the arsenal of democracy and serving the cause of freedom ". From a political and messaging perspective the president cleverly focused on the workers involved in producing such weaponry, rather than the giant corporations that profit from arming Israel, Ukraine and other nations at war. But profit they do and, even more strikingly the revenues that flows to those firms is pocketed as staggering executive salaries and stock buy backs that only boost that is only boost shareholders earnings further. The US should certainly provide Ukraine with what it needs to defend itself from Russia. Sending arms alone however without an accompanying diplomatic strategy is a recipe for an endless grinding war ( and endless profits for those arms makers ) that could always escalate into a far more direct and devastating conflict between the US, NATO and Russia. Nevertheless given the current urgent need to keep supplying Ukraine, the sources of the relevant weapons systems are bound to be corporate giants like Raytheon and Lockheed Martin. No surprise here, but keep in mind that they're not doing any of this out of charity. Beyond such direct profits there is a larger here: the way this country's arms lobby is using this war to argue for a variety of favourable actions that go well beyond anything that is needed to support Ukraine. Those include less restrictive, multi year contracts, reductions in protections against price gouging, faster approval of foreign sales, and the construction of new weapons plants Over the years far from being a reliable arsenal of democracy, American arms makers have often helped undermine democracy globally, while enabling even greater repression and conflict - a fact largely ignored in mainstream coverage of the industry. For example in a 2022 report for the Quincy institute, I noted that if the 46 then - active conflicts globally, 34 involved parties armed by the United States. In some cases American arms supplies were modest but in many other conflicts such weaponry was central to the military capabilities of one or more of the warring parties. Nor do such weapons sales promote democracy over autocracy, a watch word of the Biden's adminstration's approach. In 2021 the most recent year for which full statistics are available, the US armed 31 nations that Freedom House a non - profit that tracks global trends in democracy, political freedom and human rights designated as not free. " I, like the article support the United States support of Ukraine, however to suggest that the American industrial military complex is a not for profit industrial base is ludicrous. All true. There is a time and a place for everything but using this argument after a peaceful nation is invaded by a despot with delusions of grandeur is neither the time nor the place. Also the Euros did look the other way in 2014 for the reasons given by McCain but have come around since the current invasion, albeit sometimes more slowly than is healthy for many Ukrainians. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 (edited) 8 hours ago, King Heffy said: If Russia attacked us, the same people moaning about the American military industry would be begging for their help. yes, military manufacturers make money. OK... well, lets imagine a world without the US military. Are we actually better off? But maybe if we just hug Putin and show him how much we care about him, he'll see the error of his ways. Edited February 27 by Bob Long 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph. Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 12 minutes ago, Bob Long said: yes, military manufacturers make money. OK... well, lets imagine a world without the US military. Are we actually better off? But maybe if we just hug Putin and show him how much we care about him, he'll see the error of his ways. I dunno, I think an effective alternative can be achieved. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muscatel Marauder Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Brace yourselves folks, because MAGA Mike Johnson is going to make Putin one happy man. What a coward. https://us.cnn.com/2024/02/27/politics/mike-johnson-urkaine-aid-dilemma/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 6 minutes ago, Honky Cat said: The slow retreat offers many many unguarded opportunities for UKR to thin RuZ armour and troops .. This pic is a perfect example of that. Lets not forget , there should be a line of UKR artillery, including Patriots that have moved within range waiting for the right opportunities. RuZ WILL move into those Kill zones .….. that’s just the way they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ukraine-aid-white-house-meeting-chuck-schumer-mike-johnson/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/west-must-help-ukraine-more-prevent-spillover-polish-fm-says-2024-02-26/ https://www.vanityfair.com/news/mike-johnson-gop-house-shutdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 To add to Honky Cats post : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 To add to Honky Cats 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 The New York Times: The head of Ukrainian intelligence, Kyrylo Budanov, was one of the officers in an elite Ukrainian commando unit known as Unit 2245, which the CIA began training around 2016. This unit captured Russian drones and communications equipment so that CIA technicians could repurpose them and break Moscow's encryption systems. At the time, Kyrylo Budanov "was the rising star" of the unit, known for daring operations behind enemy lines. In particular, the newspaper described how Budanov and a group of Ukrainian military officers dressed in Russian military uniforms sailed across the gulf by boat and landed in Crimea in 2016. They were met on the peninsula by elite Russian special forces, a battle ensued, during which there were fatalities on the Russian side (including the general's son), while the Ukrainians managed to get out by swimming to the shore. The publication also wrote that after Budanov was shot in the arm in Donbas, he was invited for treatment at the Walter Reed National Military Medical Center in the United States, which was an "extraordinary step." The operation in Crimea, according to the publication, angered the administration of then US President Barack Obama because of the crossing of "red lines". 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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