The Russia/Ukraine War Thread

[Satchmo]

1 minute ago, WHL rocks said:

Lol I just posted the link a couple of mins ago. There us no way you could have gone to telegram link I posted and watched and read all the information.  Took me half hour to do it. You can't even go to channel and scroll up to look for the vids that quick.  

 

 

That's fine. I'm not trying to change anyone's mind. Personally I don't have a horse in the race. I just like to know what's really happening for my own knowledge..

 

 

 

The link showed me nothing really.  Took me while to get it going and then I just gave up and left.   I will admit I was not all that interested in what an unknown Telegram channel would tell me.  The 'unknown Telegram channel' part of it is what put me off.   People are saying all kinds of stuff ITT and elsewhere.   Just call me a sceptic.  I usually need the same story from multiple sources before I believe anything (and I sometimes even then have doubts).    I'm confident a single video produced in Russia is not likely to convince me of much.   They were blaming Ukraine 10 minutes after the fact.

[WHL rocks]

DL

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks

[Gurn]

It is your contention that Ukraine went through all that trouble- rather than send in 2 drones to blow up the place?

After being very careful, for years, to only attack military targets, they just decided to send a few idiots to shoot civilians in a theater?

How can that seem credible to you?

No really- how can that seem credible to you?

[Satchmo]

Just now, Gurn said:

It is your contention that Ukraine went through all that trouble- rather than send in 2 drones to blow up the place?

After being very careful, for years, to only attack military targets, they just decided to send a few idiots to shoot civilians in a theater?

How can that seem credible to you?

No really- how can that seem credible to you?

But it's on Telegram!  And the Russians are saying it's all true!    Have they ever lied to  us before?

[112]

ISIS claimed responsibility for the attack in short order. The U.S. provided an intelligence warning to Russia both on March 7 and a few days prior to the attack (standard to do regardless of whether the target country is an adversary). They set warnings out to their citizens in Moscow to stay away from concert halls. And the U.S. has said that the attack was coordinated and undertaken by ISIS. Meanwhile, Ukraine has been careful not to hit civilian targets for the entirety of the war. Their drone attacks are limited to oil refineries and it would do them no favours internationally to kill 150 people trying to enjoy their evenings at a concert hall. I think the conspiracy theory is a mistake.

 

e: regardless, Putin is going to spin this against Ukraine.

Edited March 23 by 112

[WHL rocks]

DL

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks

[King Heffy]

38 minutes ago, Satchmo said:

But it's on Telegram!  And the Russians are saying it's all true!    Have they ever lied to  us before?

I'd trust expired milk left out on the porch for a week in the summer before I'd trust that source.

[Satchmo]

3 minutes ago, WHL rocks said:

ISIS in Arabian peninsula is not the same group as the ISIS K group which took credit for this attack.

 

ISIS K is a proxy group in Khorasan. They do attacks against Iran and Pakistan and Chinese interests in Pakistan. They also did an attack against Russian interests in Pakistan. 

 

They're are propped up by the Indian RAW he US CIA and Israel Mossad for their own interests to carry out attacks. 

 

The average person sees the news flash that ISIS took credit and that's that.

 

This is bigger game than most people realize. 

 

Just like CIA propped up Osama Bin Laden and the Mujahideen in the 80s they have several groups they currently support in that area.

 

The Pakistan Taliban are another such group controlled by Indian RAW and Afghanistan intelligence. They attack Pakistan. Most people would hear the name Taliban and think OH the Taliban. But this is a completely different group. 

 

ISIS K is one of those proxy groups used to do terror attacks in Iran by Mossad and CIA. The RAW uses them against Pakistan. 

 

For them to take credit means absolutely nothing. They're a proxy in the game of thrones. 

As I mentioned, I usually like to get my news from a few sources.    Here's some that differ from your post in many ways:

 

Explainer: What is ISIS-K, the group that attacked a Moscow concert hall?

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/why-did-isis-k-attack-moscow-theater-2024-03-23/

 

 

What We Know About ISIS-K, the Group That Claimed Responsibility for the Moscow Attack

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/22/us/politics/isis-k-moscow-attack.html

 

Moscow concert hall attack: Why is ISIL targeting Russia?

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/3/23/moscow-concert-hall-attack-why-is-isil-targeting

 

BTW - 'ISIS K is one of those proxy groups used to do terror attacks in Iran by Mossad and CIA.'    Where are you getting this stuff from?

[Yoshiyoshi]

1 minute ago, Satchmo said:

As I mentioned, I usually like to get my news from a few sources.    Here's some that differ from your post in many ways:

 

Explainer: What is ISIS-K, the group that attacked a Moscow concert hall?

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/why-did-isis-k-attack-moscow-theater-2024-03-23/

 

 

What We Know About ISIS-K, the Group That Claimed Responsibility for the Moscow Attack

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/22/us/politics/isis-k-moscow-attack.html

 

Moscow concert hall attack: Why is ISIL targeting Russia?

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/3/23/moscow-concert-hall-attack-why-is-isil-targeting

 

BTW - 'ISIS K is one of those proxy groups used to do terror attacks in Iran by Mossad and CIA.'    Where are you getting this stuff from?

dont worry about it, hes a conspiracy theorist. dont even bother engaging.

[WHL rocks]

DL

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks

[Warhippy]

2 hours ago, WHL rocks said:

https://t.me/readovkanews

 

Edit: you'll have to scroll up to earlier timeline posts for vids of terrorists being arrested and information about this attack as they were posted earlier. Maybe scroll up around 30 posts at the time of this post. 

 

Go to this telegram channel if you guys are interested in seeing the 4 terrorists getting arrested and interrogated by the Russian special forces. 

 

They are all Tajikstani and were recruited by the Ukrainian intelligence. The former head of Ukrainian intelligence is currently the attache at UKR embassy in Tajikstan. They have been recruiting a lot of men in Tajikistan to fight in the war.

 

Click on text to translate each post. You can watch videos of the terrorists arrests and interrogation and get a better understanding of this attack. 

 

Russians don't mess around. One of the terrorists arrested his ear lobe was cut off immediately and put into his own mouth while he was being arrested. 

 

One of them says he was to be paid 500k rubles and received a 250k advance deposit.

 

These are not ideology driven Islamic militants like ISIS are. These were poor men doing it for the money. ISIS would have died in a shoot out. These clowns were hoping to live a good life after wards. 

 

140 civilians killed while enjoying a night out at a concert. Horrible..

 

11 people have been arrested altogether including the 4 gunmen. 

 

 

So lemme get this straight.

 

Ukraine who at ANY point in time could have been slaughtering civilians anywhere along the front line and Crimea/Belgorod or now Moscow or anywhere with their new drones and hasn't.

 

Has hired 4 random individuals from a poor nation to go and shoot up a random theater with literally no strategic value and slaughter civilians.  And this is believable because an obvious russian channel on a 2nd rate social media app told you so.

 

I really want you to think about how little sense that makes.

 

Like really think

[Satchmo]

3 minutes ago, WHL rocks said:

First of all  Reuters NYT and AL Jazeera imo are the same as any of the state controlled media of China Russia India Iran Pakistan or any other country. They are closely tied to their national interests.. 

 

About the ISIS K its not a secret. They are just like ISIS WAP (western Africa) or ISIS GS (greater sahara)  or many groups in Pakistan ie: Tireek e Pakistan or Jaish Muhammad or Lakshar e Toiba or the several Balochistan outfits or the TTP or the Jundhulla or the Haqanni network or I can go on and on...

 

They are all proxies used by various powers from around the world to attack their enemies. 

 

Just like Hamas and Hezbollah are proxies of Iran and also Russia via Iran. 

 

Just a couple of months ago ISIS K did an attack where around 100 people died. Iran did not hide the fact who was responsible.  They blamed Mossad.  

 

These things are not secrets. You have to get news from all over the world and think for yourself.  Not just from one source. NYT Reuters and AL Jazeera are the same source just different names. 

I disagree with just about everything you've posted today and I'm done.  See you in some other thread.   

[WHL rocks]

DL

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks

[RomanPer]

2 hours ago, WHL rocks said:

https://t.me/readovkanews

 

Edit: you'll have to scroll up to earlier timeline posts for vids of terrorists being arrested and information about this attack as they were posted earlier. Maybe scroll up around 30 posts at the time of this post. 

 

Go to this telegram channel if you guys are interested in seeing the 4 terrorists getting arrested and interrogated by the Russian special forces. 

 

They are all Tajikstani and were recruited by the Ukrainian intelligence. The former head of Ukrainian intelligence is currently the attache at UKR embassy in Tajikstan. They have been recruiting a lot of men in Tajikistan to fight in the war.

 

Click on text to translate each post. You can watch videos of the terrorists arrests and interrogation and get a better understanding of this attack. 

 

Russians don't mess around. One of the terrorists arrested his ear lobe was cut off immediately and put into his own mouth while he was being arrested. 

 

One of them says he was to be paid 500k rubles and received a 250k advance deposit.

 

These are not ideology driven Islamic militants like ISIS are. These were poor men doing it for the money. ISIS would have died in a shoot out. These clowns were hoping to live a good life after wards. 

 

140 civilians killed while enjoying a night out at a concert. Horrible..

 

11 people have been arrested altogether including the 4 gunmen. 

 

 

 

lol, I’m just curious why exactly are you reading “Readovka” Telegram channel? Are you aware that this channel is heavily pushing official russian propaganda?

[King Heffy]

37 minutes ago, WHL rocks said:

Have a good day..

 

I understand.  It's too much information and it would take years of having interest in the subject and stydying it to get a grasp.

Obvious lies posted from a source controlled by a Nazi regime don't qualify as information. Should we also believe anything that comes out of Putin's mouth?  The only use your source has is as fertilizer once it's exterminated.

Edited March 24 by King Heffy

[WHL rocks]

DL

 

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks

[MattJVD]

35 minutes ago, WHL rocks said:

Intelligence opps are too complicated for me or you or anyone on this hockey forum to know who what when where why etc. 

 

In this situation there are 2 scenarios imo.

 

1. Putin killed his own people to expand the war.

 

2. Foreign intelligence together with members of Ukrainian GRU carried out the mission..

 

I don't think Zelenski or Syrskyi ordered the attack. It would be an intelligence agent(s) working with other allied country intelligence agents.  

 

Maybe NATO is planning to enter the field in western Ukraine and want Russia to go into full attack and use that as a reason to enter..

 

Maybe Mossad did a payback for the Oct 7 Hamas attack as they did in Tehran 2 months ago when they used ISIS K to kill 100 people along with other terror attacks that have happened recently in Iran.

 

You know Israel thinks Russia thru Iran gave the nod for Oct 7 Hamas attack. And I do think Russia gave the nod to Iran for that attack to punish Israel for its role in Ukrain uprising and the war that followed. 

 

So I think there are so many scenarios that it would be impossible for us to know all the answers. 

 

But with ISIS K immediately taking responsibility and knowing they are a CIA and Mossad proxy does provide me with enough information to think this was most likely a combined UKR and another foreign intelligence operation. 

 

I don't even think CIA would be involved because of a multitude of reasons. I think most likely it's some UKR agents with Mossad involved at some level. 

 

This is a chess match and there are so many things involved in war that we would never even think about.

3: ISIS/ISIL affiliated/inspired militants carried it out for their own ideological reasons (Russia's intervention in Sryia). No doubt Russia would like the population to believe Ukraine is behind it, to make the next wave of mobilization more palatable.

 

The level of connectivity you're presribing is absolute non-sense. These entities are not controlled by other intelligence agencies. They are chaotic, fractured, and have varying motivations and allegences within. But most of all, they have agency over themselves.

 

Int organizations deliberately leak things or run supplies to these groups for specific results in specific actions, but Mossad/CIA do not control them.

Edited March 24 by MattJVD

[Warhippy]

30 minutes ago, WHL rocks said:

Intelligence opps are too complicated for me or you or anyone on this hockey forum to know who what when where why etc. 

 

In this situation there are 2 scenarios imo.

 

1. Putin killed his own people to expand the war.

 

2. Foreign intelligence together with members of Ukrainian GRU carried out the mission..

 

I don't think Zelenski or Syrskyi ordered the attack. It would be an intelligence agent(s) working with other allied country intelligence agents.  

 

Maybe NATO is planning to enter the field in western Ukraine and want Russia to go into full attack and use that as a reason to enter..

 

Maybe Mossad did a payback for the Oct 7 Hamas attack as they did in Tehran 2 months ago when they used ISIS K to kill 100 people along with other terror attacks that have happened recently in Iran.

 

You know Israel thinks Russia thru Iran gave the nod for Oct 7 Hamas attack. And I do think Russia gave the nod to Iran for that attack to punish Israel for its role in Ukrain uprising and the war that followed. 

 

So I think there are so many scenarios that it would be impossible for us to know all the answers. 

 

But with ISIS K immediately taking responsibility and knowing they are a CIA and Mossad proxy does provide me with enough information to think this was most likely a combined UKR and another foreign intelligence operation. 

 

I don't even think CIA would be involved because of a multitude of reasons. I think they knew a lot more details and exactly who was planning the attack. Because they did give warnings on the exact type of attack that was on the way this is pretty much known.

I think most likely it's some UKR agents with Mossad involved at some level. 

 

This is a chess match and there are so many things involved in war that we would never even think about.

 

Edit: in any event I don't think Putin will over react. He's a 16 year KGB agent and 20+ year president.  He's very patient as shown with the 8 years of Ukrainian shelling and killing Russians in Eastern Ukraine before finally sending in the military.  I think over 15k + Russians were killed in Eastern Ukraine since 2014 before he sent in the military 

 

He will be patient and deliberate in his response. 

 

Russians are advancing every day in the east. He won't get emotional and do something stupid. He will have a big response and punish Kiev. 

 

 

 

I adore you think that during a war there are only ever two possibilities for an event 

 

Again I am asking your opinion, since you believe what is a blatant and admitted Russian propaganda channel on Telegram.

 

With Ukraine having the ability to slaughter Russians anywhere any time but not having done so to any extent or recordable extent during this invasion.  Why would they waste money, time and resources hiring a small group of random individuals to murder innocents in a random concert hall in Russia?  

 

Simple question

[King Heffy]

1 hour ago, WHL rocks said:

Intelligence opps are too complicated for me or you or anyone on this hockey forum to know who what when where why etc. 

 

In this situation there are 2 scenarios imo.

 

1. Putin killed his own people to expand the war.

 

2. Foreign intelligence together with members of Ukrainian GRU carried out the mission..

 

I don't think Zelenski or Syrskyi ordered the attack. It would be an intelligence agent(s) working with other allied country intelligence agents.  

 

Maybe NATO is planning to enter the field in western Ukraine and want Russia to go into full attack and use that as a reason to enter..

 

Maybe Mossad did a payback for the Oct 7 Hamas attack as they did in Tehran 2 months ago when they used ISIS K to kill 100 people along with other terror attacks that have happened recently in Iran.

 

You know Israel thinks Russia thru Iran gave the nod for Oct 7 Hamas attack. And I do think Russia gave the nod to Iran for that attack to punish Israel for its role in Ukrain uprising and the war that followed. 

 

So I think there are so many scenarios that it would be impossible for us to know all the answers. 

 

But with ISIS K immediately taking responsibility and knowing they are a CIA and Mossad proxy does provide me with enough information to think this was most likely a combined UKR and another foreign intelligence operation. 

 

I don't even think CIA would be involved because of a multitude of reasons. I think they knew a lot more details and exactly who was planning the attack. Because they did give warnings on the exact type of attack that was on the way this is pretty much known.

I think most likely it's some UKR agents with Mossad involved at some level. 

 

This is a chess match and there are so many things involved in war that we would never even think about.

 

Edit: in any event I don't think Putin will over react. He's a 16 year KGB agent and 20+ year president.  He's very patient as shown with the 8 years of Ukrainian shelling and killing Russians in Eastern Ukraine before finally sending in the military.  I think over 15k + Russians were killed in Eastern Ukraine since 2014 before he sent in the military 

 

He will be patient and deliberate in his response. 

 

Russians are advancing every day in the east. He won't get emotional and do something stupid. He will have a big response and punish Kiev. 

 

 

 

Wow.  You're actually claiming that subhuman vermin like Putin have been patient?    The only response that would be appropriate would be for him to put a gun in his mouth and pull the trigger.  Forum rules prevent me from adequately expressing how disgusting it is to read Nazi propaganda like you're posting in here.

[CBH1926]

5 hours ago, WHL rocks said:

Why is everyone on here saying ISIS did this attack.

 

The shooters are all in custody. They are all Tajikistani and were hired by Ukraine intelligence. This has nothing to do with ISIS. This is a Ukranian intelligence attack. 

 

I don’t see Ukraine carrying this out for obvious reasons, if this is tied back to them, it will invite even bigger retaliation by the Russians. U.S has been in bed with some ruthless political and military players in the past, Europeans not so much.

Only an idiot would think after seeing videos of civilians executed, wounded people having their throats slit and kids getting killed. That all this would not have an effect on Norway, Sweden, Austria, Netherlands, Belgium, New Zealand, Canada etc. continuing to send weapons to Ukraine. Like it or not, Ukraine has to continue to be the “good guy” here not to jeopardize aid.

[RomanPer]

2 hours ago, WHL rocks said:

Intelligence opps are too complicated for me or you or anyone on this hockey forum to know who what when where why etc. 

 

 

 

Don’t judge others on this forum by your own internal standard… As for the rest of your post - you are clearly getting your information mainly (if not only) from that russian propaganda telegram channel, so really, there’s nothing to discuss there.

[RomanPer]

1 minute ago, CBH1926 said:

I don’t see Ukraine carrying this out for obvious reasons, if this is tied back to them, it will invite even bigger retaliation by the Russians. U.S has been in bed with some ruthless political and military players in the past, Europeans not so much.

Only an idiot would think after seeing videos of civilians executed, wounded people having their throats slit and kids getting killed. That all this would not have an effect on Norway, Sweden, Austria, Netherlands, Belgium, New Zealand, Canada etc. continuing to send weapons to Ukraine. Like it or not, Ukraine has to continue to be the “good guy” here not to jeopardize aid.

 

I think the “only an idiot” part of your reply applies here quite well  

[WHL rocks]

DL

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks

[King Heffy]

25 minutes ago, WHL rocks said:

I watched this interview with CIA agent a whike back..  He said anyone can parrot their opinions and defend their position with energy and vigor . But intelligence agents know smart people are those who can talk about a subject without being emotionally involved. And can look at things from other people's or countries perspective.. 

 

Like I said I don't have a horse in the game. I don't care who's right or wrong. Who's the good guy or the bad guy. I enjoy geo politics as a hobbie. 

 

None of you guys ever heard of ISIS K or know where Khorasan is on a map before I mentioned it..

 

None of you know Iran bombed a senior ISIS K and Mossad meeting last month in Kurdistan at a Mossad safe house just steps from CIA post... killing very senior members involved in the terror attack in Tehran a month prior. 

 

None of you can name any proxies from any country besides Hamas.

 

Honestly if any of you had genuine interest you would ask questions that would help you gain knowledge.  But sometimes facts are too bitter to sallow and require too much energy and time to learn. 

 

But you call me names. Lol. Good job. You guys are so smart. Back to CNN for you guys. 

 

This is like being in a kindergarten trying to talk about adult topics. Beyond the capacity of pupils tcomprehendnd. My fault. 

 

See you guys in another thread. 

 

 

 

Guys like Roman and Optimist have access to a lot more sources and information than you do Googling while you're taking a dump.  I'm grateful that they choose to share their perspective.

[WHL rocks]

DL

Edited April 8 by WHL rocks