[Trade] Canucks Acquire Elias Lindholm from Calgary for Andrei Kuzmenko, Hunter Brzustewicz, Joni Jurmo, 2024 1st and Conditional 2024 4th

[Coconuts]

4 minutes ago, tas said:

from a team that wants him on their first line, sure. 

 

if he wants the money and the pressure, he'll take the offer. if he'd rather play a little lower down and have a chance to win, maybe he takes less. 

 

swedes aren't usually greedy. 

 

If he signs in Vancouver there's a good chance he would be, depending on which line is actually the top line going forward. I expect that'll be Pettersson's line going forward as Miller ages. 

 

I guess it comes down to what you consider as being "less". I think 8-8.5M would probably be fair value. Both are less than 9M. I'll be a bit surprised if his next deal begins with a 7. Mid to high 7's would be generous on his part. 

 

One could argue his numbers have taken a hit, one could also argue his team has been shit. 

Edited February 1 by Coconuts

[Canuck You]

LOL!

 

 

[Ghostsof1915]

The only thing that unites Calgary and Vancouver is our hatred of the Oilers and Leafs.

[Hammertime]

25 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

Ehhh, I disagree but I'm not going to go around in circles over it. 

 

Lindholm should probably cost any team 8-8.5Mish, I don't see why he wouldn't at least get close to Horvat money given that's a very recent comparable. 

When Horvat signed he was on pace for 50g. I think 7.5 max for Lindholm if he walks he walks. Signing a bad contract won't make the trade better. 

 

I'm also in the keep Garland boat.  

 

 

[Strawbone]

1 minute ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

The only thing that unites Calgary and Vancouver is our hatred of the Oilers and Leafs.

 

I gotta admit, I'm going to be low-key cheering the Flames on while Kuzy is there.

[PeteyBOI]

if he gets 7.5 million he will be lucky...

 

this is his range IMO 6.5-7.5m add a few hundred thousand to play on any canadian team not Vancouver...

 

Vancouver may be one of the better spots to chose to live long term... if he signs with us im expecting a similiar to kadri deal.... 7x7 and hoping for a 6.5mx6

[aGENT]

15 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Don't mistake Garland's line as the 3rd line and call him a 3rd line player.  That line IS the 2nd line on this team right now pending what Lindholm can do for the newly formed 2nd line.  That 2nd line of Mik-Petey-Kuz was dreadful, and the only reason we got anywhere in the standings was because the Garland line was scoring at an incredible clip (almost PPG for all 3 of them). 

 

Mik plays on the PP, plays/played with Petey, spent most of his time this season on the ice with Petey, Kuz, Hughes, and Hronek, but his production is still less than Garland.  You don't see anything wrong with that?  Meanwhile Garland spends almost all his time with Joshua, Blueger, Cole, and Myers and has out produced Mikheyev.  Hmmm....

 

Then you have Suter who spends a few games in the top 6 and produces 25% of the amount of points Mikheyev has all season...

 

Mikheyev is best suited for the 4th line right now.  Strong defensively, weak offensively.

 

Mik, Petey, Lind will be our 2nd line. Garland is on our 3rd line. It's even the main reason we were given for being unable to trade him last summer. A lot of teams view him as a 3rd liner on a contender (though IMO he can play a complementary role to a bigger, 2 way 2C and/or on a lesser team). Your small sample size doesn't change that.

 

Coming off knee surgery, dragging dead weight, in a small sample size.....sure. We're talking next year's roster, with a recovered Mikheyev. 

 

Again, complementary, both special teams, affordable top 6 player vs expensive, play driving 5v5 3rd line player. 

Edited February 1 by aGENT

[Coconuts]

1 minute ago, Hammertime said:

When Horvat signed he was on pace for 50g. I think 7.5 max for Lindholm if he walks he walks. Signing a bad contract won't make the trade better. 

 

I'm also in the keep Garland boat.  

 

 

 

Yes, and Horvat also had UFA leverage which is part of why he got what he got. If the Isles hadn't given it to him another team likely would have. Lindholm is two seasons removed from 40 goals and 42 assists playing alongside Gaudreau and Tkachuk, he's demonstrated that he can center top tier talent and produce. Lindholm also has UFA leverage. 

 

Lindholm also has a more complete game than Horvat, and is a recent Selke finalist as well as a right handed center. Someone would give him a Horvat type deal via UFA, I don't see why 500k-1M should be the barrier that stops us from signing him if we're serious about contending going forward. 

 

I'd rather allocate more to our top forwards and whittle down our bottom six if it comes to it, it's not as if we'd be Toronto level top heavy. 

 

Lindholm doesn't owe the Canucks a thing, he may be willing to take less on a more competitive club but I don't expect it'll be drastically less. 

 

Sometimes you've just got to pay the piper and pay market value, every contract isn't going to be a bargain or a steal. 

 

I'm fine with shipping Garland out, I'm also fine with keeping him, but I do view him as a luxury on the third line. 

 

 

[GrammaInTheTub]

I think Lindholm comes down to earth after his down years and signs a sensible extension at around $7M if we see him as a long term fit. If not, it’s a fair price for a rental this year and frees up money next year to keep working at it. Like I’ve said before, I wish our outgoing players all the success in the world so long as it’s not against us. 
 

But let’s be real. Every news outlet has said this was tidy work and a good deal for a team pushing all in. If the doofs that push that fluff have come onboard, it should be clear to us. 

[tas]

14 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

If he signs in Vancouver there's a good chance he would be, depending on which line is actually the top line going forward. I expect that'll be Pettersson's line going forward as Miller ages. 

 

I guess it comes down to what you consider as being "less". I think 8-8.5M would probably be fair value. Both are less than 9M. I'll be a bit surprised if his next deal begins with a 7. Mid to high 7's would be generous on his part. 

 

One could argue his numbers have taken a hit, one could also argue his team has been shit. 

because of the down year, if he's eager to win and wanting to fit into a particular team, I could see him settling for $7.5-8, depending how juicy the other offers are. 

[PeteyBOI]

we have to believe we are a place that people want to play for... 6.5mx6 is not out the question when Vancouver is like the number 1 place to live in the world...

 

we have to destroy the negative nancies that are our media... sure we can have alot of them but no more Thomas drance type's causing a riot among the fans...

[aGENT]

7 minutes ago, Hammertime said:

When Horvat signed he was on pace for 50g. I think 7.5 max for Lindholm if he walks he walks. Signing a bad contract won't make the trade better. 

 

This exactly... you either get him for a reasonable $7-$7.5, or he walks (hopefully after a VERY long playoff run) and we spend that cap elsewhere.

[GrammaInTheTub]

9 minutes ago, Strawbone said:

 

I gotta admit, I'm going to be low-key cheering the Flames on while Kuzy is there.

I’ll be cheering Kuzy for sure 

[Bob Long]

8 mil - Miller

9 mil - Lindholm

11 mil - Petey 

 

I mean thats not bad for that level of C talent. 

 

[Coconuts]

1 minute ago, tas said:

because of the down year, if he's eager to win and wanting to fit into a particular team, I could see him settling for $7.5-8, depending how juicy the other offers are. 

 

I'd happily extend him at 7.5-8.5M, I'm not going to quibble over a few hundred thousand if it gets us a top tier defensive center who has demonstrated the ability to produce alongside top tier talent. 

[spook007]

32 minutes ago, steviewonder20 said:

‘Lindholm, though, was going to be a goner. He is reportedly seeking roughly $9 million per year on his next contract, a huge hit for a guy who is having an underwhelming offensive campaign.’

 

From the Calgary Herald.

 

Holy shut, Batman. If he’s seeking $9 million, this is clearly a rental.

At $9M he'll be a rental....

[I.AM.THE.WALRUS]

19 minutes ago, Canuck You said:

LOL!

 

 

BRILLIANT

 

GO CANUCKS GO

 

[HKSR]

1 minute ago, aGENT said:

 

Mik, Petey, Lind will be our 2nd line. Garland is on our 3rd line. It's even the main reason we were given for being unable to trade him last summer. A lot of teams view him as a 3rd liner on a contender (though IMO he can play a complementary role to a bigger, 2 way 2C and/or on a lesser team). Your small sample size doesn't change that.

 

Coming off knee surgery, dragging dead weight, in a small sample size.....sure. We're talking next year's roster, with a recovered Mikheyev. 

 

Again, complementary, both special teams, affordable top 6 player vs expensive, play driving 5v5 3rd line player. 

The sample size we have of Mikheyev is that he's always recovering from some kinda injury.  He hasn't played more than 54 games in a season.  He has only scored more than 13 goals in a season ONCE. 

 

Our 3rd line is our life line.  Without it, we're nowhere near where we are.  You wanna know how good that line is?

 

"Seventy-one forward lines in the NHL have played at least 100 minutes together and the Garland-Blueger-Joshua combo ranks 11th best with a dominant 61.5 percent control of expected goals according to MoneyPuck. They’re hemming opponents in the defensive zone with a repeated barrage of heavy shifts, generating a high volume of dangerous chances and boasting strong defensive results too."

 

https://theathletic.com/5145416/2023/12/18/conor-garland-canucks-observations/

 

Let that sink in.  11th best in terms of expected goals. 

 

And even MORE facts and statistics to show how Garland is the driver of that 11th best line in the NHL:

 

 

Suck it up buttercup.  Garland is immensely valuable.  FAR more than Mikheyev.  We keep Garland on that 3rd line because he makes that line the consistent threat that it is day in and day out. 

 

Again, you keep flinging your same narrative -- OH, Mikheyev is recovering, oh Mikheyev had to carry a 2nd line with Kuzmenko and Pettersson on it... is that it?  That Mik is recovering and that he was forced to carry Pettersson and Kuzmenko?  THAT is your premise?

 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

5 hours ago, PureQuickness said:

 

I'm happy for Hutton. Hutton is one of the few exceptions of Gillis' poor drafting, and how many drafts did it take for him to draft one NHL serviceable player? If I recall, he's the ONLY non-first round draft pick to succeed out of Gillis - out of five years.

 

The amount of crap that we picked over the years by Gillis makes me so upset.

In all seriousness, I highly doubt Gillis even knew anything about Ben Hutton (other than what his scouts told about him).  NHL GM's have very little to do with later round picks.  They hire amateur scouts to handle much of that.  They wouldn't have the time to do their jobs if they did.  What you can hold Gillis to the fire was that he had PLENTY of time to revamp the clearly inadequate domestic amateur scouting staff of the Canucks.  They've sucked donkey balls for DECADES (long before Gillis).  Look at one of the failed Jim Benning first round picks, Jake Virtanen.  Was in the WHL when he was drafted by us.  *SAME* failure from these guys.  Sure, our European & US amateur scouts aren't perfect, but they've been carrying this franchise FOREVER.  I laugh when Benning gave credit to Delorme for the EP pick.  That guy couldn't find a "comfort woman" with a fistfull of cash at the Mustang Ranch (remember Brendan Gallagher - just one example?).  

[WHL rocks]

Lindholm will have Canucks patch on his All Star jersey.

 

Was just listening to Jeff Marek show and Friedman confirmed that they sewed on the patches last night and Lindholm will have Canucks patch..

 

6 players 

1 coach 

7 representatives from the Canucks

[GrammaInTheTub]

1 minute ago, Bob Long said:

8 mil - Miller

9 mil - Lindholm

11 mil - Petey 

 

I mean thats not bad for that level of C talent. 

 

I don’t usually disagree with you Bob, but I do here. I’m not paying for lighting in a bottle that was Tkachuk-Lindholm-Gaudreau when the magic seems to have dried up for Jonny and Lindholm. I expect we will see an increase in production once he hits our line up for sure, but in a cap strapped world this old ladies purse strings are tighter than ever. I think he comfortably takes a 7-7.5M with term deal and I’m comfortable with that too. It would be a win. I’m not saying we won’t still be an amazing team if we do extend him for more either. Just my wish list I suppose. 

[Bob Long]

Just now, GrammaInTheTub said:

I don’t usually disagree with you Bob, but I do here. I’m not paying for lighting in a bottle that was Tkachuk-Lindholm-Gaudreau when the magic seems to have dried up for Jonny and Lindholm. I expect we will see an increase in production once he hits our line up for sure, but in a cap strapped world this old ladies purse strings are tighter than ever. I think he comfortably takes a 7-7.5M with term deal and I’m comfortable with that too. It would be a win. I’m not saying we won’t still be an amazing team if we do extend him for more either. Just my wish list I suppose. 

 

Im just sort of looking at the whole price for the 3 coming in at 30 mil. Maybe Lindholm is a bit less, Petey a bit higher. But compared to what other teams are paying for their C talent, its not too bad imo.

[HKSR]

Just now, WHL rocks said:

Lindholm will have Canucks patch on his All Star jersey.

 

Was just listening to Jeff Marek show and Friedman confirmed that they sewed on the patches last night and Lindholm will have Canucks patch..

 

6 players 

1 coach 

7 representatives from the Canucks

What's the record number of representatives?  I can't seem to find anything online, but I remember seeing it on TV somewhere.... I think it was the Avs back in the day?  But that was pre-cap era I believe.

[Guntrix]

Jesus Christ. This is way, way, way too much. Kuzmenko, a 1st, AND Brzustewicz for a potential rental? 

 

Brzustewicz hurts the most for me. The guy is putting up absolute elite numbers for a D. Still maintain he's more valuable than Willander.

[Rocket-68]

9 minutes ago, HKSR said:

What's the record number of representatives?  I can't seem to find anything online, but I remember seeing it on TV somewhere.... I think it was the Avs back in the day?  But that was pre-cap era I believe.

 

1986 Oilers had 9 players at the game plus Glen Sather --> https://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=28952 .. I can't imagine anyone would have beaten that particular season.

 

EDIT: there is an argument about "starting lineup" (Oilers had 5, while the Canucks have 6)  but can't find clarity on that particular distinction. Perhaps someone can post. In any event, as pure bodies, if Messier is your reserve and you use that as an argument that the Canucks 2024 are better than the Oilers of 1986 in terms of All Stars then I would suggest perhaps cricket or croquet as a sport. 

Edited February 2 by Rocket-68