PureQuickness Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 1 minute ago, Bob Long said: I mean this is the holy land for hindsight isn't it? If we end up keeping Lindholm because Petey wants out e.g., it will look like quite a good move. But.. but... but.... you can go over and over what ifs, which I admit is kind of fun to do. I trust this current management groups ability to do the pro-side development well, most of the time. Compared to ol Jimbo, e.g., who's decisions we're still paying for. It's a little too early to judge on pro-side development so far, but the new management has done a great job so far. Lindholm has seemingly allowed Miller to flourish. Maybe it's coincidence though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 6 minutes ago, PureQuickness said: It's a little too early to judge on pro-side development so far, but the new management has done a great job so far. Lindholm has seemingly allowed Miller to flourish. Maybe it's coincidence though. Yes, I agree. I would like to see a little more from Pettersson now, but I think Mikheyev being on his line is holding him back a little, but at the same time, a really good player, someone we think will re-sign for 11 million + range, makes everyone around him better. I don't think Pettersson has been playing at the same level he started the season at. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 3 hours ago, Coryberg said: -Joni Jurmo was not an asset -Kuzzy and his 5.5 million dollar cap hit was not an asset -a 4th round pick is what we got for Curtis Lazar We gave up 2 decent assets in the late 1st and B level prospect. So a first round pick and the OHL's leading scorer. Oh plus a 39 goal scorer. Everything sounds different when you say it with flair. Also in that light, Kuzmenko and Lindholm are currently scoring at the same pace points-wise but Kuzmenko is scoring a higher goals/game. Calgary are a 7-3-0 team since dumping this team cancer while the Canucks are 0.500, so addition by subtraction as well. I know obviously Lindholm should be the better player and the real worth of all of those pieces, but this was not a long-term trade for us, it was a short term trade, and we've already burned about a third of his rental value and so far it's been dreadful. We should be winning a rental trade in the short-term and of course Calgary will win it in the long run, but already Calgary are winning it. More importantly, I was a bit hesitant for us to mess with our team chemistry, we were really chugging nicely before Lindholm arrived. Then the coaches try and play him in our top-6 - a disaster everywhere, so he's buried on his own line where he's even tanking Garland now too. There's something to be said of not acquiring stars when you've got a top team and we've seen it before. We could use some depth, sure, but trying to fit Lindholm into our top-6 and PP has been a disaster and no one wants to talk about it. For as much brilliance PA and JR have done to this team (and I'll mainly highlight the coaching staff and defence restructuring), so far this has been a big blunder. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryberg Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 2 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said: So a first round pick and the OHL's leading scorer. Oh plus a 39 goal scorer. Everything sounds different when you say it with flair. A late first in a draft that drops off around 20. Kuzy WAS a 39 goal scorer, we can sign Kessel for league min if we want a player you used to score goals. Brzustewicz isn't leading the OHL in scoring, he isn't even the leading scorer amongst defenseman, he isn't even the leading scorer on his team for that matter. 2 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said: Also in that light, Kuzmenko and Lindholm are currently scoring at the same pace points-wise but Kuzmenko is scoring a higher goals/game. How's Kuzmenko doing in the faceoff dot? Lots of PK time? I'm sure he is getting his fair share of Dzone deployment and blocking shots. 2 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said: Calgary are a 7-3-0 team since dumping this team cancer while the Canucks are 0.500, so addition by subtraction as well. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breadnbutta Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 6 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said: So a first round pick and the OHL's leading scorer. Oh plus a 39 goal scorer. Everything sounds different when you say it with flair. Also in that light, Kuzmenko and Lindholm are currently scoring at the same pace points-wise but Kuzmenko is scoring a higher goals/game. Calgary are a 7-3-0 team since dumping this team cancer while the Canucks are 0.500, so addition by subtraction as well. I know obviously Lindholm should be the better player and the real worth of all of those pieces, but this was not a long-term trade for us, it was a short term trade, and we've already burned about a third of his rental value and so far it's been dreadful. We should be winning a rental trade in the short-term and of course Calgary will win it in the long run, but already Calgary are winning it. More importantly, I was a bit hesitant for us to mess with our team chemistry, we were really chugging nicely before Lindholm arrived. Then the coaches try and play him in our top-6 - a disaster everywhere, so he's buried on his own line where he's even tanking Garland now too. There's something to be said of not acquiring stars when you've got a top team and we've seen it before. We could use some depth, sure, but trying to fit Lindholm into our top-6 and PP has been a disaster and no one wants to talk about it. For as much brilliance PA and JR have done to this team (and I'll mainly highlight the coaching staff and defence restructuring), so far this has been a big blunder. How is lindholm a team cancer??? Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 6 minutes ago, Breadnbutta said: How is lindholm a team cancer??? Lol Someone is still hurt about Brewski. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 7 hours ago, Bob Long said: Someone is still hurt about Brewski. Not even fussed about Hunter, he could easily be the next Rathbone, we just targeted the wrong center and overpaid for him. Meanwhile Monahan and the Jets are laughing. Think we should blame our scouting department on this one, not so much PA and JR. Lindholm looks like he should be the perfect fit for this team but he's been trash and any good scout watching the Flames over the last few years would have seen this trend. We just spent 4 assets on Manny Malhotra/Pahlsson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthy animal Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 16 hours ago, HKSR said: I think this is a key takeaway. Miller has taken off since Lindholm arrived. I'm sure it has to do with reduced defensive duties. Thats a very good point. JT has thrived ever since they put the 3 guys (petey JT, Lindy) on different lines. Opposing teams don't know who to match up with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 3 minutes ago, filthy animal said: Thats a very good point. JT has thrived ever since they put the 3 guys (petey JT, Lindy) on different lines. Opposing teams don't know who to match up with Actually Miller was tearing it up prior to the All-star break when we acquired Lindholm. He had 24 points in 18 games prior to acquiring Lindholm. Then Lindholm comes in, plays what, 2-3 games with Miller and he has like 1 point in 3 games, then Lindholm gets off his line and he takes off again. No surprise... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthy animal Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 4 minutes ago, DownUndaCanuck said: Actually Miller was tearing it up prior to the All-star break when we acquired Lindholm. He had 24 points in 18 games prior to acquiring Lindholm. Then Lindholm comes in, plays what, 2-3 games with Miller and he has like 1 point in 3 games, then Lindholm gets off his line and he takes off again. No surprise... Its not just about the points. I know its only been 2 games, but notice the other teams superstars have been a non factor? Marchand Pastrnak and Malkin were rendered useless and for the most part Crosby was contained. Thats what Lindholm does when you got all 3 down the middle. Full health, its forseeable that the Blueger Joshua Garland line will almost exclusively go up against 3rd or 4th liners, they'll win that matchup 90% of that time. If toc can find the right wingers for the EP40 and Lindholm line with the best 3rd line in the league intact, we'll do well come april may Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthy animal Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 24 minutes ago, DownUndaCanuck said: Not even fussed about Hunter, he could easily be the next Rathbone, we just targeted the wrong center and overpaid for him. Meanwhile Monahan and the Jets are laughing. Think we should blame our scouting department on this one, not so much PA and JR. Lindholm looks like he should be the perfect fit for this team but he's been trash and any good scout watching the Flames over the last few years would have seen this trend. We just spent 4 assets on Manny Malhotra/Pahlsson. People thought the Lighting were insane trading top tier assets for Coleman and Goodrow, you don't see them complaining. We're not playing for hockey pools, we're playing for spring/early summer (hoping!) hockey 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 2 hours ago, filthy animal said: Its not just about the points. I know its only been 2 games, but notice the other teams superstars have been a non factor? Marchand Pastrnak and Malkin were rendered useless and for the most part Crosby was contained. Thats what Lindholm does when you got all 3 down the middle. Full health, its forseeable that the Blueger Joshua Garland line will almost exclusively go up against 3rd or 4th liners, they'll win that matchup 90% of that time. If toc can find the right wingers for the EP40 and Lindholm line with the best 3rd line in the league intact, we'll do well come april may We're 0.500 since Lindholm joined and have been getting bombed defensively. I know that's not all Lindholm's fault but he's a -5 in 12 games. We've been averaging 3.5 goals against per game since Lindholm joined. I know on paper and in theory he's brilliant and makes a lot of sense, but this team is a mess since he joined for whatever reason and our coaches have to figure out a solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 5 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said: Not even fussed about Hunter, he could easily be the next Rathbone, we just targeted the wrong center and overpaid for him. Meanwhile Monahan and the Jets are laughing. Think we should blame our scouting department on this one, not so much PA and JR. Lindholm looks like he should be the perfect fit for this team but he's been trash and any good scout watching the Flames over the last few years would have seen this trend. We just spent 4 assets on Manny Malhotra/Pahlsson. Lindholm is not "trash" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorvatToBaertschi Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 I'd like to highlight that Lindholm has been pretty fucking good in our own zone. Yes, he's been absolute dogshit in the offensive zone, but now that we have 3 potential scoring lines (and our 4th line is somehow dominating the offensive zone, thanks Teodors!), this makes things easier for either Miller or Pettersson. It seems as though teams are focusing on Pettersson, which is leaving Miller and Boeser with favorable matchups. During the course of the game, as Miller ramps up his intensity, they tend to navigate towards him, and then Pettersson and Hoglander have more room out there. I've noticed their best shifts come later in the game when they have more room. Basically, what I'm trying to say is, we have a deep forward corps and it's had a very positive impact. We're losing games right now because of our special teams and our inability to stop taking stick penalties. Goaltending and offense is a non issue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 If we wanted a checking 3rd line center we would have targeted some one else. We wanted a top-6 center/winger who can play good defence, not a cheap checking center. You don't pay that price for a 3C. There are so many other centers out there who will probably end up being cheaper than Lindholm and out-produce him in the top-6. Henrique and Monahan are the first big two that come to mind. Also, if he does just end up being an 18 minute 3rd line checking center who only scores 40 points these days, surely we can re-sign him for say 5-6M? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 1 minute ago, DownUndaCanuck said: If we wanted a checking 3rd line center we would have targeted some one else. We wanted a top-6 center/winger who can play good defence, not a cheap checking center. You don't pay that price for a 3C. There are so many other centers out there who will probably end up being cheaper than Lindholm and out-produce him in the top-6. Henrique and Monahan are the first big two that come to mind. Also, if he does just end up being an 18 minute 3rd line checking center who only scores 40 points these days, surely we can re-sign him for say 5-6M? No one thinks Monahan is a better player than Lindholm. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanuckMan Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 Reunite the lotto line and keep it there. Play Suter and Hoglander with Lindholm on the 2nd line. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dannyboy88 Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 22 minutes ago, CanuckMan said: Reunite the lotto line and keep it there. Play Suter and Hoglander with Lindholm on the 2nd line. That's a terrible sounding second line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanuckMan Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 3 hours ago, Dannyboy88 said: That's a terrible sounding second line. Doesn’t make sense to have Lindholm on the third line either when you have Suter/Bluegar to play 3C/4C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammertime Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 I think Lindholm re ups in the off season. If it's true he was offered 9m he should have taken it then. No GM in the league is going to give him 9m today. Lindholm is still a hell of a player though. If he comes in under 7 I'm all for keeping him. If not then he is a rental, and I'm ok with that too, but I would prefer to re-sign him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekker Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 I mean, crazy thought. Could Alvin flip Lindholm at the deadline? Why not recoup the first and go after Taffoli. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flickyoursedin Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 How much does this guy want on a new deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureQuickness Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 2 hours ago, flickyoursedin said: How much does this guy want on a new deal? Minimum 8 M in all likelihood, but that's not confirmed. Maybe he'll take a paycut to stay, but he really doesn't have to. He might have certain benefits to keep him in the lineup, but he hasn't done much... and still isn't doing much... I don't hate the player, but maybe it's time to wake up to the reality. It's still early, so we're holding on to hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureQuickness Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 15 hours ago, Bob Long said: No one thinks Monahan is a better player than Lindholm. He would've been cheaper to acquire. There'd also be more cap space. A lot more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 1 hour ago, PureQuickness said: Minimum 8 M in all likelihood, but that's not confirmed. Maybe he'll take a paycut to stay, but he really doesn't have to. He might have certain benefits to keep him in the lineup, but he hasn't done much... and still isn't doing much... I don't hate the player, but maybe it's time to wake up to the reality. It's still early, so we're holding on to hope. If I'm a betting man, I think Lindholm walks at the end of the season. Might be sooner than we think, cause we might not go very far in the playoffs either with the way that we're currently playing, and how some of our stars aren't producing when the going gets tough. This is when the games matter, and at least for the last 6-7 games, they haven't shown up. Worries me a little bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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