Speculation- Hughes wanting Canucks to trade for Tanev

[tas]

3 hours ago, canucks curse said:

How very The Alchemist of you 

I certainly don't understand the reference. 

[Sonoman]

On 1/25/2024 at 3:01 PM, Alflives said:

Coming UFA 

And 34 years old.  Not worth a first now. 

[Sonoman]

On 1/25/2024 at 3:49 PM, Bob Long said:

How about Myers (for the cap balance), our 1st and Lekkeriamki for Lindholm and Tanev (1/2 retained) with an extension in place for Lindholm first.

Thought Lekkerimaki was untouchable.   I wouldn’t want to give up a a very promising RW for a couple of months of Tanev.  Loved Chris when he was here but getting quite long in the tooth now, 34-35? 

[Bob Long]

7 hours ago, Sonoman said:

Thought Lekkerimaki was untouchable.   I wouldn’t want to give up a a very promising RW for a couple of months of Tanev.  Loved Chris when he was here but getting quite long in the tooth now, 34-35? 

 

I was thinking more JL for Lindholm but I get it.

[DeNiro]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

I was thinking more JL for Lindholm but I get it.

Yea if we’re trading a blue chipper it’s for a guy with term or an extension in place.

 

Lindholm would have to be a sign and trade.

[Bob Long]

1 minute ago, DeNiro said:

Yea if we’re trading a blue chipper it’s for a guy with term or an extension in place.

 

Lindholm would have to be a sign and trade.

 

Yep exactly.

[Alflives]

Just now, DeNiro said:

Yea if we’re trading a blue chipper it’s for a guy with term or an extension in place.

 

Lindholm would have to be a sign and trade.

And be 25 on the rise and not 30 and falling off a cliff. Zero chance this management does a Benning. 

[Bob Long]

Just now, Alflives said:

And be 25 on the rise and not 30 and falling off a cliff. Zero chance this management does a Benning. 

 

Don't you think Lindholm would be a good fit?

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Bob Long said:

 

Don't you think Lindholm would be a good fit?

 The Empties are clear on Lidholm. They think he’s a puck sucker. Next Loui. 

[Bob Long]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

 The Empties are clear on Lidholm. They think he’s a puck sucker. Next Loui. 

 

Oh man. Let's not do that then 

[DeNiro]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

 The Empties are clear on Lidholm. They think he’s a puck sucker. Next Loui. 

Petey would turn him back into the player he was a couple years ago.

 

Losing Gaudreau and Tkachuk is gonna hurt any players output. I think we could get him at a bargain to be honest

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Petey would turn him back into the player he was a couple years ago.

 

Losing Gaudreau and Tkachuk is gonna hurt any players output. I think we could get him at a bargain to be honest

I don’t disagree that Petey can (and does) carry lesser wingers. But why spend assets to acquire a guy that Petey needs to carry? The Loui signs are shining in bright neon on Lindholm. 

[HKSR]

Read an article somewhere the other day that might make some sense... acquire Tanev with a double retention on him (ie. use a 3rd party team to retain another 50%)...

 

So that would mean Tanev @ $1.125M ($4.5 @ 50% = $2.25 @ 50% = $1.125)

 

Could add Tanev to our current roster without taking anything away.

[DeNiro]

34 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I don’t disagree that Petey can (and does) carry lesser wingers. But why spend assets to acquire a guy that Petey needs to carry? The Loui signs are shining in bright neon on Lindholm. 

My point is he can be an elite player that drives play when paired with other skilled players.

 

If the Canucks got rid of Miller and Boeser I’m sure Petey wouldn’t look as good either. Petey needs skilled guys to play with just like Lindholm and he just doesn’t have that anymore in Calgary.

[VegasCanuck]

21 hours ago, Dom said:

It's gonna hurt to acquire both but I think this is fair

 

To Van:

Lindholm (50% retained)

Tanev (50% retained)

 

To Cgy:

1st 2024

2nd 2025

Mikheyev

Raty

Woo

 

Flame away! 

I think, like when we acquired Zadorov, the return for rentals will be a LOT lower than fans are predicting. It's been the way it's worked for the past few years with a flat cap.

 

Don't be surprised if we move Myers for a cheaper cap hit as well as Kuzmenko in the next 10 days.

 

Kuzmenko and Myers to Chicago for exchange of picks, then Lindholm and Tanev from Calgary. 

 

Have seen some suggest getting Tom Wilson from Washington, but with his 7 year extension at 6.5 million, guys who play like him, usually don't have really long careers, his style of game really takes a toll on the body.

[Dom]

12 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

I think, like when we acquired Zadorov, the return for rentals will be a LOT lower than fans are predicting. It's been the way it's worked for the past few years with a flat cap.

 

Don't be surprised if we move Myers for a cheaper cap hit as well as Kuzmenko in the next 10 days.

 

Kuzmenko and Myers to Chicago for exchange of picks, then Lindholm and Tanev from Calgary. 

 

Have seen some suggest getting Tom Wilson from Washington, but with his 7 year extension at 6.5 million, guys who play like him, usually don't have really long careers, his style of game really takes a toll on the body.

You're probably right, and I hope you are. Hahaha. 

[Devron]

Would love Tanev anchoring the second or third pairings but he’s not worth a first at his age. Would be a great depth piece though. And he’s awesome person and always a Canuck imo 

[DownUndaCanuck]

4 hours ago, Devron said:

Would love Tanev anchoring the second or third pairings but he’s not worth a first at his age. Would be a great depth piece though. And he’s awesome person and always a Canuck imo 

 

I doubt Allvin parts with a 1st for Tanev, he'd surely much rather sign him in the off-season to replace one/both of Myers and Cole. I think he's happy with how his D looks right now and will spend that 1st on a center and circle back on Tanev in the off-season which makes perfect sense.

 

If we can get Tanev for a 2nd + prospect I'd do it because it'd be great to have some depth in the playoffs, pushing Soucy to essentially a 7th man and we could rotate him in and out of the lineup and manage the old guys (Cole, Myers, Tanev) better down the stretch, but a first is too rich for an 18 minute defenceman who's 33.

[NHL97OneTimer]

I hope this management is smarter than to trade our blue chips for what could be rentals.  This team will look quite different in the next few years and having these prospects will be critical........especially if we're paying EP the big dough.

[RockemSockem]

30 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

I hope this management is smarter than to trade our blue chips for what could be rentals.  This team will look quite different in the next few years and having these prospects will be critical........especially if we're paying EP the big dough.

Yeah I do agree with this.  Maybe go for a cheaper under the radar deadline trade.  In the offseason we can explore trades to free up cap and then possibly sign Tanev and Lindholm in free agency.

[VegasCanuck]

11 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

 

I doubt Allvin parts with a 1st for Tanev, he'd surely much rather sign him in the off-season to replace one/both of Myers and Cole. I think he's happy with how his D looks right now and will spend that 1st on a center and circle back on Tanev in the off-season which makes perfect sense.

 

If we can get Tanev for a 2nd + prospect I'd do it because it'd be great to have some depth in the playoffs, pushing Soucy to essentially a 7th man and we could rotate him in and out of the lineup and manage the old guys (Cole, Myers, Tanev) better down the stretch, but a first is too rich for an 18 minute defenceman who's 33.

My guess, based on other teams availability to acquire right now, Vancouver picks up Tanev for a 2nd round pick with 50% retained. Lindholm is having a bit of an off season, probably largely due to Calgary's overall performance. I think if we go this route, it's something like:

 

To Chicago:

Kuzmenko

2024 6th round pick

 

To Vancouver 2024 2nd round pick (probably ours back)

 2025 7th round pick

 

Frees up 5.5 million

 

To Calgary:

2024 1st round pick

2024 2nd round pick

2025 7th round pick (Conditional - pick becomes a 2026 2nd if Lindholm resigns in Vancouver, becomes a 2026 1st if Canucks win the cup this season and Lindholm is a major contributor)

Karlsson

Truscott (rights)

 

To Vancouver:

Lindholm 50% retained

Tanev 50% retained

 

Calgary then trades out Kadri (wants to leave if they are rebuilding), Hanifin, Markstrom (not convinced they can move him right now unless there's a team looking to make him their starter) and anything else not nailed down.

 

They take all the accumulated draft picks and make a call to Arizona about all the young talent that they have sitting in the cupboard that they aren't ready for until they get a new building nailed down or moved to a new city.

 

I think they will go hard and try and rebuild around Weegar and Huberdeau and hope that he can regain his playing form next year with an energized youth movement. Looking at Calgary, this last 2 lines is how I would attempt to reconstruct the team, they need a new identity.

[flat land fish]

Noting a few comments on the cheap rentals and I'm not sure around that.  Lots of teams still in the mix and the ones right out of it don't have alot to offer.

 

Teams are looking at core guys from teams that may not want to sell as the last few places in each conference are up for grabs although that could change by deadline day.

[HKSR]

On 1/29/2024 at 12:21 PM, VegasCanuck said:

I think, like when we acquired Zadorov, the return for rentals will be a LOT lower than fans are predicting. It's been the way it's worked for the past few years with a flat cap.

 

Don't be surprised if we move Myers for a cheaper cap hit as well as Kuzmenko in the next 10 days.

 

Kuzmenko and Myers to Chicago for exchange of picks, then Lindholm and Tanev from Calgary. 

 

Have seen some suggest getting Tom Wilson from Washington, but with his 7 year extension at 6.5 million, guys who play like him, usually don't have really long careers, his style of game really takes a toll on the body.

Yup, TDL rentals have not been that expensive the past few years.  Cap space is at a premium, so even though contenders want the boost for the playoffs, the cost/benefit analysis for them results in not wanting to pay an arm and a leg for a rental.

 

Some notable pending UFAs at last year's TDL (not all are rentals, but still shows how a pending UFA loses value):

 

Damon Severson went for a 3rd round pick -- we're talking a top 4 RHD here.

 

Max Domi and Dylan Wells for Anton Khudobin and a 2nd Round Pick -- Domi had 49 points in 60 games with CHI prior to this trade.

 

Tyler Bertuzzi for a 1st and 4th -- this was kind of a dumb move by Boston IMO.  Bertuzzi had 14 pts in 29 games with only 4 goals. 

 

Mikael Granlund for a 2nd

 

Patrick Kane for Vili Saarijarvi, Andy Welinski, 2nd and a 4th -- yup, that's it for Patrick Kane as a rental

 

This is why I think people are overvaluing how much guys like Lindholm and Monahan are gonna receive in return.  Probably could even say the same for Guentzel.  There's only so much cap space to go around, and contenders generally have so little to work with that they can't afford to even fit these guys under the cap limit without taking away from their current lineup.  If they have to take something significant out of their lineup, they're not gonna be willing to pay as much to acquire a net small upgrade.

 

 

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, HKSR said:

Yup, TDL rentals have not been that expensive the past few years.  Cap space is at a premium, so even though contenders want the boost for the playoffs, the cost/benefit analysis for them results in not wanting to pay an arm and a leg for a rental.

 

Some notable pending UFAs at last year's TDL (not all are rentals, but still shows how a pending UFA loses value):

 

Damon Severson went for a 3rd round pick -- we're talking a top 4 RHD here.

 

Max Domi and Dylan Wells for Anton Khudobin and a 2nd Round Pick -- Domi had 49 points in 60 games with CHI prior to this trade.

 

Tyler Bertuzzi for a 1st and 4th -- this was kind of a dumb move by Boston IMO.  Bertuzzi had 14 pts in 29 games with only 4 goals. 

 

Mikael Granlund for a 2nd

 

Patrick Kane for Vili Saarijarvi, Andy Welinski, 2nd and a 4th -- yup, that's it for Patrick Kane as a rental

 

This is why I think people are overvaluing how much guys like Lindholm and Monahan are gonna receive in return.  Probably could even say the same for Guentzel.  There's only so much cap space to go around, and contenders generally have so little to work with that they can't afford to even fit these guys under the cap limit without taking away from their current lineup.  If they have to take something significant out of their lineup, they're not gonna be willing to pay as much to acquire a net small upgrade.

 

 

 

I still remember packages on here like Hoglander and a 1st, to get...Zadorov... 

[HKSR]

19 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

I still remember packages on here like Hoglander and a 1st, to get...Zadorov... 

People are equating the value of these guys to players that have term remaining and are therefore cost and team controlled.  UFAs are very risky.  If they don't work out, you literally threw assets away and there's no time to work with the player to regain form.