Contract dilemma this summer

[Hero11]

Not so much a dilemma, more like an opportunity!

[coolboarder]

I honestly think that Myers' contract will be off the book to allow for Myers' money to be able to give some raise to Hronek, Joshua, , and Zakorov.  If Myers wants to stay here then he would have to take a pay cut.   If we want to keep our 3rd line for next season, it would also help for them to maintain the chemistry that will give opponents fits.  It is like Red Wings 3rd line consists of Maltby, Draper, Kocur that really helped them a lot more.  Without them, the Red Wings would not be elite but still a respectable playoff team.    If we could find a way to keep our 3rd line together for one more season, it will help he Canucks to find extra wins on games that they do not generally play well.   Our 3rd line is the key to where we are today.  We can afford to lose Cole because he is old but still serviceable and is replaceable.  That money would be used to help keep our players and I think that Zakorov thinks that this organization is the top notch and would want to stay here with a short-term contract.  for first time ever, I am more confident and more comfortable going into the off-season to entice a good players wanting to join the Canucks for short-term and cheap contract so that he could get a bigger payday with other teams 2-3 years down the road.  They would relish a chance to play with Hughes who will produce extra points and has reputation of tilting the ice in our favor.  We might not have to worry about bidding war on UFA this off-season.

[aGENT]

12 minutes ago, DeltaSwede said:

You'd expect one of Garland, Mikheyev and Kuzmenko to be traded in the off-season. Also think they have the depth to let the lower end UFAs go if they are asking for too much or they run out of room. We're actually in a great position to improve over the off-season with more shrewd moves from Allvin

 

[Miss Korea]

4 hours ago, Sativika said:

How so?!?!?!?? As in, they didn't expect to to be this good?

 

Yea. After this season and after how things looks in the playoffs, they'll make adjustments as needed. I'm confident that they'll keep it real.

Go Canucks Go!!!!!

 

4 hours ago, HKSR said:

Yup, in other words, let's see who performs in the playoffs. 

 

4 hours ago, IBatch said:

Yes.  And the post season matters.   Don't see why they should be in a rush.  

 

Front office vision went from "Who can play consistently enough to help us make the playoffs" to "Who can play consistently in the playoffs"

[Johnny]

7 hours ago, CanuckMan said:

No particular reason to be honest but be just seems the most expendable out of that group. Toch seems to like Joshua/Bluegar I think he’d hate to lose those 2 over Lafferty 

I agree,

lafferty is nothing special, he a good 4th liner

[Hammertime]

I don't think it's too bad. Some ballparks:

 

Pete will get around 12m my guess is mid term so he can re up!

Hronek 7.8m just a hair under Huggy?

Dakota 2.5? He maybe a offseason casualty

Myers 2m retirement contract. He's a leader in the room. We could do a lot worse than Myers for 2m.

Zadorov 4m x 4?

De Smith 3m x 2?

 

Walk: Lafferty, Blueger, Cole, 

 

Offseason/draft trade: Mikheyev - Pick or no money coming back deal. 

 

Call up: Pod, Bains, Raty? IMO Bains is the kind of playmaking puck hound that could ignite Kuzz, Pete's offense like Burr did with the Sedins. 

 

To Abby: Lekkerimaki, D Pete, Willander? We are going to need at least 1 of these guys to make the jump in 25/26

 

 

fits under the cap. 

 

I'm not sure how active PA will be at the DL I could see him making a move to rent a player like Tanev who would instantly mesh with our team. Or acquire a 3C on an efficient contract like Sissons. Both of these scenarios I think our 1st would have to be in play. 

 

 

[CRAZY_4_NAZZY]

The big assumption is that the team will replace some of those bodies from internal means.

 

I assume Podkolzin and Bains will be given every chance to fill those needs. The biggest worry is finding pieces for the blueline, because I don't see anyone on the farm that is suitably ready to replace the likes of Cole, Zadorov, and Myers.

[Dr. Crossbar]

14 hours ago, CanuckMan said:

Is anyone else concerned with the number of key UFA/RFA we have?

 

No, I'm not "concerned".

 

The only time I was really "concerned" was when management first came in and all their talking points were almost identical to Benning's - patience, drafting, reclamations, hidden gems, etc. I was pretty vocal about those concerns. 

 

But then management started to make  changes, smart changes, which dispelled/alleviated my concerns. That "concern" transformed into confidence based on results and the remarkable turnaround in such a short amount of time.

 

So, no, I'm not concerned. I'm confident management will continue to build upon this newly found winning culture and make the right decisions. They're committed to winning and figuring this out.

[DSVII]

5 hours ago, DeltaSwede said:

It fees good to say this, but I trust management completely that they will make the right decisions and negotiate good deals. If the UFAs are asking for too much I expect them to let them go and find fitting replacements in FA. Changes will come but it's nice to have a management group that is more than qualified to make them.  

 

 

It's great to just be able to relax and enjoy the product without worrying about the future. 

[Captkirk888]

6 hours ago, Alflives said:

Watching Podz this year developing in Abby and we can see he could play Joshua’s minutes 5 on 5. He’s a heavy player and is learning how to fight too. Bains looks good too, but not as heavy to play against. But both will likely be on the big club for our Cup run this spring and then full time next year. 

Unless there are injuries I don’t understand why people think Pods And Bain will be brought up for the playoff push or actual playoffs. No offence intended Alfie.

[Ghostsof1915]

5 hours ago, Captkirk888 said:

Unless there are injuries I don’t understand why people think Pods And Bain will be brought up for the playoff push or actual playoffs. No offence intended Alfie.

Depth?

[Captkirk888]

32 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Depth?

Yah, I guess we will need our Black Aces.

[IBatch]

16 hours ago, Johnny said:

I agree,

lafferty is nothing special, he a good 4th liner

Nothing special,  but is having a special season.  10/10 , 20 playing 12 minutes a night (yes some of that was with EP),  while being a responsible two-way guy...pretty great.   Wasn't long ago, that JB would overpay for guys like him.   And those guys, maybe had 10 whole goals on the entire season.   Unlike, say Pearson, he doesn't live in the top six either.    The TO game, the talking heads were grumbling over how well Lafferty is doing, compared to Bertuzzi lol.    Same production in their top six.    It won't be easy.   Especially given, we are going to have  to rely on AHL guys moving up.   Podz, Karlsson etc.   

[IBatch]

13 hours ago, Captkirk888 said:

Unless there are injuries I don’t understand why people think Pods And Bain will be brought up for the playoff push or actual playoffs. No offence intended Alfie.

Podz might get the extra man spot and come with the team.   Hard to say.   Alf is also looking into the empties, and pretty sure they say - deep run.   

[DownUndaCanuck]

Allvin has a lot of options and also the free agents list is fairly decent too. This off-season could go one of so many ways. The key is defence though. Petey and Hronek will get re-signed, no question about it, to fair deals. Probably 11M for Petey, 7.5M or so for Hronek (surely he can't make more than the captain which is a nice anchor). That's when things get interesting.

 

Up front we have so many short-term deals, kind of like "show-me" type deals and everyone on them has exceeded expectations. It's hard to say if it was the player or coaching or both. Guys like Joshua, Lafferty, Suter, Blueger etc. have all surpassed their cap hits. We might get lucky and re-sign a couple of them to similar deals without giving out too many raises but you know people will go fishing elsewhere and there'll be a market for these good middle-6 guys. Luckily we have plenty of help in the wings - Hoglander and Podkolzin for a start can certainly start moving up the ranks, taking more minutes and on dirt-cheap contracts so I'm not too worried there. Essentially a lot of those depth guys are replaceable in such a good coaching system.

 

My main concern is on defence. We've got Hughes, Hronek and Soucy who are all locks. I'd like to think we lock up Zadorov to a 3.5-4M contract longer-term and he can really be a solid, consistent number 4 guy for years to come (assuming Hughes is number 1, Hronek 2 and Soucy number 5). Then what do we do about number 3 and 6? Cole will be a year older and slower which is a worry. I'm sure we could tempt him back if we have success, keep him on a 2-3M deal, but I worry he'll be too old to log 20 minutes as a number 3 guy. Myers is dropping a 40pt season on us, 20+ minutes and a healthy +/- and I think the consensus is that he can get paid 4M elsewhere so will likely do that, so we need a number 6 guy. Internally we have some guys, Juulsen would fill the 6 role beautifully and very cheaply. 

 

This is where making a deal for a defenceman at the TDL can make some sense - if we get someone like Tanev he could easily fill a 18 minute role for us this and next year. We could just wait until free agency and make a splash but won't have too much cash for a big name. There's loads of other guys out there we won't be able to afford. I really wanted us to target someone like Hanifin or Marcus Pettersson in particular - very healthy low cap hit and can play that number 3 role as a shutdown LD to a tee.

 

Worst case scenario on defence - we lose Zadorov, Myers and Cole to free agency, Soucy is our number 3 guy, we get a crappy old depth guy and a bunch of AHLers to rock the bottom pairing. Doubt Allvin will let that happen. Best case scenario is that we keep Zadorov on our 2nd pairing, get Tanev or Cole to play around him and ideally one other guy somewhere to replace Myers, and leave Juulsen where he belongs as a 7th guy.

[aGENT]

3 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Allvin has a lot of options and also the free agents list is fairly decent too. This off-season could go one of so many ways. The key is defence though. Petey and Hronek will get re-signed, no question about it, to fair deals. Probably 11M for Petey, 7.5M or so for Hronek (surely he can't make more than the captain which is a nice anchor). That's when things get interesting.

 

Up front we have so many short-term deals, kind of like "show-me" type deals and everyone on them has exceeded expectations. It's hard to say if it was the player or coaching or both. Guys like Joshua, Lafferty, Suter, Blueger etc. have all surpassed their cap hits. We might get lucky and re-sign a couple of them to similar deals without giving out too many raises but you know people will go fishing elsewhere and there'll be a market for these good middle-6 guys. Luckily we have plenty of help in the wings - Hoglander and Podkolzin for a start can certainly start moving up the ranks, taking more minutes and on dirt-cheap contracts so I'm not too worried there. Essentially a lot of those depth guys are replaceable in such a good coaching system.

 

My main concern is on defence. We've got Hughes, Hronek and Soucy who are all locks. I'd like to think we lock up Zadorov to a 3.5-4M contract longer-term and he can really be a solid, consistent number 4 guy for years to come (assuming Hughes is number 1, Hronek 2 and Soucy number 5). Then what do we do about number 3 and 6? Cole will be a year older and slower which is a worry. I'm sure we could tempt him back if we have success, keep him on a 2-3M deal, but I worry he'll be too old to log 20 minutes as a number 3 guy. Myers is dropping a 40pt season on us, 20+ minutes and a healthy +/- and I think the consensus is that he can get paid 4M elsewhere so will likely do that, so we need a number 6 guy. Internally we have some guys, Juulsen would fill the 6 role beautifully and very cheaply. 

 

This is where making a deal for a defenceman at the TDL can make some sense - if we get someone like Tanev he could easily fill a 18 minute role for us this and next year. We could just wait until free agency and make a splash but won't have too much cash for a big name. There's loads of other guys out there we won't be able to afford. I really wanted us to target someone like Hanifin or Marcus Pettersson in particular - very healthy low cap hit and can play that number 3 role as a shutdown LD to a tee.

 

Worst case scenario on defence - we lose Zadorov, Myers and Cole to free agency, Soucy is our number 3 guy, we get a crappy old depth guy and a bunch of AHLers to rock the bottom pairing. Doubt Allvin will let that happen. Best case scenario is that we keep Zadorov on our 2nd pairing, get Tanev or Cole to play around him and ideally one other guy somewhere to replace Myers, and leave Juulsen where he belongs as a 7th guy.

 

If the dollars work after adding Tanev or similar, I'm not opposed to bringing Cole back for the right price as our #6.

 

Hughes, Hronek/Tanev

Zadorov/Soucy, Tanev/Hronek

Soucy/Zadorov, Cole

 

Friedman, Juulsen

[Johnny]

6 hours ago, IBatch said:

Nothing special,  but is having a special season.  10/10 , 20 playing 12 minutes a night (yes some of that was with EP),  while being a responsible two-way guy...pretty great.   Wasn't long ago, that JB would overpay for guys like him.   And those guys, maybe had 10 whole goals on the entire season.   Unlike, say Pearson, he doesn't live in the top six either.    The TO game, the talking heads were grumbling over how well Lafferty is doing, compared to Bertuzzi lol.    Same production in their top six.    It won't be easy.   Especially given, we are going to have  to rely on AHL guys moving up.   Podz, Karlsson etc.   

by nothing special I mean there are laffertys in our system

 

hes great but if we lose him he is replaceable 

 

the Bertuzzi thing is more how terrible his contract vs production is

[CanuckMan]

Petey/Hronek/Zadorav they need to sign for sure if they want this ship headed in the right direction.

 

I think they need to bring back Joshua and Bluegar for sure. It’s been a while since we had a productive/defensively responsible 3rd line. 

 

Myers/Cole - bring back one on a cheap contract 

 

*Desmith is most likely going to get over paid by a team hurting for goal tending

*Lafferty might be available for cheap again


 

[NorthWestNuck]

Re-sign Petey, Hronek, Joshua, Laff, Zads, and DeSmith. Let the rest walk. Between promoting, UFA hunting, I think we’ll be fine.

 

Hogz - Miller - Boeser

UFA - Petey - Podz

Joshua - Suter - Garland

Bains/UFA - Aman - Laff

Karlsson

 

Hughes - Hronek

Zad - UFA

Soucy - UFA

Juulson

 

Demko, DeSmith

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, NorthWestNuck said:

Re-sign Petey, Hronek, Joshua, Laff, Zads, and DeSmith. Let the rest walk. Between promoting, UFA hunting, I think we’ll be fine.

 

Hogz - Miller - Boeser

UFA - Petey - Podz

Joshua - Suter - Garland

Bains/UFA - Aman - Laff

Karlsson

 

Hughes - Hronek

Zad - UFA

Soucy - UFA

Juulson

 

Demko, DeSmith

We should definitely keep Big Z and DJ. They provide a physical presence and skill. 

[Jaimito]

Will depend on how they perform in playoffs. And also what changes are made by TDL.  

 

Too much what ifs at this point for me to get into it.  That's what sports talk shows are for I guess.  

[JamesB]

JR and PA have said that they would like to start with Petey. Obviously their ability to re-sign other players depends on whether Petey re-signs and, if he does, how much that number is. Hronek would come next.

 

The problem is that the Petey situation might not be resolved by the time free agency opens.  But at least the Canucks should have some idea by then of how much it would cost to re-sign him.

 

I think all the other potential free agents are on hold until Petey is willing to at least enter into a conversation unless someone is willing to re-sign for a team-friendly deal.

 

Personally, I do not think it is unreasonable for Petey to delay conversations until the Canuck season is over. But it is important to have serious discussions quickly after that. If not, the team might have to look at trading him. (The Tkachuk outcome would be better than the Gaudreau outcome.)

[JamesB]

 

A lot of people are saying "re-sign this guy and not that guy". But it all depends on what the player is willing to accept.

 

So, yeah, re-signing Joshua is a probably good idea at a cap hit of, say, 1.5 million, but would be a bad idea at a cap hit of $3 million. I am pretty sure that other teams will be willing to overpay Joshua. I think he has benefited a lot from playing with Garland and Blueger and that will raise his value in the market to a level the Canucks might not want to pay.  He is a valuable player, but winning is all about getting high value relative to a player's cap hit.

 

Same with Hronek. Playing with Hughes has elevated his value in the market. It might be that the best strategy for the Canucks to sell high on him in the off-season. But if he is willing to sign for a reasonable cap hit, great.

 

 

[Goose]

On 1/29/2024 at 8:58 AM, coolboarder said:

I honestly think that Myers' contract will be off the book to allow for Myers' money to be able to give some raise to Hronek, Joshua, , and Zakorov.  If Myers wants to stay here then he would have to take a pay cut.   If we want to keep our 3rd line for next season, it would also help for them to maintain the chemistry that will give opponents fits.  It is like Red Wings 3rd line consists of Maltby, Draper, Kocur that really helped them a lot more.  Without them, the Red Wings would not be elite but still a respectable playoff team.    If we could find a way to keep our 3rd line together for one more season, it will help he Canucks to find extra wins on games that they do not generally play well.   Our 3rd line is the key to where we are today.  We can afford to lose Cole because he is old but still serviceable and is replaceable.  That money would be used to help keep our players and I think that Zakorov thinks that this organization is the top notch and would want to stay here with a short-term contract.  for first time ever, I am more confident and more comfortable going into the off-season to entice a good players wanting to join the Canucks for short-term and cheap contract so that he could get a bigger payday with other teams 2-3 years down the road.  They would relish a chance to play with Hughes who will produce extra points and has reputation of tilting the ice in our favor.  We might not have to worry about bidding war on UFA this off-season.

 

As much as I like what Joshua has brought this season 5 on 5 and in the PK, I do believe that of the three the team could feasibly swap him out.  It will be interesting to see what happens w him (hoping he stays but Im guessing he will be offered a much bigger/longer contract by another team)

[Goose]

44 minutes ago, JamesB said:

Same with Hronek. Playing with Hughes has elevated his value in the market. It might be that the best strategy for the Canucks to sell high on him in the off-season. But if he is willing to sign for a reasonable cap hit, great.

 

 

 

I often wonder if Hronek demands a much higher contract than initially projected, whether he gets moved as well.  Tanev could definitely play w Hughes for 2-3 more years.  The other pairings have shown they can hold it down as well.