Devron Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 1 minute ago, German Canuck said: Spend the money for quality has nothing to do with Benning Ya Benning never spent money on quality. Just overpaid bottom 6 players 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryberg Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 12 minutes ago, GrammaInTheTub said: Zadorov’s year end presser was telling. Said he has another gear and thinks he can hit it consistently. He has been a very good 4-6 dman for awhile but believes in himself for more. It’s not unfair - I believe he has it too. It’s just too bad we couldn’t make the money work. Will be very interested to see what he gets. I suspect it will be a Gardiner type deal of $5.5-$5.75 at 5 years. Maybe Zadorov doesn't realize he is 29 and had 11 seasons to show that he is more than a 4/5 Dman. It's understandable that he would forget such a thing, there is a lot of posters with the same condition. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devron Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 I need a nap now maybe wake up to some good news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RupertKBD Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 Just now, Devron said: I need a nap now maybe wake up to some good news. Yeah, I know what you mean. Biden shit the bed in the debate last night and now this.....these things usually happen in threes, so I'm fully expecting Canada to lose to Chile tomorrow in Soccer..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Lamora Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 14 minutes ago, HKSR said: Yup... Zadorov's 6th NHL team in 11 years. If he was that irreplaceable, I question why he's played on that many teams in that period of time. There indeed be something to this. I said it in a previous post, but Allvin sure suggested that the coaching staff were lobbying hard for bringing Myers back, perhaps not so much for Big Z. I have a hard time not believing that if Tocchet was pounding the table hard for Big Z to JR/PA, he’d be signed with us. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devron Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 1 minute ago, RupertKBD said: Yeah, I know what you mean. Biden shit the bed in the debate last night and now this.....these things usually happen in threes, so I'm fully expecting Canada to lose to Chile tomorrow in Soccer..... At least we got Hronek locked up. Lots of people wanted him gone too so win some lose some 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 7 minutes ago, Coconuts said: Zadorov doesn't have a track record of being a top 4D on teams with a strong defense, the numbers don't bear that out. His ice time throughout his tenure in Calgary, who had a superior D at the time, indicated he was a 5. 21-22, Zadorov ranked 6th in ATOI for Calgary D regulars behind Andersson, Hanifin, Tanev, Kylington, Gudbranson, and Stone. Averaged 16:55. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CGY/2022.html 22-23, he ranked 5th behind Andersson, Hanifin, Tanev, and Weegar. Averaged 18:41. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CGY/2023.html Even this past season he ranked 5th in ATOI for Calgary D regulars behind Andersson, Hanifin, Tanev, and Weegar. Averaged 18:24. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CGY/ Zadorov topped out as having the 3rd highest ATOI amongst D regulars on a lousy Blackhawks team behind Keith and Murphy. Averaged 19:12. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CHI/2021.html Go back to 19-20 with the Avs and he ranked 5th in ATOI amongst D regulars behind Girard, Johnson, Makar, and Graves. And even then, he only beat out the 6th ranked guy in coal by 4 seconds. Zadorov averaged 17:46 while Cole averaged 17:42. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/COL/2020.html Shhhh... people won't be able to see past the hits and "wah wah" faces that Big Z makes. They will point to how he played bigger minutes and a larger role in the playoffs. I would counter with the historical facts that you've presented, and the fact he will be playing for his 6th NHL team in 11 years. If he was truly the irreplaceable and top end defenceman that some are making him out to be, then he wouldn't have been tossed around as much as he has. Some might argue that he will still improve from here and point to Chara as an example. I challenge you to find another solid example other than from a hall of fame candidate. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wai_lai416 Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 20 minutes ago, CanucksJay said: Myers Soucy pairing is a solid pairing and we know that works. That's a 6.25m pairing which can either be the best 3rd pairing in the league or an adequate 2nd pairing. We also know Hughes and Hronek works. That is our bonafide top pairing. That leaves Z who we really like but at 5m+, who would he play with? It's a tricky puzzle and the amount he commands would mean very little money left to sign our remaining D to fill out our starting D roster. Like let's think about this... Hronek signed for 7.5m Z is looking for 5.5+ Z is basically a more physical version of Myers (the way he thinks and reads plays) and Myers signed for 3m 4.5 is the max he should really get. of myers and soucy is your 3rd pairing defenceman making 6.25mil that's horrible way of spending your cap.. most teams are in the 2mil-3mil range total for 3rd pairing defenceman and we are paying more than double that. what teams out there are even remotely close to paying more than 4mil for 3rd pairings? i'm not counting those on massive contract that have declined.. i'm counting those that are currently playing at their market rate. how many teams made the final in the last decade with a 3rd pairing that's paid that much? i don't think there is a single team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 4 minutes ago, RupertKBD said: Yeah, I know what you mean. Biden shit the bed in the debate last night and now this.....these things usually happen in threes, so I'm fully expecting Canada to lose to Chile tomorrow in Soccer..... More like Biden shit himself again. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviewonder20 Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 I’m really disappointed and a bit surprised, as Milstein’s comment about patience suggested to me that a deal was done for Zads and they were just waiting for Mik to be traded to open cap space. However, we have a hall of famer in JR, a runner-up GM of the year in PA, and a coach of the year in Tocchet constructing our team. We are in good hands and they are clearly better at this than any of us armchair warriors. I look forward to seeing what they can create. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemon Face Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 9 minutes ago, Devron said: I need a nap now maybe wake up to some good news. Take something for longer nap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrammaInTheTub Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 9 minutes ago, Coryberg said: Maybe Zadorov doesn't realize he is 29 and had 11 seasons to show that he is more than a 4/5 Dman. It's understandable that he would forget such a thing, there is a lot of posters with the same condition. Agreed in part. Some guys take a little longer to put it all together and he might be one of those guys. I’m not saying he’s Chara. He’s in an interesting spot because people will be paying for potential regardless of where he ends up; it’s fair to say he’s different from players on the downturn of their career based on what we saw with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolexSub Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 13 minutes ago, German Canuck said: Spend the money for quality has nothing to do with Benning Benning was dishing out big contracts and the players did not meet their expectations. I am ok paying the big price but I don't see how Guentzel is worth over $11M per year!! That is all I am saying and you are telling me I won't be a successful GM. You can't be over paying every player that has hit 40 goals 2x's in their 9yr career. That is all I am saying. There are alternatives that comes at a lower price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 1 minute ago, HKSR said: Shhhh... people won't be able to see past the hits and "wah wah" faces that Big Z makes. They will point to how he played bigger minutes and a larger role in the playoffs. I would counter with the historical facts that you've presented, and the fact he will be playing for his 6th NHL team in 11 years. If he was truly the irreplaceable and top end defenceman that some are making him out to be, then he wouldn't have been tossed around as much as he has. Some might argue that he will still improve from here and point to Chara as an example. I challenge you to find another solid example other than from a hall of fame candidate. Yup. The numbers are there for anyone to see, I went and got em. I corrected my mistake about the 21-22 Flames too. I said Zadorov ranked 6th, which he did, but left Stone's name up there too. Technically he ranked 7th, Zadorov Averaged 16:55 but Stone actually averaged more time on ice than Zadorov did with 17:27, but he only played 11 games. Amongst regulars he was 6th. Cherry on top, our own stats from this past season. Zadorov averaged 17:04, which places him as 6th in averge ATOI for D regulars behind Hughes, Hronek, Myers, Soucy, and Cole. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/VAN/2024.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 1 minute ago, Coconuts said: Yup. The numbers are there for anyone to see, I went and got em. I corrected my mistake about the 21-22 Flames too. I said Zadorov ranked 6th, which he did, but left Stone's name up there too. Technically he ranked 7th, Zadorov Averaged 16:55 but Stone actually averaged more time on ice than Zadorov did with 17:27, but he only played 11 games. Amongst regulars he was 6th. Cherry on top, our own stats from this past season. Zadorov averaged 17:04, which places him as 6th in averge ATOI for D regulars behind Hughes, Hronek, Myers, Soucy, and Cole. https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/VAN/2024.html So.... regular Top 4 defenceman then? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 I want Theodore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 1 minute ago, Odd. said: I want Theodore Fine. Here you go. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolexSub Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 (edited) I like how this thread has almost 3000 post with over 76,000 views just tells you how important signing Big Z to a new contract was to the Canucks Fans!!! The 3rd most viewed and comments on this Forum besides the Petey contract talks. Edited June 28 by RolexSub 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Lamora Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 I’ll say this….I’ll REALLY miss having a nuclear deterrent on our roster. I do wonder how we might attempt to address this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maninthebox Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 Are we already in the 'jilted ex lover phase' with Zadorov? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g_bassi13 Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 Super happy he didn't sign, based on the prices being thrown out there. I don't envy the team that will have to deal with the 6 X 6 he's asking for. I like the guy and his personality, but we shouldn't be paying him like a top 2 defenseman. He was unreal at taking a forward in a 1 on 1 situation, he throws big hits, and his size is helpful on the backend, but at no point in his career has he ever been "the guy" and we shouldn't pay him like he is. He's played for over a decade, and is bouncing around the league for a reason. There's bigger priorities out there. You dont win championships by handcuffing your team to its #4/5 defenseman. I can appreciate that Allvin judged his value, and went out of his way to say he won't "overpay" for him in that press response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slegr Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 2 minutes ago, Maninthebox said: Are we already in the 'jilted ex lover phase' with Zadorov? Yes… him and Tryamkin can screw off. … I didn’t mean that - please take us back! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Lamora Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 1 minute ago, Maninthebox said: Are we already in the 'jilted ex lover phase' with Zadorov? Can’t speak for others, but I hold no hard feelings for the big guy. Sounds very much like a business decision for Big Z, and that is completely his right. The number he signs for will be interesting and I suspect it will be an amount that will raise some eyebrows….and lend some perspective as to why we didn’t sign him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Crossbar Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 29 minutes ago, HKSR said: Shhhh... people won't be able to see past the hits and "wah wah" faces that Big Z makes. They will point to how he played bigger minutes and a larger role in the playoffs. I would counter with the historical facts that you've presented, and the fact he will be playing for his 6th NHL team in 11 years. If he was truly the irreplaceable and top end defenceman that some are making him out to be, then he wouldn't have been tossed around as much as he has. Some might argue that he will still improve from here and point to Chara as an example. I challenge you to find another solid example other than from a hall of fame candidate. Part of problem was people saying over and over that Zad was a Top 4 dman and even suggesting he was more important than a first pairing dman. Obviously their emotions were getting the better of them. @Coconutsgreat post detailing Zad's history tells the accurate tale. Absolutely love Zad and hate to see him go but $4.5 to $5 was fair given his history. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highstickin Posted June 28 Share Posted June 28 Would love to have Z back on the team but it cannot be at the expense of the bigger picture. Who knows, maybe he gets out into the market and finds out all the others teams don't value him the way he and his agent do either. Just because he gets to the market doesn't mean he won't circle back to the canucks. In the end, I'm just happy we have a leadership team that can accurately assess talent, create a plan and stick to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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