IBatch Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 (edited) 8 hours ago, Curmudgeon said: I am both saddened and angered over the tragic story of Chris Simon. Saddened that the injuries he absorbed from countless heavy blows to the head so horribly affected his mental and physical health and angered that the NHL seems steadfast in denying any link between CTE and hockey fights. It is nothing more than wilful ignorance and fear of the deluge of lawsuits the league will be hit with if they ever admit that getting hit repeatedly in the head isn't good for someone's longterm health. This quote made me retch: [Frank Seravalli] Asked Bill Daly whether the NHL’s viewpoint has changed with additional medical studies that show a definitive link between CTE and repeated blows to the head. “No,” Daly said. “I think the science is still lacking.” Here is what Simon was battling: Time for the league to 1) Pay up, and 2) ban fisticuffs once and for all. They did a piss poor job of protecting the players pre-lockout. It was "play the game and get paid". Parros, part of the final group of guys who did this job, with a degree from Princeton, made the choice to play the sport and knowing the risks, purely as a financial decision. Ciccone, who had a bit more then a cup of coffee, wasn't educated, but also said "what else am I going to do? Go make 12$ an hour at the mill?". Basically said the same thing. Reality is most gen x'ers would have given their right nut to even have a short career in the NHL. And the fringe guys, who were willing and able, could literally fight their way into the league. There is way too much evidence saying that role went way too far. As for fighting, it has organically reduced to less then original six levels. 12 fights for the Canucks ... as a team. Gino and 20 or so other guys, often had that many on their own by the New Year. The NHLPA needs a better program for these guys. And the NHL needs to buck up now and make sure there isn't anyone else out there, right now, that is struggling post career in that 45-55 age group, that did the same job Simon, Rypien, Boogard, Belak, Probert. Even guys like Montador, who fought 60 times. One way they could mitigate, and avoid a future arms race, is impose a limit on how many a player is allowed to fight. 10 seems reasonable, start giving suspension's at 8, get to 10, out for the year, maybe with 50/50 earnings some to pocket, the rest to emergency fund for the players, unless that player responds to an instigator, those don't count. That way guys will never be able to literally fight their way in anymore. And guys that are willing are want to do this, are kept in check for their own safety. Personally think it's all but gone as is. It's been removed from the younger levels. If you go back and look at the league leaders for fights during the original six, sometimes it was a single digit..:15 was a lot. Edited March 21 by IBatch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 2 hours ago, IBatch said: They did a piss poor job of protecting the players pre-lockout. It was "play the game and get paid". Parros, part of the final group of guys who did this job, with a degree from Princeton, made the choice to play the sport and knowing the risks, purely as a financial decision. Ciccone, who had a bit more then a cup of coffee, wasn't educated, but also said "what else am I going to do? Go make 12$ an hour at the mill?". Basically said the same thing. Reality is most gen x'ers would have given their right nut to even have a short career in the NHL. And the fringe guys, who were willing and able, could literally fight their way into the league. There is way too much evidence saying that role went way too far. As for fighting, it has organically reduced to less then original six levels. 12 fights for the Canucks ... as a team. Gino and 20 or so other guys, often had that many on their own by the New Year. The NHLPA needs a better program for these guys. And the NHL needs to buck up now and make sure there isn't anyone else out there, right now, that is struggling post career in that 45-55 age group, that did the same job Simon, Rypien, Boogard, Belak, Probert. Even guys like Montador, who fought 60 times. One way they could mitigate, and avoid a future arms race, is impose a limit on how many a player is allowed to fight. 10 seems reasonable, start giving suspension's at 8, get to 10, out for the year, maybe with 50/50 earnings some to pocket, the rest to emergency fund for the players, unless that player responds to an instigator, those don't count. That way guys will never be able to literally fight their way in anymore. And guys that are willing are want to do this, are kept in check for their own safety. Personally think it's all but gone as is. It's been removed from the younger levels. If you go back and look at the league leaders for fights during the original six, sometimes it was a single digit..:15 was a lot. There is a lot of talk about what the enforcer roll has dished out to so many who have suffered physical injury and even premature death. It should not be forgotten that hockey also provided a more structured opportunity than many would have had otherwise. Many were able to take advantage and have had good careers and lives. I don’t know why but Wendell Clark comes to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 RIP Chris. One of the toughest players of his era. He was a part of the Lindros trade and went to Quebec. I remember watching him when he played in Colorado. Won the cup with them. I think he was the toughest guy in the league in 1996. Only guy I know who beat up Tie Domi not once but twice. And also beat up Bob Probert. I would say Chris was one of the top 5 toughest guys in NHL history for sure. Was a lefty too like Brashear... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockeyville88 Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 CTE is one of those silent killers that you have to look out for even decades after the trauma occurred. RIP and hope the NHL can do better to prevent these types of injuries Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 On 3/20/2024 at 6:26 PM, Curmudgeon said: I am both saddened and angered over the tragic story of Chris Simon. Saddened that the injuries he absorbed from countless heavy blows to the head so horribly affected his mental and physical health and angered that the NHL seems steadfast in denying any link between CTE and hockey fights. It is nothing more than wilful ignorance and fear of the deluge of lawsuits the league will be hit with if they ever admit that getting hit repeatedly in the head isn't good for someone's longterm health. This quote made me retch: [Frank Seravalli] Asked Bill Daly whether the NHL’s viewpoint has changed with additional medical studies that show a definitive link between CTE and repeated blows to the head. “No,” Daly said. “I think the science is still lacking.” Here is what Simon was battling: Time for the league to 1) Pay up, and 2) ban fisticuffs once and for all. I never really understood lawsuits like that. They knew what hockey is and the risks involved and took that risk willingly. You can't just say, retroactively, the NHL is at fault for me taking those risks........especially from an era where medical science didn't even understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 (edited) 4 hours ago, stawns said: I never really understood lawsuits like that. They knew what hockey is and the risks involved and took that risk willingly. You can't just say, retroactively, the NHL is at fault for me taking those risks........especially from an era where medical science didn't even understand. It’s similar to smoking. The government allowed cigarette companies to promote their ads and said nothing of the health risks involved. They had to change course eventually when people started dying from smoking. Same with fighting. The NHL keeps denying that CTE is a result of punches to the head, so the players are still allowed to fight. At some point, when there are enough deceased players from CTE, the NHL will change its tune. I doubt that happens anytime soon, but just like smoking it will happen eventually… Edited March 22 by Elias Pettersson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 (edited) 5 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: It’s similar to smoking. The government allowed cigarette companies to promote their ads and said nothing of the health risks involved. They had to change course eventually when people started dying from smoking. Same with fighting. The NHL keeps denying that CTE is a result of punches to the head, so the players are still allowed to fight. At some point, when there are enough deceased players from CTE, the NHL will change its tune. I doubt that happens anytime soon, but just like smoking it will happen eventually… Except no one knew the true impact concussions could have, doctors and medical science included........they've always known smoking was bad and intentionally hid it, so it's not the same. I'm easily into double digit concussions in my life and back then docs would just say you got your bell rung and make sure you wake up every couple of hours every night. I knew hockey was risky, I knew the role I took on was risky and I took that risk willingly, so did these guys. You can't retroactively say the NHL should have known better when medical science didnt know at the time. Edited March 22 by stawns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BabychStache Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 I’m about to turn 40 with 5 major concussions in my past. The last one at 35 which required serious medical assistance. CTE plays a role in my own mental health and depression issues, but I’ve found that purpose everyday helps me the most. I suspect a lot of these guy lose identity after the game. Getting lost and not having a role anymore. The NHL really should get every vet back involved in the game after retirement. Mandatory coaching training to be eligible for a pension. Something like that. Lack of purpose, leads to isolation, which leads to depression, then substances, then the inevitable. just a personal anecdote and perspective. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erkayloomeh Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 On 3/20/2024 at 4:54 AM, Alflives said: It’s so stupid the NHL allows (encourages really) bare knuckle fighting. Makes me wonder about MMA. That seems like a much worse sport in that regard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan since 82 Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 On 3/19/2024 at 10:48 PM, Alflives said: It’s a tough job being an enforcer. So sad that so many seem to struggle with their personal demons and die (tragically) way too young. Well sometimes their "demons" are the result of repeated head injuries that go untreated. They catch up with you eventually and some have dramatic personality changes as a result. Very sad... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 1 minute ago, Fan since 82 said: Well sometimes their "demons" are the result of repeated head injuries that go untreated. They catch up with you eventually and some have dramatic personality changes as a result. Very sad... Plus, it’s very rare that a guy enjoys the constant fighting. Broken hands, getting punched in the face, and knowing it’s coming each game would be difficult. But the big NHL paycheque is a big pull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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