[Article] Rutherford: Canucks almost 'out of some contracts we'd prefer not to have'

[Johnny]

Anyone bashing rutherford for being too ruthless or creating a toxic room

 

there is a difference between a contract and a player. The players paterson mentioned all have a value, but the price of their contracts are higher than their value. 

[Bob Long]

8 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Begs the question... What's he been waiting for?

 

Get lighter, get some extra skating training. Been saying it for years.

 

I think his family situation was pretty rough for him. 

[Diamonds]

It's nice of Rutherford to give Benning some benefit of the doubt by saying he would have made some similar moves in a non flat cap world, and maybe that applies to Myers, but most of the "anchors" were introduced when already in a flat cap world. The OEL and Garland trade, Pearson re-signing, and Poolman signing were all done in 2021 when it was known there would be a flat cap.

[JeremyCuddles]

29 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Begs the question... What's he been waiting for?

 

Get lighter, get some extra skating training. Been saying it for years.

I think he bulked up to try evolve his game, then last year kind of lost his father at a young age. But yeah, what a dumbass.

[Dr. Crossbar]

Absolutely nothing wrong with what Rutherford said. Nothing. 

[Outsiders]

11 hours ago, Canuck You said:

 

 

 The problem is that you only think about trade value or how much a player sucks, I think more about the morale of the team, the culture and a players mental health. Also shows how much you care about your players and trying to attract future talent.

 

If I worked for a company that held 10 employees in which 8 were on 2 year contracts and me and another guy were on 1 yr and the boss basically flat out told everyone how he can't wait to get those 1 year contracts over with, How do you think I would feel? Lucky if the company got 10 percent out of me let alone 20, Extra long breaks, lazy and late..yeah eff you too.

 

It's about professionalism and creating a good environment , Not throwing your employees under the bus and stirring the pot making things worse and telling this sh!tty media about things we already know.

 

These are professional athletes making millions of dollars a season to play the game they love. They are already babied enough and have their ass kissed.  We all saw what happened when the players weren't held accountable. Now there is a standard and expectations, look how they have responded.

 

Nothing wrong with calling it like it is. We have to stop living in some dream world, tough love is what we need. We haven't made the playoffs in a decade. 

 

Rutherford didn't single anybody out and also said he didn't blame Benning for the moves as the cap was expected to rise. If they cap had gone up we wouldn't be in this mess or have it impacting us as much.

 

Finally, our "culture" and morale around the team has improved drastically under this management team than the previous one. The message is clear from the top to the bottom. Players aren't wondering where they stand as the message is clear. Their minds are probably at ease as they aren't in the dark like before 

 

 

[Dr. Crossbar]

22 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

These are professional athletes making millions of dollars a season to play the game they love. They are already babied enough and have their ass kissed.  We all saw what happened when the players weren't held accountable. Now there is a standard and expectations, look how they have responded.

 

Nothing wrong with calling it like it is. We have to stop living in some dream world, tough love is what we need. We haven't made the playoffs in a decade. 

 

Rutherford didn't single anybody out and also said he didn't blame Benning for the moves as the cap was expected to rise. If they cap had gone up we wouldn't be in this mess or have it impacting us as much.

 

Finally, our "culture" and morale around the team has improved drastically under this management team than the previous one. The message is clear from the top to the bottom. Players aren't wondering where they stand as the message is clear. Their minds are probably at ease as they aren't in the dark like before 

 

 

 

Excellent post! Nailed it! We've needed tough love, accountability, and raised standards for a long time. I appreciate Rutherford telling it like it is. 

 

Also, it's important to point out that the players themselves know when their contract is bad for the team. Myers agent said as much in a recent interview. 

[Truefan99]

Garland will be waived and hopefully gets picked up by someone

[kilgore]

Paterson is the worst at sh*t disturbing. 

 

The whole sentence he quoted at the top is:

"That's going to change next year and also we're going to be at the point where we're out of some contracts that we'd prefer not to have."

 

He may have only been saying by next year we'd be naturally out of Poolman's and Myer's contracts.  Its just JR's awkwardness with his wording sometimes. I highly doubt he was saying in public that the team would prefer not to have Garland or Boeser or even Myers, on the team as of this moment. Players that could, and most of them will, most likely play for the team this season.  He may think it, but I'm sure he wasn't trying to put that out there.  Paterson is the kind of writer that will pounce on any faux pas and twist it into a controversy.

 

 

[Coconuts]

I mean, it's no secret that we have some contracts we could probably do without. 

[aGENT]

3 hours ago, JeremyCuddles said:

I think he bulked up to try evolve his game, then last year kind of lost his father at a young age. But yeah, what a dumbass.

 

4 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

I think his family situation was pretty rough for him. 

 

This isn't just about last year... We all know why the last couple years have been rough, I'm talking about the 5 seasons before that. 

[tas]

4 hours ago, Johnny said:

Anyone bashing rutherford for being too ruthless or creating a toxic room

 

there is a difference between a contract and a player. The players paterson mentioned all have a value, but the price of their contracts are higher than their value. 

 

sure, so when your employer fires you because he likes you, just not enough to pay you what you're earning, you're cool with that?  no hard feelings? all part of the business?

[JeremyCuddles]

30 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

 

This isn't just about last year... We all know why the last couple years have been rough, I'm talking about the 5 seasons before that. 

His first 2 years he had 25+ goals and the last two years had family troubles. For a guy with 6 full seasons that really only leaves 2 really poor seasons for Boeser. Both of those seasons he also played fewer than 60 games. I truly think injuries had him spooked into getting bigger, and that hurt his conditioning. He also said with Miller's addition he wanted to be more active on the forechecks. Helps when you can out muscle folks along the boards. I also think we just assume getting faster is easy. Like anyone can do it. I can't think of many players that just instantly became faster. Horvat was one and even he's not exactly a speed demon, but we forget the dozens upon dozens of players that struggled with their skating and never improved. Can't assume all of them just didn't care or didn't try.

 

Boeser is one of the only players to really adapt his game, the only part that hasn't taken major strides was his skating. But he went from a one way scorer to a more all around player. His forechecking, his willingness to be infront of the net, his playmaking. All improved. He isn't this guy that doesn't or didn't care to improve. He went into the shop this offseason to work on his skating. And if it improved like the other areas of his game, we should be happy instead of roasting the guy like he didn't do anything the last 6 years.

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, JeremyCuddles said:

His first 2 years he had 25+ goals and the last two years had family troubles. For a guy with 6 full seasons that really only leaves 2 really poor seasons for Boeser. Both of those seasons he also played fewer than 60 games. I truly think injuries had him spooked into getting bigger, and that hurt his conditioning. He also said with Miller's addition he wanted to be more active on the forechecks. Helps when you can out muscle folks along the boards. I also think we just assume getting faster is easy. Like anyone can do it. I can't think of many players that just instantly became faster. Horvat was one and even he's not exactly a speed demon, but we forget the dozens upon dozens of players that struggled with their skating and never improved. Can't assume all of them just didn't care or didn't try.

 

Boeser is one of the only players to really adapt his game, the only part that hasn't taken major strides was his skating. But he went from a one way scorer to a more all around player. His forechecking, his willingness to be infront of the net, his playmaking. All improved. He isn't this guy that doesn't or didn't care to improve. He went into the shop this offseason to work on his skating. And if it improved like the other areas of his game, we should be happy instead of roasting the guy like he didn't do anything the last 6 years.

 

 

I'm not one of the people that bashes Boeser FYI. Perfectly happy to have him on the team moving forward. And I get why the last couple years have been rough (and I don't really need a history lesson, and am happy he's rounded out his game). But I've literally been saying for years that he needs to slim down and focus on his legs/skating and core if he wants to improve (and nobody said it was easy). Even when he was scoring 25+ goals.

 

If it's been blatantly obvious to some idiot on a forum (me) for years now, how did he, any number of coaches, trainers/medical, management, teammates, agents, advisors etc not get this across to him until now? It's baffling and more an indictment of the organization than Boeser. I also never said he didn't do anything for 6 years, I'd appreciate you not trying to put words in my mouth.

 

 

[Eddie]

From the perspective of: 'If you're continually not performing to your contract we will be happy when we get rid of you'  perspective, I don't see anything wrong with the statement. Myers has mostly played up to the best of his ability, it's just that ability is worth at most 50% of his contract - and should be happy to play for another lower contract in the knowledge he's bank a good 20+ Mil he really was never worth.   Boeser is capable of living up to his contract, but he just hasn't for a very long time - same with Garland - Its in their hands to prove they are worth it now and should really bloody try. But, 

 

and here's the thing . . . Old grandpa Jim there kinda did himself a huge disservice with the Bruce treatment last year - you knew from square one he wasn't gonna back the coach and even if Bruce had got us into the playoffs you just knew he was on his way out... it was textbook lame duck coach. So if that had permuated the organization then these players may well just thing they can't win no matter no, so won't even try - it's a very modern attitude after all. 

 

Ultimately i really would prefer that J.R keeps these kinds of public observations to himself - as while this occurrence isn't completely egregious, it's dating him, and ultimately he might end up the way of old Bab's there if he ain't careful.  
 

[Johnny]

1 hour ago, tas said:

 

sure, so when your employer fires you because he likes you, just not enough to pay you what you're earning, you're cool with that?  no hard feelings? all part of the business?

not even close to being the same

 

try again

[tas]

1 minute ago, Johnny said:

not even close to being the same

 

try again

how isn't it? it's being told, and in myers's and garland's case even worse than my hypothetical because it's publicly, that you aren't worth what you're being paid. that you aren't valued enough to be kept. 

[Johnny]

2 minutes ago, tas said:

how isn't it? it's being told, and in myers's and garland's case even worse than my hypothetical because it's publicly, that you aren't worth what you're being paid. that you aren't valued enough to be kept. 

They still get paid

 

Rutherford didnt mention names, paterson assumed

 

read the article again

 

[Ballisticsports]

6 minutes ago, tas said:

how isn't it? it's being told, and in myers's and garland's case even worse than my hypothetical because it's publicly, that you aren't worth what you're being paid. that you aren't valued enough to be kept. 

A player should know if he is pulling his end of the bargain for what he is being paid (without wondering if the boss is talking about him)

Shot fired across the bow, everyone is accountable to themselves and the team

How many of these overpaid players ever come back saying I was overpaid for 3 years, let's underpay me for 3 years to even it out in pay and I will play my heart out?

[Nucker67]

4 hours ago, Dr. Crossbar said:

Absolutely nothing wrong with what Rutherford said. Nothing. 

I agree, but got to admit, I started to cringe a bit when he started discussing DeSmith's charges. Thinking "Shut up Jim, just stop talking!"  Thankfully he ddn't say more than he did. 

[The Duke]

20 hours ago, PureQuickness said:

This year will be a big test for JR/Allvin. We've heard all the excuses they made, some of which they inflicted on themselves (i.e. cap issues). So far, they've paid it through draft picks, something very reminiscent of the previous regime. In short, it's hypocritical.

 

We have to see how this team fares this year because I'm honestly tired of the excuses from management. In my mind, this management has it a lot better than whatever Benning was left with from Gillis.

I actually agree with this.  It wasn’t perfect by any stretch, but they inherited Petey, Bo, Miller, Hughes and Demko.  A bunch of middle 6-ish wingers. The only true long term albatross contract was OEL.  
 

Everything else was up in a relatively short period of time and at least were serviceable NHL players.  
 

They could have easily done a more aggressive retool by doing some combination of moving Miller AND Bo, not re-signing (or trading) Boeser and not signing Mikheyev or trading for Hronek.  There’s at least another 2 1sts to be had and another strong prospect on top of Raty if they take his route.  
 

They’d then have cap room / draft capital to chase or trade for a younger 2C than Miller.

 

That said, you have to like what they’ve done this offseason - and if Petey was truly not going to re-sign then that would have meant full tear down - which some would love, but would spell 5 years more of no chance of making playoffs.

 

In any case they certainly had the opportunity to take another step or two back to really reset - but chose to keep pushing just like Benning (albeit with what appears to be much better pro scouting and contract work.)

[The Duke]

Back to Rutherford’s comments, he reminds me of my dad.  He’s not wrong but he’s also no politician.  Some people get really irked by the lack of decorum.  I don’t mind stuff like this, but didn’t love his undermining Boudreau even before they hung him out to dry.

Edited September 21, 2023 by The Duke

[Dr. Crossbar]

3 minutes ago, Nucker67 said:

I agree, but got to admit, I started to cringe a bit when he started discussing DeSmith's charges. Thinking "Shut up Jim, just stop talking!"  Thankfully he ddn't say more than he did. 

 

Yeah, he was careful and smart about that ... and the Babcock question. 

[tas]

19 minutes ago, Johnny said:

They still get paid

 

Rutherford didnt mention names, paterson assumed

 

read the article again

 

 

as I've said before, rutherford didn't need to say the names. every single person has known who he's talking about for months. confirming it is a poor decision. 

[tas]

15 minutes ago, Ballisticsports said:

A player should know if he is pulling his end of the bargain for what he is being paid (without wondering if the boss is talking about him)

Shot fired across the bow, everyone is accountable to themselves and the team

How many of these overpaid players ever come back saying I was overpaid for 3 years, let's underpay me for 3 years to even it out in pay and I will play my heart out?

that's what his exit meeting 5 months ago was for.