Offseason Planning - regardless of outcome

[Diamonds]

If we're talking ideal off-seasons, this is what I would personally do.

 

Signing UFAs

Matt Roy - $5.5Mx5

Dylan DeMelo - $4.5Mx3

 

Trades

Hronek for Necas or Crouse

Dump Mikheyev (either in Hronek trade or however possible)

 

Re-Signings

Silovs - $1Mx2

Zadorov - $4.75Mx5

Blueger - $2.25Mx3

Necas (if rights acquired) - $6.5Mx6

Joshua or Lindholm (pick one)

 

New roster with $6M cap space to insert Joshua or Lindholm:

Slide Blueger down to 4C if re-signing Lindholm, slide Podkolzin, Hoglander, or Suter down if re-signing Joshua.

 

Our defense sacrifices a little bit of offense swapping Hronek and Myers for Roy and DeMelo but becomes better defensively and harder to play against. We also sacrifice some bottom six depth to give Petey a true top 6 winger to play with. We've seen Blueger can hold down 3C if we don't re-sign Lindholm and Podkolzin should hopefully fill Joshua's role if we pick Lindholm instead so while the bottom six takes a small hit, it shouldn't be a very big one.

 

 

I'm very interested to see what PA/JR end up doing.

[HarbularyBattery]

30 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

The thing about Z is you can't teach size, yes he'll be overpaid but if we don't, Trotz will.

 

yeah i think ultimately its gonna come down to coaching staffs assessment of our roster construction

 

overall i do think zads outperformed his abilities (especially in his offensive output), lindholm essentially performed at his, hronek underperformed during the playoffs. 

 

despite having lindholm, we were definitely missing the offensive firepower we had in the first half of the season with kuzmenko in our top-6. but no doubt we were a better defensive team in the playoffs than we were in the first half of the year. 

 

i do lean towards keeping lindholm + trying to find a cheap winger that has some finishing ability. I wonder if Tolvanen might be an affordable option. Hes a good goalscorer, hasnt really broken out yet. 

 

[Bob Long]

5 minutes ago, HarbularyBattery said:

 

yeah i think ultimately its gonna come down to coaching staffs assessment of our roster construction

 

overall i do think zads outperformed his abilities (especially in his offensive output), lindholm essentially performed at his, hronek underperformed during the playoffs. 

 

despite having lindholm, we were definitely missing the offensive firepower we had in the first half of the season with kuzmenko in our top-6. but no doubt we were a better defensive team in the playoffs than we were in the first half of the year. 

 

i do lean towards keeping lindholm + trying to find a cheap winger that has some finishing ability. I wonder if Tolvanen might be an affordable option. Hes a good goalscorer, hasnt really broken out yet. 

 

 

I could see us moving both Garland and Mik to make the cap for Guentzel 

[HarbularyBattery]

1 minute ago, Bob Long said:

 

I could see us moving both Garland and Mik to make the cap for Guentzel 

id love that but id be surprised if carolina fails to re-sign guentzel

[Goose]

12 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

I could see us moving both Garland and Mik to make the cap for Guentzel 

 

Isnt Garland a + contributor though?  I see him on Miller’s wing next year.

 

JG would be nice but at age 30 next year and his contract price I wonder. 

 

 

[stawns]

1 hour ago, AngryGoose said:

 

Isnt Garland a + contributor though?  I see him on Miller’s wing next year.

 

JG would be nice but at age 30 next year and his contract price I wonder. 

 

 

 

I'd rather see him with Petey and leave the miller/boeser combo alone

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, AngryGoose said:

 

Isnt Garland a + contributor though?  I see him on Miller’s wing next year.

 

JG would be nice but at age 30 next year and his contract price I wonder. 

 

 

 

He is but he's not in the same tier as Guentzel.

[bh90]

I think what's important to look at is how much money is there really available for NHL teams to spend this off-season.

 

Overall and adjusting for some obvious LTIR candidates, there's a total of $604,414,752 available in cap space next season with 181 roster spots to fill for all the teams to field a 22 man roster. In theory, that means for the 181 players to be signed to make a full roster the average salary can be $3,339,308. 

 

To me that means the top half of the free agent class will most likely get north of that figure, while the bottom half would get below. I did the same exercise last year and i believe the number came below $2,000,000 so this year there's a lot of money available and the following season it's anticipated another 128 million (4m x 32 teams) will be added in available funds.

 

Additionally, there's only

• 46 forward UFA/RFA that had 30 or more points
• 75 defenseman UFA/RFA that played more than 15 minutes a game and dozens of them only played that much due to being on bad teams and are probably worth league minimum

 

In theory, even if the above 46 F + 75 D would get an average salary of $3,339,308 that would be a total cap hit of $404,056,270 and still leave an available cap-hit of almost $200,000,000 available to spend on the top of free agent class which could be narrowed down to Reinhart, Stamkos, Guentzel, Lucas Raymond, Marchessault, Seth Jarvis, Duchene, Monahan, Mittlestadt, Toffoli, Byfield, Hronek, Lindholm, Seider, Montour, Beniers, Perfetti, Harley, Necas, Teravainen,  ... or a total of 20 guys that these top 20 guys couuld all get average contracts of $10,000,000 per year and there's still be enough money in the NHL left over...

 

Needless to say there's A LOT of money available.

 

Hronek at 8, Lindholm at 8, Zadarov at 6 ... those are just the prices if you ask me and we shouldn't be shocked at these asking prices. Player agents and front offices focus on market share and cap share when comparing player contracts. They're not focusing on what another comparable player signed 2 seasons ago.

 

That being said i think it'll also be easier to unload contracts (i.e. Mikheyev) because there is a lot of money available

 

 

 

[CanuckDownUnder]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

He is but he's not in the same tier as Guentzel.

 

And as always, the reality is that they are going to have to give up something in any move (unless they are just unloading). There will undoubtedly be some popular players not returning next year.

[Dizzle]

4 minutes ago, CanuckDownUnder said:

 

And as always, the reality is that they are going to have to give up something in any move (unless they are just unloading). There will undoubtedly be some popular players not returning next year.

Possible Zadorov, Joshua, lindholm, Cole and Myers could all be gone. 
 

I think Myers will be back. Not so sure one way or another with pretty much all our other ufa’s. 

[CanuckDownUnder]

1 minute ago, Dizzle said:

Possible Zadorov, Joshua, lindholm, Cole and Myers could all be gone. 
 

I think Myers will be back. Not so sure one way or another with pretty much all our other ufa’s. 

 

It is also interesting how people's perceptions changed for some of these players in the playoffs. Myers in particular was a source of almost universal frustration in the regular season. Lindholm seemed to be on the fence. Their playoffs performances really were stellar in comparison. I doubt that management will only look at that when making these decisions. It is such a complex interplay of cap, chemistry, what other teams want etc., I gave up ages ago trying to predict off season moves.

[Northern_Nuck]

I know it won’t be a popular take, but ideally I’d like to trade Boeser & Mikheyev. Let Myers and Diguseppe walk. 
 

 I think there’s 100 players in this league that could get 40 on this team. But they’d bring skating, hitting and possibly defensive awareness and they might even do it for 5 or so. That’s why I’d be up for moving Brock. 
 

 2nd I want someone mean and aggressive on the 4th line. Someone in this 23 that can actually throw and intimidate or help our players be less intimidated. 
 

There will be a few teams that see Myers as a 4 million dollar guy… I’m okay with him at 2, and as a 6/7. I’d rather use the extra couple million on Zadorov. 

[stawns]

54 minutes ago, bh90 said:

I think what's important to look at is how much money is there really available for NHL teams to spend this off-season.

 

Overall and adjusting for some obvious LTIR candidates, there's a total of $604,414,752 available in cap space next season with 181 roster spots to fill for all the teams to field a 22 man roster. In theory, that means for the 181 players to be signed to make a full roster the average salary can be $3,339,308. 

 

To me that means the top half of the free agent class will most likely get north of that figure, while the bottom half would get below. I did the same exercise last year and i believe the number came below $2,000,000 so this year there's a lot of money available and the following season it's anticipated another 128 million (4m x 32 teams) will be added in available funds.

 

Additionally, there's only

• 46 forward UFA/RFA that had 30 or more points
• 75 defenseman UFA/RFA that played more than 15 minutes a game and dozens of them only played that much due to being on bad teams and are probably worth league minimum

 

In theory, even if the above 46 F + 75 D would get an average salary of $3,339,308 that would be a total cap hit of $404,056,270 and still leave an available cap-hit of almost $200,000,000 available to spend on the top of free agent class which could be narrowed down to Reinhart, Stamkos, Guentzel, Lucas Raymond, Marchessault, Seth Jarvis, Duchene, Monahan, Mittlestadt, Toffoli, Byfield, Hronek, Lindholm, Seider, Montour, Beniers, Perfetti, Harley, Necas, Teravainen,  ... or a total of 20 guys that these top 20 guys couuld all get average contracts of $10,000,000 per year and there's still be enough money in the NHL left over...

 

Needless to say there's A LOT of money available.

 

Hronek at 8, Lindholm at 8, Zadarov at 6 ... those are just the prices if you ask me and we shouldn't be shocked at these asking prices. Player agents and front offices focus on market share and cap share when comparing player contracts. They're not focusing on what another comparable player signed 2 seasons ago.

 

That being said i think it'll also be easier to unload contracts (i.e. Mikheyev) because there is a lot of money available

 

 

 

 

Those may be the prices, but it doesn't mean it makes sense for Vancouver to do it.  Teams with depth win Cups, imo, and you get that depth by bring smart and not overpaying a guy like Hronek, who might get $8m from a desperate GM on the open market, but really isn't worth more than $5.5-6m on the ice.

[bh90]

8 minutes ago, stawns said:

 

Those may be the prices, but it doesn't mean it makes sense for Vancouver to do it.  Teams with depth win Cups, imo, and you get that depth by bring smart and not overpaying a guy like Hronek, who might get $8m from a desperate GM on the open market, but really isn't worth more than $5.5-6m on the ice.

 

i agree we still need to make the best decisions for our team

 

but, i'm not surprised as to why the rumours are what they are about prices being so high because there's money available.  

[N4ZZY]

8 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

I worry a bit about paying for one decent season..... Don't really want to see another Baertschi. 

That's probably what it will take to keep him, though. Bärtschi wasn't bad, though. He produced; Benning just gave him a bad contract. 

 

[Dizzle]

10 minutes ago, stawns said:

 

Those may be the prices, but it doesn't mean it makes sense for Vancouver to do it.  Teams with depth win Cups, imo, and you get that depth by bring smart and not overpaying a guy like Hronek, who might get $8m from a desperate GM on the open market, but really isn't worth more than $5.5-6m on the ice.

Hronek for under 6 take it and run as fast as you can. Guy had a rough playoffs without a doubt - actually after the all star break I’d say him and petey both struggled. Maybe it’s not a coincidence the whole team struggled a bit more when those two faded. 
 

Id imagine both of them are going to have pretty good years next year after falling off the end of this one. I do wonder about injuries with both of them as well, but I guess we’ll find out. 
 

all that said.. anything under 6 mil for that guy and we’re laughing. 

[N4ZZY]

1 minute ago, bh90 said:

 

i agree we still need to make the best decisions for our team

 

but, i'm not surprised as to why the rumours are what they are about prices being so high because there's money available.  

Just because there's money available doesn't mean Allvin should spend all of it unwisely. 

 

The question for me is, can we win with Hronek at the backend? If Tocchet loves his large defenseman, who are we going to bring in for the backend to make us difficult to play against if we lose both Myers and Zadorov? My gut tells me that Myers will be back, because he's at that stage in his career where he just wants to be close to family and home, and this is home here in BC. He'll take less to stay. I think term probably is more important to him as well. 3M for 3 years? I mean, if Allvin can get him to sign for 2.5M for 3 years, that would be a steal of a contract. 

 

 

[N4ZZY]

2 minutes ago, Dizzle said:

Hronek for under 6 take it and run as fast as you can. Guy had a rough playoffs without a doubt - actually after the all star break I’d say him and petey both struggled. Maybe it’s not a coincidence the whole team struggled a bit more when those two faded. 
 

Id imagine both of them are going to have pretty good years next year after falling off the end of this one. I do wonder about injuries with both of them as well, but I guess we’ll find out. 
 

all that said.. anything under 6 mil for that guy and we’re laughing. 

It's not going to be under 6M. If Allvin could do that, he should win GM of the year. 

 

I think Hronek's deal is probably going to be the toughest deal to make. I think we lose Lindholm at the end of the day, unless he gives management a deal that they cannot refuse. He won't get anything more than 7M from the Canucks. Is that a bad deal for them if he's versatile enough to play 3C when needed, but also wing on the top two lines? But the team probably still needs another scoring winger (Guentzel?). Question for me is how do you afford both Lindholm and Guentzel (who's likely going to be asking for 8-9M per year), and then also sign Myers, Zadorov, Joshua and Blueger (he needs to come; as important a role player in my opinion for the team). 

[stawns]

4 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

It's not going to be under 6M. If Allvin could do that, he should win GM of the year. 

 

I think Hronek's deal is probably going to be the toughest deal to make. I think we lose Lindholm at the end of the day, unless he gives management a deal that they cannot refuse. He won't get anything more than 7M from the Canucks. Is that a bad deal for them if he's versatile enough to play 3C when needed, but also wing on the top two lines? But the team probably still needs another scoring winger (Guentzel?). Question for me is how do you afford both Lindholm and Guentzel (who's likely going to be asking for 8-9M per year), and then also sign Myers, Zadorov, Joshua and Blueger (he needs to come; as important a role player in my opinion for the team). 

 

I'm not sure where all the JG talk is coming from, but that's not remotely realistic, imo.  If they've got that kind of dough, they'll spend it on Lindy

[N4ZZY]

31 minutes ago, Northern_Nuck said:

I know it won’t be a popular take, but ideally I’d like to trade Boeser & Mikheyev. Let Myers and Diguseppe walk. 
 

 I think there’s 100 players in this league that could get 40 on this team. But they’d bring skating, hitting and possibly defensive awareness and they might even do it for 5 or so. That’s why I’d be up for moving Brock. 
 

 2nd I want someone mean and aggressive on the 4th line. Someone in this 23 that can actually throw and intimidate or help our players be less intimidated. 
 

There will be a few teams that see Myers as a 4 million dollar guy… I’m okay with him at 2, and as a 6/7. I’d rather use the extra couple million on Zadorov. 

Are you kidding me? Definitely not a popular take LOL. 

 

Look. 40 goal scorers don't come around often. I don't know the statistics and all, but there's no way a 40 goal scorer can be had for 5M. No way. Name me a player that scores 40 and does everything you've listed and is being paid 5M. Whoever that GM is, he should have won GM of the fucking year. 

 

Guentzel's scored 40 goals twice in his career, and he's about to be making 8-9M in the open market - at least. So where you get the idea that a player that can score 40, and then hits, and has defensive awareness that'll cost 5M. I'm not sure where you're getting that from. Goal scorers aren't cheap, and if there's one in the open market that can do it, they're not going to be paid cheaply. Need to pay to get. 

 

[N4ZZY]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

 

I'm not sure where all the JG talk is coming from, but that's not remotely realistic, imo.  If they've got that kind of dough, they'll spend it on Lindy

Yeah, but you'll still need another winger to play with Petey. Would Lindholm be it? 

 

I still think they need to add a winger that can score to the top six. Lindholm alone wouldn't be enough. 

 

[stawns]

25 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

Yeah, but you'll still need another winger to play with Petey. Would Lindholm be it? 

 

I still think they need to add a winger that can score to the top six. Lindholm alone wouldn't be enough. 

 

 

Garland

[Goose]

4 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

He is but he's not in the same tier as Guentzel.

 

If they cant afford Guentzel/isnt available, another guy I really like is Chandler Stephenson.  Excellent skater, wing or C, and while not the sexiest statline he is the type of player that helps a line go from D to O zone.  I could see him being a fit w Petey or Miller.

Edited May 23 by AngryGoose
typos

[Rusty Shackleford]

3 hours ago, stawns said:

 

I'd rather see him with Petey and leave the miller/boeser combo alone

 

Petey - Lind - Garland 

 

That looks like it would be a great line.

[Bob Long]

41 minutes ago, AngryGoose said:

 

If they cant for Guentzel/isnt available, another guy I really like is Chandler Stephenson.  Excellent skater, wing or C, and while not the sexiest statline he is the type of player that helps a line go from D to I zone.  I could see him being a fit w Petey or Miller.

 

For sure there will be many teams trying to land him.