stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 Just now, DeNiro said: There was definitely a crime no doubt. But that doesn’t mean we are close to finding out who is directly responsible. There is likely going to be a long trial. I agree, but the investigation phase of these 5 players has been almost surely been completed and the evidence already compiled. They don't arrest first and then look for evidence 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrayDog Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 11 minutes ago, Rekker said: My kids are my kids. I will be there for them, no matter what. Doesn't mean I condone any and everything. But when the whole world is against my child, no matter what they did, I will be there for them. My kids are my kids. I do not honestly know that I could stand behind them in such a moment. I will also say I don't know if I could easily turn my back, but I probably would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 Just now, StrayDog said: I did not mean the family of the rapists. I mean if the rapist is a member of my family. I have a great amount of sympathy for the victim and the families of the victim and perpetrators. I can also have empathy for the accused as well. They are facing a horrible stretch of their lives and are probably having some severe mental health issues right now. I can empathize with how they must be feeling. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 1 minute ago, stawns said: I agree, but the investigation phase of these 5 players has been almost surely been completed and the evidence already compiled. They don't arrest first and then look for evidence Nope and arrest doesn’t mean guilty either. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrayDog Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 10 minutes ago, JayDangles said: I didn't know they were being charged with rape... or did you intentionally add that to make you seem morally righteous? I also don't have sympathy for murderers... should we just accuse them of that too? Yes, it was intended to give me a sense of moral superiority. Or did you not read folks saying that "sexual assault" is Canadian for "rape" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekker Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 3 hours ago, JayDangles said: Fuck what a mess. I honestly feel bad for everyone involved. Of course the victim first. Hope she is getting all the help she needs. But to the players who royally fucked up, folks need to understand something... If you're an uber driver, a student, a contractor, whatever and you are charged with sexual assault, there is a high likelihood you will serve your time and still become employed after. Youre friends and family will know.. but life will probably restart. Youre life isnt ruined. Youre career isnt over. You can repent, serve your time, try and make a difference for the better... but your life is likely not completely over at 24. For these guys their life is basically over, their dream is over.. Thats got to be tough. Again, I'm not condoning or defending the actions... but I do think its sad when something you do at 18 has the power to destroy everything. Lots of lives destroyed here. I see your point, not saying I agree, disagree, or can understand the paramaters. You will get burned for your comments. I can say there are some truths to what you say. It's a terrible life changing event for all involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 1 minute ago, DeNiro said: Nope and arrest doesn’t mean guilty either. Of course not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mike Vanderhoek Posted January 24 Popular Post Share Posted January 24 18 minutes ago, stawns said: You can feel empathy for the victim and the perpetrator of the crime and especially for the families on both sides. Empathy doesn't mean you excuse their behavior Important distinction, unfortunately there are a lot of people who don't quite understand how that works. 2 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 3 minutes ago, StrayDog said: My kids are my kids. I do not honestly know that I could stand behind them in such a moment. I will also say I don't know if I could easily turn my back, but I probably would. I don't care what my child did, they're still my child and I'm still their dad. If they don't have me, who do they have? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenbean30 Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 2 minutes ago, stawns said: He was their coach after it happened. He was hired in October of 2018 And the event happened in the summer of 2018, and Cal and Dillon were in the AHL for the 18-19 season, which would include October 2018. So if Adam was hired in October 2018, which he was, then he never coached Cal or Dillon as they were both in the AHL in October 2018. Cal was in Syracuse, Dillon was in Stockton and Calgary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johngould21 Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 4 minutes ago, stawns said: The bulk of the investigation is done. I'm sure they'll be digging deeper for other involvement, but if they arrest these players, they've got the best evidence from an investigation already conducted I agree with you on this, they wouldn't be asking these players to surrender if they didn't have enough evidence. However, the players lawyers will have their chance to prove themselves not guilty too. DeNiro said as well, some might get found at fault in some capacity, but have their character etc., destroyed to the point they don't find a team willing to take them on, ala Jake Virtanen. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 2 hours ago, stawns said: And a head coach who already pleaded guilty to being a part of an organized gambling ring Ok this is it's own story. I don't see why you think that's relevant. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekker Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 2 minutes ago, StrayDog said: My kids are my kids. I do not honestly know that I could stand behind them in such a moment. I will also say I don't know if I could easily turn my back, but I probably would. I know I try not to judge others without knowing what they have gone through. Lol, I fail miserably at it though. I like this more recent comment a lot more than your first. Not honestly knowing what you would do is pure truth and fact. We think we know how we will handle any situation, but until you are faced with the decision, we really can't be certain. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 7 minutes ago, stawns said: I agree, but the investigation phase of these 5 players has been almost surely been completed and the evidence already compiled. They don't arrest first and then look for evidence Actually they do that all the time. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 Just now, Rekker said: I know I try not to judge others without knowing what they have gone through. Lol, I fail miserably at it though. I like this more recent comment a lot more than your first. Not honestly knowing what you would do is pure truth and fact. We think we know how we will handle any situation, but until you are faced with the decision, we really can't be certain. Yep. I think if it were me being accused, the last thing I'd want is for my dad's career to be effected 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 1 minute ago, Johngould21 said: I agree with you on this, they wouldn't be asking these players to surrender if they didn't have enough evidence. However, the players lawyers will have their chance to prove themselves not guilty too. DeNiro said as well, some might get found at fault in some capacity, but have their character etc., destroyed to the point they don't find a team willing to take them on, ala Jake Virtanen. I think there's been enough information out there about this incident that we can assume if 8 players were accused and 5 were arrested, that those 5 were the main perpetrators of the crime and they have the evidence to prove that. Obviously they'll have their day in court, but when you arrest public figures, like athletes or celebrities, you better have a pretty air tight case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekker Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 2 minutes ago, stawns said: I don't care what my child did, they're still my child and I'm still their dad. If they don't have me, who do they have? Yip. Not to make light of the situation, but one of my kids cheered on Boston in 2011, was a huge Chara fan.....was a tough spring, but still love the kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 1 minute ago, Bob Long said: Yep. I think if it were me being accused, the last thing I'd want is for my dad's career to be effected If it were me, id want my support system there with me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekker Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 Just now, stawns said: If it were me, id want my support system there with me. Yip, it's our job as parents. I never forget that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 3 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Actually they do that all the time. This was a what, two year investigation? Really, it started in 2019, was closed and rw-opened almost two years ago. Imo, there's no chance they don't have the evidence they need Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayDangles Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 5 minutes ago, Rekker said: I see your point, not saying I agree, disagree, or can understand the paramaters. You will get burned for your comments. I can say there are some truths to what you say. It's a terrible life changing event for all involved. Its fine, as I've said many times. It takes an emotionally mature person to understand and have empathy for someone. To not feel the need to cast the first stone, or sit in judgement of others. Most folks who are against my post just don't understand that its not about them and how they feel. They are unable to see a world where their feelings are not the most important in every situation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayDangles Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 13 minutes ago, StrayDog said: My kids are my kids. I do not honestly know that I could stand behind them in such a moment. I will also say I don't know if I could easily turn my back, but I probably would. Make sure you let your kids know now though.. that their dad will likely bail on them if the going gets tough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekker Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 1 minute ago, JayDangles said: Its fine, as I've said many times. It takes an emotionally mature person to understand and have empathy for someone. To not feel the need to cast the first stone, or sit in judgement of others. Most folks who are against my post just don't understand that its not about them and how they feel. They are unable to see a world where their feelings are not the most important in every situation. This is true. I have a daughter and a son so can imagine the horrors on both sides. Bottom line is it's a terrible life changing event for all involved. Doesn't condone anything, just confirms that it's a terrible, life altering event for all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrayDog Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 16 minutes ago, stawns said: I can also have empathy for the accused as well. They are facing a horrible stretch of their lives and are probably having some severe mental health issues right now. I can empathize with how they must be feeling. I can't bring myself to that level of empathy. I have known victims of such crimes and can't bring myself to feel anything but disgust for the perpetrators. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrayDog Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 15 minutes ago, Rekker said: I know I try not to judge others without knowing what they have gone through. Lol, I fail miserably at it though. I like this more recent comment a lot more than your first. Not honestly knowing what you would do is pure truth and fact. We think we know how we will handle any situation, but until you are faced with the decision, we really can't be certain. I'll admit my first was a little more kneejerk, mostly because I have known victims of such crimes but (more importantly) because I have already disowned an uncle for it (yes, he is currently serving time) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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