Bob Long Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 14 minutes ago, Alflives said: Garlsnd makes five on the cap. Hogs can play his minutes. Neither is a PK or PP guy. Garland is a good player and has positive value. So we should be able to move off all his cap. Then there’s four mil to bump up both DJ and Big Z by two per. IMHAO I’d rather our club has DJ and Big Z over Garland. We have a replacement for Garland in Hogs. Who replaces DJ and Big Z and what they provide? but.. there's always a but... not overpaying DJ and moving or buying out Mik pretty much creates the same space. I don't think Garly is a regular top 6, but he can certainly slot in and is great on a 3rd line. So many moving parts tho, it all depends on what trades JR/PA have lined up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 10 minutes ago, D-Money said: When the chips were down in game 7, and we needed a spark, the only guy who took his game to a new level was Garland. He’s the type of guy you build around, not trade to keep the big guy who he propped up. I’m also wary of signing UFAs who take their game to a new level in their contract year. Joshua was a guy who was singled out in camp for not putting in the work in the offseason. Once he has a fat multi-year contract in his pocket, will motivation be a problem for him? I think it will. Tocchet might live Garland but 5 mil for a guy who only plays 3rd line minutes and can’t PP or PK is a luxury. Especially when we already have another player (Hogs) who can play those minutes. Saving four mil in cap could be very useful in keeping our key UFAs or signing a winger like Geuntzel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 (edited) There are a few big guys among the group 6 UFAs that I wouldn’t mind talking a flyer on for cheap. All of these guys have proved as much or more than Joshua had not long ago: - Otto Koivula - Brett Murray - Riley Tufte Edited June 2 by D-Money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 9 minutes ago, Bob Long said: According to natural stat trick, Garland does about the same without Joshua, but Joshua without Garly not so great. Stinks with Petey in fact: https://naturalstattrick.com/linestats.php?fromseason=20232024&thruseason=20232024&stype=2&sit=5v5&score=all&rate=n&team=VAN&vteam=ALL&view=wowy&loc=B&gpfilt=none&fd=2023-10-10&td=2024-04-18&tgp=2000&strict=incl&p1=8478856&p2=8478057&p3=8480012&p4=0&p5=0 He did not work with Petey, at all. I don't agree the idea that Petey needs a big power forward on his line, particularly because of how poorly he and Joshua played together. I get that it just might have been those two, but Petey is highly skilled and needs highly skilled players to play with. Joshua just wasnt fast enough, quick enough or skilled enough to compliment Petey's tool box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Just now, stawns said: He did not work with Petey, at all. I don't agree the idea that Petey needs a big power forward on his line, particularly because of how poorly he and Joshua played together. I'm thinking more Hyman than Wilson. Just now, stawns said: I get that it just might have been those two, but Petey is highly skilled and needs highly skilled players to play with. Joshua just wasnt fast enough, quick enough or skilled enough to compliment Petey's tool box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Someone convince me that Podz can't take over from Joshua. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 2 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Someone convince me that Podz can't take over from Joshua. I think that's the likeliest scenario. I think two internal moves can give them some flexibility..........garland to the top 6 and Podz to the third line and actually leave him there and give him a legit chance. If they moved Garland into the top 6, it's easier to rebuild the third line than it is to find a top 6 winger without breaking the bank......and it leaves more $ for the dcorp, which should be the priority, imo 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 12 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Someone convince me that Podz can't take over from Joshua. Can Pods PK and fight the big boppers? Pods is a good player but IMHAO he’s not ready for the role DJ played. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammertime Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 I think we have Dak at home in either Podkolzin Bains. Bains is a heck of a playmaker I think he could make his way all the way to top 6 in a few seasons and wouldn't that be a story for Vancouver. We really need a guy whos strong on the boards with vision. And that will probably never change. It's usually one or the other. Podkolzin I'm not sure why his development stalled. He's got all the tools and apparently he works in the gym like a mad man. He's gotta loosen up feel like the kid's gripping his stick and playing to not make a mistake. He's got that Big Dad Energy now. Either way or if it's through signing or trade I think our next Dak is a few years away. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 21 minutes ago, Hammertime said: I think we have Dak at home in either Podkolzin Bains. Bains is a heck of a playmaker I think he could make his way all the way to top 6 in a few seasons and wouldn't that be a story for Vancouver. We really need a guy whos strong on the boards with vision. And that will probably never change. It's usually one or the other. Podkolzin I'm not sure why his development stalled. He's got all the tools and apparently he works in the gym like a mad man. He's gotta loosen up feel like the kid's gripping his stick and playing to not make a mistake. He's got that Big Dad Energy now. Either way or if it's through signing or trade I think our next Dak is a few years away. I think, with Podz, he needs to be put in a situation to succeed. He was such an impact player in Abby, but he's got to play with skilled players to be that player himself. He's got a great shot, but he's a very very underrated playmaker and he needs to play with someone who can finish, imo. In that respect, I think he almost replaces Garland on the third line, more than Joshua 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman955 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 On 6/1/2024 at 12:22 PM, Alflives said: 1 minute ago, stawns said: I am at a loss here. DJ is what we need. No player in our system is near his level. DJ has certainly grown into his role. Thanks to Rick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman955 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Just now, snowman955 said: Oops 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman955 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 We need the likes of DJ& ZADOROV now and for at least 3 years. Do what needs to be done. Letting them go FA is not the route to success. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman955 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 4 minutes ago, snowman955 said: Sry Stawns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 4 minutes ago, snowman955 said: Sry Stawns No worries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 1 hour ago, Alflives said: Tocchet might live Garland but 5 mil for a guy who only plays 3rd line minutes and can’t PP or PK is a luxury. Especially when we already have another player (Hogs) who can play those minutes. Saving four mil in cap could be very useful in keeping our key UFAs or signing a winger like Geuntzel. Garland played 139 minutes on the power play last year. Höglander only 40 minutes. Garland can drive the second unit PP. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 5 minutes ago, snowman955 said: We need the likes of DJ& ZADOROV now and for at least 3 years. Do what needs to be done. Letting them go FA is not the route to success. While I agree on both players, they also can't afford to overpay and, in the case of DJ, you're basing it on one good year, with nothing other than that to justify a significant raise. I would love to have DJ back, but not at more than $2-2.25m for me. Zad is another guy looking for a payday beyond what his resume justifies. He had a great playoff, bo doubt, but does the rest of his body of work justify anything beyond $4.5m a year? I'd say definitely not. Now, if they move off hronek, maybe you can justify $5m for Zad.........but on a shorter term, imo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain insano Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 1 hour ago, Alflives said: Seems a good target. Played on a horrible Buffalo team that has no leadership in the core. DJ played for under a million. I wonder what Robinson would come in at? Also Columbus then buffalo I feel like he’s the type that tocchet would unlock him into a fan favourite soon as everyone saw the boards flexing every time he hit the ice, he def needs a crowd to keep him buzzing with his style, Robinson was a healthy scratch down the stretch I think he comes in at league minimum maybe 1m 1 hour ago, stawns said: I don't think they have to get someone for league minimum, just not much over a million or so they don’t have to I was just pointing out a player that I feel can pave out his own type of Joshua comparable career as I saw a list that seemed a little vague not promoting players with the potential 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-dlc- Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 25 minutes ago, stawns said: Zad is another guy looking for a payday beyond what his resume justifies. He had a great playoff, bo doubt, but does the rest of his body of work justify anything beyond $4.5m a year? I'd say definitely not. Now, if they move off hronek, maybe you can justify $5m for Zad.........but on a shorter term, imo I'd say definitely yes. The fact that he gives our other players protection is worth a whole lot. He embraces the role and if we let him go, who does that part? Along with the fact he has pretty good hands and is a total team player. You just don't get guys like him every day and, if you have one, you hold onto him. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 8 minutes ago, -dlc- said: I'd say definitely yes. The fact that he gives our other players protection is worth a whole lot. He embraces the role and if we let him go, who does that part? Along with the fact he has pretty good hands and is a total team player. You just don't get guys like him every day and, if you have one, you hold onto him. IMHAO both Zadorov and Joshua add what you describe to our club. DJ broke his hand standing up for Garland. Other than Miller do we have any other players who do that? DJ and Zadorov help the club in more ways, like you point out, than just points. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman955 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 1 minute ago, Alflives said: IMHAO both Zadorov and Joshua add what you describe to our club. DJ broke his hand standing up for Garland. Other than Miller do we have any other players who do that? DJ and Zadorov help the club in more ways, like you point out, than just points. They are both heart and soul players. Both did comment about wanting to remain in BC. Not likeing the fact we might have to face them someday! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flat land fish Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 2 hours ago, D-Money said: When the chips were down in game 7, and we needed a spark, the only guy who took his game to a new level was Garland. He’s the type of guy you build around, not trade to keep the big guy who he propped up. I’m also wary of signing UFAs who take their game to a new level in their contract year. Joshua was a guy who was singled out in camp for not putting in the work in the offseason. Once he has a fat multi-year contract in his pocket, will motivation be a problem for him? I think it will. I love Garland as a player and competitor but look at his stat line for the playoffs. He controls play well but the production is a 40-50 point energy guys and that's who he is. The point that hoglander could play the same role with more upside isn't outlandish. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 6 minutes ago, snowman955 said: They are both heart and soul players. Both did comment about wanting to remain in BC. Not likeing the fact we might have to face them someday! Clearly we need to find the cap room to sign both DJ and Z. It’s a long, hard season, especially on the top minute guys. DJ and Z make those top guys’ minutes easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.AM.THE.WALRUS Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 This might be off topic but there seems to be a thing when it comes to Canadian players and winning Stanley cups - it’s a pattern and therefore we need to get more Canadians that are tough they just have more character… more heart… I know it’s a weird stat but it’s a thing - it’s actually true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 1 minute ago, flat land fish said: I love Garland as a player and competitor but look at his stat line for the playoffs. He controls play well but the production is a 40-50 point energy guys and that's who he is. The point that hoglander could play the same role with more upside isn't outlandish. We all love Garland. But we do have a guy in Hogs who can play those minutes. We don’t have guys to play the minutes (and role) of DJ and Zadorov. IMHAO we can reallocate Garland’s cap to keep DJ and Big Z. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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