[Speculation] Latest On Dakota Joshua

[Barbarian]

I love Dak as a player and warrior and hope it makes $ense to bring him back. He was getting better and better in the regular season and seemed to be straight up taking over games before his hand injury sustained while throwing big punches.

 

I could see him continuing to improve as a player - it takes a certain work ethic to keep fighting and improving as an older player (28) and not giving up - he's got heart and pride.

 

I would be surprised if he got a payday and slowed his grind. Love him for the team and the room.

[fuzzy]

7 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

We failed in the playoffs because of the top 6 and because Petey was playing with AHL players.  That won't happen again.  Allvin said the top 6 is a priority and he also said he will find the next Dakota Joshua...

Allvin and staff have shown a keen eye for talent evaluation. I have faith in their abilities to reinforce the top 6 and reconstruct the bottom of the roster 

[NHL97OneTimer]

6 hours ago, DeNiro said:

Let’s not discount Garlands role in his break out season though. Everyone who played with Garland improved.

 

Would he have the same success elsewhere? That’s what he has to ask himself.

If that's the case, put Garland with EP!

[fuzzy]

4 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

If that's the case, put Garland with EP!

Unfortunately Garland's muffin shot isn't playable in the top 6.

[Bob Long]

14 minutes ago, fuzzy said:

Unfortunately Garland's muffin shot isn't playable in the top 6.

 

[NHL97OneTimer]

Just now, fuzzy said:

Unfortunately Garland's muffin shot isn't playable in the top 6.

I wasn't really serious when I typed that.....but with that said, Garland is paid to be a top 6 player and it would have been interesting to see EP with Garland and Joshua when he was in a funk.

 

I've often thought about the west coast express line make-up and how Naslund was freed up to snipe away while Bertuzzi took all the attention (needing multiple defenders).  Morrison was along for the ride for the most part but he served as a good playmaker.  EP really needs a heavy power-forward on his line to free him up.  Garland's not heavy, but his aggressive play does disrupt the defence enough to free his linemates up.

[NHL97OneTimer]

I wouldn't be surprised for there to be a bunch of posturing on both sides for a bit and they'll land on a figure close to $3M/yr.  Most are suggesting 3 x $3M/yr, but I wonder if they'll do a 4 year deal to get to the $3M/yr mark.  Not a gamble based on this year, but it is if you look at the bigger picture.  It really comes down to if management thinks he played to a contract or if they think he's committed to improve still.  He certainly indicated that he would like to come back but PA's comments seemed to suggest otherwise.

 

We'll see but I hope they get it done.  For those saying Garland is the key to the line and Joshua may not do as well elsewhere......have a think back to how our record dropped without him in the lineup.  His contributions have been timely and he appeared to be effective on the PK (not sure of any metrics though).

[fuzzy]

12 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

I wouldn't be surprised for there to be a bunch of posturing on both sides for a bit and they'll land on a figure close to $3M/yr.  Most are suggesting 3 x $3M/yr, but I wonder if they'll do a 4 year deal to get to the $3M/yr mark.  Not a gamble based on this year, but it is if you look at the bigger picture.  It really comes down to if management thinks he played to a contract or if they think he's committed to improve still.  He certainly indicated that he would like to come back but PA's comments seemed to suggest otherwise.

 

We'll see but I hope they get it done.  For those saying Garland is the key to the line and Joshua may not do as well elsewhere......have a think back to how our record dropped without him in the lineup.  His contributions have been timely and he appeared to be effective on the PK (not sure of any metrics though).

He's pk ability, speed, physical play, and cap hit make him more valuable than Garland imo.

[stawns]

2 hours ago, Barbarian said:

I love Dak as a player and warrior and hope it makes $ense to bring him back. He was getting better and better in the regular season and seemed to be straight up taking over games before his hand injury sustained while throwing big punches.

 

I could see him continuing to improve as a player - it takes a certain work ethic to keep fighting and improving as an older player (28) and not giving up - he's got heart and pride.

 

I would be surprised if he got a payday and slowed his grind. Love him for the team and the room.

 

I'd bet without Garland, he'd have been a marginal player.

[stawns]

52 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

I wouldn't be surprised for there to be a bunch of posturing on both sides for a bit and they'll land on a figure close to $3M/yr.  Most are suggesting 3 x $3M/yr, but I wonder if they'll do a 4 year deal to get to the $3M/yr mark.  Not a gamble based on this year, but it is if you look at the bigger picture.  It really comes down to if management thinks he played to a contract or if they think he's committed to improve still.  He certainly indicated that he would like to come back but PA's comments seemed to suggest otherwise.

 

We'll see but I hope they get it done.  For those saying Garland is the key to the line and Joshua may not do as well elsewhere......have a think back to how our record dropped without him in the lineup.  His contributions have been timely and he appeared to be effective on the PK (not sure of any metrics though).

 

Too much, imo

[JeremyCuddles]

1 hour ago, stawns said:

 

I'd bet without Garland, he'd have been a marginal player.

Worth mentioning Garland struggled a bit shortly after Joshua went down. 1 point in 8 games. But from March 3rd-25th he had 8 points in 9 games. Hard to tell if they "need" each other or just play well with other good players. I don't look at Joshua like a passenger. I think he is a good player and he mixes well with Garland stylistically. As well as having great chemistry in general with him.

[stawns]

4 minutes ago, JeremyCuddles said:

Worth mentioning Garland struggled a bit shortly after Joshua went down. 1 point in 8 games. But from March 3rd-25th he had 8 points in 9 games. Hard to tell if they "need" each other or just play well with other good players. I don't look at Joshua like a passenger. I think he is a good player and he mixes well with Garland stylistically. As well as having great chemistry in general with him.

 

I do agree they worked well together, but Garland is very definitely the play drive on that line..........any line he's on actually

[wai_lai416]

4 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

I wasn't really serious when I typed that.....but with that said, Garland is paid to be a top 6 player and it would have been interesting to see EP with Garland and Joshua when he was in a funk.

 

I've often thought about the west coast express line make-up and how Naslund was freed up to snipe away while Bertuzzi took all the attention (needing multiple defenders).  Morrison was along for the ride for the most part but he served as a good playmaker.  EP really needs a heavy power-forward on his line to free him up.  Garland's not heavy, but his aggressive play does disrupt the defence enough to free his linemates up.

they never played garland in the top 6 with miller or ep because garland holds on to the puck too long.. Miller/EP/Hughes all needs the puck more than garland.. he's basically ineffective in the top 6 because he'll be up against the top pairing defenceman that knows how to easily neutralize him.. he struggles against big defenceman coz they just pin him to the board and he's going no where with the puck. he's far more effective in a 3rd line role because he's up against the lesser player where he can use his speed and his tiny body to spin loose against the board.. garland also doesn't really use his linemates.. he's a shoot first guy that likes to hold on to the puck. what EP needs is another good hybrid playmaker with a decent shot on his line.. he has no one 5v5 to get him the puck outside of QH.. mikheyev and Hoglander have negative playmaking ability or offensive awareness as seen countless of time in the playoff when there's a open guy ahead of the play they turn back and passes it backward.. so basically you negate EP as a shooter unless he some how manage to deke around guys with his bad knees.. watching the playoffs i've never seen any other canucks that get closed off and double teamed as much as EP 5v5.. basically they know can take chances to cheat on him and double team him coz they don't care about the other forwards on the line.

[wai_lai416]

i think joshua is good as gone.. i see him wanting mid terms 4-5 years at 3.5-4mil.. if mikheyev can get 4.75 for 4 years out of PA/JR.. someone prolly will offer joshua what he wants.. literally had same season as mikheyev prior to his 4.75mil.. and the cap gone up since.. and they literally do the same thing.. good on the forecheck good on the pk.. just not as fast but 10x tougher

[LillStrimma]

4 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

they never played garland in the top 6 with miller or ep because garland holds on to the puck too long.. Miller/EP/Hughes all needs the puck more than garland.. he's basically ineffective in the top 6 because he'll be up against the top pairing defenceman that knows how to easily neutralize him.. he struggles against big defenceman coz they just pin him to the board and he's going no where with the puck. he's far more effective in a 3rd line role because he's up against the lesser player where he can use his speed and his tiny body to spin loose against the board.. garland also doesn't really use his linemates.. he's a shoot first guy that likes to hold on to the puck. what EP needs is another good hybrid playmaker with a decent shot on his line.. he has no one 5v5 to get him the puck outside of QH.. mikheyev and Hoglander have negative playmaking ability or offensive awareness as seen countless of time in the playoff when there's a open guy ahead of the play they turn back and passes it backward.. so basically you negate EP as a shooter unless he some how manage to deke around guys with his bad knees.. watching the playoffs i've never seen any other canucks that get closed off and double teamed as much as EP 5v5.. basically they know can take chances to cheat on him and double team him coz they don't care about the other forwards on the line.

The best thing is to see how well Lekkerimäki translates to NHL.

If he’s a match we just would spend a lot of money on a winger for Petey that we need elsewhere.

[IBatch]

19 hours ago, Bob Long said:

4 mil is just too much. 

Yes it is.    3.25 x 3?   He's only 28, that would give him a chance at a legacy deal if things work out and he continues to improve.   Not sure.   It's a gamble, one thing I am sure of, unless we make a trade or find a UFA (is there any available?), our forward group loses half their sandpaper with him off the roster.    Foligno or Marroon are aging options.    Can't have a roster full of Bluegar/Suter sized support players.  

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, LillStrimma said:

The best thing is to see how well Lekkerimäki translates to NHL.

If he’s a match we just would spend a lot of money on a winger for Petey that we need elsewhere.

Sure that's the plan.   At 5'10 166lbs, on a smaller ice surface, sure hope part of their plan is to have Tochett and training staff on him to get into Hog's type shape.    The regular season is made for skilled players, the way the NHL is now, so that's a huge plus.    A guy like DJ mucking on the  boards, then maybe this could work.    Whomever is the third wheel on that line, is going to need size, speed and good hands.    Mikheyev had two of those.    And sure the brass felt he was the total package.     Allvin says he wants him on NA ice and to have time to adjust.  IF he can make it out of camp, and keep up and even help EP's game,  that would be a massive boon for the team.     
 

Another reason to sign Lindholm.   He's a known commodity in the club now,  a playoff performer,  and won't cost us some key players to take a run at Guentzal.    Who CAR is trying to sign right now too.    A bird in hand.   And likely will cost a couple million less.    Play Lindholm with EP ?  until Lekkermaki is ready.    Once he is,  we'd have two first rate scoring lines. 

Edited June 1 by IBatch

[IBatch]

6 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

they never played garland in the top 6 with miller or ep because garland holds on to the puck too long.. Miller/EP/Hughes all needs the puck more than garland.. he's basically ineffective in the top 6 because he'll be up against the top pairing defenceman that knows how to easily neutralize him.. he struggles against big defenceman coz they just pin him to the board and he's going no where with the puck. he's far more effective in a 3rd line role because he's up against the lesser player where he can use his speed and his tiny body to spin loose against the board.. garland also doesn't really use his linemates.. he's a shoot first guy that likes to hold on to the puck. what EP needs is another good hybrid playmaker with a decent shot on his line.. he has no one 5v5 to get him the puck outside of QH.. mikheyev and Hoglander have negative playmaking ability or offensive awareness as seen countless of time in the playoff when there's a open guy ahead of the play they turn back and passes it backward.. so basically you negate EP as a shooter unless he some how manage to deke around guys with his bad knees.. watching the playoffs i've never seen any other canucks that get closed off and double teamed as much as EP 5v5.. basically they know can take chances to cheat on him and double team him coz they don't care about the other forwards on the line.

Teams have the book on every star.   We did a pretty good job keeping McJesus off the scoreboard 5 x 5 too.   

 

Hogs worked his way up the lines the right way, and made some incredibly skilled plays in the regular season.   It was tough to watch that disappear, even tougher to watch Mikheyev get grade A scoring chances and whiff.   Millers pass in Game 7... was I think the only time I saw him make a move,  every other time, he just shot the puck at the net blindly it seemed.   No fake shot, no little move of the shoulder's just a muffin right into the crest.  

 

Not sure how they will figure out next years roster, it's apparent to the hockey universe that EP needs his own Brock Boeser.   Or Patrick Sharp or whomever, a guy skilled enough to be considered a core player, not a middle six player.    One middle six player is fine. 

[spook007]

19 hours ago, Bob Long said:

4 mil is just too much. 

Not for Toronto ...

 

18 hours ago, JeremyCuddles said:

Our 3rd line was better than our 2nd line. 3mil for Joshua isn't even that bad. Given other 3rd liners are making more. I'd rather let Myers and Zads walk and target a top 6 winger with their cap.

 

And back to the world of small or plugs on defence again?

[spook007]

18 hours ago, DeNiro said:

Let’s not discount Garlands role in his break out season though. Everyone who played with Garland improved.

 

Would he have the same success elsewhere? That’s what he has to ask himself.

At 28, if he can get a 4 year contract around or close to 4M, he'll take it... he need to make a killing, if he can, and worry about line mates later...

He may never get another opportunity.

[Alflives]

19 hours ago, DeNiro said:

Let’s not discount Garlands role in his break out season though. Everyone who played with Garland improved.

 

Would he have the same success elsewhere? That’s what he has to ask himself.

Garland was good with the puck in the offensive zone. He didn’t PK at all. He was a liability without the puck. DJ, although not worth more than 2.25 x 4 is not a product of Garland. If anything DJ, being big and fast, pushed D back below the dots creating room for Garland to make plays. 
IMHAO both players are gone this summer. But if we’re overpaying to keep one it’s definitely DJ. He’s by far the more complete and useful player. 

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

Yes it is.    3.25 x 3?   He's only 28, that would give him a chance at a legacy deal if things work out and he continues to improve.   Not sure.   It's a gamble, one thing I am sure of, unless we make a trade or find a UFA (is there any available?), our forward group loses half their sandpaper with him off the roster.    Foligno or Marroon are aging options.    Can't have a roster full of Bluegar/Suter sized support players.  

 

No, we can't. Suter is great but you are correct we need more size not less. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Bob Long said:

 

No, we can't. Suter is great but you are correct we need more size not less. 

And DJ is fast. We need more speed on our wings to drive opponents’ off their blue line. DJ does that. Snd he’s very good on the PK because of his speed, size, toughness, and smarts. 
Heck, he sure sounds like a 3 plus per player, doesn’t he? Just not too sure if he can stay at his recent level. 
DJ at 3.25 x 4 or Garland? IMHAO we can’t have both. 

[Bob Long]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And DJ is fast. We need more speed on our wings to drive opponents’ off their blue line. DJ does that. Snd he’s very good on the PK because of his speed, size, toughness, and smarts. 
Heck, he sure sounds like a 3 plus per player, doesn’t he? Just not too sure if he can stay at his recent level. 
DJ at 3.25 x 4 or Garland? IMHAO we can’t have both. 

 

Dunno, something just makes me concerned that he won't sustain it.

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

Dunno, something just makes me concerned that he won't sustain it.

Yup. Got to agree. It’s not too long ago he was in Tocchet’s doghouse for coming to camp in not too shape. Does that put into question DJ’s commitment to off season training and being the best player he can be? 

I guess PA and Tocchet have a good handle on DJ and whether he’s worth the risk.