[Speculation] Hurricanes Rumors: Jake Guentzel Likely to Hit Market, Rights available for mid round pick

[Hammertime]

30 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

They can, but we'd match in all likelihood.

Ya but might really suck if it happens. We can't really afford to be throwing an extra mil or more at him

[DeNiro]

9 minutes ago, Crabcakes said:

This fixation on Guentzel reminds me of 2020 and Benning fixated on landing OEL, failing and not signing Tanev and Toffoli.

 

I'd really like to think that Allvin is smarter than Benning.

 

I agree with Provost.  Would rather sign a couple of gettable $5M wingers than get in a bidding war for a big fish that could go $10M+.  This, after refusing Lindholm $8M+ (amount undisclosed)

I don’t think it’s a good idea to just go out and get two wingers for $5 mil.

 

First if all it’s free agency so you’re likely to overpay on dollars and term. What if they’re not a fit and we get another Mikheyev and Garland level player. Guys who aren’t quite good enough to be regular top 6ers. That would hurt this team long term.

 

If they can’t get an actual difference maker like Guenztel then just wait out the market. Look for some trades to bring in guys you actually want and can help the team. And then fill out the roster with some late free agency bargains.

[filthy animal]

2 hours ago, zduck14 said:

Absolutely! But.... he got to play with Mikheyev all year. Not even MacKinnon or McDavid were going to turn him into a legit top 6 player. He was THAT bad! Players like Reinhart, Verhaeghe, Hyman and even Drouin and Lehkonen are drastic upgrades from Mikheyev. 

 

Dont agree with you. Mikeyev would get 30 goals with his eyes closed with McDavid. Mik is an everyday nhler that has scored in this league, dont make it as if hes an echl-er journeyman, and if he was, hed get his goals too beside 97

 

Lets just face the facts, Ep40 aint in that tier of elite with the big boys. Hell, hes not even the best forward on his own team

[Bob Long]

20 minutes ago, Hammertime said:

Ya but might really suck if it happens. We can't really afford to be throwing an extra mil or more at him

 

It's pretty low risk I think with the number of starters apparently available.

[CBH1926]

Guentzel is going to be overpaid, plenty of teams with lot of salary cap.

He is not coming to Vancouver.

[aGENT]

35 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

I don’t think it’s a good idea to just go out and get two wingers for $5 mil.

 

First if all it’s free agency so you’re likely to overpay on dollars and term. What if they’re not a fit and we get another Mikheyev and Garland level player. Guys who aren’t quite good enough to be regular top 6ers. That would hurt this team long term.

 

If they can’t get an actual difference maker like Guenztel then just wait out the market. Look for some trades to bring in guys you actually want and can help the team. And then fill out the roster with some late free agency bargains.

 

 

The only guys I really want to see us sign is Guentzel ~ $9x7, Marsh $7x3 (or any of the unlikely guys... Stamkos, Reinhart, Lindholm etc). Othereise you're just making lateral moves at inflated UFA prices. No bueno.

 

Sign key guys or look at the secondary market and trades. That's the way to go. Otherwise we're better off spending that money where it will make a bigger difference (Pesce/Tanev/Miller/Carrier etc)

[Provost]

2 hours ago, aGENT said:

 

It's certainly not a bad angle to explore for teams tight to the cap.

 

VGK - Karlsson/Roy at F, Theodore/Whitecloud/Hague on D

TBL - Cirelli or Cernak

OTT- Chychrun or Zub

The Rangers always love big game hunting and there are continued rumours about Trouba and Kakko.

 

Hoglander who has some careers numbers at a low contract would be very appealing to them.

 

Zub would be an excellent pick up.

[Provost]

2 hours ago, aGENT said:

 

It's certainly not a bad angle to explore for teams tight to the cap.

 

VGK - Karlsson/Roy at F, Theodore/Whitecloud/Hague on D

TBL - Cirelli or Cernak

OTT- Chychrun or Zub

Those are all interesting names.  

The Rangers always love big game hunting and there are continued rumours about Trouba and Kakko.

 

Hoglander who has some careers numbers at a low contract would be very appealing to them.

 

Zub would be an excellent pick up.

Edited Wednesday at 03:12 AM by Provost

[NHL97OneTimer]

6 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

lol what kind of take is this? Because I made $25 million I’ll take less to help the team? Name one player that thinks and operates that way? Mcdavid made like 80+mil + endorsement. He should take a league minimum contract so he can win the cup then? Players rarely take massive discount beyond 500k-1mil for teams. Management have 0 loyalty to players. You can be good 1 season struggle the next and they will happily trade you or buy you out if necessary.

 

As for Toronto.. what part of this is even close to Toronto? They have 4 players at around 11mil? We have 1 and if we go after jg at 9.. that’s nothing remotely close to Toronto.. they signed those guys when cap is at like 80 and below.. we signing these guy when the cap is closer to 90.. Vegas have these types of contract.. Tampa rangers etc all have similar contract structures so does Colorado.. Vancouver even signing a jg at 9 is not even remotely close to those teams in cap structure.. their issue is they are spending so much on bottom 6 and bottom 4 defence

Daniel and Henrik

 

Burrows

 

Kesler

 

Demko

 

Luongo

 

I could keep going....lol.  You obviously don't get it.  That's okay.  We're two different people.  "When enough is enough" is something I understand.  You do not seem to.  That's okay.  I do very well in life and have a number of times been reminded that when you have a good life, having more things doesn't mean more happiness.  In fact, it can oddly make one more miserable.  EP can have plenty of homes and cars.  Another few cars won't really change much in his life.  Winning a cup and having a city behind you through thick and thin is priceless.  He'll never get these years back.  It's all good if he leads us to a cup or a series of good runs, but if his play drops consistently, the city will turn on him.  So I guess, selfishly as a fan, I would like to see a winning team.....but that's hard / near impossible to do when you pay players top dollar.

[Blitz-Pix]

4 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

They can, but we'd match in all likelihood.

 

Unless they offer sheet him to $2.5 - $3.5 million a season and it fucks with our CAP trying to get guys signed. 

If you're going to sign him, try and get it done early so you don't have to match a silly offer sheet from a team that desperately needs a young goalie.

We should be able to resign him in the $1.25 -$1.5 million range.

 

Offer sheet compensation. 

 

• $1,415,741 to $2,145,061 = Third-round pick.
• $2,145,062 to $4,290,125 = Second-round pick

 

(I think) There are probably a few teams out there that would gladly give up a 3rd round pick (Maybe a second) to get a good young goalie

after what he showed in the playoffs.

 

Just my 2 cents 

Edited Wednesday at 05:06 AM by Blitz-Pix

[wai_lai416]

1 minute ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Daniel and Henrik

 

Burrows

 

Kesler

 

Demko

 

Luongo

 

I could keep going....lol.  You obviously don't get it.  That's okay.  We're two different people.  "When enough is enough" is something I understand.  You do not seem to.  That's okay.  I do very well in life and have a number of times been reminded that when you have a good life, having more things doesn't mean more happiness.  In fact, it can oddly make one more miserable.  EP can have plenty of homes and cars.  Another few cars won't really change much in his life.  Winning a cup and having a city behind you through thick and thin is priceless.  He'll never get these years back.  It's all good if he leads us to a cup or a series of good runs, but if his play drops consistently, the city will turn on him.  So I guess, selfishly as a fan, I would like to see a winning team.....but that's hard / near impossible to do when you pay players top dollar.

you are trolling right? the only reason luongo deal seem less was coz it's for 12 fuking years? daniel and hank barely took less than market.. their contracts 8% and followed by 11% and 11% of the cap.. so where's the discount? lol demko took a discount?? he signed a 5mil contract after what? less than 60 games in the league? burrows did not take a discount.. he is what he is.. a product of the sedin.. and kesler took the short 5 year contract to get himself to UFA to get paid and really didn't even get the money's worth.. got 2 good season out of it.

 

you literally listed every player that didn't take a discount.. you are clueless what a discount and market price is

[NHL97OneTimer]

Just now, wai_lai416 said:

you are trolling right? the only reason luongo deal seem less was coz it's for 12 fuking years? daniel and hank barely took less than market.. their contracts 8% and followed by 11% and 11% of the cap.. so where's the discount? lol demko took a discount?? he signed a 5mil contract after what? less than 60 games in the league? burrows did not take a discount.. he is what he is.. a product of the sedin.. and kesler took the short 5 year contract to get himself to UFA to get paid and really didn't even get the money's worth.. got 2 good season out of it.

 

you literally listed every player that didn't take a discount.. you are clueless what a discount and market price is

I have an opinion and you're pumping shade my way while asking if I'm a troll?  Sure bud, if hiding behind your screen like the bold keyboard warrior you are makes you feel good, knock yourself out.  I'm quite well aware of what all of those guys could have got based on market conditions at the time.  If you feel differently about it, good for you.  That's why they're called "opinions".  Move along....

[NHL97OneTimer]

3 hours ago, aGENT said:

 

 

The only guys I really want to see us sign is Guentzel ~ $9x7, Marsh $7x3 (or any of the unlikely guys... Stamkos, Reinhart, Lindholm etc). Othereise you're just making lateral moves at inflated UFA prices. No bueno.

 

Sign key guys or look at the secondary market and trades. That's the way to go. Otherwise we're better off spending that money where it will make a bigger difference (Pesce/Tanev/Miller/Carrier etc)

Except Zadorov is likely ~$5M/yr and a difference maker (mostly in terms of how the team plays with him on the team....plus entertainment value).  

[aGENT]

9 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Except Zadorov is likely ~$5M/yr and a difference maker (mostly in terms of how the team plays with him on the team....plus entertainment value).  

 

Sorry, that post is assuming Zadorov back.

[NHL97OneTimer]

3 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Dont agree with you. Mikeyev would get 30 goals with his eyes closed with McDavid. Mik is an everyday nhler that has scored in this league, dont make it as if hes an echl-er journeyman, and if he was, hed get his goals too beside 97

 

Lets just face the facts, Ep40 aint in that tier of elite with the big boys. Hell, hes not even the best forward on his own team

Truth.....people don't want to agree, but it's the truth.  The argument that people will say is that EP is still young and not at his peak yet.  They are paying for the great years ahead.  Might be true but it might not be......it's a big gamble and right now we're paying him like a Conn Smyth candidate.  Is he?

 

I think most of this board completely misses the point that what players are worth on the open market is not what a playoff contender can pay for all players.  EP's contract now sets the comparison for everyone else on the team and the numbers just don't work in a salary cap era unless you have a deep pipeline of young players that will greatly exceed their salary level.  The Canucks are not that team (thanks to not doing a proper rebuild).

 

EP is a special talent but his contract will be a considerable barrier moving forward.

[Alflives]

17 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Truth.....people don't want to agree, but it's the truth.  The argument that people will say is that EP is still young and not at his peak yet.  They are paying for the great years ahead.  Might be true but it might not be......it's a big gamble and right now we're paying him like a Conn Smyth candidate.  Is he?

 

I think most of this board completely misses the point that what players are worth on the open market is not what a playoff contender can pay for all players.  EP's contract now sets the comparison for everyone else on the team and the numbers just don't work in a salary cap era unless you have a deep pipeline of young players that will greatly exceed their salary level.  The Canucks are not that team (thanks to not doing a proper rebuild).

 

EP is a special talent but his contract will be a considerable barrier moving forward.

[Alflives]

28 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Except Zadorov is likely ~$5M/yr and a difference maker (mostly in terms of how the team plays with him on the team....plus entertainment value).  

Zadorov is a 30 year old D man who is what his is. And that’s a 4/5 guy. And On our club he’s a bottom pairing guy who needs a babysitter to cover for his defensive liabilities. 

[RWJC]

1 hour ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Truth.....people don't want to agree, but it's the truth.  The argument that people will say is that EP is still young and not at his peak yet.  They are paying for the great years ahead.  Might be true but it might not be......it's a big gamble and right now we're paying him like a Conn Smyth candidate.  Is he?

 

I think most of this board completely misses the point that what players are worth on the open market is not what a playoff contender can pay for all players.  EP's contract now sets the comparison for everyone else on the team and the numbers just don't work in a salary cap era unless you have a deep pipeline of young players that will greatly exceed their salary level.  The Canucks are not that team (thanks to not doing a proper rebuild).

 

EP is a special talent but his contract will be a considerable barrier moving forward.

EP’s contract is the price anyone would be paying as salaries increase and may end up appearing as a relative standard for a 90-100 point player within a minimum of 3 years time. Say what you will but almost every team would commit those same $ to him in the now if they had the cap space to do so.
 

Are you negating the fact that most teams are locking up their higher end RFA talent to large $ long term deals and most prior to having actually earned it. It’s an anticipated investment and one every team must make in order to retain a nucleus to build from. Market has shifted, as has roster construction. 

BUF isn’t there yet in terms of being a competitor but have already invested long term and large contracts into a core of young players who could converge around the same period of time into their prime form. If so, they then could have a true bounty of talent that most teams would envy. EP is our lone player above 10 mill at this point in time and is our prime asset alongside QH. How can you even complain about that especially in comparison to other teams?!? And what do you think QH is going to command on his next deal? Be prepared, it’ll be in similar range.

 

Edited Wednesday at 07:07 AM by RWJC

[TNucks1]

6 hours ago, filthy animal said:

 

Dont agree with you. Mikeyev would get 30 goals with his eyes closed with McDavid. Mik is an everyday nhler that has scored in this league, dont make it as if hes an echl-er journeyman, and if he was, hed get his goals too beside 97

 

Lets just face the facts, Ep40 aint in that tier of elite with the big boys. Hell, hes not even the best forward on his own team

 

Killed it in the bubble bull shit playoffs, but he'll bounce back, hopefully he's seeing a sports psychologists doctor, helped Mackinnon out a ton. Just cause he got paid n wasn't playing like his usually self, didn't he say he was playing injured?, disappointing considering the fun run we had going, but I believe in pa/Jr n Co. Can't wait for next season n free agency/off season.

 

P.s - sorry for the rant lol

[TNucks1]

On 6/23/2024 at 11:04 AM, bh90 said:

Well I'd argue on cup contending/winning years

 

Florida - Tkachuk, Barkov, Reinhart, Verheaghe(sp?), Rodrigues, Bennett, Tarasenko

 

Edmonton - McDavid, Draisatl, Hyman, RNH (with McDavid & Draisatl being generational talents)

 

Colorado- Mckinnon, Landeskog, Rantanen, Nichuskin, Kadri

 

Tampa Bay - kucherov, Point, Stamkos and more

 

Vegas - Stone, Eichel, Karlsson, Marschesault and more

 

Pittsburgh- Crosby, Malkin, Guentzel with an amazing supporting cast over the years in their cup winning teams

 

I'd argue our trio of Miller, Boeser, Petey are not at that level of thr guys above.

 

Those teams have dominated the playoffs in the last decade and teams that have great depth and a great collection of solid players have not I.e. stars, Islanders, Hurricanes, Jets etc

 

 

 

 

They haven't had playoff experience like alot of the teams, Colorado took a long time of trial n errors with Landy and Mackinnon.

[Bob Long]

9 hours ago, Blitz-Pix said:

 

Unless they offer sheet him to $2.5 - $3.5 million a season and it fucks with our CAP trying to get guys signed. 

If you're going to sign him, try and get it done early so you don't have to match a silly offer sheet from a team that desperately needs a young goalie.

We should be able to resign him in the $1.25 -$1.5 million range.

 

Offer sheet compensation. 

 

• $1,415,741 to $2,145,061 = Third-round pick.
• $2,145,062 to $4,290,125 = Second-round pick

 

(I think) There are probably a few teams out there that would gladly give up a 3rd round pick (Maybe a second) to get a good young goalie

after what he showed in the playoffs.

 

Just my 2 cents 

 

I guess we'll see, but it would also be something we could do right back to that team too.

 

Not sure Silovs would want to do it either, I'm sure he knows ian Clark will have to go with him if he wants longer term success. It would be pretty risky career wise for him to sign one.

[I.Am.Ironman]

If we can't get guentzal I'd be ok with Teurovainen, Stammer, Lindholm (7.5), Reinhart. I'm not keen on offering 8+ to anyone else. If those fish are gone then I think we round out the dcorps with a Pesce like player and add some grit to the bottom 6. We can then head into the season with a little bit of cap space to play with at the deadline.

[Blitz-Pix]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

I guess we'll see, but it would also be something we could do right back to that team too.

 

Not sure Silovs would want to do it either, I'm sure he knows ian Clark will have to go with him if he wants longer term success. It would be pretty risky career wise for him to sign one.

 

I guess I'm of he opinion that if you're planning on resigning him why bother potentially putting yourself in that situation in the first place.

The Canucks control their own fate at this point and can probably get him signed to a team friendly contract, which free's you up to look after 

resigning others and go shopping in free agency.   

 

But I'm not a GM and they didn't ask my opinion. LOL

 

 

  

Edited Wednesday at 03:09 PM by Blitz-Pix

[Bob Long]

Just now, Blitz-Pix said:

 

I guess I'm of he opinion that if you're planning on resigning him why bother potentially putting yourself in that situation in the first place.

The Canucks control their own fate at this point and can probably get him signed to a team friendly contract, which free's you up to look after 

resigning others and go shopping in free agency.      

 

I think we'll see it this week. 

[NHL97OneTimer]

8 hours ago, RWJC said:

EP’s contract is the price anyone would be paying as salaries increase and may end up appearing as a relative standard for a 90-100 point player within a minimum of 3 years time. Say what you will but almost every team would commit those same $ to him in the now if they had the cap space to do so.
 

Are you negating the fact that most teams are locking up their higher end RFA talent to large $ long term deals and most prior to having actually earned it. It’s an anticipated investment and one every team must make in order to retain a nucleus to build from. Market has shifted, as has roster construction. 

BUF isn’t there yet in terms of being a competitor but have already invested long term and large contracts into a core of young players who could converge around the same period of time into their prime form. If so, they then could have a true bounty of talent that most teams would envy. EP is our lone player above 10 mill at this point in time and is our prime asset alongside QH. How can you even complain about that especially in comparison to other teams?!? And what do you think QH is going to command on his next deal? Be prepared, it’ll be in similar range.

 

My point is that it's hard to build a contender with those salaries......easier with salaries like JT Miller and Hughes.  In 5 years from now if the cap is $20M/yr higher, it will be fine if EP is performing at a 90-100 point pace.  But for the next 4 years it will very much limit this team (not on its own, but because of the standard it has set).  Like I said, EP will have to carry this team for me to look back and say it was worth it (which I'm fine with, but don't see it in the cards at this point).