US Politics Thread

[RupertKBD]

13 hours ago, Sabrefan1 said:

I voted for the Green Party candidate in the last 3 elections and yet I'm not a tree hugging communist.

 

Yes and now you can't be blamed for electing Trump or Biden....

 

 

...or can you?

 

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/06/20/democrats-shrug-off-potential-green-party-spoiler-in-2020-329170

 

One thing to bear in mind if you give a shit at all about your democracy.....Republican voters, (and Trump voters in particular) don't vote their conscience. They vote the Republican ticket, even if David Duke is at the top of it.

 

The Dems are far from perfect, but they at least aren't trying to install a king, 250 years after you fought a war to get rid of the last one...

[Bob Long]

4 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

 

Yes and now you can't be blamed for electing Trump or Biden....

 

 

...or can you?

 

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/06/20/democrats-shrug-off-potential-green-party-spoiler-in-2020-329170

 

One thing to bear in mind if you give a shit at all about your democracy.....Republican voters, (and Trump voters in particular) don't vote their conscience. They vote the Republican ticket, even if David Duke is at the top of it.

 

The Dems are far from perfect, but they at least aren't trying to install a king, 250 years after you fought a war to get rid of the last one...

 

Doesn't this article use the same logic people up here use to tell people to not vote NDP?

 

At least he's engaged. I'd be voting green or independent as well if I could vote in the US. 

[RupertKBD]

5 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

Doesn't this article use the same logic people up here use to tell people to not vote NDP?

 

At least he's engaged. I'd be voting green or independent as well if I could vote in the US. 

 

Just one man's opinion, but IMO, there's a time to vote your conscience and a time to do everything to can to keep a dangerous demagogue from office.

 

I realize that it's an opinion not shared by some, but that's why we're here talking about it.

[Bob Long]

Just now, RupertKBD said:

 

Just one man's opinion, but IMO, there's a time to vote your conscience and a time to do everything to can to keep a dangerous demagogue from office.

 

I realize that it's an opinion not shared by some, but that's why we're here talking about it.

 

Yep. We are likely going to see our left help  hand PP power next election... He's no Trump but he's creepy 

 

Id be quite annoyed by the Dems right now, not sure you send them the right message by supporting them.

 

My vote would depend a lot on my state, how tight the races were etc.

[The Arrogant Worms]

MSNBC's Jen Psaki Busts A Myth About Nikki Haley

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/jen-psaki-nikki-haley-myth_n_656f0043e4b0f3e5f44aaae5

 

 

MSNBC’s Jen Psaki on Monday noted how Republican presidential candidate Nikki Haley appears to be “having a moment” by slowly climbing in the polls.

 

There’s hope among some Republicans that the former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations is “a sane, moderate alternative” to GOP front-runner Donald Trump, said the former Biden White House press secretary.

 

“But is she actually?” Psaki then asked.

 

Haley, unlike Trump, doesn’t go on unhinged rants or resort to racist tropes, acknowledged Psaki, but she’d actually govern “a lot closer to Trump and MAGA universe than you might think.”

 

Psaki noted Haley’s support of 6-week abortion bans, her talk of sending U.S. forces into Mexico to fight drug cartels and commentary that Florida’s so-called “Don’t Say Gay” law is not tough enough.

 

“It is definitely a good thing, unquestionably, that she isn’t launching into unhinged rants and echoing the language of dictators, but it’s also important to dig into what she says she would actually do as president.

 

You might find it isn’t so moderate after all.”

[bishopshodan]

If he gets in again, he will be POTUS until he dies.

Then the pretty one will take over. 

 

[RupertKBD]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

Yep. We are likely going to see our left help  hand PP power next election... He's no Trump but he's creepy 

 

Id be quite annoyed by the Dems right now, not sure you send them the right message by supporting them.

 

My vote would depend a lot on my state, how tight the races were etc.

 

Firstly, why? Secondly, do you honestly think electing Trump is a better "message" to send?

 

Disagree about 1000%

[24K]

1 hour ago, RupertKBD said:

 

Just one man's opinion, but IMO, there's a time to vote your conscience and a time to do everything to can to keep a dangerous demagogue from office.

 

I realize that it's an opinion not shared by some, but that's why we're here talking about it.

If you live in a solid blue or red state then vote your conscience as your vote don't matter. Likewise in Canada if your riding is solid Lib, Con, or NDP. 

 

Saberfan probably live in NY so he can vote whatever way he wants as his vote won't matter. 

 

If you live in a swing state/riding than you have to be strategic and hold your nose and vote for the lesser evil. 

[Bob Long]

55 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

 

Firstly, why?

 

Big mistake sticking with Harris. Joe is too old. They dropped the ball on affordability.

 

55 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

Secondly, do you honestly think electing Trump is a better "message" to send?

 

I can have an option on the democrats thats independent of the orange one. 

 

55 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

Disagree about 1000%

 

thats OK, its a big tent 

[RupertKBD]

4 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

Big mistake sticking with Harris. Joe is too old. They dropped the ball on affordability.

 

 

I can have an option on the democrats thats independent of the orange one. 

 

 

thats OK, its a big tent 

 

Fair enough on the first and third points....but I don't know what #2 means.....

[Bob Long]

15 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

 

Fair enough on the first and third points....but I don't know what #2 means.....

 

the part about my vote choice (if I had one in the US) electing Trump. People are allowed to vote their conscience, if a 3rd party is what appeals to them then thats what they should do. It tells the democrats and/or republicans that you don't like either of what they are offering.

 

Blaming people for splitting the vote usually gets NDP supporters up here in a huff. Same thing with democrats in the US. It has a bit of an entitlement vibe to me. Instead of blaming the voter for not doing what they want, maybe the democrats should just put forward better people?

 

[The Arrogant Worms]

 

‘Not Just Rhetoric’: Steve Bannon and Kash Patel Warn ‘Morning Joe’ Staff That Trump’s Threats of Revenge Are Real

https://www.mediaite.com/politics/not-just-rhetoric-steve-bannon-and-kash-patel-warn-morning-joe-staff-that-trumps-threats-of-revenge-are-real/

[The Arrogant Worms]

Mike Johnson Says Republicans Are Blurring Jan. 6 Footage To Protect Rioters From DOJ

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/mike-johnson-jan-6-footage_n_656f46cce4b09331c7f2219e

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, bishopshodan said:

If he gets in again, he will be POTUS until he dies.

Then the pretty one will take over. 

 

 

I mean, everyone can see it coming. If thats what US voters pick, then so be it. 

 

Some progressive voters stayed home because they were mad about not getting Bernie and didn't like Clinton. Maybe they do it again in the US, because Palestine this time, who knows.

 

Not sure it matters anymore. The right has the supreme court, it might get another house majority too. So Biden might be an instant lame duck anyway.

 

US is hooped for a while yet. 

 

[RupertKBD]

2 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

the part about my vote choice (if I had one in the US) electing Trump. People are allowed to vote their conscience, if a 3rd party is what appeals to them then thats what they should do. It tells the democrats and/or republicans that you don't like either of what they are offering.

 

Blaming people for splitting the vote usually gets NDP supporters up here in a huff. Same thing with democrats in the US. It has a bit of an entitlement vibe to me. Instead of blaming the voter for not doing what they want, maybe the democrats should just put forward better people?

 

I see....

 

Well, it's pretty easy to say "you should have done better" to the Dems....but meanwhile, you're still stuck with 4 more years of Donald Trump. IMO, all other considerations should supercede that.

 

But hey, we can all walk with our head held high, saying "we did what we wanted", while Trump fires everyone in government who isn't loyal to him personally and hands large chunks of Ukraine to Putin.....

 

That'll learn the democrats. Next time they won't nominate an old guy.....

[Bob Long]

Just now, RupertKBD said:

I see....

 

Well, it's pretty easy to say "you should have done better" to the Dems....but meanwhile, you're still stuck with 4 more years of Donald Trump. IMO, all other considerations should supercede that.

 

But hey, we can all walk with our head held high, saying "we did what we wanted", while Trump fires everyone in government who isn't loyal to him personally and hands large chunks of Ukraine to Putin.....

 

That'll learn the democrats. Next time they won't nominate an old guy.....

 

if I were living in the US, I'd be much more concerned with my ability to earn, vs who's potus. Because I'd have to be. So I'd be looking as much at my state situation e.g., as anything else. 

 

We're maybe a bit over focused on Trump here since we tend to see the US as a big block, but I think a lot of people identify more with their state situation? maybe @Sabrefan1 can shed some light on that.

 

How else can a voter send a message, other than by voting? 

 

I totally get why democrats are not happy with Biden and Harris. Its not a secret. Yet they refuse to at least move out Harris to give themselves a better chance. Why should voters just swallow that?

[bishopshodan]

4 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

I mean, everyone can see it coming. If thats what US voters pick, then so be it. 

 

Some progressive voters stayed home because they were mad about not getting Bernie and didn't like Clinton. Maybe they do it again in the US, because Palestine this time, who knows.

 

Not sure it matters anymore. The right has the supreme court, it might get another house majority too. So Biden might be an instant lame duck anyway.

 

US is hooped for a while yet. 

 

 

It's weird that many say that its only the progressives supporting Palastine. I have seen the reports of muslim leaders but I was watching fox yesterday....yes, fox.

 

I wanted to see their spin on Isreal and was really surprised. They had a cousin of an Isreali hostage on and he was condemning Isreals approach. Says it is gong to get all the remaining hostages killed. I was confused, everyone tells me that the left are the only ones ripping on Isreal.

So, I dont know how much effect that will have on the next election. Right and left, they both have varied opinions on that conflict.

 

If DT wins. The US will practice isolationism and will turn into a dictatorship, It will greatly, hugely even, impact the rest of the world. Being so close to them...when that big ship goes down...we could be sucked under.

 

 

 

[Bob Long]

9 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

It's weird that many say that its only the progressives supporting Palastine. I have seen the reports of muslim leaders but I was watching fox yesterday....yes, fox.

 

I wanted to see their spin on Isreal and was really surprised. They had a cousin of an Isreali hostage on and he was condemning Isreals approach. Says it is gong to get all the remaining hostages killed. I was confused, everyone tells me that the left are the only ones ripping on Isreal.

So, I dont know how much effect that will have on the next election. Right and left, they both have varied opinions on that conflict.

 

I mentioned the progressives specifically because they are so important to the democratic vote. I doubt many conservative voters would be swayed, they tend to vote con no matter what. 

 

9 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

If DT wins. The US will practice isolationism and will turn into a dictatorship, It will greatly, hugely even, impact the rest of the world. Being so close to them...when that big ship goes down...we could be sucked under.

 

 

 

 

Its possible. I think more likely the orange clown goes on his revenge tour and we just end up dealing on a Canada-state level anyway, like we pretty much always do. 

 

I guess I'm just burned out on the whole thing as well. If this is what the US wants to do with itself, I kind of don't give a shit anymore. 

 

 

 

[RupertKBD]

19 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

if I were living in the US, I'd be much more concerned with my ability to earn, vs who's potus. Because I'd have to be. So I'd be looking as much at my state situation e.g., as anything else. 

 

We're maybe a bit over focused on Trump here since we tend to see the US as a big block, but I think a lot of people identify more with their state situation? maybe @Sabrefan1 can shed some light on that.

 

How else can a voter send a message, other than by voting? 

 

I totally get why democrats are not happy with Biden and Harris. Its not a secret. Yet they refuse to at least move out Harris to give themselves a better chance. Why should voters just swallow that?

 

Who's the better choice? If you dump the black woman, how do African Americans and women in general react to that? If there were an obvious choice, then I'd be with you, but I don't see who it is. The grass isn't always greener.....

 

As far as your first statement, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me....unless you are of the opinion that you would have a better chance to "earn" under a Trump presidency than a Biden presidency.

 

That fact that every Republican Senator voted against the American Rescue Plan and the Inflation Reduction Act, yet voted for a tax break for the wealthy that added a Trillion dollars to the US deficit, tells me that the assertion is questionable at best.

[bishopshodan]

6 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

Its possible. I think more likely the orange clown goes on his revenge tour and we just end up dealing on a Canada-state level anyway, like we pretty much always do. 

 

I guess I'm just burned out on the whole thing as well. If this is what the US wants to do with itself, I kind of don't give a shit anymore. 

 

US isolationism will affect us.

 

I hear you about being burnt out...I've thought Trump was a f*ckwad since the Apprentice. His legions are blind, i cant understand the support. 

 

One good thing I heard lately is that an average Trump supporter, most are male, have a hard time getting dates. 

Keep it up women in the US! if there is one way to change a mans mind...it's below the belt.

[Bob Long]

Just now, RupertKBD said:

 

Who's the better choice? If you dump the black woman, how do African Americans and women in general react to that? If there were an obvious choice, then I'd be with you, but I don't see who it is. The grass isn't always greener.....

 

how about someone not polling in the low 30s in popularity?  https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/approval/kamala-harris/

 

Surely there is a better option. 

 

Just now, RupertKBD said:

 

As far as your first statement, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me....unless you are of the opinion that you would have a better chance to "earn" under a Trump presidency than a Biden presidency.

 

I think a lot of Americans would see it that way.

 

 

Just now, RupertKBD said:

That fact that every Republican Senator voted against the American Rescue Plan and the Inflation Reduction Act, yet voted for a tax break for the wealthy that added a Trillion dollars to the US deficit, tells me that the assertion is questionable at best.

 

I just don't think enough US voters actually care about this stuff. They care more about their personal finances. They'll vote that way more often that not imo.

 

 

[Bob Long]

Just now, bishopshodan said:

 

US isolationism will affect us.

 

it could, but we're so tied in to individual states I'm not sure how easily it can be undone. We're also an after thought for most Americans. 

 

Just now, bishopshodan said:

I hear you about being burnt out...I've thought Trump was a f*ckwad since the Apprentice. His legions are blind, i cant understand the support. 

 

if they aren't swayed now to change their support, they never will be. 

 

Dem's otoh have to contend with many different viewpoints. It can be their downfall. 

 

I'm also not accepting the idea that I have to be forced into voting democrat because Trump. Thats weak. Its what Poilievre is doing, he's all about "I'm not Trudeau". Well so what? whats his ideas?

 

Like I said above, I'd probably be voting independent if I were an American. I don't think the dem's are doing a good job. 

 

Just now, bishopshodan said:

 

 

One good thing I heard lately is that an average Trump supporter, most are male, have a hard time getting dates. 

Keep it up women in the US! if there is one way to change a mans mind...it's below the belt.

 

[RupertKBD]

Just now, Bob Long said:

 

how about someone not polling in the low 30s in popularity?  https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/approval/kamala-harris/

 

Surely there is a better option. 

 

 

I think a lot of Americans would see it that way.

 

 

 

I just don't think enough US voters actually care about this stuff. They care more about their personal finances. They'll vote that way more often that not imo.

 

 

 

#1 - Okay. Who?

#2 - Sure, but a lot of them think George Soros and Hugo Chavez used satellites to change Trump votes to Biden votes. I thought we were talking about how you would vote....

#3 - They don't care about the facts? Agreed.....but I don't see how that refutes my point.

[4petesake]

6 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

US isolationism will affect us.

 

I hear you about being burnt out...I've thought Trump was a f*ckwad since the Apprentice. His legions are blind, i cant understand the support. 

 

One good thing I heard lately is that an average Trump supporter, most are male, have a hard time getting dates. 

Keep it up women in the US! if there is one way to change a mans mind...it's below the belt.

 

 

 

[Bob Long]

Just now, RupertKBD said:

 

#1 - Okay. Who?

 

maybe Whitmer or Newsome? someone who at least looks like they could do better in the polls and competently take over if Joe falls off his bike. 

 

Just now, RupertKBD said:

#2 - Sure, but a lot of them think George Soros and Hugo Chavez used satellites to change Trump votes to Biden votes. I thought we were talking about how you would vote....

 

I'd likely be looking 3rd party. Dunno what to say about anyone that likes MTG theories. 

 

Just now, RupertKBD said:

#3 - They don't care about the facts? Agreed.....but I don't see how that refutes my point.

 

I'm not sure that they rise to the level of importance that effects their vote.