US Politics Thread

[Rob Eh]

I haven't tried it yet but it obviously works.

[Alflives]

5 minutes ago, Rob Eh said:

 

I am.

Maybe Alf should too? 

[the destroyer of worlds]

 

[Canuckle]

12 hours ago, Bob Long said:

I applaud the effort. I hope young US voters do go shake the damn thing up, otherwise it really will be the same old crap. 

And that's kinda the point. Sure, throw your vote at whatever person claims to want to kill us a little less. But I caution do not put your faith in the demopublican political system like it will lead to some sort of revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people. Representative "democracy" aka Oligarchy is not the method to force that sort of change; It comes from the grass roots-- labour movements, social movements-civil rights movements, suffrage movements, etc. etc. which exist OUTSIDE the state system. But I digress. Yes, shake the thing up. And I'd advocate using a Diversity of Tactics to do so.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diversity_of_tactics

[Canuckle]

9 hours ago, Warhippy said:

One of my favourite moments from this current manifestation of the trump thread or the original CDC US election/Trump thread is how there is a poster here literally showing and proving to people that no matter WHO is in charge in the US (and canada for that matter) that the system that has been created is literally built against the people and no matter who is in charge things will not change for the better in the ways that the part du jour promises.

 

You have outliers in both parties who seem to walk the walk and genuinely care and genuinely are tryint to effect a change.  but by and large you have people who are fully enmeshed in the system so much that they have convinced people they are trying to change things when they're actually propagating it and making things worse.

 

The truth is very simple.  Democrat or Republican/. Lib or Con.  The bottom line is that people can live and act as both.  Believe and dislike both while wearing the hat of a different party than their statements may present.  That at the end of the day, changing the ass in the seat means does and changes nothing because the party in power will continue to do what the system they've created wants to their own betterment no matter how much lip service is paid.

 

Quite literally going back 100 years, both parties have flipped and flopped on issues so much that they've both been right wing.  they've both been left wing.  They've both effectively done nothing but screw the people and while they promise to change and fix it, in fact always get in to power and change absolutely nothing.

 

All while people believe the lies that their choice of pony is somehow fighting for them.

 

This is my new favourite thing because it's literally so clear, so obvious and so blatant that it should be common knowledge.  Instead, ironically people are arguing that this individual is wrong while pretending that somehow one party is better than the other in that the party they follow is believed to magically finding their way in to power and changing things for the better when they haven't changed much of anything except the diapers of their older decades long seated senators and congress people 

 

Love this for y'all

 

I think you and I can be friends.

[Mac]

On 10/7/2023 at 2:40 PM, StrayDog said:

I'll try to explain it to you.

It means that trans people deserve to have the same rights as everyone else. 

I hope that was clear enough for you. Please let me know if there's something you didn't understand.

I understand what you far left fringe feel, that severely mentally unstable people can call themselves whatever they want.

 

How sad.

[4petesake]

16 minutes ago, Mac said:

I understand what you far left fringe feel, that severely mentally unstable people can call themselves whatever they want.

 

How sad.

 

Busy dropping turds in every thread I see.

 

How sad.

[StrayDog]

4 hours ago, Mac said:

I understand what you far left fringe feel, that severely mentally unstable people can call themselves whatever they want.

 

How sad.

I understand that you far right fringe don't comprehend empathy and allowing people who are different from you to be who they are. It has to be difficult not to understand basic human decency.

I'd say it was sad, but sadness infers that I care about how you feel when you dismiss the "other". That mentality deserves no sympathy or kindness. 

But thank you for showing yourself. It's better to know where the bigots are than them being hidden under their rocks.

 

[Gurn]

[Bob Long]

8 hours ago, Canuckle said:

And that's kinda the point. Sure, throw your vote at whatever person claims to want to kill us a little less. But I caution do not put your faith in the demopublican political system like it will lead to some sort of revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people. Representative "democracy" aka Oligarchy is not the method to force that sort of change; It comes from the grass roots-- labour movements, social movements-civil rights movements, suffrage movements, etc. etc. which exist OUTSIDE the state system. But I digress. Yes, shake the thing up. And I'd advocate using a Diversity of Tactics to do so.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diversity_of_tactics

 

But see here's the thing about US politics in particular - almost no one votes in the candidate primaries. If the u40s got organized they could stack the Dems with the people that really would make a difference. 

 

People have to get involved early. By the time you wait for a general election in the US it's too late.

[Playoff Beered]

9 hours ago, Canuckle said:

And that's kinda the point. Sure, throw your vote at whatever person claims to want to kill us a little less. But I caution do not put your faith in the demopublican political system like it will lead to some sort of revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people. Representative "democracy" aka Oligarchy is not the method to force that sort of change; It comes from the grass roots-- labour movements, social movements-civil rights movements, suffrage movements, etc. etc. which exist OUTSIDE the state system. But I digress. Yes, shake the thing up. And I'd advocate using a Diversity of Tactics to do so.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diversity_of_tactics

 

Diversity of tactics like the anarchists used in early 1930's Spain and Germany? That got us Franco and Hitler.

 

Nobody except MAGA's is expecting their politicians to bring about "revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people." but your message that it's all the same allows fascists to take over.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Playoff Beered

[Canuckle]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

But see here's the thing about US politics in particular - almost no one votes in the candidate primaries. If the u40s got organized they could stack the Dems with the people that really would make a difference. 

 

People have to get involved early. By the time you wait for a general election in the US it's too late.

 

Sigh. That's not really true.

 

Primaries are essentially rigged due to how delegates and superdelegates with the Democratic National Committee work. The Republican National Committee is even worse.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/04/08/the-primaries-are-rigged-commentary.html

[Bob Long]

16 minutes ago, Canuckle said:

 

Sigh. That's not really true.

 

Primaries are essentially rigged due to how delegates and superdelegates with the Democratic National Committee work. The Republican National Committee is even worse.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/04/08/the-primaries-are-rigged-commentary.html

 

Ok then get independent candidates elected. 

[Canuckle]

1 hour ago, Playoff Beered said:

Diversity of tactics like the anarchists used in early 1930's Spain and Germany? That got us Franco and Hitler.

 

Hahahahahhaha. You have NO idea what you're talking about.Just wait until you find out who bankrolled Hitler!

 

And no offense you strike me as a huge coward.

 

Never step out of line. Tow the line. Never defend yourself against oppression or they'll just do something worse!! Don't unionize. Don't fight for civil rights. Blah blah blah.

 

Laughable.

 

1 hour ago, Playoff Beered said:

Nobody except MAGA's is expecting their politicians to bring about "revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people." but your message that it's all the same allows fascists to take over.

 

Your conception of history needs serious remedy, mate. 

[Canuckle]

15 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

Ok then get independent candidates elected. 

 

Sigh. First past the post voting system is a bitch, man.  Even a progressive candidate just plays spoiler affect stealing votes from the candidate that would closer reflect the person you'd otherwise choose.

 

 

And here's one on the electoral college:

 

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Canuckle

[Playoff Beered]

6 minutes ago, Canuckle said:

Hahahahahhaha. You have NO idea what you're talking about.Just wait until you find out who bankrolled Hitler!

 

And no offense you strike me as a huge coward.

 

Never step out of line. Tow the line. Never defend yourself against oppression or they'll just do something worse!! Don't unionize. Don't fight for civil rights. Blah blah blah.

 

Laughable.

 

Your conception of history needs serious remedy, mate. 

 

Hit a sore spot? You need to attack me and make ridiculous assumptions? 

[Bob Long]

12 minutes ago, Canuckle said:

 

Sigh. First past the post voting system is a bitch, man.  Even a progressive candidate just plays spoiler affect stealing votes from the candidate that would closer reflect the person you'd otherwise choose.

 

 

And here's one on the electoral college:

 

 

 

Any excuse not to get active then? Bannon proved how the primaries can be manipulated easily. Left side voters need to get better organized.

 

Do you really think some sort of anarchist takeover would be easier or better?

[Canuckle]

4 minutes ago, Playoff Beered said:

 

Hit a sore spot? You need to attack me and make ridiculous assumptions? 

 

You're the one fighting so hard not to discuss the political system in the US buddy. Handwaving and making ridiculous claims, supplying half truths and statist propaganda.

 

Hit a nerve? Yeah. I don't like snake oil salesman.

[Playoff Beered]

3 minutes ago, Canuckle said:

You're the one fighting so hard not to discuss the political system in the US buddy. Handwaving and making ridiculous claims, supplying half truths and statist propaganda.

 

Hit a nerve? Yeah. I don't like snake oil salesman.

 

Nock it off, I'm not fighting to stop you from discussing anything.

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Playoff Beered

[Canuckle]

6 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

Any excuse not to get active then? Bannon proved how the primaries can be manipulated easily. Left side voters need to get better organized.

 

Do you really think some sort of anarchist takeover would be easier or better?

 

I had to go back and look and see who I originally replied to. It was to you.I already explained it.. did you not read my reply?  Heres ill post it again.

"And that's kinda the point. Sure, throw your vote at whatever person claims to want to kill us a little less. But I caution do not put your faith in the demopublican political system like it will lead to some sort of revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people. Representative "democracy" aka Oligarchy is not the method to force that sort of change; It comes from the grass roots-- labour movements, social movements-civil rights movements, suffrage movements, etc. etc. which exist OUTSIDE the state system. But I digress. Yes, shake the thing up. And I'd advocate using a Diversity of Tactics to do so.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diversity_of_tactics

 

This isn't about "takeover." This is about using effective tactics for social change, whatever that need may be.

 

Hate to have to post this yet again due to how the thread context works in this place, but it's all about class conflict.

 

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Class_conflict

 

[Bob Long]

2 minutes ago, Canuckle said:

 

I had to go back and look and see who I originally replied to. It was to you.I already explained it.. did you not read my reply?  Heres ill post it again.

"And that's kinda the point. Sure, throw your vote at whatever person claims to want to kill us a little less. But I caution do not put your faith in the demopublican political system like it will lead to some sort of revolutionary change and work in the interests of regular people. Representative "democracy" aka Oligarchy is not the method to force that sort of change; It comes from the grass roots-- labour movements, social movements-civil rights movements, suffrage movements, etc. etc. which exist OUTSIDE the state system. But I digress. Yes, shake the thing up. And I'd advocate using a Diversity of Tactics to do so.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diversity_of_tactics

 

This isn't about "takeover." This is about using effective tactics for social change, whatever that need may be.

 

Hate to have to post this yet again due to how the thread context works in this place, but it's all about class conflict.

 

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Class_conflict

 

 

No I read it. Zero chance of this happening in the US.

 

 

[Canuckle]

7 minutes ago, Playoff Beered said:

 

Nock it off, I'm not fighting to stop you from discussing anything.

 

 

You've been fighting tooth and nail against the discussion, making false claims of logical fallacies when you've been doing exactly that the entire time. But rather than be open to a dialogue about the political system, this is what you choose?

 

It's actually sad.

[Playoff Beered]

1 minute ago, Canuckle said:

You've been fighting tooth and nail against the discussion, making false claims of logical fallacies when you've been doing exactly that the entire time. But rather than be open to a dialogue about the political system, this is what you choose?

 

It's actually sad.

 

[Canuckle]

6 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

No I read it. Zero chance of this happening in the US.

 

Zero chance of what happening?

 

Social movements, labour movements, civil rights movements, suffrage movements forcing the state to change policies, repeal laws, provide protections, right to vote...?

 

 That's called history, my dude.

 

So again I ask, zero chance of WHAT happening? What is it you think I'm saying here?

[Bob Long]

2 minutes ago, Canuckle said:

 

Zero chance of what happening?

 

Social movements, labour movements, civil rights movements, suffrage movements forcing the state to change policies, repeal laws, provide protections, right to vote...?

 

 That's called history, my dude.

 

So again I ask, zero chance of WHAT happening? What is it you think I'm saying here?

 

Much of that happened under the current voting system in the US. 

 

You seem to think voting in the US is a useless exercise.