24K Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 39 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: You still haven't explained how he got the ladder to climb up to the roof, how the cop who saw him didn't even bother to alert the secret service, how he had 3 minutes to set up and aim his shot and actually take it before the counter sniper team shot back. And I don't believe you need to wait until someone takes a shot before you can take them out. That makes no sense. Are you telling me in Pennsylvanis you can point a gun at someone and the other person cannot fire back in self defence until they are shot at? Serioulsy? Title 18 - PA General Assembly (state.pa.us) § 505. Use of force in self-protection. (a) Use of force justifiable for protection of the person.--The use of force upon or toward another person is justifiable when the actor believes that such force is immediately necessary for the purpose of protecting himself against the use of unlawful force by such other person on the present occasion. You can 100% take someone out if they are pointing a gun at you. It's called Stand Your Ground Law... I don't know where he got the ladder. Maybe he brought it himself. It ain't like a ladder is hard to get or even a concern. Someone can easily bring their own ladder and get ontop of a building just to get a better view. Cop not alerting usss is not surprising. These people don't coordinate between themselves. Due to incompetence or just don't know the chain if command or just want to be top dog. US agencies don't talk to each other all the time. Your stand your ground law applies if you have someone directly in front of you aiming. This guy is so far away from anyone you don't know if he is actually aiming at Trump or someone or just using the scope to play security. Not like GOP love to play law enforcement with their toys. Edit: read an ABC article that go over the facts. Local police spotted him and transmitted through airwaves that there is someone suspicious and possibly another altercation happening at the same time. They are likely concentrating trying to find him among the crowd and did not bother to look at top of building. My theory now. Anyone that did glimpse or reported him on top of the building may have been interpreted by local police to be one of there own trying to locate the suspicious person from a top down view as they were stationed inside the same building. Hence lack of immediate action. As far as ladder, it is believed the culprit bought a ladder but law enforcement said it wasn't found at the scene and they do not believe it was used if there was one. Open question there still. Edited July 17 by 24K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 7 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: You still haven't explained how he got the ladder to climb up to the roof, how the cop who saw him didn't even bother to alert the secret service, how he had 3 minutes to set up and aim his shot and actually take it before the counter sniper team shot back. And I don't believe you need to wait until someone takes a shot before you can take them out. That makes no sense. Are you telling me in Pennsylvanis you can point a gun at someone and the other person cannot fire back in self defence until they are shot at? Serioulsy? Title 18 - PA General Assembly (state.pa.us) § 505. Use of force in self-protection. (a) Use of force justifiable for protection of the person.--The use of force upon or toward another person is justifiable when the actor believes that such force is immediately necessary for the purpose of protecting himself against the use of unlawful force by such other person on the present occasion. You can 100% take someone out if they are pointing a gun at you. It's called Stand Your Ground Law... I believe you are correct regarding Pennsylvania law. I'll state the obvious and say he bought the ladder at Home Depot. I've heard he climbed atop an air conditioning unit to gain access to the roof. I have searched for, but have not found, any proof he actually used the ladder. If he did, are you sure there where metal detectors in the area outside of the main perimeter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Satchmo said: I believe you are correct regarding Pennsylvania law. I'll state the obvious and say he bought the ladder at Home Depot. I've heard he climbed atop an air conditioning unit to gain access to the roof. I have searched for, but have not found, any proof he actually used the ladder. If he did, are you sure there where metal detectors in the area outside of the main perimeter? If you look at the picture, the ladder was already set up. He didn't buy it at Home Depot. The ladder is at least 8' high. Or are you thinking that he was walking around with an 8' foot ladder AND an AR-15 and nobody noticed him or alerted the secret service? Edited July 17 by Elias Pettersson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: If you look at the picture, the ladder was already set up. He didn't buy it at Home Depot. The ladder is at least 8' high. Or are you thinking that he was walking around with an 8' foot ladder AND an AR-15 and nobody noticed him or alerted the secret service? I do not know who Tayler Tylor is but a quick look at his most recent tweets does not inspire me to believe him at all. If that is a valid picture does the fact that it cannot be seen anywhere else point to a deep state conspiracy? EDIT - I see you edited and added the same picture posted by the Daily Mail (the most trusted name in journalism ) Edited July 17 by Satchmo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 49 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: You still haven't explained how he got the ladder to climb up to the roof, how the cop who saw him didn't even bother to alert the secret service, how he had 3 minutes to set up and aim his shot and actually take it before the counter sniper team shot back. And I don't believe you need to wait until someone takes a shot before you can take them out. That makes no sense. Are you telling me in Pennsylvanis you can point a gun at someone and the other person cannot fire back in self defence until they are shot at? Serioulsy? Title 18 - PA General Assembly (state.pa.us) § 505. Use of force in self-protection. (a) Use of force justifiable for protection of the person.--The use of force upon or toward another person is justifiable when the actor believes that such force is immediately necessary for the purpose of protecting himself against the use of unlawful force by such other person on the present occasion. You can 100% take someone out if they are pointing a gun at you. It's called Stand Your Ground Law... It's not worth arguing over. I've posted about Biden's Secretary Mayorkas saying the USSS screwed up and even posted a link this morning where the Director of the USSS finally changed her tune and admitted the USSS was responsible. It's game over when the Secretary of Homeland Security and the Director of the Secret Service both admit that the USSS screwed the pooch. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/rnc-night-one-ratings-down-5-million-viewers-compared-to-2016-despite-dramatic-trump-appearance/ar-BB1q8WC2?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=6568f4c3e0c44ce6a42639d17cb79c78&ei=81 "Despite Donald Trump’s dramatic appearance days after an assassination attempt, the opening night of the Republican National Convention drew in five million fewer viewers than the first night of the convention back in 2016 – when he became the party’s presidential candidate for the first time. According to Nielsen, Monday night’s coverage of the event in Milwaukee drew 18.1 million viewers across 12 broadcasters and cable networks, down from 23 million viewers across seven networks in 2016. Fox News had the highest ratings for its RNC coverage, with 6.9 million viewers as of 10pm on Monday. --------------------- MAL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 29 minutes ago, Satchmo said: I do not know who Tayler Tylor is but a quick look at his most recent tweets does not inspire me to believe him at all. If that is a valid picture does the fact that it cannot be seen anywhere else point to a deep state conspiracy? EDIT - I see you edited and added the same picture posted by the Daily Mail (the most trusted name in journalism ) So now the picture is fake? Is that what you're running with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 Just now, Gurn said: https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/rnc-night-one-ratings-down-5-million-viewers-compared-to-2016-despite-dramatic-trump-appearance/ar-BB1q8WC2?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=6568f4c3e0c44ce6a42639d17cb79c78&ei=81 "Despite Donald Trump’s dramatic appearance days after an assassination attempt, the opening night of the Republican National Convention drew in five million fewer viewers than the first night of the convention back in 2016 – when he became the party’s presidential candidate for the first time. According to Nielsen, Monday night’s coverage of the event in Milwaukee drew 18.1 million viewers across 12 broadcasters and cable networks, down from 23 million viewers across seven networks in 2016. Fox News had the highest ratings for its RNC coverage, with 6.9 million viewers as of 10pm on Monday. --------------------- MAL Not surprising. Like with Obama's 2nd run, people are much less excited about Trump his third time around. That's the best opening for Biden. He needs to get his base energized and to the voting polls in November. Easier said than done however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 1 minute ago, Sabrefan1 said: Not surprising. Like with Obama's 2nd run, people are much less excited about Trump his third time around. That's the best opening for Biden. He needs to get his base energized and to the voting polls in November. Easier said than done however. I used to be convinced Joe would stick it out, to be the nominee, but he is recently quoted saying words like 'If the doctors tell me...' yada yada leaves enough wiggle room, he can step back, without looking like a quitter; something that is important to folk of certain generations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrefan1 Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 4 minutes ago, Gurn said: I used to be convinced Joe would stick it out, to be the nominee, but he is recently quoted saying words like 'If the doctors tell me...' yada yada leaves enough wiggle room, he can step back, without looking like a quitter; something that is important to folk of certain generations. Good catch. I didn't notice that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 6 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: So now the picture is fake? Is that what you're running with? I am neither stating it nor fully discounting it. Certainly image fakery is an all too common thing these days. I am mostly questioning why only questionable sources are showing it. (as I typed that sentence I realized you are showing it too but I am merely questioning the validity your sources.) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 5 minutes ago, Satchmo said: I am neither stating it nor fully discounting it. Certainly image fakery is an all too common thing these days. I am mostly questioning why only questionable sources are showing it. (as I typed that sentence I realized you are showing it too but I am merely questioning the validity your sources.) According to CNN, Crooks purchased a 5' ladder and 50 rounds of ammo the morning of the rally. He drove to the rally in a Hyundai Sonata. We are supposed to believe that he had a 5' ladder, a rifle, 50 rounds of ammo, a bomb and a bomb detector, all in his car as he got to the rally. We are also supposed to believe that Crooks entered the perimeter of the venue carrying the 5' ladder and an AR-15 rifle along with the ammo, and nobody saw him, nothing was suspicious and nobody said a word to the Secret Service. This is what CNN is telling you. Here is a demonstration of Thomas Crooks entering the outside of the venue. This is what they want you to believe... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarneyKook Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 56 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: If you look at the picture, the ladder was already set up. He didn't buy it at Home Depot. The ladder is at least 8' high. Or are you thinking that he was walking around with an 8' foot ladder AND an AR-15 and nobody noticed him or alerted the secret service? When was this photo taken? Maybe this ladder was used by police after the incident to get up to the body? Or maybe it was used by police prior to the event to check out the roof? Maybe they were supposed to stay on the roof? Was Trump late as usual and on a hot day so the police came down? The shooter was not carrying a ladder around when first spotted. Where was his car located? Was it near the buildings where he could grab it and set it up without being seen. Lots of questions 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6of1_halfdozenofother Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 1 hour ago, Curmudgeon said: I don't think it is about competence. I believe it is more about turf. Every agency wants to be the lead dog, so there is inter-agency rivalry all the time. The cops don't want to take orders from the FBI, which doesn't want to take orders from the USSS which thinks it is the supreme decision maker. This leads to different protocols and uncertainty as to who does what and when. Egos get in the way. The attempt on Trump clearly demonstrated this disconnect among the law enforcement and protection agencies. Everybody was waiting for someone to tell them what to do. Massive failure. Reminds me of this: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the destroyer of worlds Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 7 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: According to CNN, Crooks purchased a 5' ladder and 50 rounds of ammo the morning of the rally. He drove to the rally in a Hyundai Sonata. We are supposed to believe that he had a 5' ladder, a rifle, 50 rounds of ammo, a bomb and a bomb detector, all in his car as he got to the rally. We are also supposed to believe that Crooks entered the perimeter of the venue carrying the 5' ladder and an AR-15 rifle along with the ammo, and nobody saw him, nothing was suspicious and nobody said a word to the Secret Service. This is what CNN is telling you. Here is a demonstration of Thomas Crooks entering the outside of the venue. This is what they want you to believe... The bolded is the whole problem with your whole assessment of what happened. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: According to CNN, Crooks purchased a 5' ladder and 50 rounds of ammo the morning of the rally. He drove to the rally in a Hyundai Sonata. We are supposed to believe that he had a 5' ladder, a rifle, 50 rounds of ammo, a bomb and a bomb detector, all in his car as he got to the rally. We are also supposed to believe that Crooks entered the perimeter of the venue carrying the 5' ladder and an AR-15 rifle along with the ammo, and nobody saw him, nothing was suspicious and nobody said a word to the Secret Service. This is what CNN is telling you. Here is a demonstration of Thomas Crooks entering the outside of the venue. This is what they want you to believe... Mr. I Meme Therefore I Am's twitter feed is as dumb as that other guy's but what the hell.... I have seen credible evidence that he bought a 5 foot ladder at Home Depot. I have seen no proof from anyone trustworthy that he actually used a ladder of any length. Many rounds of ammo and the only bomb material I've read of was found in his car. The mystery ladder is never mentioned by anyone except these twitter experts. I tire of this conversation Petey. I think you are jumping to conclusions. You do not. So, we disagree. Status Quo it would seem. Edited July 17 by Satchmo typo 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BarneyKook Posted July 17 Popular Post Share Posted July 17 extra extra, get your $299 Trump Assassination sneakers here, limited to only 5000 pairs, max three per customer Never leave them behind *made in China https://gettrumpsneakers.com/products/fight-fight-fight-high-top-sneaker 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said: If you look at the picture, the ladder was already set up. He didn't buy it at Home Depot. The ladder is at least 8' high. Or are you thinking that he was walking around with an 8' foot ladder AND an AR-15 and nobody noticed him or alerted the secret service? A ladder... on the grounds of a park well you've convinced me. Fucking moon landing all over again. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 4 minutes ago, BarneyKook said: extra extra, get your $299 Trump Assassination sneakers here, limited to only 5000 pairs, max three per customer Never leave them behind *made in China https://gettrumpsneakers.com/products/fight-fight-fight-high-top-sneaker I'm waiting for the ear muffs. Well, muff. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: According to CNN, Crooks purchased a 5' ladder and 50 rounds of ammo the morning of the rally. He drove to the rally in a Hyundai Sonata. We are supposed to believe that he had a 5' ladder, a rifle, 50 rounds of ammo, a bomb and a bomb detector, all in his car as he got to the rally. We are also supposed to believe that Crooks entered the perimeter of the venue carrying the 5' ladder and an AR-15 rifle along with the ammo, and nobody saw him, nothing was suspicious and nobody said a word to the Secret Service. This is what CNN is telling you. Here is a demonstration of Thomas Crooks entering the outside of the venue. This is what they want you to believe... Perhaps he scouted the area ahead of time and formulated his plan? Perhaps he hid the ladder earlier in the day? Perhaps he looked like a nerdy kid in an open carry state and no one batted an eye until he got on that roof. Nope, deep state, inside job, pizza gate, babies blood, pedophile ring..... Edited July 17 by JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curmudgeon Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Satchmo said: I have seen credible evidence that he bought a 5 foot ladder Home Depot. I have seen no proof from anyone trustworthy that he actually used a ladder of any length. The ladder in the picture was not a five-foot ladder. A five foot ladder wouldn't come close to reaching the eaves on that building. And as far as the photograph goes, how do we know it wasn't put there after the fact by someone with some sort of agenda? Or that the ladder was put there by the police and USSS personnel who climbed up onto the roof after the kid was dead? In my experience, the delay in releasing information about the shooting from the FBI/USSS/Local Police comes from one of three alternatives: 1) Complete and utter incompetence due to turf wars and egos, or 2) A massive coverup to shift blame elsewhere, or 3) Both of the above. Edited July 17 by Curmudgeon 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 3 hours ago, bishopshodan said: Welp, fook Starbucks. I'm gonna have some extra pocket cash. Thier sludge is expensive. you could go to Tim's but they are Wendy's now, hate to break it to you: https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/wendy-s-co/totals?id=D000000802 This is a neat website that tracks political donations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 2 minutes ago, Bob Long said: you could go to Tim's but they are Wendy's now, hate to break it to you: https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/wendy-s-co/totals?id=D000000802 This is a neat website that tracks political donations. A thing that has been nagging at me for awhile now is companies that tell you they donate X% of their profits to--- whatever. first thing that crosses my mind is "How about I deduct that % from my bill, and call it even? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 Just now, Gurn said: A thing that has been nagging at me for awhile now is companies that tell you they donate X% of their profits to--- whatever. first thing that crosses my mind is "How about I deduct that % from my bill, and call it even? if only. Just checked Starbucks, turns out money that flows through them actually goes far more to democrats than republicans: https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/starbucks-corp/totals?id=D000037780 So... that tweet didn't tell the whole story. I'm shocked. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 50 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: According to CNN, Crooks purchased a 5' ladder and 50 rounds of ammo the morning of the rally. He drove to the rally in a Hyundai Sonata. We are supposed to believe that he had a 5' ladder, a rifle, 50 rounds of ammo, a bomb and a bomb detector, all in his car as he got to the rally. We are also supposed to believe that Crooks entered the perimeter of the venue carrying the 5' ladder and an AR-15 rifle along with the ammo, and nobody saw him, nothing was suspicious and nobody said a word to the Secret Service. This is what CNN is telling you. Here is a demonstration of Thomas Crooks entering the outside of the venue. This is what they want you to believe... I think you greatly underestimate the iadequacy of local law enforcement and thd inefficiency and clusterfuckedness of inter agency communication in rhd US 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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