Canadian Politics Thread

[Elias Pettersson]

8 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

I'll leave the stats convo to you an OP...

 

but thanks for saying this...

It's kinda what I am seeing, he seems to be needlessly alienating a big group of voters. 

I will never see Canada in a bad light and I will never take up a weak victim mentality. I will stay in this country ( with my massive net worth) and be part of what can get us through these growing pains. 

I am surprised that you think the Libs would win with a different leader. I've wanted them to do that for a while but I wonder if the damage is now already done. JT has overstayed his welcome and lost the room. The idea that you think he is the only reason that the Libs will lose is interesting or/and that you think most Canadians want a Lib government if wasn't for him. 

It may or may not be too late. It depends on who replaces him. If it’s someone in his cabinet like Freeland then I don’t think she moves the needle enough to win. Too close to Trudeau. It has to be an outsider, someone not directly involved in Trudeau’s current government. Remember Trudeau wasn’t involved with Chretien or Martin either. He was an outsider who developed his own following. 
 

Yes, you can say Trudeau has lost the room. Just like every coach in NHL history. Even Scotty Bowman got fired. 

Edited June 15 by Elias Pettersson

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, aGENT said:

 

 

You can thank right wing politics (and rich Americans duping them) for that largely.

 

The right is the anti union, off shore manufacturing, race to the bottom, let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark group that's meant we don't have nice things.

And the left (tree huggers) places too many barriers to good Canadians pumping, digging, and chopping. We need a government that will support and encourage using all our resources to the max. 
 

[bishopshodan]

2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

It may or may not be too late. It depends on who replaces him. If it’s someone in his cabinet like Freeland then I don’t think she moves the needle enough to win. Too close to Trudeau. It has to be an outsider, someone not directly involved in Trudeau’s current government. Remember Trudeau wasn’t involved with Chretien or Martin either. He was an outsider who developed his own following. 
 

Yes, you can say Trudeau has lost the room. Just like every coach in NHL history. Even Scotty Bowman got fired. 

 

Interesting EP.

I know you give some props to the NDP at times but didnt know you had this kind of belief in the Libs.

[Warhippy]

1 hour ago, ArmchairGM22 said:

No debate lost 

 

please explain to me how the liberal govt has improved the economic lives of Canadians over their period in office 

 

When you can’t, you’ll have to accept I won the debate 

What debate?

 

You refused to answer simple questions.  Cried about being a victim.  Privately messaged people to claim you were being victimized and then insulted them.  Posted some questionable opinion columns and Twitter links then told people how smart you were and how they must be jealous you have an economics degree and they don't.

 

What colour is the sky in the world you live in bud?

[bishopshodan]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

And the left (tree huggers) places too many barriers to good Canadians pumping, digging, and chopping. We need a government that will support and encourage using all our resources to the max. 
 

I wonder if this whole UNDRIP stuff will help. 

[The Lock]

1 hour ago, ArmchairGM22 said:

No debate lost 

 

please explain to me how the liberal govt has improved the economic lives of Canadians over their period in office 

 

When you can’t, you’ll have to accept I won the debate 

 

It's not us debating dude. It's you vs someone else.

 

Besides, they haven't, but not for the reason you're thinking. You see, there was something called Covid that hit and messed everything up. You may have heard of it.

 

Also, it's not up for you to decide whether or not you won a debate. That's going to be up to everyone else. Debates are about convincing the other side that your side has more merit. Claiming you, yourself, won the debate means nothing other than showing you have arrogance.

Edited June 15 by The Lock

[Chicken.]

1 minute ago, aGENT said:

 

 

You can thank right wing politics (and rich Americans duping them) for that largely.

 

The right is the anti union, off shore manufacturing, race to the bottom, let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark group that's meant we don't have nice things.

Im sure others know the details better than me but i’d wager both parties have played a part in selling off control of our natural resources to China, US and the like. 
Quite a blanket statement on right wing / conservative mindset there. I havent seen much done in the last 10 years of liberal control to buck this sad trend/fact. 
 

As for the US not wanting us to keep our ability to sell/process our resources in house.. for sure.. cant blame em they’re looking out for their best interest, we need to be looking out for ours. Its a blessing and a curse living beside that economic titan.

[aGENT]

23 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Yeah I wouldn’t bother asking. Reason why is because nobody can predict the future so we don’t really know how a Conservative government will change things. Of course posters can speculate which is what’s been happening in this thread for the last 643 pages. 

 

 

You can try to ignore the modern history of the conservative party, their actual and recent voting history, their platform (what scant info there is) and their current actions, behavior and statements all you like in the name of ousting Trudeau. But let's not try to pretend we don't have a good idea how this is going to go. One does not need to be able to "see the future".

 

 

[Chicken.]

3 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

Interesting EP.

I know you give some props to the NDP at times but didnt know you had this kind of belief in the Libs.

Hes absolutely right, if JT resigns the Libs are in the drivers seat IMO and its been said many times in this thread. Too bad his ego seems to be getting in the way. Im sure @Bob Long would be ecstatic if ol mark carney took the reigns.

[bishopshodan]

1 minute ago, Chicken. said:

if JT resigns the Libs are in the drivers seat IMO and its been said many times in this thread

It has been said many times that JT should step down. I havent read that if he did that, they would be in the drivers seat.

I agree that they would have a much better chance, that chance is deminishing as time goes on imo. 

 

But drivers seat? 

hmm.

 

[Chicken.]

Just now, bishopshodan said:

It has been said many times that JT should step down. I havent read that if he did that, they would be in the drivers seat.

I agree that they would have a much better chance, that chance is deminishing as time goes on imo. 

 

But drivers seat? 

hmm.

 

Its my guess that the anti trudeau crowd is just that large. 

[bishopshodan]

Just now, Chicken. said:

Its my guess that the anti trudeau crowd is just that large. 

 

yeah, maybe its just the island...those that I know are not just anti- JT...they're anti- anything Lib now.

 

Do the Libs get your vote if JT is replaced by an outsider?

[The Lock]

47 minutes ago, Satchmo said:

Oh.  I might ask how a change to PP's land of vague promises will actually improve things but I think I'd rather just not bother.  None of the answers I've heard so far have been helpful in making me understand his grand plan.  I can understand how 'Drill baby, drill' might lead to a few short term financial benefits but that's about it. 

 

I think a lot of it's more about public perspective rather than policies themselves. Simply put, a party that is in power is more likely to push legislation that's not going to be popular with everyone. Do that enough times, and you gradually have more people showing discontent. It also just so happens that the longer a party is in power, the more legislation people view negatively on.

 

And I'm focusing on the "negative" rather than the "positive" for a reason: human nature. When something goes wrong, we as humans typically complain about it. When everything's going right, we often don't say anything at all.

 

But overall, the CPC will likely get into power because of the current discontent with the Liberals. Then it'll be time for the CPC to make legislation that impacts people negatively and the cycle continues. The real question's going to be how long will it take the CPC to annoy people for the shift back to the Liberals to happen? 

Edited June 15 by The Lock

[aGENT]

4 minutes ago, Chicken. said:

Im sure others know the details better than me but i’d wager both parties have played a part in selling off control of our natural resources to China, US and the like. 
Quite a blanket statement on right wing / conservative mindset there. I havent seen much done in the last 10 years of liberal control to buck this sad trend/fact. 

 

Both parties certainly serve their corporate master's interests. The right is just far more complicit in it. Liberals bad, cons worse. 

 

It's not the Liberals that sold off our NEP, or the Wheat Board, they're not the ones hell bent on privatizing medical...

 

4 minutes ago, Chicken. said:

As for the US not wanting us to keep our ability to sell/process our resources in house.. for sure.. cant blame em they’re looking out for their best interest, we need to be looking out for ours. Its a blessing and a curse living beside that economic titan.

 

Absolutely. Wouldn't it be great if right wing voters realized that and voted/acted accordingly...?

[Chicken.]

2 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

yeah, maybe its just the island...those that I know are not just anti- JT...they're anti- anything Lib now.

 

Do the Libs get your vote if JT is replaced by an outsider?

I would certainly listen to whatever that individual had to say with an open mind. Not going to commit one way or the other until we’re a bit closer to said election lol yeesh Fall 2025 is a ways away

[Satchmo]

15 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And the left (tree huggers) places too many barriers to good Canadians pumping, digging, and chopping. We need a government that will support and encourage using all our resources to the max. 
 

I could agree if you had said use all our resources wisely and responsibly.

[bishopshodan]

1 minute ago, Chicken. said:

I would certainly listen to whatever that individual had to say with an open mind. Not going to commit one way or the other until we’re a bit closer to said election lol yeesh Fall 2025 is a ways away

 

Atta boy Chicken.

 

[aGENT]

3 minutes ago, Chicken. said:

Its my guess that the anti trudeau crowd is just that large. 

 

Which to me is asinine, ignorant and short sighted. (Unfortunately a rather accurate description of most voters apparently).

 

Vote party policy and platform and for your individual MP. Some Muppet that's just a face doesn't particularly matter that much. Certainly not at the expensive of worse policy and governance. 

[Boudrias]

13 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

It may or may not be too late. It depends on who replaces him. If it’s someone in his cabinet like Freeland then I don’t think she moves the needle enough to win. Too close to Trudeau. It has to be an outsider, someone not directly involved in Trudeau’s current government. Remember Trudeau wasn’t involved with Chretien or Martin either. He was an outsider who developed his own following. 
 

Yes, you can say Trudeau has lost the room. Just like every coach in NHL history. Even Scotty Bowman got fired. 

The damage Trudeau has done by direction or incompetence cannot be trivialized by suggesting his being booted out is a natural progression. His successes have to be weighed against his failures and a report card to the nation required. Progressives like Trudeau might have the best of intent but that is the easy part. Orchestrating change has a cost and accompanying failure can hurt more than it helps. IMHO Trudeau and his party have set the country back for many years to come.  

[Chicken.]

3 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

Both parties certainly serve their corporate master's interests. The right is just far more complicit in it. Liberals bad, cons worse. 

 

It's not the Liberals that sold off our NEP, or the Wheat Board, they're not the ones hell bent on privatizing medical...

 

 

Absolutely. Wouldn't it be great if right wing voters realized that and voted/acted accordingly...?

Its been nearly 10 years.. what has improved in this specific area under the current government that should make us think it is in our best interest to continue with the Libs?  Our economy is still entirely propped up by real estate and the cheap immigrant labour we need to continue drudging along 

[The Lock]

7 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

It has been said many times that JT should step down. I havent read that if he did that, they would be in the drivers seat.

I agree that they would have a much better chance, that chance is deminishing as time goes on imo. 

 

But drivers seat? 

hmm.

 

Yeah, I don't know if I'm convinced they'd be in the driver's seat. There'd certainly be a shift in votes but that shift's really going to depend on who becomes leader. For them to get into the driver's seat, that's going to require more than just a double digit percentage of a shift. lol

[Alflives]

15 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

I wonder if this whole UNDRIP stuff will help. 

Don’t know what that is. The time is coming though when people will vote for a party with an idiot for a leader because the people need good paying jobs. Getting our hands dirty pays good and takes little training or school. Mills, factories, mining, forestry, oil/gas. Do these to the max. 

[Chicken.]

2 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

Which to me is asinine, ignorant and short sighted. (Unfortunately a rather accurate description of most voters apparently).

 

Vote party policy and platform and for your individual MP. Some Muppet that's just a face doesn't particularly matter that much. Certainly not at the expensive of worse policy and governance. 

Optics play a large part in politics, so if you want to blame someone besides the general electorate then look at the muppet in charge to read the writing on the wall and do whats best for his party, and in turn the country. 

[bishopshodan]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Don’t know what that is. The time is coming though when people will vote for a party with an idiot for a leader because the people need good paying jobs. Getting our hands dirty pays good and takes little training or school. Mills, factories, mining, forestry, oil/gas. Do these to the max. 

https://www.enbridge.com/sustainability-reports/indigenous-discussion-paper/case-for-change

 

[Elias Pettersson]

21 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

Interesting EP.

I know you give some props to the NDP at times but didnt know you had this kind of belief in the Libs.

 

I am a centrist.  Always have been.  The Chretien liberals were my government.  That's what I grew up with.  I lean more right now as I've gotten older, but I am in no way on the extreme.  The current iteration of the Liberals are too close to the NDP.  They need to move closer to the centre.  If they can do that with a new leader then I can see them coming back at some point.  However, if the Conservatives were also to move closer to the centre with a new leader that could change things too.  IMO, the party that moves closest to the centre will be the one that wins the race.  PP will easily win the next election if Trudeau is still in power.  However, after that it's wide open...