The Lock Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, aGENT said: Which to me is asinine, ignorant and short sighted. (Unfortunately a rather accurate description of most voters apparently). Vote party policy and platform and for your individual MP. Some Muppet that's just a face doesn't particularly matter that much. Certainly not at the expensive of worse policy and governance. One thing you have to keep in mind is that roughly 70% of voters don't even care about politics. They're not going to be all that passionate about policies. They're not even going to look at policies. They're just going base things on how they were impacted by the current leadership and if anything shows up negative, that's going to affect things. They're going to see Trudeau did things that affected them. They're not going to care what PP's like. Literally everyone in this thread is of a minority: people who actually care about politics. That's the unfortunate circumstance really. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, Chicken. said: Its been nearly 10 years.. what has improved in this specific area under the current government that should make us think it is in our best interest to continue with the Libs? Our economy is still entirely propped up by real estate and the cheap immigrant labour we need to continue drudging along No, there was ~5 years and then another ~5 years of minority government. With a global pandemic, supply chain issues, a couple idiotic wars, increasing and costly issues with climate change and a global aging population crisis. Multiple massive and global issues that have hugely shifted the landscape, regardless of who was in charge of Canada's government. Things weren't going to get "better" regardless of which party happened to be in power. And make no mistake, I'm not here suggesting the Liberals are the answer and cure-all to these issues. They're not. I'm here to tell you that if you think they're bad under the Liberals, the Cons lean even further to the direction of making them worse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said: I am a centrist. Always have been. The Chretien liberals were my government. That's what I grew up with. I lean more right now as I've gotten older, but I am in no way on the extreme. The current iteration of the Liberals are too close to the NDP. They need to move closer to the centre. If they can do that with a new leader then I can see them coming back at some point. However, if the Conservatives were also to move closer to the centre with a new leader that could change things too. IMO, the party that moves closest to the centre will be the one that wins the race. PP will easily win the next election if Trudeau is still in power. However, after that it's wide open... I'm a centist too, apparently, according to one of those online thingys. I'm not sure though that, that it isn't because I have views that might be extreme on both sides...but those topics are for a different thread I think. i will likely vote NDP again. Im not a huge fan of Jag but that party has delivered in a stagnant time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 28 minutes ago, aGENT said: You can try to ignore the modern history of the conservative party, their actual and recent voting history, their platform (what scant info there is) and their current actions, behavior and statements all you like in the name of ousting Trudeau. But let's not try to pretend we don't have a good idea how this is going to go. One does not need to be able to "see the future". There will be good things and bad things. You don't need to see the future to understand this. The whole scare tactic schtick that the Conservatives are going to destroy the country isn't being bought by the average person. We are already $2 trillion in the hole. Life isn't great right now for the average Canadian. There are people who can't pay their mortgage or buy food. So they want a change. That's the only thing that matters to them. You can bring up abortion and every other social issue you want, you can be like Heffy and call every Conservative a Nazi too, but that rhetroic isn't going to help you to convince voters to change their tune... Edited June 15 by Elias Pettersson 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 6 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: https://www.enbridge.com/sustainability-reports/indigenous-discussion-paper/case-for-change Just so long as we maximize the use of our resources. That’s what matters. No more tree hugger policies. Pump, Dig, Chop to the max. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken. Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 minute ago, aGENT said: No, there was ~5 years and then another ~5 years of minority government. With a global pandemic, supply chain issues, a couple idiotic wars, increasing and costly issues with climate change and a global aging population crisis. Multiple massive and global issues that have hugely shifted the landscape, regardless of who was in charge of Canada's government. Things weren't going to get "better" regardless of which party happened to be in power. And make no mistake, I'm not here suggesting the Liberals are the answer and cure-all to these issues. They're not. I'm here to tell you that if you think they're bad under the Liberals, the Cons lean even further to the direction of making them worse. So government efforts are futile in the current global environment to improve our natural resource management.. got it. And those first 5 years were before the pandemic and pointless wars started if i recall. Hey at least we got legal weed now ill take it, though regulation of that needs improving too. Who is the idiot that limits cannabis edible packages to 10mg? If we want people to stop the inhalation method maybe we should make it more accessible to ingest cannabis in other ways. Sorry just a side tangent i had to get off my chest before i hit the gym now lol it really puzzles me though I wont put that on ol Trudopey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lock Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: There will be good things and bad things. You don't need to see the future to understand this. The whole scare tactic schtick that the Conservatives are going to destroy the country isn't being bought by the average person. We are already $2 trillion in the hole. Life isn't great right now for the average Canadian. There are people who can't pay their mortgage or buy food. So they want a change. That's the only thing that matters to them. You can bring up abortion and every other social issue you want, you can be like Heffy and call every Conservative a Nazi too, but that rhetroic isn't going to help you to convince voters to change their tune... Yeah, there's definitely been some wording that's been used that's just made it harder for everyone else who are more sympathetic to the Liberals harder to defend against. Of that I'm not going to deny. On the flip side, I've seen some people on the right in this thread be a little disingenuous in their tactics as well. Sometimes very disingenuous. I'd rather have a discussion where we both learn something. Unfortunately, that kind of conversation is rare. Edited June 15 by The Lock 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: There will be good things and bad things. You don't need to see the future to understand this. The whole scare tactic schtick that the Conservatives are going to destroy the country isn't being bought by the average person. We are already $2 trillion in the hole. Life isn't great right now for the average Canadian. There are people who can't pay their mortgage or buy food. So they want a change. That's the only thing that matters to them. You can bring up abortion and every other social issue you want, you can be like Heffy and call every Conservative a Nazi too, but that rhetroic isn't going to help you to convince voters to change their tune... If there is a serious downturn in building houses our economy will be seriously screwed. We used to be a nation of a diverse economy with its backbone in using our natural resources. Now we import lumber. Infriggin’ believable what tree hugger polices have done to our economy over the past decades. Do we wave any mills processing our trees? Our mines have closed. And its hands off oil/gas because they are (somehow) bad for the air. The truly sad part is we will elect an idiot as our pm because the economy stinks. And it’s highly likely the economy will struggle until we get pumping, digging, and chopping again. Which means the idiot will get more than one term. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Alflives said: Just so long as we maximize the use of our resources. That’s what matters. No more tree hugger policies. Pump, Dig, Chop to the max. Given the long history of your schtick I can never tell if you are trying to play smart or trying to play dumb. Tree huggers can be laughed at but let's not forget they helped put an end to some truly horrible practices by the forestry industry. It's a sustainable industry only if managed properly. (I wrote software for lumber companies for decades and kept my eye on them from the inside.) Pumping and digging must also be done responsibly. Edited June 15 by Satchmo 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lock Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Alflives said: If there is a serious downturn in building houses our economy will be seriously screwed. We used to be a nation of a diverse economy with its backbone in using our natural resources. Now we import lumber. Infriggin’ believable what tree hugger polices have done to our economy over the past decades. Do we wave any mills processing our trees? Our mines have closed. And its hands off oil/gas because they are (somehow) bad for the air. The truly sad part is we will elect an idiot as our pm because the economy stinks. And it’s highly likely the economy will struggle until we get pumping, digging, and chopping again. Which means the idiot will get more than one term. There's more than just buildings houses though. There's a lot of properties out there with no one in them (at least in Vancouver). Building houses is fine and all, but if they get scooped up by the same group not living in those houses, it's not going to matter. Edited June 15 by The Lock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said: There will be good things and bad things. You don't need to see the future to understand this. The whole scare tactic schtick that the Conservatives are going to destroy the country isn't being bought by the average person. We are already $2 trillion in the hole. Life isn't great right now for the average Canadian. There are people who can't pay their mortgage or buy food. So they want a change. That's the only thing that matters to them. You can bring up abortion and every other social issue you want, you can be like Heffy and call every Conservative a Nazi too, but that rhetroic isn't going to help you to convince voters to change their tune... I'm not a YouTuber, I'm not posting a video with big red letters stating: THE CONS WILL DESTROY CANADA. I never even mentioned abortion either FYI. It will just be the continued erosion of crown assets, wealth and safety nets we see, that happens EVERY time the cons are in power. Tax cuts to the wealthy/corporations, expanded reliance on cheap labour/off shoring, privatization, cutting of social safety nets to pay for it. And when the rich/corporations pocket the vast majority of that money instead of investing it and hiring more people, they'll sell off some more crown assets (OUR assets) to cover the costs. If you think that will help people struggling to buy food and pay mortgages... Will it "DESTROY CANADA"? No. That's silly hyperbole. Is it just a continued and quicker erosion of the EXACT things people are already pissed about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Just now, Satchmo said: Given the long history of your schtick I can never tell if you are trying to play smart to trying to play dumb. Tree huggers can be laughed at but let's not forget they help put an end to some truly horrible practices by the forestry industry. It's a sustainable industry only if managed properly. (I wrote software for lumber companies for decades and kept my eye on them from the inside.) Pumping and digging must also be done responsibly. Nope. People will choose an idiot for our next pm because our current economy stinks. People need good paying jobs. The service industry isn’t that. Getting our hands dirty (like we used to, before the tree hugger policies) pays good. Pump, dig, chop. And all the tertiary employment that follows. These are the jobs that built our nation. People are obviously pissed off with the current state of our economy. Why else would they vote for a party with an idiot for its leader? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 58 minutes ago, Satchmo said: A bit harsh Heffy. He's done nothing to indicate he should be Prime Minister but I'm not sure what he's done to deserve a prison term. His open promotion of domestic terrorism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Just now, Alflives said: Nope. People will choose an idiot for our next pm because our current economy stinks. People need good paying jobs. The service industry isn’t that. Getting our hands dirty (like we used to, before the tree hugger policies) pays good. Pump, dig, chop. And all the tertiary employment that follows. These are the jobs that built our nation. People are obviously pissed off with the current state of our economy. Why else would they vote for a party with an idiot for its leader? Maybe we need more blacksmiths and people making beaver hats. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lock Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Alflives said: Nope. People will choose an idiot for our next pm because our current economy stinks. People need good paying jobs. The service industry isn’t that. Getting our hands dirty (like we used to, before the tree hugger policies) pays good. Pump, dig, chop. And all the tertiary employment that follows. These are the jobs that built our nation. People are obviously pissed off with the current state of our economy. Why else would they vote for a party with an idiot for its leader? Well I am still looking for work and I am in the services as a software engineer. (Coming up to a year without a job and trying not to be depressed about it. Not saying this as a "woe is me" but more to show relevance to the rest of what I'm saying) Still, I don't see the current situation as Trudeau's fault but more of a global issue, but I could see where someone in my position would start to blame him. Edited June 15 by The Lock 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 14 minutes ago, Chicken. said: So government efforts are futile in the current global environment to improve our natural resource management.. got it. And those first 5 years were before the pandemic and pointless wars started if i recall. Futile? No. The Liberals have FWIW got a pipeline built, expansion in mining, battery plants, automotive manufacturing etc, etc though. They HAVE actually accomplished things, even under a minority. But again, I'm not here to tell you the Liberals are perfect. They're just less imperfect than the cons. 14 minutes ago, Chicken. said: Hey at least we got legal weed now ill take it, though regulation of that needs improving too. Who is the idiot that limits cannabis edible packages to 10mg? If we want people to stop the inhalation method maybe we should make it more accessible to ingest cannabis in other ways. Sorry just a side tangent i had to get off my chest before i hit the gym now lol it really puzzles me though I wont put that on ol Trudopey. Supported my local retailer yesterday I vape my herb personally. Less of a fan of the edible high (though can be fun once in a while). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Maybe the Liberal "plan" will start working in the next 9 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 It's like Trudeau is doing everything he can to look stupid or hypocritical In one breath, we created the NSICOP to ensure that all parti s have access to information and to ensure that everything was transparent and held to the highest standards of the most trusted law enforcement in the nation In another breath, ya we don't believe them or the way they investigated this. Ffs man...you can't say it's great and then crap on it in the same gd breath and expect to be credible or at the least keep the program respectable. With him saying that with his marriage falling apart he was thinking of stepping down, and then saying how he felt he had unfinished business and he appreciated the challenge the conservatives were going to give him. While also saying it was his legacy at stake, one has to wonder if he gives a crap more about the country, his party; or his ego more. https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/trudeau-calls-into-question-findings-of-stunning-watchdog-foreign-interference-report-1.6928257 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 minute ago, bolt said: Maybe the Liberal "plan" will start working in the next 9 years. Oh look another Pierre tidbit. That guy has the most punchable face in Ottawa after Callandra peaced out 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Warhippy said: It's like Trudeau is doing everything he can to look stupid or hypocritical In one breath, we created the NSICOP to ensure that all parti s have access to information and to ensure that everything was transparent and held to the highest standards of the most trusted law enforcement in the nation In another breath, ya we don't believe them or the way they investigated this. Ffs man...you can't say it's great and then crap on it in the same gd breath and expect to be credible or at the least keep the program respectable. With him saying that with his marriage falling apart he was thinking of stepping down, and then saying how he felt he had unfinished business and he appreciated the challenge the conservatives were going to give him. While also saying it was his legacy at stake, one has to wonder if he gives a crap more about the country, his party; or his ego more. https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/trudeau-calls-into-question-findings-of-stunning-watchdog-foreign-interference-report-1.6928257 I loathe our choices in the coming election. Douche and turd sandwich seem like too kind of metaphors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 17 minutes ago, King Heffy said: His open promotion of domestic terrorism. Reprehensible? Yes. Culpable? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 22 minutes ago, Satchmo said: Maybe we need more blacksmiths and people making beaver hats. Make Rupert’s Land great again! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 21 minutes ago, The Lock said: Well I am still looking for work and I am in the services as a software engineer. (Coming up to a year without a job and trying not to be depressed about it. Not saying this as a "woe is me" but more to show relevance to the rest of what I'm saying) Still, I don't see the current situation as Trudeau's fault but more of a global issue, but I could see where someone in my position would start to blame him. IMHAO it’s not Trudeau or anyone’s fault that our best jobs are gone. It’s the “tree hugger” policies that have killed the economy our nation was built on. The “dirty hands” jobs pay good. Families can afford houses and cars and boats and holidays and dinners out and hockey gear and the list goes on. There’s a lot of other jobs that come from those “dirty hands” workers spending their money. It’s like sharing the wealth. Then other folk who need jobs in other industries have those jobs available. If our economy was good and people were doing well financially then no way would we elect an idiot for PM. Yet here we are almost doing exactly that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lock Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Alflives said: IMHAO it’s not Trudeau or anyone’s fault that our best jobs are gone. It’s the “tree hugger” policies that have killed the economy our nation was built on. The “dirty hands” jobs pay good. Families can afford houses and cars and boats and holidays and dinners out and hockey gear and the list goes on. There’s a lot of other jobs that come from those “dirty hands” workers spending their money. It’s like sharing the wealth. Then other folk who need jobs in other industries have those jobs available. If our economy was good and people were doing well financially then no way would we elect an idiot for PM. Yet here we are almost doing exactly that. There's certainly some truth to it. Just look at the great depression in the 30's and how many fascist governments were created from a lack of economy. In desperate times, people will do desperate things. Emotions can be more easily targeted when people are emotional. Edited June 15 by The Lock 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 24 minutes ago, aGENT said: I loathe our choices in the coming election. Douche and turd sandwich seem like too kind of metaphors. After reading his statements earlier this week regarding him thinking about stepping down and then deciding not to, and the reasons he decided not to. It really does just seem like it's Trudeau versus angry Trudeau or ego vs ego. Neither of these leaders care about the nation as much as they care about optics or their legacy or some such crap. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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