bishopshodan Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 25 minutes ago, Bob Long said: This is pure Skippy. A guy who's had his entire career in politics calling another politician a "sellout" Conservatives launch attack ads on NDP, calling leader 'Sellout Singh' https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/conservatives-attack-ads-ndp-1.7281519 This is great. I'd be stoked if I was Jag and the NDP. Boosts that parties' profile. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Just now, bishopshodan said: This is great. I'd be stoked if I was Jag and the NDP. Boosts that parties' profile. this is what conservatism is now. Thanks Preston. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 hour ago, bishopshodan said: This is great. I'd be stoked if I was Jag and the NDP. Boosts that parties' profile. At this point they should just merge with the liberal party, every one knows they are just going to bend the knee first chance they get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bishopshodan Posted August 2 Popular Post Share Posted August 2 Just now, Bure_Pavel said: At this point they should just merge with the liberal party, every one knows they are just going to bend the knee first chance they get. Horse shit. They got stuff done by working with the Libs. If the Libs didnt ' bend the knee' to the confidence-and-supply agreement then the NDP would have dropped the support. Quite a good job for a party not in the top spot. No wonder they are getting some attack ad attention. Also, I dont want a two party system. Seems like the Cons do cause they smell pretty American these days... 1 1 1 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 8 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: Horse shit. They got stuff done by working with the Libs. If the Libs didnt ' bend the knee' to the confidence-and-supply agreement then the NDP would have dropped the support. Quite a good job for a party not in the top spot. No wonder they are getting some attack ad attention. Also, I dont want a two party system. Seems like the Cons do cause they smell pretty American these days... More than a two party system is a great way to not get stuff done. People talk about political red tape to get things done, this is it. Having to bribe the coalition party every time you want something passed has to be tiring. Im guessing thats where the cons got Sellout Singh from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6of1_halfdozenofother Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 18 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: Also, I dont want a two party system. Seems like the Cons do cause they smell pretty American these days... A two-party system is great for simpletons because it simplifies the messaging (in spite of the fact that the issues are often very complex). It makes for great "us and them" and helps to drive wedges. It also serves to push things to the extreme, instead of finding common consensus. Plus it's one step away from dictatorship/authoritarianism/totalitarianism. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 6 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: More than a two party system is a great way to not get stuff done. People talk about political red tape to get things done, this is it. Having to bribe the coalition party every time you want something passed has to be tiring. Im guessing thats where the cons got Sellout Singh from. Have you ever noticed how hard it is to get things done in the two party USA? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 4 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: More than a two party system is a great way to not get stuff done. People talk about political red tape to get things done, this is it. Having to bribe the coalition party every time you want something passed has to be tiring. Im guessing thats where the cons got Sellout Singh from. I thought it was not a coalition but a confidence-and-supply? I could be wrong. Respect that you want a 2 party system but i point to the south for an example of a mess. Your nicknames for Singh dont bother me. I'd like a new leader for the party but you are also inaccurate. He's not a sell out, he got things done that his supporters wanted. Not bad for a party that never gets the top job, as I keep pointing out. He and theNDP brought us dental and pharma. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6of1_halfdozenofother Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 minute ago, bishopshodan said: I thought it was not a coalition but a confidence-and-supply? I could be wrong. You're correct - it's a c&s. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 20 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: I thought it was not a coalition but a confidence-and-supply? I could be wrong. Respect that you want a 2 party system but i point to the south for an example of a mess. Your nicknames for Singh dont bother me. I'd like a new leader for the party but you are also inaccurate. He's not a sell out, he got things done that his supporters wanted. Not bad for a party that never gets the top job, as I keep pointing out. He and theNDP brought us dental and pharma. The NDP did really well for them selves, they were given a lot of power even though they only had 24 / 338 seats in the house of commons. Only 7.1% percent of the ridings wanted them to have the power but they had it anyways. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 minute ago, Bure_Pavel said: The NDP did really well for them selves, they were given a lot of power even though they only had 24 / 338 seats in the house of commons. Only 7.1% percent of the ridings wanted them to have the power but they had it anyways. Exactly. Got a bunch done. Saw an opportunity and took it. IF people we'rn't so scared of PP, I bet the NDP would get a ton of Lib supporters because of the great effort. Maybe they would get some Cons too, a few of my friends that hate JT are also not too stoked on this new Cons yankee doodle act. But they will stick with them probably becuase of the reverse...scared of JT. Damn binary folks! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 5 minutes ago, bishopshodan said: Exactly. Got a bunch done. Saw an opportunity and took it. IF people we'rn't so scared of PP, I bet the NDP would get a ton of Lib supporters because of the great effort. Maybe they would get some Cons too, a few of my friends that hate JT are also not too stoked on this new Cons yankee doodle act. But they will stick with them probably becuase of the reverse...scared of JT. Damn binary folks! Could be similar this time around but with the BLOC party and Conservatives instead. Many people forget that the Bloc had more seats than the NDP. The whole Coalition thing Im not a big fan of though as it takes power out of the voters hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 34 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: Could be similar this time around but with the BLOC party and Conservatives instead. Many people forget that the Bloc had more seats than the NDP. The whole Coalition thing Im not a big fan of though as it takes power out of the voters hands. How so? Didn’t the Liberals and NDP get over 50% of the vote in the last election compared to 33% for the Conservatives? I would argue that coalition governments actually serve more Canadians wishes and can’t pander to the extremes. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 43 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: Could be similar this time around but with the BLOC party and Conservatives instead. Many people forget that the Bloc had more seats than the NDP. The whole Coalition thing Im not a big fan of though as it takes power out of the voters hands. 56 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: The NDP did really well for them selves, they were given a lot of power even though they only had 24 / 338 seats in the house of commons. Only 7.1% percent of the ridings wanted them to have the power but they had it anyways. You forget that this is exactly what our democracy is set up for. As well even with such a small amount of seats it gives the majority (over 51% of the population) representation which is again, democratic. As for the Bloc and Conservatives. Remember the comments Pierre has made about Quebec over the past few years and while he was a major face under the old Conservative majority government. the Bloc are possibly the most left leaning party in canada along true leftist ideals and while a coalition is possible and again, a democratic right that would represent a true majority of the population; it might be an untenable one due to the opposing ideologies of the two parties. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 29 minutes ago, 4petesake said: How so? Didn’t the Liberals and NDP get over 50% of the vote in the last election compared to 33% for the Conservatives? I would argue that coalition governments actually serve more Canadians wishes and can’t pander to the extremes. It gives small parties like NDP and Bloc more power than that in which they were actually voted to have. An extreme hypothetical example would be if the People Party or whatever it is called now (far right) have three seats but the cons were 3 seats short of a majority. That party even though they only had 3 seats would have a disproportional amount of power compared to what was voted. As the smart move would be to coalition with the smallest party that gets you enough seats for the majority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Just now, Bure_Pavel said: It gives small parties like NDP and Bloc more power than that in which they were actually voted to have. An extreme hypothetical example would be if the People Party or whatever it is called now (far right) have three seats but the cons were 3 seats short of a majority. That party even though they only had 3 seats would have a disproportional amount of power compared to what was voted. As the smart move would be to coalition with the smallest party that gets you enough seats for the majority. People know what they are going to get when they vote NDP or Bloc. I think you are describing a problem that does not really exist. Even if it does exist going to a two party system would just mean going to another set of problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 39 minutes ago, Warhippy said: You forget that this is exactly what our democracy is set up for. As well even with such a small amount of seats it gives the majority (over 51% of the population) representation which is again, democratic. As for the Bloc and Conservatives. Remember the comments Pierre has made about Quebec over the past few years and while he was a major face under the old Conservative majority government. the Bloc are possibly the most left leaning party in canada along true leftist ideals and while a coalition is possible and again, a democratic right that would represent a true majority of the population; it might be an untenable one due to the opposing ideologies of the two parties. Push come to shove I think they would join forces as it would forward both their parties interest even if they don't see eye to eye, would be stupid not to if it meant a majority. Not as much can be done in a minority government. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Satchmo said: People know what they are going to get when they vote NDP or Bloc. I think you are describing a problem that does not really exist. Even if it does exist going to a two party system would just mean going to another set of problems. Its not perfect but personally I prefer the two party system, the bloc was the third largest party last election and their interest focuses on just one province which is a bit messed up. Ying and yang, two opposing forces just makes sense, only one other party to dislike as well. Edited August 2 by Bure_Pavel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 minute ago, Bure_Pavel said: Its not perfect but personally I prefer the two party system, the bloc was the third largest party last election and their interest focus on just one province which is a bit messed up. Ying and yang, two opposing forces just makes sense, only one other party to dislike as well. Well, I have to disagree. I've already done that and am only responding now because you mention Ying and Yang in order to convince me. Now THAT is nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 10 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: It gives small parties like NDP and Bloc more power than that in which they were actually voted to have. An extreme hypothetical example would be if the People Party or whatever it is called now (far right) have three seats but the cons were 3 seats short of a majority. That party even though they only had 3 seats would have a disproportional amount of power compared to what was voted. As the smart move would be to coalition with the smallest party that gets you enough seats for the majority. I see what you’re getting at but look at it like this - a centre/left coalition like the Libs/NDP (or call it left/further left if you prefer) represents a majority of Canadians and a voter from either party is most likely to vote for the other if they were to change their votes. The same goes for a coalition of Cons and your People Party so like it or not it would still represent the majority. 4 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: Its not perfect but personally I prefer the two party system, the bloc was the third largest party last election and their interest focus on just one province which is a bit messed up. Ying and yang, two opposing forces just makes sense, only one other party to dislike as well. Personally I don’t get why a party like the Bloc is allowed in a national election, they run candidates in only one province and make no illusions of representing all Canadians. But that’s just me… 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 2 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said: More than a two party system is a great way to not get stuff done. People talk about political red tape to get things done, this is it. Having to bribe the coalition party every time you want something passed has to be tiring. Im guessing thats where the cons got Sellout Singh from. A lot of our best legislation got passed under minority governments. Having to work with other parties gives more Canadians a voice regarding how the country is governed. This is a good thing. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 23 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said: Push come to shove I think they would join forces as it would forward both their parties interest even if they don't see eye to eye, would be stupid not to if it meant a majority. Not as much can be done in a minority government. I agree that given the chance the Bloc would join forces to promote their own interests. The one fear of that I have is, by extension the NDP is doing it for the whole of the nation, I fear the Bloc may be more Quebec centric and that the Conservatives to hold power would cater to the province more than they have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the destroyer of worlds Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 hour ago, Bure_Pavel said: It gives small parties like NDP and Bloc more power than that in which they were actually voted to have. An extreme hypothetical example would be if the People Party or whatever it is called now (far right) have three seats but the cons were 3 seats short of a majority. That party even though they only had 3 seats would have a disproportional amount of power compared to what was voted. As the smart move would be to coalition with the smallest party that gets you enough seats for the majority. By all means, the CONs could saddle up with the Peoples Party of Ctazy. They would not be as effective as the Greens here in BC were when they helped to push the BC NDP over the line because I think they would hinder the CONs in getting to a majority in subsequent elections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 minute ago, the destroyer of worlds said: By all means, the CONs could saddle up with the Peoples Party of Ctazy. They would not be as effective as the Greens here in BC were when they helped to push the BC NDP over the line because I think they would hinder the CONs in getting to a majority in subsequent elections. That was an extreme hypothetical much more likely to be the Bloc if anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 hour ago, Warhippy said: I agree that given the chance the Bloc would join forces to promote their own interests. The one fear of that I have is, by extension the NDP is doing it for the whole of the nation, I fear the Bloc may be more Quebec centric and that the Conservatives to hold power would cater to the province more than they have Quebec would be eating good in this scenario. Generally the federal government is more favorable to Ontario and Quebec anyways, A lot of the western provinces feel they are forgotten by the way side. Even the BC premier was complaining recently they thought an unfair percentage of BC tax revenue was be relocated to eastern provinces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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