Canadian Politics Thread

[Elias Pettersson]

2 hours ago, Bob Long said:

 

Nope the rates are predatory with these companies. It isn't an either-or situation, both things can be true and actual families are being hurt, and it's bad for the country.

 

We can discuss what theoretical future inventory might accomplish but right now predatory rent levels are happening.

 

If Petey owned apartment buildings, he would be just as predatory as any corporation.  Do you not think I would jack up rates too to market value?  Every Landlord who has a few million to buy an apartment building would do the same thing.

 

Instead of everyone shitting on the developers, maybe we can elect some smarter politicians who can work with these big bad developers to get more affordable housing out there.  Ken Sim is the only one I can think of who has some level of intelligence at the moment...

[Elias Pettersson]

 

Even the CBC, the state-owned media, doesn't believe Trudeau's bullshit anymore...

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

Will the Air Canada strike set up a no confidence vote for the Liberals if they put forward back to work legislation?

Edited Friday at 05:45 PM by Elias Pettersson

[Elias Pettersson]

If this is what pilots are actually making, I'd go on strike too.  And it could be awhile before they are back...

 

 

[King Heffy]

11 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

If this is what pilots are actually making, I'd go on strike too.  And it could be awhile before they are back...

 

 

We agree again!  I actually contacted my MP asking her not to support any kind of legislation and to respect the bargaining process.

Edited Friday at 05:59 PM by King Heffy

[the destroyer of worlds]

6 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

If this is what pilots are actually making, I'd go on strike too.  And it could be awhile before they are back...

 

 

Here is Capt. Chesley "Sully" Sullenberger from 15 years ago speaking about the US system. 

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

4 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

We agree again!  I actually contacted my MP asking her not to support any kind of legislation and to respect the bargaining process.

 

Jagmeet said he will support the pilots and vote against the Liberals if they bring in back to work legislation.  This would trigger an election.  Trudeau is in a pickle now.  If the pilots walk off the job and don't come back, the Liberal government is gonna be screwed...

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

If Petey owned apartment buildings, he would be just as predatory as any corporation.  Do you not think I would jack up rates too to market value?  Every Landlord who has a few million to buy an apartment building would do the same thing.

 

Instead of everyone shitting on the developers, maybe we can elect some smarter politicians who can work with these big bad developers to get more affordable housing out there.  Ken Sim is the only one I can think of who has some level of intelligence at the moment...

 

Agreed, the us vs them crap with development and some governments is  part of the problem.

[the destroyer of worlds]

So I guess there should be no complaints about flights cancelled and the economic impacts and criticism that JT did nothing to prevent this from happening.  

 

The CONs and the NDP are in agreement then.  JT should do nothing.  OK.  Got it.

[King Heffy]

5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Jagmeet said he will support the pilots and vote against the Liberals if they bring in back to work legislation.  This would trigger an election.  Trudeau is in a pickle now.  If the pilots walk off the job and don't come back, the Liberal government is gonna be screwed...

Or they can just not bring in back to work legislation.  Ball is in their court.

[King Heffy]

2 minutes ago, the destroyer of worlds said:

So I guess there should be no complaints about flights cancelled and the economic impacts and criticism that JT did nothing to prevent this from happening.  

 

The CONs and the NDP are in agreement then.  JT should do nothing.  OK.  Got it.

I'm personally directly impacted by the strike and had to book a backup flight that makes me lose an extra day at work unpaid.  I still don't want the pilots legislated back to work; they are severely underpaid for the experience, training, and importance of their job.

[Elias Pettersson]

3 minutes ago, the destroyer of worlds said:

So I guess there should be no complaints about flights cancelled and the economic impacts and criticism that JT did nothing to prevent this from happening.  

 

The CONs and the NDP are in agreement then.  JT should do nothing.  OK.  Got it.

 

Didn't Trudeau's government purchase 6.4% of Air Canada back in 2021?  You would think he has some responsibility to make sure pilots are getting paid a fair wage.  $60k for a pilot is a joke.  They should be making double that...

[King Heffy]

9 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Didn't Trudeau's government purchase 6.4% of Air Canada back in 2021?  You would think he has some responsibility to make sure pilots are getting paid a fair wage.  $60k for a pilot is a joke.  They should be making double that...

Can't really blame him for a CBA signed before he was in power.  I'll certainly blame him if they're forced to work in any capacity.

[Elias Pettersson]

Pilots in the US make more than double what they do in Canada?  WTF?  

 

Air Canada pay main sticking point as pilots ready to strike (thestar.com)

 

Charlene Hudy has a simple message for Canadians worried about the possibility of a strike by Air Canada pilots next week: She doesn’t want one either.

 

“I don’t want to be here. I wish I were being interviewed about a deal we’d just agreed to, instead of opening up a strike centre,” said Hudy, a first officer at Air Canada, who’s also chair of the Air Line Pilot Association division representing pilots at the country’s biggest airline.

 

As of 12:01 a.m. Wednesday, Hudy and her colleagues will be in a legal strike position. While there’s been some progress at the bargaining table during the last 15 months, there’s still a substantial gap, especially on the sticky issue of wages, Hudy said.

 

“We still need to see some significant moves from Air Canada at the table to get to a deal that is really worthy of the pilot group’s consideration,” said Hudy in an interview with the Star in an ALPA office, while her colleagues ran a phone bank speaking to Air Canada pilots around the world about logistics if there’s a strike or the airline locks them out.

 

Federal labour minister Steve MacKinnon met separately with each side Thursday, and called on them to reach a deal.

 

“There’s no reason why these parties can’t work together and get a deal done,” MacKinnon posted on X, the platform formerly known as Twitter.

 

A chart provided by the union shows some eye-popping wage differences across the border, with U.S. pilots making more than double than their Air Canada counterparts in some categories. Even in categories where there’s less of a gap, it’s still substantial: For captains with 12 years experience flying Boeing 777s, pilots at United, Delta and American Airlines make 76 per cent more in salary than their Air Canada counterparts.

 

The pay gap — if not closed or at least narrowed substantially, risks costing Air Canada some of its pilots, said industry expert John Gradek.

 

“These guys have tens of thousands of hours worth of experience. There is no shortage of jobs for pilots in the U.S. They have a ticket to ride,” said Gradek, a former Air Canada executive and head of McGill University’s Global Aviation Leadership Program.

 

Air Canada pilots work the phones fielding calls from fellow pilots wondering how a potential strike will affect them.

 

Gradek estimated that U.S. pilots flying a 777 make $450,000 (U.S.), while their Air Canada counterparts make $300,000 in Canadian currency.

 

In an email to the Star, Air Canada spokesperson Peter Fitzpatrick confirmed that wages are still a significant sticking point, but argued that comparing salaries in two countries isn’t appropriate.

 

“Although we have made progress on many issues in the talks since they began, some still remain, such as compensation,” said Fitzpatrick, adding that the airline hadn’t yet cancelled any flights in anticipation of a work stoppage.

 

“It does not make sense to base compensation discussions solely on the situation in another country, and that has never been the basis of wage negotiations in Canada.”

 

He also pointed to a company document which said the airline’s pilots earned on average between $215,075 and $351,958 in 2023, depending upon which kind of plane they fly.

 

While the union is in a legal strike position as of Wednesday, it would still need to give the airline 72 hours notice if it intends to go ahead with the strike. The airline could also lock its employees out with 72 hours notice, but has said it could cancel some flights even before that notification is given, in order to reduce the number of planes and passengers stuck around the world.

 

Business lobby groups called on MacKinnon to refer the two sides to the Canada Industrial Relations Board for binding arbitration, arguing that a strike or lockout would damage the economy, especially coming on the heels of a strike at CPKC and CN Rail.

 

“Canada cannot afford another major disruption to its transportation network. A labour disruption at Air Canada would ripple through our economy, from tourism to critical supply chains. The federal government must be prepared to intervene if necessary,” said Goldy Hyder, president and CEO of the Business Council of Canada.

 

That rail strike was ended when MacKinnon referred the two sides to the CIRB for binding arbitration, citing Section 107 of the Canada Labour Code. The CIRB agreed, sparking heavy criticism from unions across the country, and a legal challenge by the rail workers.

 

Hudy warned that government intervention would be a mistake, and that interventions in previous strikes, including the rail dispute, send a message to companies that they don’t have to come up with their best offer.

 

“if Air Canada and other corporations in Canada feel that the government is going to interfere or help them out when things get hard at the bargaining table, what incentivizes them to put their best foot forward at the bargaining table?,” said Hudy, adding that Air Canada’s pilots are leery of repeating the pattern set in 2012, when the government ordered arbitration, which resulted in a ten-year contract.

 

“The Air Canada pilots have a history of government interference in free and open collective bargaining. And we’re still suffering some of the repercussions from ... 2012,” said Hudy.

 

Settlements from binding arbitration can be counter-productive for both sides, and creates lingering bad blood, Hudy argued.

 

 McMaster University labour relations professor Stephanie Ross blasted the request by business organizations for the government to intervene.

 

“What we’re seeing right now is that workers have rights on paper until they inconvenience  business,” said Ross. “Do we actually believe that workers should have rights to shape their wages and working conditions, or not?”

 

MacKinnon also seemed to pour cold water on the idea of referring the dispute to the CIRB, as it did in the twin railway shutdowns in August.

“What I would say are there are significant differences between those two situations and leave it at that.” 

[Elias Pettersson]

Here is the starting salary for a pilot at Air Canada.  It's not even $60k.  What a joke.  You literally have to spend like $150,000 before you can even be qualified to fly an Air Canada plane...

 

FYI, these are for the First Officers, the person who assists the Captain.  Still, the First Officer still has to know how to fly the plane...

 

Edited Friday at 06:38 PM by Elias Pettersson

[King Heffy]

3 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Here is the starting salary for a pilot at Air Canada.  It's not even $60k.  What a joke.  You literally have to spend like $150,000 before you can even be qualified to fly an Air Canada plane...

 

FYI, these are for the First Officers, the person who assists the Captain.  Still, the First Officer still has to know how to fly the plane...

 

They're still dealing with the aftermath of wage cuts from 2004 they took to help the airline out.

[the destroyer of worlds]

28 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Didn't Trudeau's government purchase 6.4% of Air Canada back in 2021?  You would think he has some responsibility to make sure pilots are getting paid a fair wage.  $60k for a pilot is a joke.  They should be making double that...

The ownership was the result of a "bailout".  For a lot of the same reasons that Canada had shares in GM after the 2008 financial crisis.

 

And obviously I agree that pilots should make more.  Lots more.  

 

I find it rich that PP is appearing to side with labour when his voting record mostly says otherwise.

[King Heffy]

https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/trudeau-says-govt-pressuring-air-canada-pilots-avert-strike-2024-09-13/

 

The rare case where all sides appear to be in agreement.  We are all better for it when this happens.

[Coconuts]

22 hours ago, Warhippy said:

Since we're now using CBC as a viable source of info.

 

Something I have spoken of frequently and been told I was wrong has now been brought up nationally starting in Ontario.

 

The financialization of our housing sector by businesses and private/corporate enterprise.  This has been going on for almost 14 years and the numbers clearly show that a significant number of rental units are now being purchased in bulk numbers by these companies/corporations.

 

When a 20 unit development goes up for pre-sale and a single entitiy buys 12 of those units, they effectively control the price of rent in that unit and the surrounding area.

 

This is a huge problem and needs to be addressed immediately.

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/financialized-landlord-higher-rents-canada-1.7307015

 

Khalil Alibi is facing his Goliath.

Starlight Investments is Canada's largest landlord, with more than 54,000 units nationwide and 68,000 globally. Starlight was granted approval by Ontario's Landlord and Tenant Board to raise the rent above provincial guidelines twice in the last two years. Alibi says this makes his unit no longer affordable for him. 

"They should not be allowed to get away with this. They just keep coming to take and take and take," he said.

Alibi, who lives with his wife and three children, says the rent for his three-bedroom unit is now $1,761 per month, up from $1,472 in December 2019, the year Starlight purchased the building. One-bedroom units that have since become vacant are starting at $2,428 a month.

Alibi says he has to fight back. 

He and dozens of other tenants from his and two adjacent buildings — including 71, 75 and 79 Thorncliffe Park Drive in north Toronto — have joined forces in a rent strike since May 2023 to protest the Above Guideline Increases (AGIs) after the second one was issued to tenants earlier that year. 

What Alibi and the others are going through is hardly an anomaly. According to data from Rentals.ca, rents have risen across Canada by 22 per cent in just two years.

Starlight Investments is also part of a growing trend across Canada: the "financialized landlord," whose business model allows outside investors to share in the profit of rental housing.

 

Some tenants and housing experts believe this model is leading to higher rents across Canada, as the pressure to increase shareholder value becomes the top priority and these companies expand their share of the country's rental stock.

 

Absolutely baffling that this is allowed to go on, it's predatory af. That's an astonishing number of units and that's only one corporate entity. 

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, Coconuts said:

 

Absolutely baffling that this is allowed to go on, it's predatory af. That's an astonishing number of units and that's only one corporate entity. 

 

it really is bad. I get that no government wants to be blamed for lowering equity, but too many people are hurt by this, and if that part doesn't move the needle for people, its really bad for our economy. 

 

[RupertKBD]

I guess I'm missing something here....

 

From what I can tell, Air Canada is a privately owned enterprise (with the government owning a small percentage).....so how it is the government's fault that pilots are underpaid?

[King Heffy]

3 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

I guess I'm missing something here....

 

From what I can tell, Air Canada is a privately owned enterprise (with the government owning a small percentage).....so how it is the government's fault that pilots are underpaid?

Previous governments legislating pilots back to work is a big factor.

[the destroyer of worlds]

3 minutes ago, RupertKBD said:

I guess I'm missing something here....

 

From what I can tell, Air Canada is a privately owned enterprise (with the government owning a small percentage).....so how it is the government's fault that pilots are underpaid?

Narrator:  It's not.

[RupertKBD]

6 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Previous governments legislating pilots back to work is a big factor.

 

I get that, but I'm talking specifically about pilot's wages.

[Coconuts]

16 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

it really is bad. I get that no government wants to be blamed for lowering equity, but too many people are hurt by this, and if that part doesn't move the needle for people, its really bad for our economy. 

 

 

This is true, but I think at some point they've got to step in, equity has skyrocketed over the past five years as is. Warhippy hit the nail on the head when stating that "unfettered capitalism has been the direct contributor to the rise of housing in Canada and the US.". 

 

Housing costs have risen exponentially since 2019, folks have spoken about this both here and in the BC thread, and because of this many folks don't have a hope of getting into the market. Thing is, folks still need to live somewhere, the amount of dollars it takes to get into the housing market allows the squeeze to be put on folks who have no choice but to rent. I understand why folks would try to capitalize this and squeeze the rental market for all they can, that doesn't mean they should be able to. It's the average Canadian, or lower and medium tier income earners, who increasingly feel the squeeze, like they predominantly due with other rising costs of living. 

 

Perhaps we need more radical approaches that involve things like rent control, limiting how many properties and so on one can own, making renovictions geared towards getting someone out to up the rent tougher to accomplish, several evictions that come shortly after the buying of residential buildings, and so on. At what point do we value the average Canadian not being gouged by costs of living, egregious rental hikes, and sky high housing costs over the "free market"? BC in particular has become an investment playground over the past few decades, when is enough enough? 

 

I understand that some folks view real estate investment as their path to wealth, retirement, and so on, but I take issue with the state of things. Housing is a human right but it seems that it's becoming more and more inaccessible for the average Canadian, this affects every generation and demographic within Canada, and the it's becoming increasingly expensive. These are complicated issues, but greed and the desire for profit underpin it all. I'm not saying housing (not even home ownership) should be free, but things should be done to make it more accessible. 

 

You've said the government should step in and provide more social housing, you've touched on crown land, I don't disagree, but there needs to be more imo. Corporate entities having carte blanche to squeeze Canada's housing and rental markets for all they can is a disgrace. 

 

It ain't just corporate entities though, investors are increasingly eating up the existing stock in general. Investors are the fastest growing share of home buyers, homes and housing should be an affordable and a social right rather than a financial asset for the rich. Don't get me wrong, I get that it's complicated, but things just seem to keep getting worse. 

 

"With new condo construction hitting “record levels,” prospects for first-time homebuyers may be improving, but experts warn competition for those units will be fierce."

"Wealthy investors looking for a second or third property are common customers for those types of homes. Recent trends show more of them are purchasing properties than first-timers." 

 

"The majority of investors are mom-and-pop investors, smaller investors,” said Pasalis. “Investors are the one segment of the home buying market that’s actually growing more so than first time buyers and repeat buyers. And in fact, the share of first-time buyers buying homes is declining. And largely investors are taking up that market share."

 

“As much as a quarter to maybe a third or slightly more of certain markets are being bought up by multiple property purchasers or investors. So (that is) adding another layer of competition to first time buyers that are actually looking to get into the housing market for a place to live.”

 

"According to a recent TD Bank report, investors accounted for around 30 per cent of all houses bought in Canada last year."

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/10394986/are-mom-and-pop-investors-pricing-out-first-time-homebuyers/#:~:text=According to a recent TD,and the wider Canadian economy.