EastCoastExpress Posted Sunday at 04:10 PM Share Posted Sunday at 04:10 PM 3 minutes ago, Bob Long said: SpaceX has been heavily subsidized and rewarded government contracts. Where are you getting this idea from? Look up the history of NRC funding eg. Starlink is not a SpaceX company. SpaceX is delivering on Gov Contracts that used to be NASA. Some examples? Bombardier? We didnt get any of that back and they sold off the train divisions. (also another quebec company) Or, in another year, they will ask for another billion and gov will do it rather than lose the initial investment. Do Canadian tax payers get shares in the company? Shouldn't Canadians get 2.1 B worth of shares? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 04:16 PM Share Posted Sunday at 04:16 PM (edited) 14 minutes ago, EastCoastExpress said: Starlink is not a SpaceX company. SpaceX is delivering on Gov Contracts that used to be NASA. Which company do you think Starkink is a subsidiary of? 14 minutes ago, EastCoastExpress said: Some examples? Bombardier? We didnt get any of that back and they sold off the train divisions. (also another quebec company) Or, in another year, they will ask for another billion and gov will do it rather than lose the initial investment. Do Canadian tax payers get shares in the company? Shouldn't Canadians get 2.1 B worth of shares? How do you think new tech companies and major initiatives are formed in Canada, and around the world? Also why would we want the money to leave Canada? Edited Sunday at 04:25 PM by Bob Long Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastExpress Posted Sunday at 04:27 PM Share Posted Sunday at 04:27 PM 3 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Which company do you think Starkink is a subsidiary of? How do you think new tech companies are formed in Canada, and around the world? Most Tech company startups are supported by investment firms, private investors. You ever watch "Dragons Den" or Shark tank? The ones on TV programs are not the only ones. The ones supported by Government funding are usually failures. There is NO accountability. If the Government wants to support an industry for Jobs, they should demand part ownership (by CANADIAN TAXPAYERS) of said company, or tell them to get private funding. We all bitch and complain and justify these massive projects but I am just trying to raise the point there is a solution. They can create jobs by throwing millions or billions around at these companies, but the taxpayer should now "own" part of said company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted Sunday at 04:41 PM Share Posted Sunday at 04:41 PM 10 minutes ago, EastCoastExpress said: Most Tech company startups are supported by investment firms, private investors. You ever watch "Dragons Den" or Shark tank? The ones on TV programs are not the only ones. The ones supported by Government funding are usually failures. There is NO accountability. If the Government wants to support an industry for Jobs, they should demand part ownership (by CANADIAN TAXPAYERS) of said company, or tell them to get private funding. We all bitch and complain and justify these massive projects but I am just trying to raise the point there is a solution. They can create jobs by throwing millions or billions around at these companies, but the taxpayer should now "own" part of said company. Can you see any benefits to a company becoming successful and employing a lot of taxpayers while the company itself is paying corporate taxes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 04:58 PM Share Posted Sunday at 04:58 PM 30 minutes ago, EastCoastExpress said: Most Tech company startups are supported by investment firms, private investors. You ever watch "Dragons Den" or Shark tank? The ones on TV programs are not the only ones. The ones supported by Government funding are usually failures. There is NO accountability. If the Government wants to support an industry for Jobs, they should demand part ownership (by CANADIAN TAXPAYERS) of said company, or tell them to get private funding. We all bitch and complain and justify these massive projects but I am just trying to raise the point there is a solution. They can create jobs by throwing millions or billions around at these companies, but the taxpayer should now "own" part of said company. this is just bunk. NRC IRAP has funded many succesful Canadian start ups and ideas. You have no idea what you are talking about, sorry bud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 05:00 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:00 PM Lets see, we can promote GDP growth, support high paying tech jobs (that pay taxes), retain industry in Canada, or, meh lets just pay Elon. FFS is this reallywhat the CPC has in store for Canada? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 05:35 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:35 PM 3 hours ago, Bob Long said: Do you honestly think CBC would protect Trudeau? Also how would CBC have exclusive access to this info? CNN protects Joe and Kamala. Fox News protects Trump. CBC protects Trudeau. Do you really think those names haven’t been leaked yet? You think CNN doesn’t know who’s on Epstein’s client list? CBC has exclusive access to certain politicians. Those politicians have access to the names. Very simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 05:47 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:47 PM 1 hour ago, EastCoastExpress said: Starlink is not a SpaceX company. SpaceX is delivering on Gov Contracts that used to be NASA. Some examples? Bombardier? We didnt get any of that back and they sold off the train divisions. (also another quebec company) Or, in another year, they will ask for another billion and gov will do it rather than lose the initial investment. Do Canadian tax payers get shares in the company? Shouldn't Canadians get 2.1 B worth of shares? Starlink is a wholly owned subsidiary of SpaceX… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 05:50 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:50 PM 13 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: CNN protects Joe and Kamala. Fox News protects Trump. CBC protects Trudeau. Do you really think those names haven’t been leaked yet? You think CNN doesn’t know who’s on Epstein’s client list? CBC has exclusive access to certain politicians. Those politicians have access to the names. Very simple. dunno Petey, its all speculation. For CBC to have the info, someone has to break the law. Like the guy that leaked info to the Globe and Mail. Do you really think Justin would do that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 05:52 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:52 PM 1 hour ago, Bob Long said: SpaceX has been heavily subsidized and rewarded government contracts. Where are you getting this idea from? Look up the history of NRC funding eg. SpaceX has raised most of the money on its own through private equity investment. Even Google owns a part of SpaceX. They have been given government contracts, but quite frankly SpaceX is really the only company that can do what they do. They literally had to bail out NASA to save the astronauts stuck in space. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted Sunday at 05:56 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:56 PM 2 hours ago, bolt said: Why the need for taxpayer infused investment if their product was so good. Their far out project is twice the price of star link. Their company might have past success but this project seems unnecessary. Why does musk need so much tax payer money again? Asking for a friend who loves hypocrisy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 05:57 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:57 PM 4 minutes ago, Bob Long said: dunno Petey, its all speculation. For CBC to have the info, someone has to break the law. Like the guy that leaked info to the Globe and Mail. Do you really think Justin would do that? The press never disclose their sources. Same with Frank Seravalli and Elliotte Friedman. How do you think Friedman gets all the scoops? Same with reporters. They would go to jail before disclosing their sources. I’d bet big money somebody at the CBC has the list of names. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted Sunday at 05:59 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:59 PM 1 hour ago, EastCoastExpress said: . They can create jobs by throwing millions or billions around at these companies, but the taxpayer should now "own" part of said company. This has actually been brought up and agreed upon by most of the forum numerous times. Ironically it is a certain group that usually disagrees with this idea. We all agree that taxpayer money should not be going to corporations period. Without the government taking some form of direct cut or ownership for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 05:59 PM Share Posted Sunday at 05:59 PM 1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said: SpaceX has raised most of the money on its own through private equity investment. Even Google owns a part of SpaceX. They have been given government contracts, but quite frankly SpaceX is really the only company that can do what they do. They literally had to bail out NASA to save the astronauts stuck in space. Petey, they got subsidies to get started, like many businesses do, thats not in dispute, and its not a thing i have an issue with. I think governments should help seed its industires. What's baffling is your CPC buddies wanting to pad Elon's wallet, instead of supporing Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 06:00 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:00 PM 2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: The press never disclose their sources. Same with Frank Seravalli and Elliotte Friedman. How do you think Friedman gets all the scoops? Same with reporters. They would go to jail before disclosing their sources. I’d bet big money somebody at the CBC has the list of names. huge risk for Trudeau to take tho. He's too pretty for jail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 06:08 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:08 PM 1 minute ago, Warhippy said: Why does musk need so much tax payer money again? Asking for a friend who loves hypocrisy Where does Musk get tax payer money? SpaceX has raised most of its money through private equity investment. Same with Tesla. Tesla did get a loan from the government early on, but so did Ford and Nissan under the same automotive government program. They paid it back within 4 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satchmo Posted Sunday at 06:09 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:09 PM 33 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: CNN protects Joe and Kamala. Fox News protects Trump. CBC protects Trudeau. Do you really think those names haven’t been leaked yet? You think CNN doesn’t know who’s on Epstein’s client list? CBC has exclusive access to certain politicians. Those politicians have access to the names. Very simple. Sure sounds simple. On that I can agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastExpress Posted Sunday at 06:09 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:09 PM 8 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Petey, they got subsidies to get started, like many businesses do, thats not in dispute, and its not a thing i have an issue with. I think governments should help seed its industires. What's baffling is your CPC buddies wanting to pad Elon's wallet, instead of supporing Canada. I think that "side" of the conversation is why re-invent the wheel when you can give the people $1500 each towards buying a $299 starlink kit and another 1.5 years of subscriptons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastExpress Posted Sunday at 06:12 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:12 PM (edited) 5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Where does Musk get tax payer money? SpaceX has raised most of its money through private equity investment. Same with Tesla. Tesla did get a loan from the government early on, but so did Ford and Nissan under the same automotive government program. They paid it back within 4 years. And instead Trudeau and Ford give $5 Billion to Honda (not a payback agreement) to buy what, 1000 jobs in Ontario... Edited Sunday at 06:14 PM by EastCoastExpress Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted Sunday at 06:13 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:13 PM 2 minutes ago, EastCoastExpress said: I think that "side" of the conversation is why re-invent the wheel when you can give the people $1500 each towards buying a $299 starlink kit and another 1.5 years of subscriptons. and no benefit whatsoever to Canada. There's no side when you look at the entire picture, if you want money to stay in our country. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted Sunday at 06:25 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:25 PM 1 hour ago, EastCoastExpress said: They can create jobs by throwing millions or billions around at these companies, but the taxpayer should now "own" part of said company. This should please you then. Canadians will own interest on the loan and shares of the company. As previously disclosed, the Government of Canada loan is for $2.14 billion and will carry a floating interest rate that is 4.75% above the Canadian Overnight Repo Rate Average (CORRA) with a 15-year maturity. Interest is payable in-kind during the Telesat Lightspeed construction period, followed by a 10-year sculpted amortization. Furthermore, the Government of Canada is receiving warrants for 10% of the common shares of Telesat LEO based upon an equity valuation for Telesat LEO of US$3 billion. The Government of Quebec loan is for $400 million and has terms that largely mirror the Government of Canada loan but with warrants for 1.87%, in proportion to the smaller loan amount. The borrower under each loan, Telesat LEO Inc. (Telesat LEO), is a subsidiary of Telesat. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 06:26 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:26 PM 24 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Petey, they got subsidies to get started, like many businesses do, thats not in dispute, and its not a thing i have an issue with. I think governments should help seed its industires. What's baffling is your CPC buddies wanting to pad Elon's wallet, instead of supporing Canada. Not true. I checked their history. Most of their money came from private equity investment. Telesat will be given over $2 billion of taxpayer money. How do we know their product will even work properly? How do we know the government will stop at only $2 billion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastExpress Posted Sunday at 06:27 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:27 PM 1 minute ago, 4petesake said: This should please you then. Canadians will own interest on the loan and shares of the company. As previously disclosed, the Government of Canada loan is for $2.14 billion and will carry a floating interest rate that is 4.75% above the Canadian Overnight Repo Rate Average (CORRA) with a 15-year maturity. Interest is payable in-kind during the Telesat Lightspeed construction period, followed by a 10-year sculpted amortization. Furthermore, the Government of Canada is receiving warrants for 10% of the common shares of Telesat LEO based upon an equity valuation for Telesat LEO of US$3 billion. The Government of Quebec loan is for $400 million and has terms that largely mirror the Government of Canada loan but with warrants for 1.87%, in proportion to the smaller loan amount. The borrower under each loan, Telesat LEO Inc. (Telesat LEO), is a subsidiary of Telesat. Yes! its about time! Why is that not in the news eh? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 06:43 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:43 PM Looks like Telesat got their funding just in time before their stock got completely wiped out. What have they been doing the last 3 years for their stock to be completely tanking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted Sunday at 06:46 PM Share Posted Sunday at 06:46 PM What a coincidence!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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