[signing] Forbort to Canucks

[HarbularyBattery]

6 minutes ago, Attila Umbrus said:

YUCK 

 

This is honestly the perfect time for Hirose to shine.

 

Last year he was injured a lot. Hopefully he comes in healed and healthy and gets a full summer of training for him.

 

He needs to pack on some muscle. If he can add 10 lbs he could have a crack at the opening day lineup.

 

He has sublime skill, he’s our most affordable option for a puck moving defender.

 

Rooting for him! I may even pick him as my dark horse next year…maybe…lol

 

Allvin hinted that the system was going to change

 

Instead of everyone regrouping in the neutral zone and having a defenseman skate it up, its going to be super quick transition as soon as we get possession back, one outlet pass to a forward to create an odd man rush

 

fast, transitional play, and itll make it a lot harder for teams to clog up the netural zone and stifle our entries

 

forbort/desharnais/myers can make a quick, short outlet pass. i think thats why they focused on adding fast, forechecking goal scorers.

 

but yeah i do think we're gonna need a decent puck mover at some point, just to have the option of mixing up the zone exits

[Attila Umbrus]

1 minute ago, HarbularyBattery said:

 

Allvin hinted that the system was going to change

 

Instead of everyone regrouping in the neutral zone and having a defenseman skate it up, its going to be super quick transition as soon as we get possession back, one outlet pass to a forward to create an odd man rush

 

fast, transitional play, and itll make it a lot harder for teams to clog up the netural zone and stifle our entries

 

forbort/desharnais/myers can make a quick, short outlet pass. i think thats why they focused on adding fast, forechecking goal scorers.

 

but yeah i do think we're gonna need a decent puck mover at some point, just to have the option of mixing up the zone exits

I’m excited to see this play out. Even if they are what they are. They would make a hell of a PK tandem.

 

If you have to play them less in certain games then so be it. Hughes and Hronek and Soucy/Myers can cover the extra minutes here and there.

 

Come playoff time their minutes may even go up because they can handle the grind better.

 

I’m always amazed how the playoffs always boils down to best defence and goaltending wins…games are 3-2 or 2-1…not so high scoring. The neutral zone plugs up and shut down hockey reigns supreme. 

[CanucksJay]

15 minutes ago, Artemus said:

 

Interesting observations. Quite different than mine. I think that our D-corps with the addition of Forbort and Desharnais is faster than last year's version or at least on par.

 

Ian Cole was not fleet of foot. I think that Desharnais will prove to be more effective. Not to mention cheaper. Probably a staple on the PK.

 

Zadorov was mobile for a big man. I really liked Big Z.

Forbort, though he doesn't have the upside and the intangibles that Z brought, he is a better skater than Zadorov.

It's been a few years since I watched Forbort play but what I remember about him was his high end skating.

The trick for Forbort will be staying healthy. IIRC, Forbort much like Soucy, spends a fair bit of time in sick bay.

 

Then we have the four holdovers on defence from last year. Hughes, Hronek, Myers and Soucy.

Hughes is a very good skater.

Hronek, IMO, is an above average skater.

Myers and Soucy both skate well for big men.

 

I don't believe that our defence corps is as good as the one that we finished last year with but I am not nervous about a lack of foot speed.

 

 

That's a relief to hear a different take that is more optimistic. 

 

Here's an article about Desharnais from Edmonton

 

https://oilersnation.com/news/can-vincent-desharnais-be-an-effective-defensive-partner-for-darnell-nurse-in-the-oilers-top-four

 

Perhaps Desharnais’ greatest weakness is his foot speed and overall skating. This can be an issue against faster teams in the playoffs, potentially explaining his regression in the playoffs last season.

 

As for Forbort, I think he was an adequate skater but I don't remember him being all that fast. And that was when I remembered him in LA when he was younger. At his age now, I don't even know what level he skates at. I would think Z is the better skater at this point? 

[DrJockitch]

10 minutes ago, HarbularyBattery said:

 

Allvin hinted that the system was going to change

 

Instead of everyone regrouping in the neutral zone and having a defenseman skate it up, its going to be super quick transition as soon as we get possession back, one outlet pass to a forward to create an odd man rush

 

fast, transitional play, and itll make it a lot harder for teams to clog up the netural zone and stifle our entries

 

forbort/desharnais/myers can make a quick, short outlet pass. i think thats why they focused on adding fast, forechecking goal scorers.

 

but yeah i do think we're gonna need a decent puck mover at some point, just to have the option of mixing up the zone exits

PA seems to plan on adjusting things once seeing what he has is missing in season. Leaving him some cap flexibility is a good thing. 
‘The forward signings seem to indicate that too. Fast forechecking forwards and pests.
Pretty much JR’s entire history looks like that, surround your stars with big fast forwards and giant D. 

When we fell down in the playoffs and in parts of the season was when the 2nd and 3rd pairs struggled to move the puck out, and I don’t think that has improved from the back end perspective. 
‘What I don’t see is someone to slide up to Hughes’ right like Zads did at times in the playoffs.  Myers has never really worked there. That is a big step for VD who really has only one full season. 
I think it is correct that we will see a move for a PMD at some point but probably after 1st day of cap compliance into the season. 

[Artemus]

2 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

That's a relief to hear a different take that is more optimistic. 

 

Here's an article about Desharnais from Edmonton

 

https://oilersnation.com/news/can-vincent-desharnais-be-an-effective-defensive-partner-for-darnell-nurse-in-the-oilers-top-four

 

Perhaps Desharnais’ greatest weakness is his foot speed and overall skating. This can be an issue against faster teams in the playoffs, potentially explaining his regression in the playoffs last season.

 

As for Forbort, I think he was an adequate skater but I don't remember him being all that fast. And that was when I remembered him in LA when he was younger. At his age now, I don't even know what level he skates at. I would think Z is the better skater at this point? 

 

 

Was comparing Desharnais to the D-man that he will be replacing, that being Ian Cole, 3RHD. 

I did notice that Desharnais was having a little difficulty with some fast, smaller forwards in the playoffs but thought that he looked at least as mobile as Cole.

Cole was having difficulties in the playoffs too, just like you would expect from most 3rd pairing defensemen.

So, I am not seeing a downgrade in skating at the 3RHD spot. Plus, Desharnais is less expensive and he is younger.

 

It's been a few years since I actually watched Forbort play. He was noticeably a good skater. Perhaps injuries and time have reduced that skill.

IIRC, he is oft injured and has had some surgeries. We will have our answer in about three months.

 

When all the dust has cleared, I believe that we will have regrets about not having big Z ..... I'm going to really miss the big guy ...... but reduced foot speed amongst our D-corps should not be an issue.

 

 

 

[The Duke]

13 minutes ago, Artemus said:

 

 

Was comparing Desharnais to the D-man that he will be replacing, that being Ian Cole, 3RHD. 

I did notice that Desharnais was having a little difficulty with some fast, smaller forwards in the playoffs but thought that he looked at least as mobile as Cole.

Cole was having difficulties in the playoffs too, just like you would expect from most 3rd pairing defensemen.

So, I am not seeing a downgrade in skating at the 3RHD spot. Plus, Desharnais is less expensive and he is younger.

 

It's been a few years since I actually watched Forbort play. He was noticeably a good skater. Perhaps injuries and time have reduced that skill.

IIRC, he is oft injured and has had some surgeries. We will have our answer in about three months.

 

When all the dust has cleared, I believe that we will have regrets about not having big Z ..... I'm going to really miss the big guy ...... but reduced foot speed amongst our D-corps should not be an issue.

 

 

 

Interesting take on Forbort.  His knock out of Boston was more giveaways (though the stats don’t show it as a huge issue.) 

 

I think sometimes we just assume big and 32=slow but at 6’4 217 he isn’t so big that his size should slow him down at all.

Edited Wednesday at 07:19 PM by The Duke

[CanucksJay]

1 hour ago, Artemus said:

 

 

Was comparing Desharnais to the D-man that he will be replacing, that being Ian Cole, 3RHD. 

I did notice that Desharnais was having a little difficulty with some fast, smaller forwards in the playoffs but thought that he looked at least as mobile as Cole.

Cole was having difficulties in the playoffs too, just like you would expect from most 3rd pairing defensemen.

So, I am not seeing a downgrade in skating at the 3RHD spot. Plus, Desharnais is less expensive and he is younger.

 

It's been a few years since I actually watched Forbort play. He was noticeably a good skater. Perhaps injuries and time have reduced that skill.

IIRC, he is oft injured and has had some surgeries. We will have our answer in about three months.

 

When all the dust has cleared, I believe that we will have regrets about not having big Z ..... I'm going to really miss the big guy ...... but reduced foot speed amongst our D-corps should not be an issue.

 

 

 

 

If I was to rank Cole vs Desharnais, I would rank Cole ahead of him for both skating and skill, IQ. The fact that he got a full 1.1m more in free agency attests that GMs in the league value him more than Desharnais as well. 

I think with Desharnais, we are hoping he is a late bloomer with upside which can make him potentially better than Cole but based on actual play thus far in their careers, it would only be with homer glasses where we would say their play is even... 

If Cole was on the Oilers, I have no doubt he would have locked down a starting spot instead of coming in and out of the lineup like Desharnais. He might even have been the smallest of difference between winning the cup and not.

As for Forbort, like I said, I remember he was a serviceable d man many years ago. He was a staple on the bottom pairing. Basically a better faster Juulsen who is a 7D.

Since then, many years and injuries have passed. Let's hope he still has gas in the tank. 

If anything, I'd say Forbort in his prime is like a bigger Ian Cole. 

 

Which means... We lost the best D out of that group which was Z

 

That being said, I'm not broken up about it anymore. We have 2.75 cap space with 14 Forwards, 8D and Demko. 

We need to sign Silovs still. 

 

If we trim one forward, one D making league min, that's another 1.6 we free up with 13 forward and 7D.

 

We then have 4.35

 

If we can get Silovs under 1.35m (totally doable), we'd have 3m cap to upgrade on D at the deadline. 

 

I have no doubt we will get a solid defenseme (2-4D) at some point this season even if that means we end up giving up a high draft pick and a prospect. 

. 

 

[Blue]

On 7/1/2024 at 10:21 AM, Odd. said:

Forbort is legit one of the worst defenseman I’ve seen. Oh well. Depth signing tbh.

Forbortion 

[Theo5789]

All this talk about Forbort and Desharnais, we all know the solution to all of this is just signing Tryamkin!

[DeNiro]

2 hours ago, Theo5789 said:

All this talk about Forbort and Desharnais, we all know the solution to all of this is just signing Tryamkin!

Is he like 40 now?

 

Feels like that’s how long fans have been complaining about him leaving 

 

 

 

Edited Thursday at 01:04 AM by DeNiro

[higgyfan]

 

It's a bit of a head scratcher.  Not sure what the expectation is going to be for Forbort.  He does play

+17mins a game and plays the PK.  No doubt a depth player; certainly a cut above Friedman. Most likely

a placeholder for a rookie next season.

 

Peeps shouldn't be comparing him to Sharny, though.  Better skater than being reported, tough along the boards

and in front of the net.  Obviously, the couching staff think they can help him improve his game.  My bet is that

by the end of the season, he will be a reliable dman and the fans will be happy he's signed for the extra year.

 

[Blue]

Why aren't we more interested in some of the puck moving d men out there ? Rather than these thugs

[King Heffy]

19 minutes ago, Blue said:

Why aren't we more interested in some of the puck moving d men out there ? Rather than these thugs

These guys can play defence.  None of the "puck moving" guys available have shown any sign they're capable of playing like NHLers in their own zone.  Hopefully we're learned from Hunt/Weber/Larsen/Pouliot/Del Zotto and we won't be getting any more defensive liabilities on the blueline.

[Blitz-Pix]

1 hour ago, higgyfan said:

 

It's a bit of a head scratcher.  Not sure what the expectation is going to be for Forbort.  He does play

+17mins a game and plays the PK.  No doubt a depth player; certainly a cut above Friedman. Most likely

a placeholder for a rookie next season.

 

Peeps shouldn't be comparing him to Sharny, though.  Better skater than being reported, tough along the boards

and in front of the net.  Obviously, the couching staff think they can help him improve his game.  My bet is that

by the end of the season, he will be a reliable dman and the fans will be happy he's signed for the extra year.

 

 

I don't know much about him (besides stats)

 

He's only here for 1 year at $1.5 million...kinda sounds like a placeholder and or a show me deal. 

He's been around for 12(ish) seasons but bounced around a bit. I'm sure Mgmt spoke to the coaching staff

before signing guys though. 

   

[Pianoman]

On 7/1/2024 at 12:57 PM, DisgruntledNucksFan said:

I’m so mad about z . Glad the team is addressing toughness. We lack that . Does this guy play on the right ? Can he protect quinner if required (ala Nashville series)

Mad that he wanted 5x6 and didnt give the Canucks more of a discount? I think I would be more mad if they signed him to 6x5. 

[I.AM.THE.WALRUS]

3 hours ago, DeNiro said:

Is he like 40 now?

 

Feels like that’s how long fans have been complaining about him leaving 

 

 

 

Ya the Tram man sucked anyways 

[DeNiro]

1 hour ago, I.AM.THE.WALRUS said:

Ya the Tram man sucked anyways 

He had like two good plays that Canucks fans will relive forever. 

 

I feel like the same thing is happening with Zadorov. The legend of how good he was will continue to grow…

[N4ZZY]

10 hours ago, Artemus said:

 

 

Was comparing Desharnais to the D-man that he will be replacing, that being Ian Cole, 3RHD. 

I did notice that Desharnais was having a little difficulty with some fast, smaller forwards in the playoffs but thought that he looked at least as mobile as Cole.

Cole was having difficulties in the playoffs too, just like you would expect from most 3rd pairing defensemen.

So, I am not seeing a downgrade in skating at the 3RHD spot. Plus, Desharnais is less expensive and he is younger.

 

It's been a few years since I actually watched Forbort play. He was noticeably a good skater. Perhaps injuries and time have reduced that skill.

IIRC, he is oft injured and has had some surgeries. We will have our answer in about three months.

 

When all the dust has cleared, I believe that we will have regrets about not having big Z ..... I'm going to really miss the big guy ...... but reduced foot speed amongst our D-corps should not be an issue.

 

 

 

Yeah, I think there will be some regrets with Zadorov, but with our cap situation, we just couldn't give a third-paired defenseman 5m over 6 years. That just doesn't make any sense in the lineup. 

 

[DeNiro]

I was looking at Debrusks coaches over the years and how Tocchet will be his third straight Jack Adams coach.

Turns out Forbort has had an even more impressive resume of coaches over the years.
 

He’s been coached by Sutter, McLellan, Maurice, Cassidy, Montgomery, and now Tocchet. That’s 4 of the last 5 Jack Adams winners and the most recent cup winning coach. Needless to say he’s been coached very well.

 

Ive always said it’s good to pick up players from good systems. You don’t need to over explain things to these guys because they get it. They’ve had coaches drill the details into them their whole careers. Will hopefully make for a seem less transition for him.

 

Edited Thursday at 06:05 AM by DeNiro

[N4ZZY]

44 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

He had like two good plays that Canucks fans will relive forever. 

 

I feel like the same thing is happening with Zadorov. The legend of how good he was will continue to grow…

I guess we'll see how good he actually is, next season, in Boston. If he doesn't play the way he played with us, he's going to receive a lot of criticism in Beantown. 

 

[N4ZZY]

Just now, DeNiro said:

I was looking at Debrusks coaches over the years and how Tocchet will be his third straight Jack Adams coach.

Turns out Forbort has had an even more impressive resume of coaches over the years.
 

He’s been coached by Sutter, McLellan, Maurice, Cassidy, Montgomery, and now Tocchet. That’s 4 of the last 5 Jack Adams winners and the most recent cup winning coach. Needless to say he’s been coached very well.

 

Ive always said it’s good to pick up players from good systems. You don’t need to over explain things to these guys because they get it. They’ve had coaches drill the details into them their whole careers. Will hopefully make for a seem less tradition for him.

 

tradition or transition? lol 

 

[DeNiro]

Just now, N4ZZY said:

tradition or transition? lol 

 

Damn autocorrect.

 

But he does have a tradition of playing for Jack Adams coaches. 

[DeNiro]

3 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

I guess we'll see how good he actually is, next season, in Boston. If he doesn't play the way he played with us, he's going to receive a lot of criticism in Beantown. 

 

I mean they’re gonna love him the first time he throws his first big open ice hit.

 

But again it’s about the long term cap allocation and whether or not it makes sense to pay a guy like a top 4 when he hasn’t shown he can play that role consistently yet at age 28.

[N4ZZY]

43 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Damn autocorrect.

 

But he does have a tradition of playing for Jack Adams coaches. 

[N4ZZY]

41 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

I mean they’re gonna love him the first time he throws his first big open ice hit.

 

But again it’s about the long term cap allocation and whether or not it makes sense to pay a guy like a top 4 when he hasn’t shown he can play that role consistently yet at age 28.

Zadorov's 29, isn't he? 

 

But yeah, it's a big gamble to allocate that much cap to a guy who hasn't proven himself to have ever played on a top four on any of the teams he's played on.