JamesB Posted July 3 Author Share Posted July 3 1 hour ago, wai_lai416 said: unpopular take i think EP is going to be around the 20 goal mark... you can rip me all you want for being negative.. EP had 7 goals since the all star break 3 of them are from the PP.. you almost have to be blind and oblivous to see there's no one he's playing with is setting him up 5v5 ever since kuzmenko is gone.. debrusk sure is a nice 40-50 point guy that can score 20-25 goals consistently.. but he just like hoglander.. don't really have the playmaking ability.. that's why i was desperate for a guentzel.. because he can score and he can setup.. i'm lookinag at the likely debrusk ep hoglander line and i just don't see where EP will get his goals from we already saw the lack of offensive awareness from hoglander in the playoff when he turns back multiple time instead of passing it to a wide open streaking ep.. I think you are right that Petey will be the primary playmaker on that line, but I still think he hits 30 goals if he plays all 82 games. In his 6 years in the NHL he has never scored at less than a 30 goal per 82 game pace. Of course, he probably will miss a few games here and there but, even so, it would be a big surprise if he ends up with less 25. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromeslab Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 2 hours ago, wai_lai416 said: unpopular take i think EP is going to be around the 20 goal mark... you can rip me all you want for being negative.. EP had 7 goals since the all star break 3 of them are from the PP.. you almost have to be blind and oblivous to see there's no one he's playing with is setting him up 5v5 ever since kuzmenko is gone.. debrusk sure is a nice 40-50 point guy that can score 20-25 goals consistently.. but he just like hoglander.. don't really have the playmaking ability.. that's why i was desperate for a guentzel.. because he can score and he can setup.. i'm lookinag at the likely debrusk ep hoglander line and i just don't see where EP will get his goals from we already saw the lack of offensive awareness from hoglander in the playoff when he turns back multiple time instead of passing it to a wide open streaking ep.. That’s a lofty take Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromeslab Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Just now, Cromeslab said: That’s a lofty take It is interesting tho hoping Debrusk can spark Petey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wai_lai416 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 38 minutes ago, JamesB said: I think you are right that Petey will be the primary playmaker on that line, but I still think he hits 30 goals if he plays all 82 games. In his 6 years in the NHL he has never scored at less than a 30 goal per 82 game pace. Of course, he probably will miss a few games here and there but, even so, it would be a big surprise if he ends up with less 25. i'm just looking up his 6 year stats, outside of his first year where he played with boeser/goldobin mostly he had always had a decent playmaker majority of the time. year 2,3,4 he has Miller/boeser and then year 5 and 6 he had kuzmenko up till he was traded then he was on like a 20 goal pace. maybe debrusk commands more attention from the other team and draw some focus away from him something hoglander and mikheyev is unable to do.. but that will only give him the passing options.. so i guess we'll see how it works out.. but there are way too many times in the last half of the season EP looks alone out there when he doesn't have the puck because there's no one there to get the puck back to him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureQuickness Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 4 hours ago, ngoway said: Can't really stand Steve Dangle, but saw this video. You know they're good signings when a Toronto biased podcast/channel can't really say any bad things. Plus they've gotten a good look at Debrusk, Heinen, and Forbort and it's good that they're happy they're out of their conference. He may be 'biased', but he is also able to see things for what they are. Bias is only an issue when you're like Luke Gadzic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Trump Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 I have some thoughts. Utah had the biggest improvement. Nashville became a serious contender. Edmonton did great, way better than I thought. Scary team. Toronto got better, unfortunately. Boston got better. Washington may have a playoff team. Detroit may have a playoff team. Seattle had minor improvements. Chicago got better, but not a playoff team. Canucks got a better starting lineup than last year's start. Better forwards for sure, defense may have decreased, but hopefully more responsible defensive forwards. All.other teams have either stayed similar, or regressed. I think alot of teams got worse to be honest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 I asked a leading question to my Oilers buddy. Did you sign a goalie ? We signed Picard ! He says 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 8 hours ago, Donald Trump said: I have some thoughts. . Edmonton did great, way better than I thought. Scary team. . Im surprised how many ppl are saying this. Edmonton is constructed like an early Yahoo Fantasy team. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 (edited) For the Canucks after taking it in, I guess I can give them a grade of "C" not bad, not good. Just average. Seems like Vancouver is trying to find lighting in a bottle with their signings. Get good value players that might excel in Tocchet's system. That's fine and I can see Vancouver raising it's floor but not enough to make an improvement on their ceiling. Plus Zadorov walking still leaves quite a hole on D. Edited July 3 by iinatcc 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 21 hours ago, JamesB said: I think this is exactly wrong. Nashville is the biggest loser. Start with Stamkos -- signed for 4 years with an AAV of 8 million. Stamkos was a great player in his prime. He is well past his prime now. He had 81 points last year in 79 games, which looks good. But it is misleading. He has lost a step and has become a defensive liability. He is still very good on the PP and had 39 PP points last season. But that means he had only 42 points in other situations -- not bad, but not 8 million good. His plus\minus was -21 despite playing on a good team and getting favorable deployment (lots more o-zone starts than d-zone starts). Performance aggregators like Evolving Hockey have him as a below replacement level player defensively. Almost all forwards decline significantly in their mid-30s. In fact, very few forwards can play effectively in their mid-30s at all and most retire in their early to mid 30s. There are a few who can play well into their late 30s, but they are exceptions, and even they play well below their peak level. Next year, Stamkos will likely still be valuable as a PP specialist who can provide an offensive threat when needed, but he will need to be protected defensively. After that who knows. Their other big signings are Marchessault (age 33, 5 years at an AAV of 5.5), Skjei (age 30, 7 x 7), and re-signing Saros (age 28, contract kicks in a year down the road for 8 years at almost 8 million AAV). Those contracts are all likely to age badly. And even Carrier is no bargain at 3.75. Nashville might be pretty good next year, but they are already an old team and are likely to struggle after that. But to that point the core of the Preds is also around that age group. So these will some bad contracts after 3 years or so but in the now this is consistent with the Pred's window. Best case is it's enough to win the cup within their short window, worst case they get bad after but they can easily rebuild at that point since most of their contracts expire around 2027 to 2030. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 23 hours ago, Junkyard Dog said: Canucks did well with the cap they had. Only real gamble is Desharnais but it isn’t a huge one. I give them a tentative B. Could be higher or worse depending how the season goes in regards of how we addressed the issues we tried to fix. We get an A for not doing exactly what James B said. And kept some cap space. We've sucked at getting primo UFA's in the past, and didn't overpay (maybe over termed Debrusk) anyone. Kept things fluid. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesB Posted July 4 Author Share Posted July 4 7 hours ago, iinatcc said: But to that point the core of the Preds is also around that age group. So these will some bad contracts after 3 years or so but in the now this is consistent with the Pred's window. Best case is it's enough to win the cup within their short window, worst case they get bad after but they can easily rebuild at that point since most of their contracts expire around 2027 to 2030. You are right that the Nashville core is all around the same age (including Josi, arguably their most important skater). Nashville is going for it now. Next year will probably be their best year and they will decline after that as pretty much their entire core will be on the downward side of the "aging curve". So will they be good enough to be cup contenders next year? Maybe, but I doubt it. A lot depends on Saros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willander the Great Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 (edited) I think we did quite well, but I really wish we snagged another goal scorer for the top 6. I think Nashville could be a big winner, although loosing Sherwood could haunt them come playoffs when the game becomes much grittier. I absolutely hate to say this, but I think Edmonton might be a winner as well, inking Arvidsson and Skinner can give them even more goals… ugh! I’m not trying to hate on Leaf Nation here, but I think Toronto is looking like a looser of this free agency. Way too big and too long of contracts for two old defensemen. Another looser in my opinion is Boston. Lindholm and Zadorov are both good players in their own rights, but I really feel like they overpaid for them. And a lot of quality players walked away from their team this free agency… and they all joined the Canucks! Lol Edited July 4 by Willander the Great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 10 hours ago, Blue said: I asked a leading question to my Oilers buddy. Did you sign a goalie ? We signed Picard ! He says I am not sure why there's a narrative the Oilers need a goalie. Skinner was good enough to get the Oilers to the finals. And right now Skinner is probably one of the best Canadian born goalies in the NHL. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 I think Nashville made some interesting choices and will look very good next year but these will not age well. They got some stars across the lineup to bolster a very good team, but those are some big cap hits to ageing veterans. They'll surely be a contender next year though but it all depends on how well their stars age. I think Boston has to be considered a winner - they finally get a top line center they have lacked for ages and under 8M, and Zadorov. 12M for a 1st line center and top-4 physical defenceman is a bargain. Washington made some nice moves but their team just seems to be in limbo with no real direction. They're clearly pushing for a playoff spot but they were a bad team last year. Roy and Dubois and Chychrun are all good moves but I'm not sure if they're enough because they don't have much of a team over there anyway. I think NJD made some good moves to get back to their former glory days - they were great a couple of years ago when they had solid defencemen. They go out and get two of the best shutdown defencemen and Markstrom to complement their great forwards so I think they'll be back to the top of their division. I like what the Canucks did - got lots of role players and splashed out on a lot of depth. We could really use a 2nd pairing defenceman, especially on the left side, but maybe we'll try and force a mid-season trade, but otherwise some nice nifty small moves here and there to tinker with an already-decent lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 5 hours ago, JamesB said: You are right that the Nashville core is all around the same age (including Josi, arguably their most important skater). Nashville is going for it now. Next year will probably be their best year and they will decline after that as pretty much their entire core will be on the downward side of the "aging curve". So will they be good enough to be cup contenders next year? Maybe, but I doubt it. A lot depends on Saros. Yeah their window is like 1 to 2 years and maybe 3rd if the core can still play. I guess it's a win because even if they don't win a cup, the contacts aren't that long and Trotz can easily signal a rebuild without having to worry about long term commitments. I mean Stamkos contract is pretty good. Even if he only becomes a 40 to 50 pt player in his final year and the Preds are out of the playoffs picture, they can trade Stamkos with Salary retention for maybe a 1st round pick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 I don't really care about the other teams. Debrusk on Petey's wing along with Hogs gets me excited. How badly did Mik's failure to convert on his looks drag Petey's game into self doubt? More than we think IMHO. Hogs scored a lot of goals with almost no PP time. My hope is that both He and Debrusk can score +30 goals each. If they do that then Petey's game looks All-Star strong. It re-establishes the Canucks with 3 very strong o-zone lines. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCupSyndrome Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 On 7/2/2024 at 5:28 PM, ngoway said: I very much like the approach management took. I am sad that we couldn't bring Lindholm and Zadorov back, but I'm also glad management was firm and didn't sacrifice the overall team picture just to bring them back. Our forward group is much deeper and I'm glad that Pettersson finally has a winger in Debrusk. I'm confident our coaches can help Debrusk find some more consistency, as it sounds like when he's on, he's on and is a legitimate top 6 forward. Our defense overall is deeper with bottom pairing options, but we're still missing that true D who can carry that second pairing. All this to say that I see the Canucks as one of the winners. I'm confident this will show in the season as long as the team is able to gel. I like that everyone signed (except for Forbort) appear to have more to give if the coaches can get it out of them. A culture based on internal growth is a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, Boudrias said: I don't really care about the other teams. Debrusk on Petey's wing along with Hogs gets me excited. How badly did Mik's failure to convert on his looks drag Petey's game into self doubt? More than we think IMHO. Hogs scored a lot of goals with almost no PP time. My hope is that both He and Debrusk can score +30 goals each. If they do that then Petey's game looks All-Star strong. It re-establishes the Canucks with 3 very strong o-zone lines. Hogs kind of sucked when he was added to EPs line (much deserved as well). So not holding my breath there, it's a totally different animal playing against better competition. As for Debrusk. Drool at the thought of adding him to Millers line. Maybe Joshua and Garland get promoted? Still leaves us with a solid bottom six. Not super excited about Debrusk, EP, Hogs personally, it still seems like a "spare parts " line to me. Edited July 4 by IBatch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester13 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 9 hours ago, iinatcc said: I am not sure why there's a narrative the Oilers need a goalie. Skinner was good enough to get the Oilers to the finals. And right now Skinner is probably one of the best Canadian born goalies in the NHL. The Oilers got lucky that we didn't have Demko all series and Boeser in game 7. They barely made it passed us. And, he was terrible in the finals. Saying Skinner is one of the best Canadian-born goalies is not a feather in his cap, as all it does is show how weak Canada is at the position. It's why the US are favourites to win the four nations. All of my Coilers friends know how bad Skinner is. He's terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmaster Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 Teams like Boston and Nashville went all in and have a window of literally right now. All those contracts will hurt them real bad in the years to come. At first I was pissed we never got that “big fish” but looking at what we got, we ended up being better at the start of this season than last year. All our contracts appear good value and filled needs for an overall better team. We will improve on this later as we get closer to the deadline and land that “big fish” then, thus, theoretically being better than last year’s team in the playoffs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 I think honestly that Detroit, Nashville Utah Chicago and San Jose all did very well in free agency. Honourable mention to Anaheim who didn't screw around at all with their insane depth of picks and prospects. Sorry, forgot Washington who are obviously going to push Ovi over that 900 goal plateau as soon as possible The biggest losers IMO are honestly Winnipeg and Ottawa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 5 hours ago, Jester13 said: The Oilers got lucky that we didn't have Demko all series and Boeser in game 7. They barely made it passed us. And, he was terrible in the finals. Saying Skinner is one of the best Canadian-born goalies is not a feather in his cap, as all it does is show how weak Canada is at the position. It's why the US are favourites to win the four nations. All of my Coilers friends know how bad Skinner is. He's terrible. Leon was playing at 60% (I am guessing) in the Vancouver match up. The part in Bold ... well it doesn't make less true Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmaster Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 10 hours ago, Warhippy said: I think honestly that Detroit, Nashville Utah Chicago and San Jose all did very well in free agency. Honourable mention to Anaheim who didn't screw around at all with their insane depth of picks and prospects. Sorry, forgot Washington who are obviously going to push Ovi over that 900 goal plateau as soon as possible The biggest losers IMO are honestly Winnipeg and Ottawa Detroit made several questionable moves. I would categorize them as a big loser. Yzerman is wearing out his welcome in Detroit. That team is destined to have another non playoff season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmaster Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 6 hours ago, iinatcc said: Leon was playing at 60% (I am guessing) in the Vancouver match up. The part in Bold ... well it doesn't make less true Petey was playing less than 20% not due to injury and had 0% help from any of his wingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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