B.C. Politics Thread

[Coconuts]

13 hours ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

An interview piece of the fellow who helped Kevin Falcon win the BCLib leadership, and why this election he's voting NDP.

 

(Copy/paste from The Tyee is craptastic for maintaining formatting, so I'm only providing a URL.)

 

https://thetyee.ca/News/2024/10/14/Key-BC-Liberal-Strategist-Voting-NDP/

 

He made some good points about Trump politics, about the Cons using demagoguery as a strategy, it's disgusting. Here's hoping it doesn't work and that it fades back into the abyss. 

[Wilbur]

9 minutes ago, UnkNuk said:

 

Maybe you can clear something up for me since I'm not very familiar with our school system.

 

If schools aren't using letter grades any more, what are they using?  How are schools ensuring that the kids are actually learning whatever they're being taught?

 

 

Districts decide the scale, but are going with an EMERGING - DEVELOPING - PROFICIENT - EXTENDING "scale".  I prefer the wording.  To me it's not drastically different.  I'm simplifying here, you could argue EXTENDING = A, PROFICENT = B, DEVELOPING = C, and EMERGING = not ready for the next level (once again, an oversimplification but if it's a bridge that helps you get used to the new language, use it). 

 

We tie these to the curricular competencies that the ministry developed. 

For example, from Literary Studies 12 one curricular competency is:  Use information for diverse purposes and from a variety of sources.

Based on the assignments a student has done we can asses whether not they are EMRG - DEV - PROF - EXT at it.  

All the curricular competencies are here:  https://curriculum.gov.bc.ca/curriculum/english-language-arts/12/literary-studies

[-dlc-]

4 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Districts decide the scale, but are going with an EMERGING - DEVELOPING - PROFICIENT - EXTENDING "scale".  I prefer the wording.  To me it's not drastically different.  I'm simplifying here, you could argue EXTENDING = A, PROFICENT = B, DEVELOPING = C, and EMERGING = not ready for the next level (once again, an oversimplification but if it's a bridge that helps you get used to the new language, use it). 

 

We tie these to the curricular competencies that the ministry developed. 

For example, from Literary Studies 12 one curricular competency is:  Use information for diverse purposes and from a variety of sources.

Based on the assignments a student has done we can asses whether not they are EMRG - DEV - PROF - EXT at it.  

All the curricular competencies are here:  https://curriculum.gov.bc.ca/curriculum/english-language-arts/12/literary-studies

I prefer it to the old way.

 

It's more encouraging than discouraging. Kids like to compare and compete and there can be shame involved with letter grades. This helps eliminate some of that in my view.

[Wilbur]

1 minute ago, -dlc- said:

I prefer it to the old way.

 

It's more encouraging than discouraging. Kids like to compare and compete and there can be shame involved with letter grades. This helps eliminate some of that in my view.

Can always compete for something else, like the number of proficients or extendings 

[-dlc-]

50 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Can always compete for something else, like the number of proficients or extendings 

I just think it's easier (to tease/shame) if put on a scale of A B C D E F. Rather than words that offer positive feedback and that do involve a bit of deciphering. Not just a big black mark that stands out.

 

I mean...an F is pretty clear to kids. Bottom of the scale. Whereas emerging and developing have some acknowledgment of achievement/understanding and are more positive and encouraging.

[Alflives]

55 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

Districts decide the scale, but are going with an EMERGING - DEVELOPING - PROFICIENT - EXTENDING "scale".  I prefer the wording.  To me it's not drastically different.  I'm simplifying here, you could argue EXTENDING = A, PROFICENT = B, DEVELOPING = C, and EMERGING = not ready for the next level (once again, an oversimplification but if it's a bridge that helps you get used to the new language, use it). 

 

We tie these to the curricular competencies that the ministry developed. 

For example, from Literary Studies 12 one curricular competency is:  Use information for diverse purposes and from a variety of sources.

Based on the assignments a student has done we can asses whether not they are EMRG - DEV - PROF - EXT at it.  

All the curricular competencies are here:  https://curriculum.gov.bc.ca/curriculum/english-language-arts/12/literary-studies

Do we still keep score and compete in highschool sports, or is that a word salad too? 
I don’t get why the weird grading and no Government exams. Plus, should this really be a political thing? I doubt anyone votes based on the lack of a proper grading system or government exams. 

[Alflives]

55 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

I prefer it to the old way.

 

It's more encouraging than discouraging. Kids like to compare and compete and there can be shame involved with letter grades. This helps eliminate some of that in my view.

That’s true. But over time kids will use this new scale to classify one another. Then what’s next? Was the A-F broken? Imo % is what should be used. Students achieve a certain % in their class. Then have a government exam to level out the classes. 50/50. That way kids can compete across the province. 

[Allegend]

I retired from teaching three years ago. Since then, report card formats have changed.

The lack of letter grades has resulted in some students not working as hard since they

know they wiill pass. I believe students in grades 9-12 still have letter grades.

[Allegend]

Correction: Students in grades 10-12 still have letter grades.

[The Arrogant Worms]

Every teacher I know feels Government exams are a waste of time and money.

[-dlc-]

11 minutes ago, Allegend said:

The lack of letter grades has resulted in some students not working as hard since they

know they wiill pass. 

Where did you get this information?

 

I firmly believe this:

 

 

Not all kids have the same support systems or even starting points in place. Grading pits them against each other but shouldn't we base individual "grades/assessments" on a child's progress? Not measuring them against another. Maybe a kid heard his parent's fighting all night and didn't sleep or get breakfast...then had to go do a test that graded them. 

I think the old way really was limited in its focus. 

I worked in a private school with parents who were very driven to see their children succeed. But, at times, at the expense of their overall mental health and wellness. Pushed too hard to get a grade that would "secure" their future but is it their dream or their child's? I saw kids burning out but also fearful that they'd be punished for "bad grades". I find it more motivating to help a child succeed rather than insisting on iit.

 

But I'm helping derail the thread so will leave it at that (and get back on track). Although it does tie in because politics very much decides the climate of what happens in our schools (hospitals, communities, etc.).

[Allegend]

Deb: From a few teacher friends, and my youngest son who volunteered at a local  high school

last spring.

[Sapper]

2 minutes ago, The Arrogant Worms said:

Every teacher I know feels Government exams are a waste of time and money.

My strong dislike of the government exams is how the right wing is trying to slant funding based on grade outcomes

 

Schools in richer neighborhoods have kids that aren't starving for the most part so get better grades , kids going to private schools do even better thanks to their richer lifestyles 

 

Kids in poor neighborhoods are too busy with other things like hunger and home lives to get the same average standards .

 

 

Grades are important but not the end all to be all

[Allegend]

Deb, as you are probably aware, grades (marks) are earned through various activities and assessments:

Tests, quizzes, reports, short assignments, homework, oral presentations, group work, etc. 

[Johngould21]

2 hours ago, King Heffy said:

Rustad should be grateful for that; it's the only way an idiot like him would have graduated.

That might be the best comment of the day.

 

[Wilbur]

33 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Do we still keep score and compete in highschool sports, or is that a word salad too? 
I don’t get why the weird grading and no Government exams. Plus, should this really be a political thing? I doubt anyone votes based on the lack of a proper grading system or government exams. 

There is a Numeracy assessment at the grade 10 level and a LIteracy assessment at the grade 10 and 12 level.  They don't count towards grades, but it does help track how well our schools are doing.

[-dlc-]

4 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

There is a Numeracy assessment at the grade 10 level and a LIteracy assessment at the grade 10 and 12 level.  They don't count towards grades, but it does help track how well our schools are doing.

Also the FSA's in grades 4 & 7.

[Warhippy]

As a parent of two teens, I don't care about the letter grade or proficiency ratings.

 

I care that some kids are intentionally being passed just to pass them.

 

I know I will be dunked on for saying this but let's be honest here.  As long as kids are showing up they're not gonna fail even if they aren't getting it and are not someone who would have graduated back in the 900s or earlier.

 

Bring back the pass fail and let those who don't put in the work suffer for it

[-dlc-]

21 minutes ago, Allegend said:

Deb, as you are probably aware, grades (marks) are earned through various activities and assessments:

Tests, quizzes, reports, short assignments, homework, oral presentations, group work, etc. 

Which, for me, is exactly why "a" (one letter) grade doesn't really cut it. 

 

Students may do well in reports but get nervous during oral presentations. Or maybe the group they're in is a clique that isn't really supportive. So many things can factor in and to "assess" a student's progress with one letter that covers all the bases misses the mark for me. A general feel of whether or not the student is grasping concepts and making strides rather than stamping a "grade" on them like they're beef.

[Bob Long]

2 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

As a parent of two teens, I don't care about the letter grade or proficiency ratings.

 

I care that some kids are intentionally being passed just to pass them.

 

I know I will be dunked on for saying this but let's be honest here.  As long as kids are showing up they're not gonna fail even if they aren't getting it and are not someone who would have graduated back in the 900s or earlier.

 

Bring back the pass fail and let those who don't put in the work suffer for it

 

You are not wrong, but this will never happen.

[-dlc-]

9 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Bring back the pass fail and let those who don't put in the work suffer for it

But, again, the goal here is to help children learn. To provide a supportive environment for them to do so...not just to determine if they "pass or fail" but to intervene in that. To help change the course of things. 

 

Not putting in the work can be really misinterpreted. Some kids have issues in the home and/or health related issues that may make it more difficult for them to "put ijn the work". I've seen some teachers who didn't put in the work and were part of the problem (not the solution) in children's successes and/or failures. My daughter, in particular, was going through a really rough time that involved death in the family, a "first love" boyfriend moving to France, etc. Monumental to kids and when they're encountering emotional turmoil their work will be impacted. But it doesn't really determine if they're capable or intelligent. She had a couple of real shit teachers who dropped the ball...I pulled her out of a school where she was failing and her "new" (extremely supportive school) saw her to the honour roll and winning a community award for her work. It just took some understanding of HER and who she was to connect and pull the best out of her. Patience mostly. Funny thing is - her entire group of friends (a super creative group of misfits) all dropped out of that school. So sometimes it's not the kids that are failing...it's the system that's failing them.

 

There has to be more than pass or fail because failing kids will suffer if they don't have a form of support.

 

I don't know that making kids "suffer" is motivating or helpful in any way. The key...is to keep children engaged, focused and supported in their learning. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Warhippy said:

As a parent of two teens, I don't care about the letter grade or proficiency ratings.

 

I care that some kids are intentionally being passed just to pass them.

 

I know I will be dunked on for saying this but let's be honest here.  As long as kids are showing up they're not gonna fail even if they aren't getting it and are not someone who would have graduated back in the 900s or earlier.

 

Bring back the pass fail and let those who don't put in the work suffer for it

What? Kids get to pass even if they fail?

[Warhippy]

1 minute ago, -dlc- said:

But, again, the goal here is to help children learn. To provide a supportive environment for them to do so...not just to determine if they "pass or fail".

 

Not putting in the work can be really misinterpreted. Some kids have issues in the home and/or health related issues that may make it more difficult for them to "put ijn the work". I've seen some teachers who didn't put in the work and were part of the problem (not the solution) in children's successes and/or failures.

 

I don't know that making kids "suffer" is motivating. That's the key...to keep children engaged, focused and supported in their learning.

If a child is in school and is exhibiting the behaviours, work ethic, effort and standards that would be deemed unable to pass on to the next grade or to graduate then so be it.

 

If it means a change in the curriculum ok fine.  I am very aware of home issues being a problem, but the end result is that the system is currently passing students through the system that have no right being passed.  Whether it is of their own making or not.

[Warhippy]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

What? Kids get to pass even if they fail?

I will allow the 3 or 4 teachers in here address that appropriately 

[-dlc-]

That's on the school though, not really the system itself. And especially not the students - that's doing a huge disservice to them.

 

In the schools I've been at (most recently as an assistant to the Head of School) - no. It's not doing anyone any favours to put kids through if they're not ready. It sets them up for disaster.

 

That's a lazy way of doing things. (I, too, experienced that in my high school days...teachers didn't want us back in their class so passed us to get rid of us. One was a raging alcoholic who liked to slip into the science room for a nip).