Random Violent Attacks in Vancouver/BC

[-dlc-]

There are so many facets to this and it won't be a swift fix, but a swift response is necessary.

 

Drug addiction, soft punishments for hard crimes, long wait lists and limited options for MH treatment, homelessness and the fact that older homes are demolished for "new" buildings that are gobbled up by investors and people playing Monopoly here, displacing people who have no where to go. So many things need fixing. One problem often morphs into another. People on the streets get desperate. 

 

For those SO dangerous that they're incoherently wandering the streets with a knife, it doesn't seem that a probation or parole order (piece of paper) is a preventative measure. Do you think they're following "orders" at that point? Keep them locked up until we're "sure" they're safe to be out here, not "hoping" they're safe amongst the public.

 

The game of roulette needs to end.

 

Oh hey, another one on the news this morning. Stabbing at a bus stop in North Van.

 

https://www.nsnews.com/local-news/suspect-flees-after-stabbing-sleeping-victim-at-bus-stop-north-vancouver-rcmp-say-9481710

 

[The Arrogant Worms]

1 hour ago, DrJockitch said:

I was in med school when this came down and they absolutely pushed it as a miracle non-addictive pain killer. 
They where going to emerg docs (who have seen it all) and telling them they are causing chronic pain by undertreating acute pain and oxy would fix that. 
The Sacklers completely changed how medical schools trained doctors for dealing with drug reps and companies. 

As far as open ended prescriptions, the rules don’t allow it. There are very strict rules in the pharmacy and in my experience BC was one of the best about addressing prescribing issues around Narcotics.  Long term Narcotic use still clearly happens a lot though and back pain is one of the primary culprits. People start the pain med and the pain doesn’t go away so often people end up on it forever. I always coach someone when starting pain meds for acute pain that sometimes the pain doesn’t go away but the meds will need to. 
‘IMHO they need to take narcotic prescribing away from the regular family docs. 
‘Chronic pain and mental health are the hardest things doctors deal with day on day out and this is a discussion for another forum but I think the way we train mental health professionals, especially psychiatrists wrong. 

I have only needed strong pain killers 2-4 times in my life.

 

My wife is vigilante about making sure I never take any unless absolutely needed.

 

She is also vigilant about filling a prescription to her patients as well as any other medication.  Old school that way I suppose.

Edited September 6 by The Arrogant Worms

[112]

1 hour ago, -dlc- said:

There are so many facets to this and it won't be a swift fix, but a swift response is necessary.

 

Drug addiction, soft punishments for hard crimes, long wait lists and limited options for MH treatment, homelessness and the fact that older homes are demolished for "new" buildings that are gobbled up by investors and people playing Monopoly here, displacing people who have no where to go. So many things need fixing. One problem often morphs into another. People on the streets get desperate. 

 

For those SO dangerous that they're incoherently wandering the streets with a knife, it doesn't seem that a probation or parole order (piece of paper) is a preventative measure. Do you think they're following "orders" at that point? Keep them locked up until we're "sure" they're safe to be out here, not "hoping" they're safe amongst the public.

 

The game of roulette needs to end.

 

Oh hey, another one on the news this morning. Stabbing at a bus stop in North Van.

 

https://www.nsnews.com/local-news/suspect-flees-after-stabbing-sleeping-victim-at-bus-stop-north-vancouver-rcmp-say-9481710

 

You can't just lock people up forever on the suspicion that they might do something harmful; until such a time as a crime warranting long-term imprisonment is committed, what can be done? Restricting freedoms and liberties is serious.

[-dlc-]

1 hour ago, 112 said:

You can't just lock people up forever on the suspicion that they might do something harmful; until such a time as a crime warranting long-term imprisonment is committed, what can be done? Restricting freedoms and liberties is serious.

Oh I was referring to "hard crimes".....like if someone's attempted or succeeded in murdering others? A few years just doesn't seem to fit in my view.

 

Someone with 60 involvements with police (including assaulting them, as well as mental health workers) who was on parole. Might have been some warning signs there. At some point, you give up your rights and freedoms.

 

Not suspicion of...history of violent offences.

 

Making our streets safe so everyone's freedoms and liberties are protected is also important. We need to be able to walk down the street on a sunny morning without the threat of random violent attacks, which are happening far too frequently. The rights of those of us who aren't committing crimes is important too.

 

This guy likely should have been somewhere other than aimlessly wandering the street with a knife in a state of confusion and violence. And now he qualifies for lock up by your standards. We waited and now one guy's dead and another seriously injured. Their rights and freedoms gone because we're too f'n soft.

[bishopshodan]

Story time. One that popped in my head since reading this thread.

 

About 7/8 years ago I was on the bus. A very rare occurrance for me but my car was in the shop.

 

I'm on a MainSt bus, just arriving across from Science World. I'm sitting midway on the bus, a lady walked by and I immediately saw her stress. She looked at me and said something like... " a guy back there has two big knives and is muttering hes going to kill everyone".

She continued on and told the driver. He pulled over and announced for everyone to get off the bus. 

Myself and another dude stood at the back door and ushered people out, I still remember a mom with pram, in tears.

 

Just me and the other usher were left as, just as described, a man with two big knifes and blank eyes slowly walked from the back of the bus.

 

We got off and he followed.

Now he focused on me. 

 

You know that game you might have played with sibling where you run around an object, like a parked car or something? You keep changing direction when they try to head you off? 

Well thats what I had to do with a bus shelter... he came for me...I could see him through the plexy glass when i would stop to see which direction he was going to choose next.

He couldnt catch me, at one point he got frustrated and slammed on the glass with his weapons...eventually he headed toward the DTES.

 

The other dude from the bus was still there. I called the cops and we both started following at a safe distance.

 

Vancouver's finest showed up like the calvary and they got him a couple blocks later.

 

Whew. 

[Gurn]

This is not a new problem, but to me, it seems to be worse.

But is it?

Or are we continually being fed bad news because:

it sells

it re-enforces a message being spread by a particular political entity?

 

---------------------

don't the actual statistics on violent crime say things are actually better, despite what we hear/read?

 

So much pressure on so many people these days-even us so called 'normals'

Every increasing speed of tech- leaving people behind, or desperately trying to keep up.

Ever increasing costs, and income that is continually falling behind outflow, for so many people.

'Get rich, or die trying"- all those college educations, but so many end up being useless. Might as swell sell drugs, as a way to try and 'keep up'

Decades of movies and tv shows, designed to encourage us to keep up with the Jones'.

But not everyone can, which can create a lot of anger.

If you are falling behind, and nobody seems to care about you, why would you care about anyone else?

--------------------------------

Drugs are described as an escape from reality; if we can't change people's reality, how the heck do we expect to stop drugs?

[Goose]

4 hours ago, -dlc- said:

This guy likely should have been somewhere other than aimlessly wandering the street with a knife in a state of confusion and violence. And now he qualifies for lock up by your standards. We waited and now one guy's dead and another seriously injured. Their rights and freedoms gone because we're too f'n soft.

 

Its an issue

 

Problem is, it’s reactive by nature, and maybe even becoming too difficult of a problem in practical terms.  There will always be cases/individuals that slip through and commit violent offences.

 

I think what youre after is something like the “three strikes law” in the US.  It might be necessary, but also comes with its burdens/negative consequences too.  

 

 

[JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo]

2 hours ago, Gurn said:

This is not a new problem, but to me, it seems to be worse.

But is it?

Or are we continually being fed bad news because:

it sells

it re-enforces a message being spread by a particular political entity?

 

---------------------

don't the actual statistics on violent crime say things are actually better, despite what we hear/read?

 

So much pressure on so many people these days-even us so called 'normals'

Every increasing speed of tech- leaving people behind, or desperately trying to keep up.

Ever increasing costs, and income that is continually falling behind outflow, for so many people.

'Get rich, or die trying"- all those college educations, but so many end up being useless. Might as swell sell drugs, as a way to try and 'keep up'

Decades of movies and tv shows, designed to encourage us to keep up with the Jones'.

But not everyone can, which can create a lot of anger.

If you are falling behind, and nobody seems to care about you, why would you care about anyone else?

--------------------------------

Drugs are described as an escape from reality; if we can't change people's reality, how the heck do we expect to stop drugs?

I was thinking the same thing when I saw the post with the twitter feed about Vancouver crime. It's easy to get caught up in that stuff and get a skewed perspective of society when it's being fed to you everyday. In reality we live in an area with 3 million people, stuff is bound to happen, and always has.


That being said, I do think there has been a significant rise in mental health issues in the last 10 years, even more so with covid. People with underlying mental health issues can live their entire lives without displaying any significant symptoms. One of the keys in this regard is having a safe and healthy upbringing. More and more, researchers and scientists are finding strong links between trauma and the psychological, and actual physical, lifelong changes to the brain. They even found evidence of these traits being passed on genetically. Trauma comes in many forms and for many covid was a traumatizing experience, which could account for a rise if there is one. 


Unfortunately, another thing that can accelerate the appearance of significant mental health issues is drug use. Drugs are often an escape from the pain of reality (trauma) that many people struggle to cope with. When you hear the stories of some of these addicts and the trauma they've experienced, you begin to understand how they fell into these traps. Drug use has become an all too common coping mechanism when it comes to mental health issues, and psychedelics like Marijuana can trigger psychosis in people with underlying schizophrenia which can drastically accelerate the appearance and severity of the disease. A real double edged sword of sorts. I don't think we'll ever stop people from using drugs but I've always wondered if they could develop a system that could identify high risk individuals at a young age to help prevent this?


Ultimately, reducing the trauma that young people experience would be the most effective way of combating both of the issues above, but I don't know how that could ever be accomplished. Making sure kids are clothed and fed, living in safe supportive households just seems to be pipe dream at this point. Access to psychologists and psychiatrists at a young age is virtually impossible unless you are already displaying significant symptoms. Everything we currently do is reactive. To truly make a difference much more emphasis needs to be put on the prevention imo.  At this point, I don't think the general public, especially the more conservatively minded folks, have the stomach to deal with the kinds of changes that would need to be put in place to have a significant impact, so what can be done?  

Edited September 6 by JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo

[112]

7 hours ago, -dlc- said:

Oh I was referring to "hard crimes".....like if someone's attempted or succeeded in murdering others? A few years just doesn't seem to fit in my view.

 

Someone with 60 involvements with police (including assaulting them, as well as mental health workers) who was on parole. Might have been some warning signs there. At some point, you give up your rights and freedoms.

 

Not suspicion of...history of violent offences.

 

Making our streets safe so everyone's freedoms and liberties are protected is also important. We need to be able to walk down the street on a sunny morning without the threat of random violent attacks, which are happening far too frequently. The rights of those of us who aren't committing crimes is important too.

 

This guy likely should have been somewhere other than aimlessly wandering the street with a knife in a state of confusion and violence. And now he qualifies for lock up by your standards. We waited and now one guy's dead and another seriously injured. Their rights and freedoms gone because we're too f'n soft.

So someone convicted of assault should be locked up forever? We can't do that.

 

I've had more than 60 contacts with police in my time and don't consider myself a violent threat. Those could be wellness checks, interviews as a witness to a crime, driving infractions, or any number of more benign incidences.

 

"At some point, you give up your rights and freedoms." For how long for simple assault, though? Forever? That doesn't seem right nor possible with the costs associated with imprisonment.

 

Incarcerating people for crimes we think they might one day maybe possibly commit is akin to arresting and detaining people for thoughtcrime.

[CBH1926]

12 hours ago, DrJockitch said:

I was in med school when this came down and they absolutely pushed it as a miracle non-addictive pain killer. 
They where going to emerg docs (who have seen it all) and telling them they are causing chronic pain by undertreating acute pain and oxy would fix that. 
The Sacklers completely changed how medical schools trained doctors for dealing with drug reps and companies. 

As far as open ended prescriptions, the rules don’t allow it. There are very strict rules in the pharmacy and in my experience BC was one of the best about addressing prescribing issues around Narcotics.  Long term Narcotic use still clearly happens a lot though and back pain is one of the primary culprits. People start the pain med and the pain doesn’t go away so often people end up on it forever. I always coach someone when starting pain meds for acute pain that sometimes the pain doesn’t go away but the meds will need to. 
‘IMHO they need to take narcotic prescribing away from the regular family docs. 
‘Chronic pain and mental health are the hardest things doctors deal with day on day out and this is a discussion for another forum but I think the way we train mental health professionals, especially psychiatrists wrong. 

From 1999 until 2020, 841 000 people died in the U.S from the opioids, 500k of those were from illegally prescribed drugs. Pill mills that were popping everywhere have ravaged entire communities.

Once prescription opioids were not available, users switched to heroin which was much cheaper.

Instead of letting them go bankrupt, Purdue pharma executives and owners should have been sent to prison for a very long time.

 

Edited September 7 by CBH1926

[DrJockitch]

26 minutes ago, CBH1926 said:

From 1999 until 2020, 841 000 people died in the U.S from the opioids, 500k of those were from illegally prescribed drugs. Pill mills that were popping everywhere have ravaged entire communities.

Once prescription opioids were not available, users switched to heroin which was much cheaper.

Instead of letting them go bankrupt, Purdue pharma executives and owners should have been sent to prison for a very long time.

 

I knew all that and it also paved the way for fentanyl which is even cheaper, easier to produce and ship and is more deadly. 
yes I agree the Sacklers should have been strung up and stripped of every penny. 

[Canuck You]

On 9/5/2024 at 11:57 AM, JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo said:

And we'd be doing all of it in German. 

It's sad that we have been manipulated to think this way..I've been taught the less problems you interfere with is the less problems you will have..yet here we are poking the bear.

[CBH1926]

Article about the guy that killed 1 person and severed the hand of another individual.

All his previous crimes included provisions that he should undergo psychiatric help, anger management, substance abuse etc. But there is no information if anything was completed or not so who knows if he got any help.

 

Greyhound killer cannibal got supervised visit in under 4 years, unsupervised outings in under 6 years and full unconditional release in 8 years. Looking at this guy’s history he definitely fits paranoid schizophrenia criteria. Probably be out in several years. Canada’s justice system is lot of carrot and little stick.

 

https://vancouversun.com/news/friends-of-vancouver-attack-suspect-recall-recent-encounters

 

Edited September 7 by CBH1926

[-dlc-]

FFs, make it stop! Don't know if it was random/a stranger attack or not, but what the hell is going on???

 

https://theprovince.com/news/vancouver-woman-knife-attack-crime-watch/wcm/e493a357-a9bd-4425-a5a1-a03c48a62371?taid=66dde218c3caea0001f9c67b&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter