Hamas attacking Israel

[Playoff Beered]

19 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

A few things on my mind.

 

1) The Security - how did they not know it was coming? did they get the heads up as Egypt claims?  How does that very secure border get so compromised, in so many ways, by so many ....and nodody, no intel to see it coming?

 

2) The evacuation demand - they expect 1.2 million civilians to move out of their homes within 24 hrs, until further notice? pretty much impossible and will create a humanitarian crisis. 

 

3) Genocide - Are some in the world trying to justify actual genocide? I hear the idea that since Hamas is the governance over the Palestinians, then all of them are the enemy. All of them human-animals?

 

The world is watching .

 

Regarding #3, only emotionally and intellectually stunted people are calling for genocide, from either side.

 

Unfortunately one side is far more stunted than the other, due to decades of poverty and very limited educational resources, so in turn there is a lot more Palestinians who are calling for genocide than Israelis. Both Isreal and Hamas are to blame for this.

[Ryan Strome]

2 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Well Roman has posted directly in this thread what has happened to him.  I don't blame him one bit for wanting Hamas to be exterminated by any means necessary.

I'm pretty sure everybody in this thread wants Hamas exterminated. What they don't want is all these innocent children who are being bombed and killed and what they don't want is an absolute torturous and illegal treatment of innocent Palestinians. This stupid argument you guys are making while they voted for Hamas just stop! You have called Trump and other Republicans Nazis. You have also called conservatives in this country Nazis would you support the indiscriminate bombing of Canadians and Americans? If you can't see the hypocrisy guy..

[King Heffy]

3 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

I'm pretty sure everybody in this thread wants Hamas exterminated. What they don't want is all these innocent children who are being bombed and killed and what they don't want is an absolute torturous and illegal treatment of innocent Palestinians. This stupid argument you guys are making while they voted for Hamas just stop! You have called Trump and other Republicans Nazis. You have also called conservatives in this country Nazis would you support the indiscriminate bombing of Canadians and Americans? If you can't see the hypocrisy guy..

They don't really have another means of eradicating Hamas when those swine are using the civilians as human shields.  

Edited October 13, 2023 by King Heffy

[Ryan Strome]

1 minute ago, King Heffy said:

They don't really have another means of eradicating Hamas when those swine are using the civilians as human shields.  

And then we go back to this ridiculous argument to try and find any stupid excuse to make an excuse. Cutting off water, electricity, food, fuel, medicine, etc. You sound more like Stalin and Hitler than you do a Canadian.

[bishopshodan]

It's pretty simple.

 

If Isreal purposely kills innocent civilians then they are no better than Hamas.

[Provost]

20 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

The man's family has been directly impacted by Hamas acting like the vermin that they are.  Maybe it's you who should show some compassion.

 No, the man claims his family has been vaguely indirectly impacted because his daughter met some folks a decade ago at a band camp who may or may not have been killed.

 

He has posted many objectively false things on this thread as well, and has promoted killing innocent civilians so doesn’t seem to be a reliable or objective party to this.

 

He can be outraged and saddened because he identifies with people who were targeted by a terrorist attack.  That is perfectly reasonable.  It doesn’t mean he gets to invent his own reality in order to justify killing or displacing millions of civilians, nor should he get a pass for promoting war crimes.

 

If a Palestinian was on here promoting death to Jews because they are subhuman animals, they would have been banned after their first post.

 

If folks were calling Jews vermin because of their war crimes and atrocities, that would also be ban worthy. 
 

I have seen that playbook first hand.  It is how you get a soldier to pull the trigger and kill another human being… they need to be made into less than humans first.  Easy to kill vermin children to stop the infestation…

That is why the fake propaganda about beheaded babies and tariff came out immediately.  They needed the visceral response to undertake the actions they wanted to.  The fact it turned out quickly to not be true is irrelevant.

Every Israeli politician and spokesman uses different terms to dehumanize Arabs, that is also the vernacular used by the Israeli populace.  It isn’t accidental.

Edited October 13, 2023 by Provost

[Truefan99]

1 minute ago, bishopshodan said:

It's pretty simple.

 

If Isreal purposely kills innocent civilians then they are no better than Hamas.

If? They’ve been doing so for decades, guess you didn’t know about that?

[NewbieCanuckFan]

 

[bishopshodan]

Just now, Truefan99 said:

If? They’ve been doing so for decades, guess you didn’t know about that?

 

This conflict is old AF, of course there has been atrocities.

I was talking about the current situation and escalation. I would have guessed you would known that.

[NewbieCanuckFan]

2 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

This conflict is old AF, of course there has been atrocities.

I was talking about the current situation and escalation. I would have guessed you would known that.

the old "both sides" argument.

[bishopshodan]

Just now, NewbieCanuckFan said:

the old "both sides" argument.

Didnt say that.

 

He was pointing out Isreal had commited similar.

I was just saying that the conflict is old and we have been hearing about atrocitie for, well decades.

 

But do you need to read it, again, in one of my posts? as clear as I can...

 

I condemn any intentional killing of innocent civilians, by anyone.

 

Clear?

[NewbieCanuckFan]

4 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

Didnt say that.

 

He was pointing out Isreal had commited similar.

I was just saying that the conflict is old and we have been hearing about atrocitie for, well decades.

 

But do you need to read it, again, in one of my posts? as clear as I can...

 

I condemn any intentional killing of innocent civilians, by anyone.

 

Clear?

I'm just saying those arguments are used to justify the deliberate targeting of civilian targets by Hamas in this massacre to inflict as many casualties as possible.  No military targets were hit as far as I know.  

 

I said it earlier...Hamas did this to provoke a reaction of Israel.  In the end, nobody wins.

Edited October 13, 2023 by NewbieCanuckFan

[Truefan99]

15 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

 

This conflict is old AF, of course there has been atrocities.

I was talking about the current situation and escalation. I would have guessed you would known that.

You’re looking at this as a feud between two equivalent states, with equal means to defend themselves. The fallacy in your thinking is that one is in complete control of the others resources and indiscriminately hurting the innocent Palestinians, while the other had its land taken from it and has not been recognized as a sovereign nation. 
 

What reignited this feud this past week is horrific and 110% disagree with violence on civilians but let’s not pretend that the other side hasn’t been doing that for years and is in a disparate position of power. 
 

please educate yourself before spewing garbage and misinformation. 

Edited October 13, 2023 by Truefan99

[bolt]

More then 1,300 Israeli civilians slaughtered. 

Women and girls raped. 

People burned alive.

Young kids kidnapped. 

Babies tortured and murdered.

Parents executed in front of their young children.

 

 

Is this how Palestine becomes free? 

[bishopshodan]

1 minute ago, Truefan99 said:

You’re looking at this as a feud between two equivalent states, with equal means to defend themselves. The fallacy in your thinking is that one is in complete control of the others resources and indiscriminately hurting the innocent Palestinians, while the other had its land taken from it and has not been recognized as a sovereign nation. 
 

please educate yourself before spewing garbage and misinformation. 

 

Holy fuck. 

 

This thread is so senstive and I understand that. 

I want a free Palestine.  I was trying to keep the topic on the current situation in regards to what Isreals next steps are.

 

This thing can escalate quick, global. I have real fears for my wife's family in Iran. More good civilians living under an awful regime. Will the world think...fuck it.. bomb the shit out of them?

 

Anyway, I'm done in this thread. Thanks for the push.

 

 

 

[CBH1926]

2 hours ago, Provost said:

Collective punishment is a war crime.

 

Gaza doesn’t convert most of their humanitarian aid into weapons.  If it did, their attacks would be using more than cheaply made rockets made from plumbing pipes, a few paraglides as an “Air Force”, and 40 year old discarded AK47s.  They have little military capability.

 

The use of human shields talking point is simply that these fighters are using guerilla and partisan tactics (just like in WWII and many other conflicts between unequal forces).

 

Hamas doesn’t have to be good to think Israel is wrong.  The world didn’t go and kill German civilians en masse because of the worst Nazi atrocities.

Even with all this homemade stuff they managed to kill several hundred Israeli soldiers. So it’s either very good homemade stuff or they might have some newer stuff. AK is still most widely used military type of weapon in the world, far more durable and reliable than anything else. 
 

Most of my relatives were partisans during the WW2, although not unique to that region of the world only, Eastern Europe was probably best known example of that type of resistance. Executing kids in beds and then using civilians as human shields is not partisan type warfare. Or beheading of enemy soldiers.

Not at all, at least half a million German civilians were killed in allied raids, fire bombing of Dresden alone killed 25k civilians. I am not even going to go into mass rapes and summarily executions of German civilians throughout Europe. 

[Truefan99]

Just now, bishopshodan said:

 

Holy fuck. 

 

This thread is so senstive and I understand that. 

I want a free Palestine.  I was trying to keep the topic on the current situation in regards to what Isreals next steps are.

 

This thing can escalate quick, global. I have real fears for my wife's family in Iran. More good civilians living under an awful regime. Will the world think...fuck it.. bomb the shit out of them?

 

Anyway, I'm done in this thread. Thanks for the push.

 

 

 

It’s not about sensitivity it’s about the greater context that can’t just be dismissed in understanding the situation there and forming an informed opinion. Yeah this could go really sideways quickly, let’s hope it settles down and everyone involved comes to their proper senses. 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

Just because its posted on the internet, doesn't make it a fact.  Case in point:

 

 

 

[Warhippy]

12 hours ago, Calamity K said:

No, but I'm sure they're not calling for the gassing of Jews. It's the left that are more likely to support Palestine imo.

You should maybe pay more attention then

3 hours ago, bolt said:

Did the Jewish ghettos elect terrorists, fire rockets, kidnap, rape, torture hostages,  paraglide into their neighbors land and mow people down?  

You uh...missed the creeping annexation over the last 30 years or?

[Truefan99]

35 minutes ago, bolt said:

More then 1,300 Israeli civilians slaughtered. 

Women and girls raped. 

People burned alive.

Young kids kidnapped. 

Babies tortured and murdered.

Parents executed in front of their young children.

 

 

Is this how Palestine becomes free? 

Oh how the narrative is so one sided? This is the problem these days people reduce everything to sensationalist headlines and click baits. 
 

Ok I’ll bite. 
 

More than 1400 Palestinian civilians killed

unauthourized occupation of their land for decades with more land being taken away each year

hundreds of Palestinians kept hostage by israel

All essential basic human resources to civilians controlled by Israel including food, water, energy

Zero ability to leave for decades

Innocen Civilians kids, women, men killed in IDF raids and shelling yearly

no military defensive capability like Iron dome

 

should I keep going or are you going to get off your moral high horse and look at it objectively?

 

you truly sound like a brainwashed individual who can’t think independently. 

 

Edited October 13, 2023 by Truefan99

[Warhippy]

1 hour ago, Ryan Strome said:

This is a terrible comment man. How do you know anybody you're responding to isn't Palestinian and potentially has family in Gaza? You are asking him to show compassion yet he's pointing out The person he's responding to is also showing no compassion. What did you hope to achieve with this post?

Don't bother responding to that one.  I blocked him day 2 on the new forum.  It's always his way or everyone else is nazi vermin who need to be destroyed or exterminated.

 

When a persons entire mind set is either you agree with me to the letter or you're the enemy you'll never be able to discuss anything with them

1 hour ago, Ryan Strome said:

And then we go back to this ridiculous argument to try and find any stupid excuse to make an excuse. Cutting off water, electricity, food, fuel, medicine, etc. You sound more like Stalin and Hitler than you do a Canadian.

100%

[Warhippy]

36 minutes ago, bolt said:

More then 1,300 Israeli civilians slaughtered. 

Women and girls raped. 

People burned alive.

Young kids kidnapped. 

Babies tortured and murdered.

Parents executed in front of their young children.

 

 

Is this how Palestine becomes free? 

Since 2008 Palestinians have seen 6407 deaths and 152,560 injured

Since 2008 Israelis have seen 308 deaths and 6307 injured

 

Since 1947 Palestine has effectively shrunk to less than 10% of its initial land mass with roughly 5 million people living in 6220 sq kms.  By comparison Vancouver Island is 32,1000 sq kms with less than 830,000 on it.

 

Tell me more about freedom and how one becomes free with this knowledge in the air

 

[Odd.]

43 minutes ago, bolt said:

More then 1,300 Israeli civilians slaughtered. 

Women and girls raped. 

People burned alive.

Young kids kidnapped. 

Babies tortured and murdered.

Parents executed in front of their young children.

 

 

Is this how Palestine becomes free? 

How is it that you fail to distinguish Palestine and Hamas. Palestinian civilians who want to be free don’t have blood on their hands. Hamas does. Hamas. And Hamas doesn’t even compare to amount Israel has.

 

Meanwhile, all of Israel is complicit in the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians. 

Edited October 13, 2023 by Odd.

[Warhippy]

1 hour ago, King Heffy said:

The man's family has been directly impacted by Hamas acting like the vermin that they are.  Maybe it's you who should show some compassion.

My daughter went to a 1 day summer camp with a girl who had a relative that was killed by a bear.

 

My family has been directly affected by violence from animals.

 

See how that sounds?

 

While I can sympathize with Roman, saying the word directly is a bridge to far

[NewbieCanuckFan]

Have to wonder how the world (at least in Israel) would be different had not that right wing fanatic killed Yitzhak Rabin in the mid-90s.