the destroyer of worlds Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 Just now, Super19 said: Israel has been trying this for years! Hamas is just too barbaric. Nentanyahu does things by the book, with morality and good faith, and so much care for the Palestinians. What does Nentanyahu receive in return for being so cordial? Hamas, paragliding into Israel, with guns and masks, brutally attacking, killing, and taking the Israeli people. And to top it all off, hamas embarrassed Israeli top of the line, sophisticated Intel and defense systems. Damn these paragliding savages, they deserve every bit of destruction coming their way. And the blood in Gaza is Hamas' fault too, for being so foolish, stupid, brazen, wreckless, inhumane terroristic animals. If there was a terrorist holding children in your family or friend group hostage, I guess you'd be OK with the government drone striking the school. You know, cause the kids were human shields and collateral damage. Oops. No harm no foul. People with at least some compassion know that civilians shouldn't be targeted and operations should be planned to MINIMIZE their deaths/injuries. Bombing the Jabalya refugee camp is not that. It is reckless abandon showing no care for civilian lives. They are no better than the terrorists in this. They jumped the shark. What little good will the Israelis had is gone. Go ahead defend their barbarous actions. 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddikulus Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 25 minutes ago, Alflives said: Would the region defined in 1948 work? Don't think Israel will ever go for that. A lot has happened since that time, you would be also asking people to give up the homes that they have lived their entire lives in. Some sort of compromise is needed so that the bloodshed stops, but I don't think we will ever see it. I think the more likely scenario is that Palestine ceases to exist than there ever being a resolution. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosehead Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Bob Long said: Yes. Due process is crucial to justice. Do Hamas terrorists also deserve due process .... or only Israeli's that deserve it. as Arabs are less than...... Do you even see your double standard ? All mankind are equal. Edited November 1, 2023 by moosehead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosehead Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 1 minute ago, Riddikulus said: Don't think Israel will ever go for that. A lot has happened since that time, you would be also asking people to give up the homes that they have lived their entire lives in. Some sort of compromise is needed so that the bloodshed stops, but I don't think we will ever see it. I think the more likely scenario is that Palestine ceases to exist than there ever being a resolution. Yes but Palestinians are allies with Russia, China and Iran so anything is possible. Lots of external forces involved / potentially involved in this conflict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super19 Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 11 minutes ago, moosehead said: Sickening... Some 60 Stars of David were painted on homes - walls in the 14th arrondissement of Paris on Monday night. France is grappling with a big rise in antisemitic incidents. More than 850 such acts have been reported in France since the Hamas attacks in Israel on 7 October, says Interior Minister Gérald Darmanin. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-67274777 People are well within their right to criticize the government of Israel, but antisemitism and hate for the Jewish people is an unacceptable violation. I never want to see this. Just as I never want to see Muslims branded as terrorists, or any type of malicious racism. This is truly sickening and I don't wish to see it, no matter who you support, things like this are WRONG. Doesn't do anyone any good. As much as people criticize the Israeli govt right now, I will never stand for antisemitism or racism of any kind. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddikulus Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 1 minute ago, moosehead said: Yes but Palestinians are allies with Russia, China and Iran so anything is possible. Lots of external forces involved / potentially involved in this conflict Would you feel any sort of confidence if those were your allies? Those are some of the most repressive countries in the world right now and that is towards their own citizens. They aren't coming to the aid of Palestinians for altruistic reasons, in my opinion they are allied with Palestine for strategic reasons. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 7 minutes ago, Riddikulus said: Don't think Israel will ever go for that. A lot has happened since that time, you would be also asking people to give up the homes that they have lived their entire lives in. Some sort of compromise is needed so that the bloodshed stops, but I don't think we will ever see it. I think the more likely scenario is that Palestine ceases to exist than there ever being a resolution. Maybe the leaders making the decisions have to be mothers? It’s such a horrible situation and there just looks like no end other than we all kill one another. It’s that bloody Star Trek episode with the half black hslf white guys. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RomanPer Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 Something that’s been bothering me for a while, especially after several slurs in my direction in this thread. When gay person says that certain things are homophobic - people listen. When Black person says that certain things are racist - people listen. However, when a Jew says that certain things are antisemitic - quite a lot of people start arguing with the said Jew about it. Without even realizing that the argument of that nature in itself is antisemitic… Just saying… 1 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 7 minutes ago, Super19 said: Israel has been trying this for years! Hamas is just too barbaric. Nentanyahu does things by the book, with morality and good faith, and so much care for the Palestinians. What does Nentanyahu receive in return for being so cordial? Hamas, paragliding into Israel, with guns and masks, brutally attacking, killing, and taking the Israeli people. And to top it all off, hamas embarrassed Israeli top of the line, sophisticated Intel and defense systems. Damn these paragliding savages, they deserve every bit of destruction coming their way. And the blood in Gaza is Hamas' fault too, for being so foolish, stupid, brazen, wreckless, inhumane terroristic animals. There can never be any justification for killing children. You know how we can stop the circle of hatred, with kindness, education and forgiveness. I posted a mini doco earlier in this thread, that included a story about a Palestinian man who lost his daughter and son in law that were burnt alive in a settler attack. He was raising his grandson who suffered severe burns to his body. He was teaching him about forgiveness, not hate. I really f#ckin hate that term collateral damage. As I have stated before, it was made up by lawyers. It diminishes the fact of killing to an abstraction. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 2 minutes ago, RomanPer said: Something that’s been bothering me for a while, especially after several slurs in my direction in this thread. When gay person says that certain things are homophobic - people listen. When Black person says that certain things are racist - people listen. However, when a Jew says that certain things are antisemitic - quite a lot of people start arguing with the said Jew about it. Without even realizing that the argument of that nature in itself is antisemitic… Just saying… We are a sad species @RomanPer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 4 minutes ago, Ilunga said: There can never be any justification for killing children. You know how we can stop the circle of hatred, with kindness, education and forgiveness. I posted a mini doco earlier in this thread, that included a story about a Palestinian man who lost his daughter and son in law that were burnt alive in a settler attack. He was raising his grandson who suffered severe burns to his body. He was teaching him about forgiveness, not hate. I really f#ckin hate that term collateral damage. As I have stated before, it was made up by lawyers. It diminishes the fact of killing to an abstraction. We should never give up doing the right thing, especially when it’s most difficult. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 7 minutes ago, RomanPer said: Something that’s been bothering me for a while, especially after several slurs in my direction in this thread. When gay person says that certain things are homophobic - people listen. When Black person says that certain things are racist - people listen. However, when a Jew says that certain things are antisemitic - quite a lot of people start arguing with the said Jew about it. Without even realizing that the argument of that nature in itself is antisemitic… Just saying… LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super19 Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 11 minutes ago, the destroyer of worlds said: If there was a terrorist holding children in your family or friend group hostage, I guess you'd be OK with the government drone striking the school. You know, cause the kids were human shields and collateral damage. Oops. No harm no foul. People with at least some compassion know that civilians shouldn't be targeted and operations should be planned to MINIMIZE their deaths/injuries. Bombing the Jabalya refugee camp is not that. It is reckless abandon showing no care for civilian lives. They are no better than the terrorists in this. They jumped the shark. What little good will the Israelis had is gone. Go ahead defend their barbarous actions. I was just offering how I perceive Nentanyahus reaction was from his point of view. There are always 2 sides. I think I've made it clear that Nentanyahus response deserves a moral outrage and condemnation. But clearly it was a breaking point in the region. Hamas was fed up for Palestine, and Israel is fed up from Hamas. The world let that region down, particularly the Palestinians. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddikulus Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 Just now, RomanPer said: Something that’s been bothering me for a while, especially after several slurs in my direction in this thread. When gay person says that certain things are homophobic - people listen. When Black person says that certain things are racist - people listen. However, when a Jew says that certain things are antisemitic - quite a lot of people start arguing with the said Jew about it. Without even realizing that the argument of that nature in itself is antisemitic… Just saying… I haven't seen the slurs that were directed at you, so I am not going to comment on those. I will push back against what you said here, there are plenty of people from those groups who will use the words "homophobia" and "racism" to shut down all discussion. People can and do push back against that sort of behaviour, they are quick to remind those folks that just because they are offended doesn't mean they get the limit the speech of others. Even among those groups you will find disagreement on whether something is homophobic or racist. It absolutely makes sense to discuss the words and actions that are truly offensive, otherwise the sensitive folks will shut down any and all discussion and appoint themselves as the arbiters what can be discussed. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Alflives said: We should never give up doing the right thing, especially when it’s most difficult. Yep. For instance bombing a refugee camp today killing 400 Palestinians. Difficult thing to do bombing civilians but ah it’s the right thing to do. Ya win some you lose some. Yeah we killed some of our own hostages but meh we weren’t gonna save them anyway. Carry on! Edited November 1, 2023 by Odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 1 minute ago, Odd. said: LOL IMHAO @RomanPer didn’t intend this as humour. I find this whole situation very sad. Why would you post this? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RomanPer Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 3 minutes ago, Ilunga said: There can never be any justification for killing children. You know how we can stop the circle of hatred, with kindness, education and forgiveness. I posted a mini doco earlier in this thread, that included a story about a Palestinian man who lost his daughter and son in law that were burnt alive in a settler attack. He was raising his grandson who suffered severe burns to his body. He was teaching him about forgiveness, not hate. I really f#ckin hate that term collateral damage. As I have stated before, it was made up by lawyers. It diminishes the fact of killing to an abstraction. I 100% agree about education. And I believe this is exactly where the root cause of everything we see now. There are plenty of examples of what is being taught in schools in Gaza - kill the Jews, be a martyr. The same with Palestinian TV programming for kids. There are plenty of examples on YouTube, one just needs to search. And I challenge anyone to find something even remotely similar in children’s TV programming in Israel. You simply won’t find a single child TV program in Hebrew that says “kill the Arabs”. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super19 Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 10 minutes ago, RomanPer said: Something that’s been bothering me for a while, especially after several slurs in my direction in this thread. When gay person says that certain things are homophobic - people listen. When Black person says that certain things are racist - people listen. However, when a Jew says that certain things are antisemitic - quite a lot of people start arguing with the said Jew about it. Without even realizing that the argument of that nature in itself is antisemitic… Just saying… Can we agree that critiscm of Israel =/= antisemitism? To be more specific, criticsm of Israeli govt and Nentanyahu =/= antisemitism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 22 minutes ago, moosehead said: Do Hamas terrorists also deserve due process .... or only Israeli's that deserve it. as Arabs are less than...... Do you even see your double standard ? All mankind are equal. You are arguing with yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 2 minutes ago, Odd. said: Yep. For instance bombing a refugee camp today killing 400 Palestinians. Difficult thing to do bombing civilians but ah it’s the right thing to do. Ya win some you lose some Is bombing all these people, in your view, the right thing? Sorry I don’t understand what you’re posting here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RomanPer Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 1 minute ago, Alflives said: IMHAO @RomanPer didn’t intend this as humour. I find this whole situation very sad. Why would you post this? He’s just making his point for me. I assume that was his response to my last post? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 Just now, Alflives said: IMHAO @RomanPer didn’t intend this as humour. I find this whole situation very sad. Why would you post this? Quite frankly I don’t care for someone who calls an entire group of people as terrorists in way to dehumanize them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RomanPer Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 2 minutes ago, Super19 said: Can we agree that critiscm of Israel =/= antisemitism? To be more specific, criticsm of Israeli govt and Nentanyahu =/= antisemitism. Someone asked me that before and my answer to that was “it depends”. If criticism is well balanced - 100% agree with you. Hell, I personally think Netanyahu is corrupt and should not be in power. However, if Israel is only criticized by certain people, with no rhyme or reason, ignoring any facts presented, then it’s clear that the anti Israel sentiment is just a facade for blatant antisemitism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 5 minutes ago, Alflives said: We should never give up doing the right thing, especially when it’s most difficult. I already knew this however the events of the last six years of my life have reinforced the fact that you do the right thing, simply because it's the right thing to do. While I haven't been in a war zone these last 6 years have been the hardest of my life. I have stuck to my values, they are the only real things I can take to the grave with me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 1 minute ago, Odd. said: Quite frankly I don’t care for someone who calls an entire group of people as terrorists in way to dehumanize them. Actually the Hsmas people are bad. They are bad humans. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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