Hamas attacking Israel

[moosehead]

28 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Occupation is the only way to exterminate Hamas.  They just need to provide a better standard of living than Hamas did, which isn't difficult.  Every last member of Hamas needs to be hunted down and executed.

 

So you are saying execute 20.000 to 30,000  Hamas members...

 

Would you shoot them, hang them or gas them ?

 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by moosehead

[King Heffy]

2 minutes ago, moosehead said:

 

So you are saying execute 20.000 to 30,000  Hamas members...

 

Would you shoot them, hang them or gas them ?

 

 

Bullets are cheap.  Are you proposing letting them live?

[moosehead]

16 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Bullets are cheap.  Are you proposing letting them live?

 

I am just curious to your strategy...

 

What if you think maybe Hamas maybe not.  Would you kill them just to be on the safe side ?

Would you pursue charges in court... or just shoot them on the street if think maybe they could be Hamas....

 

Would you shoot palestinians that are only friends  or relatives with Hamas members ?

 

What about the 12 year old Hamas members that throw rocks....  do you round them up and execute them all as well..... ?

 

It seems you have  put in a lot of time working on your "STRATEGY"

 

 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by moosehead

[moosehead]

160 children killed daily

“Every day, you think it is the worst day and then the next day is worse,” UN health agency spokesperson Christian Lindmeier said, quoting a colleague in Gaza, which remains under almost complete blockade. “Access, access, access is necessary.”

 

The level of death and suffering is “hard to fathom”, Mr. Lindmeier told journalists in Geneva. On average, 160 children are killed every day in the enclave and the total death toll has passed 10,000, according to figures from the Ministry of Health in Gaza.

 

https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/11/1143292#:~:text=In a statement released in,there can be no justification."

[Optimist Prime]

I think the overexuberance to saying hunt them down and execute them is out of knowing they won't surrender to go to jail. They will literally die fighting before they surrender. Hopefully that is what the poster meant?

 

I am all for hunting down Hamas to the last man.

not so much what the White Finns did to the Red finns to end the civil war: the white finns had surrounded about 30k red finns in my grandmothers village: she was with the side of the white finns, a little girl with her family in a church basement under seige: the white finns captured the red finns en masse and decided to massacre them all to end the war that night.

They did, and it was over. 

My grand dad was among the liberating White Finns with General Mannerheim that day. No I don't recommend it, but it did end the war.

 

better if Hamas surrendered and faced the Hague for their crimes and jail in israel for the lower level fighters.

 

edit: and no he wasn't a pedo, lol...they met again later in life in Canada and got married, but comparing notes about the wars... she was literally about to be murdered ina church basement when the White Finn troops (not a racial reference by the way, a political one: the reds were commies, the whites capitalists. ) saved the day...then years later they bumped into one another in the new country, wild. 

 

[Yoshiyoshi]

1 hour ago, Super19 said:

Again, I'm asking is how does Nentanyahu expect to kill Hamas? It seems as if he is creating more Hamas with the way he is doing things right now. You can agree that making Gaza inhabitable and killing an outrageous amount of Palestinians is not the way to fight Hamas.

You need to understand that Israel needs to lift this dark cloud of occupation over Palestine, for there to be a better future and peace for both. It starts with condemning Israeli oppression, and then condemning Hamas. I argue, that if there was no Israeli oppression, there is no future for Hamas. 
 

Completely disagree with your order here. There can be no peace now until Hamas is removed from Gaza, if Israel pulled out completely and gave in to all their demands they would still attack Israel and turn Gaza/Palestine into another Afghanistan/Iran/etc oppressing their own people. Giving in to terrorists never works out for the better.

[Super19]

34 minutes ago, Yoshiyoshi said:

Completely disagree with your order here. There can be no peace now until Hamas is removed from Gaza, if Israel pulled out completely and gave in to all their demands they would still attack Israel and turn Gaza/Palestine into another Afghanistan/Iran/etc oppressing their own people. Giving in to terrorists never works out for the better.

False. Israel has had its oppressing ways on Palestine for years - decades now. And they've done nothing to solve the problem.  It's what the whole "Free Palestine" movement is about. Palestine has no military. Hamas is the only ones literally fighting for them, Israels oppression breeds Hamas resistance fighters.

[Yoshiyoshi]

7 minutes ago, Super19 said:

False. Israel has had its oppressing ways on Palestine for years - decades now. And they've done nothing to solve the problem.  It's what the whole "Free Palestine" movement is about. Palestine has no military. Hamas is the only ones literally fighting for them, Israels oppression breeds Hamas resistance fighters.

Hamas isnt fighting for them. I wont deny that Israel has helped create the problem as it currently exists but it is not relevant to the current situation anymore. Palestine is not a nation that can support itself so even if Israel pulled out and ended their siege it would not solve the problem. If they dont cripple or destroy Hamas now they will never be able to improve the situation in Palestine because Hamas and their supporters will just use any opportunity to kill more Israeli civilians. Hamas is opposed to peace because peace would mean they lose their power and they would rather rule in hell that serve in heaven as the saying goes. And Hamas isnt resistance fighters, they are terrorists. If they were resistance fighters they would have attacked targets that would help weaken Isreal like military, police, government etc, not music festivals and exclusively civilian targets.

[Elias Pettersson]

15 minutes ago, Super19 said:

False. Israel has had its oppressing ways on Palestine for years - decades now. And they've done nothing to solve the problem.  It's what the whole "Free Palestine" movement is about. Palestine has no military. Hamas is the only ones literally fighting for them, Israels oppression breeds Hamas resistance fighters.

 

Hamas doesn't fight for the Palestinian people, they use them as human shields.  The only people Hamas fight for is themselves.  

 

The reason why the Palestinian people are oppressed is because they are led by a terrorist organization that takes their food, water and medical supplies for themselves, tells these people to use their kids as suicide bombers, sets up their headquarters underneath hospitals, mosques and schools and basically starves their own people while their leaders live in luxury in Qatar.

 

The only reason there has ever been a blockade on both the Israel and Egypt side is because Israel has needed to protect themselves from terrorist attacks.  What happened on October 7 could have easily happened every day of the week without a blockade in place...

[Canuck Surfer]

Abbas confirms to US he is willing to rule Gaza after Hamas falls (msn.com)

 

Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas agreed he would be willing to take control of the Gaza Strip after Hamas falls, according to The New York Times.According to the report, Abbas would only accept the position if the Biden administration commits to promoting the establishment of a Palestinian state.

This is a developing story.

[Canuck Surfer]

 

https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/article-772238

 

A senior Hamas commander told the UK's Daily Mail that Hamas leaders Ismail Haniyeh and Yahya Sinwar had "destroyed" the lower levels of the terrorist movement by ordering the October 7 attack, according to a report by the British newspaper on Sunday.

 

The commander, calling himself Abu Mohammed, told the newspaper in an interview over Telegram that originally the plan was to kidnap a few Israeli soldiers, but the orders were changed at the last minute by Hamas military leaders to conduct the massacre which ended up taking place on that tragic Saturday morning a month ago.

 

"Our reason to speak is that we want to raise our voice to the world. My dear Gaza is under bombardment," he lamented: "The problem is because of our leadership."

 

 

 

 

 

 

The commander pointed to the fact that Haniyeh and other leaders live in splendor abroad while he's sustaining himself on some dates and olive oil.

 

Abu Mohammed also accused Sinwar of "acting like a street fighter," saying Hamas terrorists were told to "do what they like" when attacking Israel.

  Blood in houses when Hamas terrorists infiltrated Kibbutz Be'eri, and 30 other nearby communities in Southern Israel on October 7, killing more than 1400 people, and taking more than 200 hostages into Gaza, near the Israeli-Gaza border. (credit: EDI ISRAEL/FLASH90)

Hamas commander says contact lost with leaders

The commander additionally stated that contact had been lost with Hamas's political bureau, saying "We don’t know what direction to go in next. We don’t know which path to take. They destroyed us."

 

Defense Minister Yoav Gallant also spoke about the disconnect between the Hamas leadership and the lower levels of the terrorist group recently, saying that Sinwar has been completely cut off from the rest of the organization and that Hamas's command structure is collapsing.

[Canuck Surfer]

 

  https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-772311

As Israel fights in Gaza, settlers wage war on West Bank Palestinians - opinion

As the war in Gaza enters its 2nd month, Netanyahu’s messianic and ultranationalist partners are working to tighten their grip on the West Bank, expand their settlements, and drive Palestinians out.

By DOUGLAS BLOOMFIELD NOVEMBER 9, 2023 01:32 IDF SOLDIERS prevent settlers from entering the village of Deir Sharaf, west of Nablus, in response to a shooting attack last Thursday. (photo credit: NASSER ISHTAYEH/FLASH90)

 

With the world focused on the din and death of the fighting in Gaza, Israeli right-wing extremists are using that war to distract attention away from their violence, vandalism, and harassment to tighten their grip on the West Bank and to drive out Palestinians.

 

At the same time, Israeli security forces have stepped up their anti-terror raids since the October 7 Hamas pogrom. An estimated 150 Palestinians, including an unknown number of suspected Hamas terrorists, have been killed in the West Bank over the last month and over 2,000 injured as violence has increased on both sides.

 

But it’s about more than rooting out terrorists.

Israel's other Palestinian war: Settlers and the West Bank 

National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir announced the purchase of as many as 24,000 US-made M-16 assault rifles to arm settlers. After some in Congress objected, the Netanyahu government assured Washington that these would only go to first responders and not to settler groups.

 

It is hard to take such assurances seriously when it involves a notorious senior minister in the Israeli government. Ben-Gvir, who has been handing out rifles to civilians, has a long history of anti-Arab incitement and support for settler extremists and was rejected by the IDF for military service because he was too extreme.

  Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu with National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir during a discussion and a vote in the assembly hall of the Knesset in Jerusalem. March 6, 2023. (credit: YONATAN SINDEL/FLASH90)

Netanyahu has legitimized the extremists of the once-shunned parties, Ben-Gvir’s Otzma Yehudit and the Religious Zionist Party, by giving their leaders top government posts. They hold the balance of power in his coalition – if they pull out, he’s out.

 

Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich, leader of the Religious Zionist Party, wants to create dead zones surrounding Jewish settlements in the West Bank for “preventing the entrance of Palestinians.” 

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Netanyahu, frightened of his extremist partners, didn’t have the courage to fire Heritage Minister Amichai Eliyahu when, in response to a question, he voiced support for nuking Gaza; he merely suspended him from cabinet meetings.

 

Violent settler vigilantes – terrorists – not only have powerful support inside the highest echelons of the government but in the army as well.

 

US President Joe Biden has demanded settlers be “held accountable” for their violence, likening their attacks on Palestinians and the West Bank to “pouring gasoline on fire.” 

 

Palestinians who’ve been attacked by these marauders often report that when the army was called for help, soldiers too often simply stopped by and watched or even took part. The Jewish Telegraphic Agency noted that in one incident “soldiers and settlers were accused of binding, stripping, beating, and urinating on three Palestinians, and zip-typing and stealing the phones of Israeli (anti-occupation) activists.” 

 

Nearly half of these incidents involved “Israeli forces accompanying or actively supporting Israeli settlers while carrying out the attacks,” The New York Times reported, citing United Nations officials. 

 

PRESIDENT BIDEN and Secretary of State Antony Blinken have been trying to talk to Netanyahu and his government about plans for after the war, but their concerns have been shrugged off. No doubt because the administration wants to resume peace negotiations in pursuit of a two-state solution, and that is anathema to Netanyahu. In fact, that may be what got him into today’s war. 

 

Over the years, Netanyahu has bolstered Hamas – notwithstanding occasional clashes – as a rival to the more moderate and secular Palestinian Authority and Fatah. Unlike several of his predecessors who viewed PA President Mahmoud Abbas as a partner for peace, Netanyahu considered him a threat to his own power and his strident opposition to Palestinian statehood. 

 

Netanyahu explained his divide-and-conquer strategy at a Likud meeting in 2019. “Whoever opposes a Palestinian state must support the delivery of funds to Gaza because maintaining separation between the PA in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza will prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state.”

 

 

His message was if Palestinians can’t make peace with each other, how can they make peace with us? And he wanted to make sure they couldn’t.

 

It was that mindset that many of Netanyahu’s critics contend led him to ignore warnings of heightened threats from Hamas. 

 

Netanyahu is weak and preoccupied with his own survival and finding scapegoats for his multiple failures. He seems unable or unwilling to control his ministers who support and encourage the settler vigilantes. Like Donald Trump (the parallels keep popping up), he is unwilling to take responsibility for anything that goes wrong and quick to blame everyone else. He accused the military and domestic intelligence agencies of the Gaza intelligence failure (they quickly took responsibility) and not warning him (they tried but he wouldn’t listen).

 

He even tried to blame the reservists who went on strike to protest his judicial coup, but that blew up in his face and he was forced to apologize. The reservists had quickly showed up for duty, which is more than can be said for Netanyahu’s favorite son, Yair, who is sitting the war out on a Florida beach.

 

The prime minister is worried that after the war, Biden, who is more popular in Israel than Netanyahu for dramatically rushing to Israel’s side, will press for renewal of peace negotiations. And he will link that to brokering Israel-Saudi normalization. The Saudis had been indifferent to the Palestinian cause prior to October 7 but will have no choice in the post-war era. 

 

Stopping that rapprochement is believed to have been a motivating factor in Hamas’s attack and Iran’s backing. It had been Bibi’s mantra that by making deals with secular, moderate Arabs he could render the Palestinians irrelevant. 

 

Any return to the peace table will require new leadership in Israel and the PA that is ready to make tough, historic decisions, and an American president who genuinely wants to help and is trusted by both sides. 

 

Even if a new government emerges after this war – as it must – and it endorses the two-state solution, real talks could still be years away. The first requirement must be a Palestinian Authority that can speak for both the West Bank and Gaza, a halt to settlement expansion, and a crackdown on the violent agitators on both sides.

 

Each party will need to resuscitate its own peace camp and reach out to the other side to convince them of its sincerity. 

 

Sympathy for Israel after the October 7 Hamas massacre began to fade as television showed pictures of Israel’s massive bombing campaign that laid waste to Gaza City and the death toll that the Hamas Health Ministry says has passed 10,000, half of them women and children. 

 

While support for Israel remains strong in the United States, sympathy for the Palestinians has grown noticeably and the country was swept by an unprecedented wave of antisemitism. Biden’s backing among his party’s progressives and Arab-American voters has plunged. Those voters are unlikely to turn to the Republican party, especially if it is Trump, who is talking about expanding his first-term Muslim ban, but they could just stay home on November 5 and help elect him that way.

 

As the war in Gaza enters its second month, back on the other side of the country, Netanyahu’s messianic and ultranationalist partners are working to tighten their grip on the West Bank, expand their settlements, annex the land, and drive out the Palestinians. They also want to re-occupy Gaza. Biden has said it would be a major mistake, but the prime minister announced Monday that Israel plans to assume responsibility for Gaza’s security for an “indefinite period.” In other words, Joe, we don’t want your damn advice, just your money and your weapons.

 

The writer is a Washington-based journalist, consultant, lobbyist, and former American Israel Public Affairs Committee legislative director.

[Elias Pettersson]

Just sickening...

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

 

[Sabrefan1]

I've only now just noticed a new western leftist rallying cry of, "free Palestine from the river to the sea".  Is that new or have I just never run into it before in year's past.

 

Unless my recall of geography needs a refresh, that's western leftists basically calling for the destruction of Israel.

 

Am I missing something or has the far left gone even further in their rhetoric than I predicted last month that they would.

[Elias Pettersson]

 

[Sabrefan1]

2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

 

 

Great.  My taxes are now going to go down the drain for a ground war on Iran that we'll likely get bogged down in.

[Elias Pettersson]

Who wants to tell them?

 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Elias Pettersson

[Yoshiyoshi]

6 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Who wants to tell them?

 

 

I could be mistaken but isnt that poster a Russian propaganda channel? Or am i thinking of one with a similar name?

[Elias Pettersson]

7 minutes ago, Sabrefan1 said:

 

 

Great.  My taxes are now going to go down the drain for a ground war on Iran that we'll likely get bogged down in.

 

I remember you saying this was going to be a 6 day war.  One month later we are not even close yet in terms of what is going on in Gaza.  I remember saying that Gaza was just the puppy show.  The much bigger event was going to start happening when other countries got involved and expanded this war.

 

I still feel that way and I think this war is just getting started.  100%, the US is going to get involved.  The US Military Industrial Complex has never walked away from a potential chance at invading another country.  

[Elias Pettersson]

9 minutes ago, Yoshiyoshi said:

I could be mistaken but isnt that poster a Russian propaganda channel? Or am i thinking of one with a similar name?

 

I have no idea...

[Canuck Surfer]

19 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Who wants to tell them?

 

 

 

 

[Sabrefan1]

30 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

I remember you saying this was going to be a 6 day war.  One month later we are not even close yet in terms of what is going on in Gaza.  I remember saying that Gaza was just the puppy show.  The much bigger event was going to start happening when other countries got involved and expanded this war.

 

I still feel that way and I think this war is just getting started.  100%, the US is going to get involved.  The US Military Industrial Complex has never walked away from a potential chance at invading another country.  

 

You remember me talking about the actual 6-Day war that happened in 1967.  Not that this current military operation was going to be another 6-day war. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War

 

1.  This isn't technically a war.  The Palestinians don't actually have a country.

 

2.  If Israel went full bore into the area with every weapon they had and just started killing everything that moved.  They'd quickly take everything over, but would lose worldwide support and would put their future existence at risk.

 

Quote

I remember saying that Gaza was just the puppy show.  The much bigger event was going to start happening when other countries got involved and expanded this war.

 

I hope you're wrong and Iran is just sabre rattling.  Like I've said before, I don't want to pay for yet another war.

 

Quote

I still feel that way and I think this war is just getting started.

 

Again.  Let's hope you're wrong.

 

Quote

The US Military Industrial Complex has never walked away from a potential chance at invading another country.  

 

They don't care about who invades whom.  They only care about the money they'll make.  If they made more money over the long term making widgets for countries, they'd dump weapon production and make and sell widgets instead.

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Sabrefan1

[Canuck Surfer]

 

[Taxi]

7 hours ago, moosehead said:

 

So you are saying execute 20.000 to 30,000  Hamas members...

 

Would you shoot them, hang them or gas them ?

 

 

Most of the hamas members barely have any training or affiliation with Hamas. If you take out their leadership and the core group of highly trained militants, the rest just falls apart naturally.