Hamas attacking Israel

[Super19]

4 minutes ago, Taxi said:

 

This many Jewish people? So far I've seen you post about "Jewish Voices for Peace", which is a minority voice that includes a bunch of non-Jewish people and founded on the principle that they are anti-Zionist.  You also posted Rabbit Weiss, who is so anti-zionist he attended that he attended the "Weiss spoke at the International Conference to Review the Global Vision of the Holocaust," put on by Iran in 2006.

 

I have many Jewish people in my social media feeds. I have never seen that group so united in their resolve towards military action.

I've seen many nasty videos of Israelis pushing and cheering for violence against all of Gaza, some even outright saying to wipe out all the Palestinians. I know your feeds probably don't imply that, but there are a lot of shit across this whole spectrum from both sides.

So while you say that Jewish Voice for Peace is a minority voice (of Israel or the Jews), I do appreciate their views.

[Elias Pettersson]

Hamas supporter stripped of his UK visa, now faces deportation...

 

A HAMAS-sympathising radical has been stripped of his UK visa, The Sun can reveal.

The foreign national was living in Britain but has now had his right to remain removed after expressing support for the proscribed terror group.

[Super19]

 

[Super19]

What I find sad is first the death counts coming out of Gaza were being denied or taken with a pinch of salt (as if just looking at the mass destruction and seeing videos of the dead wasn't proof enough). Now we have reports from US intelligence which support the totals from the Gaza Health Ministry (which has been proven to never have lied or exaggerated death counts in previous conflicts). Even Macron now is speaking about the immense deaths of women, elderly and children from what is ultimately, Israelis bombs.

 

And then you have guys like that USC Professor, who wishes they all die, and many voices from people within Israel wishing the same thing.

 

And now Israel has come out and lowered the casuality count from Oct 7, while more and more Palestinians die everyday. Every 10 days in Gaza has seen more Children die than the entirety of Israeli casualties on Oct 7 (which did include 30% military, and there was some IDF crossfire to their own citizens from some tweets Ive read).

[Canuck Surfer]

2 hours ago, Yoshiyoshi said:

As someone who would be considered on the left, I am disappointed by how many people are jumping on the anti Israel train. Its like they arent even thinking about the situation and just immediately jump on the underdogs side.

 

I have no idea why this is a left versus right conversation?  None!

 

It should be about justice. Instead people seem to be trending, also a parallel in politics I suppose, where whomever can spark a sense of outrage gets people clamoring on board. My view is people sided with race. Arabic, Islamic people want Palestinians to be victims. Sure Jewish peoples were Holocaust victims, should they attack me? Legitimate concerns about their behaviour? There remains simple real hate. Its moral outrage by who claims understanding victimization. Both trumpet for support. Moosehead is correct in that the Palestinian side seems to be winning the Media battle as biggest victims.

 

Everyone else is just jumping on board!

 

Let's be honest; would a true leftist really want to expel all cultural diversity in Palestine? Do they know why its disappearing...  Even know! Or bagging, rightfully so, those on the right who opportunistically became Settlers. Righties, who symbolically don't care as long as their making money. Only care when public opinion when it starts costing money. None of this really matters. At its roots, the actual reason for this war, remains Jews & Christians versus Muslims. 

 

For territory!

 

I say dig deeper, no need to elaborate more at this moment. Why do so many in the Middle East still live in the dark ages? 

[Taxi]

43 minutes ago, Super19 said:

What I find sad is first the death counts coming out of Gaza were being denied or taken with a pinch of salt (as if just looking at the mass destruction and seeing videos of the dead wasn't proof enough). Now we have reports from US intelligence which support the totals from the Gaza Health Ministry (which has been proven to never have lied or exaggerated death counts in previous conflicts). Even Macron now is speaking about the immense deaths of women, elderly and children from what is ultimately, Israelis bombs.

 

And then you have guys like that USC Professor, who wishes they all die, and many voices from people within Israel wishing the same thing.

 

And now Israel has come out and lowered the casuality count from Oct 7, while more and more Palestinians die everyday. Every 10 days in Gaza has seen more Children die than the entirety of Israeli casualties on Oct 7 (which did include 30% military, and there was some IDF crossfire to their own citizens from some tweets Ive read).

 

This is the same Gaza Health Ministry that claimed Israel had killed over 500 people at thee al-Ahli Arab Hospital. This claim then provoked a bunch of anti-Israel/Jewish riots across the world. 

[RomanPer]

3 hours ago, Super19 said:

Not much thought needed for some to discern the oppressed from the oppressor.

 

Based on your posts, "thought" is not really a burden for you to begin with.

[RomanPer]

3 hours ago, Yoshiyoshi said:

Do you know which one I am talking about by any chance? I remember seeing one that with a similar name on twitter that posted a lot of stuff that seemed pro invasion but its been a while and I dont remember it.

 

Sorry, I'm not sure which one you mean. Visegrad was on the right side of history from the beginning. I believe their headquarters are in Prague (I might be wrong though).

[RomanPer]

3 hours ago, Super19 said:

It's a testimont to how disliked Israel is right now.

 

No, it's a testament (properly spelled) on how stupid and fair-weather some people are.

[Optimist Prime]

1 hour ago, Taxi said:

 

 

It's a testament to how polarized things are politically. If you are on one side of the spectrum you automatically adopt a wide set of beliefs, without any thought or consistency.

 

Once again, I don't see anyone hating Israel who wasn't hating them on October 1. 

 

1 hour ago, Super19 said:

I don't think you are seeing the sway in opinions happening in real time, which is all over social media.

 

1 hour ago, Taxi said:

 

I'm seeing the same people on social media who have been outspoken before and after this latest war, on both sides. If anything I'm seeing a lot of the quiet people in the middle state they understand Israel's position this time around, following the attacks of October 7. 

 

1 hour ago, Super19 said:

The algorithms for our social media feeds must be different, because I am definitely seeing the opposite in effect.

And again, never before have I seen this many Jewish people speaking against the Israeli government, and if you just look, you'll see it too.

In broad general strokes, I hope I am not the first one to explain it to you, social media companies funnel things to your eyeballs that you largely agree with as a means of keeping you engaged in their profit system. Some phones even have your permission to guage when your pupils dilate, and the soc.med. Co's feed on that data to stream you more of what you get off on, by way of hormone releases on your own body. to be blunt. It is literally a self fed drug reaction like dopamine that triggers things the algorithm looks for. If I am the first to explain it, sorry for the blunt force trauma.  

[Optimist Prime]

3 hours ago, Super19 said:

It's a testimont to how disliked Israel is right now.

I suspect it is a testament to how fundamentally bankrupt the latest generation of coddled N.A. young adults and teenagers critical thinking skills are. 

[Super19]

17 minutes ago, Taxi said:

 

This is the same Gaza Health Ministry that claimed Israel had killed over 500 people at thee al-Ahli Arab Hospital. This claim then provoked a bunch of anti-Israel/Jewish riots across the world. 

The ministry revised their numbers to 471.

American intelligence has it to as high as 300.

 

It'd be nice if there were more journalists there, wouldn't it?

 

Also, what do you say about the unverified reports of the 40 beheaded babies that Israel claimed, which was the biggest talking point.

[RomanPer]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

 

A little more history about the Shifa hospital. It was built by the British in 1946 as army baracks. It was redesigned by Israeli architects in 1980s to become a hospital, using the same standards as Israeli hospital Tel HaShomer in Ramat Gan (near Tel Aviv). At the time, hospitals in Israel were designed with underground levels in case a war with Egypt breaks out. Those underground levels were later reinforced by Hamas and used as a starting point for further tunnel building. When Hamas was the elections in 2005, the hospital was a scene of major battle between Hamas and Fatah and many Fatah supporters were thrown off the roof of the hospital by Hamas. In addition, Hamas fired 600 doctors from the hospital as "Fatah sympathizers". For a while the hospital only existed thanks to the international donations and support. And here's the most interesting fact - for years Israeli doctors would come to Shifa hospital for consultation, Israeli doctors were performing up to 50 surgeries/month in Shifa. The last surgeries took place at the end of September. Oh, these genocidal Israelis...

[Taxi]

8 minutes ago, Super19 said:

The ministry revised their numbers to 471.

American intelligence has it to as high as 300.

 

It'd be nice if there were more journalists there, wouldn't it?

 

Also, what do you say about the unverified reports of the 40 beheaded babies that Israel claimed, which was the biggest talking point.

 

Lol. It wasn't 471. It wasn't 300. And Israel didn't cause the blast at the hospital. The blast occurred in the parking lot and may have killed a few dozen people at most and was almost certainly caused by an errant PIJ rocket.

 

Israel never even claimed 40 beheaded babies. What happened was a soldier said he saw dozen of dead babies and beheadings. A reporter then misinterpreted the 40 beheaded babies line. Israeli officials said they could not confirm the 40 behaedings:

 

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/12/middleeast/israel-hamas-beheading-claims-intl/index.html

Quote

Israeli official says government cannot confirm babies were beheaded in Hamas attack

 

Even then, the initial reporter never said anything about 40 babies heads cut off:

 

Quote

Also Oct. 10, Zedeck posted on X that “one of the commanders told me they saw babies’ heads cut off.” Thirty-five minutes later, she posted again, saying “soldiers told me they believe 40 babies/children were killed.”

https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2023/hamas-behaded-babies-israel-unconfirmed-reports-spread/

 

Quite a bit different than the Hamas officials forcing doctors, at a press conference, to say 500 people had died at the hospital from an Israeli air strike.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Taxi

[RomanPer]

2 hours ago, Super19 said:

No one here is hating "the jews". 

And I've posted before Jewish people in America, a significant amount, criticising Israel's for their bad actions. 

Supporters of Israel need to understand that criticism of Israel is not critiscm of Jewish people.

 

I beg to differ. The same people who "don't hate the jews" here (lower case spelling from the source kept on purpose) are strangely quiet about atrocities against Muslim population perpetrated by other Muslims. It's only "the jews" that are special and require special "Anti-Israel" attention. No, no, it's not anti-Semitic at all, you are just against Israel. I said it before and I'll say it again - criticizing some Israeli policies is completely different from criticizing everything Israel does, no matter what the facts are. You may not even realize that, but trust me - it's anti-Semitic. I've been living on the receiving end of the anti-Semites (who say they are not anti-Semitic because they have a Jewish friend) my entire life. I don't need your agreement to know who you and moosehead and canuckle and a few others are in your hearts.

[Riddikulus]

Young people have always opposed innocent civilians dying in war, and older folks have always reacted by doing their best impression of the 'old man yells at cloud' meme. As much as things change, some things just stay the same no matter how much time passes.

[Bob Long]

1 minute ago, Riddikulus said:

Young people have always opposed innocent civilians dying in war

 

I think you need to check who does most of the killing in wars + young men 

 

1 minute ago, Riddikulus said:

 

and older folks have always reacted by doing their best impression of the 'old man yells at cloud' meme. As much as things change, some things just stay the same no matter how much time passes.

 

I think you just naturally see being too ideological as just as harmful as other things as you age 

[RomanPer]

1 hour ago, Super19 said:

The algorithms for our social media feeds must be different, because I am definitely seeing the opposite in effect.

And again, never before have I seen this many Jewish people speaking against the Israeli government, and if you just look, you'll see it too.

 

I think you are misunderstanding the "speaking against the Israeli government" part. People are unhappy with Bibi about the failure of security system, on top of their unhappiness with his blatant attempt at dictatorship with the Justice system reform. There aren't many Jewish people around the world who don't support an operation to get rid of Hamas. You are probably reading the signs wrong.

[Riddikulus]

3 minutes ago, RomanPer said:

I beg to differ. The same people who "don't hate the jews" here (lower case spelling from the source kept on purpose) are strangely quiet about atrocities against Muslim population perpetrated by other Muslims. It's only "the jews" that are special and require special "Anti-Israel" attention. No, no, it's not anti-Semitic at all, you are just against Israel. I said it before and I'll say it again - criticizing some Israeli policies is completely different from criticizing everything Israel does, no matter what the facts are. You may not even realize that, but trust me - it's anti-Semitic. I've been living on the receiving end of the anti-Semites (who say they are not anti-Semitic because they have a Jewish friend) my entire life. I don't need your agreement to know who you and moosehead and canuckle and a few others are in your hearts.

This argument reminds me of when the right wing reacts to outrage about police brutality against black people by talking about black on black crime. Whataboutism is never a convincing argument. 

[RomanPer]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

The far left are a lost generation...

 

 

 

They don't realize the effect it's having on their future employment. They might want to check who Bill Ackman is and what is the latest initiative that he's spearheading  

[Satchmo]

5 minutes ago, Riddikulus said:

Young people have always opposed innocent civilians dying in war, and older folks have always reacted by doing their best impression of the 'old man yells at cloud' meme. As much as things change, some things just stay the same no matter how much time passes.

I'm an old man and I've been yelling at the same clouds since about 1975.

 

Interesting take though.  Just not sure it fits.

[Riddikulus]

1 minute ago, Bob Long said:

 

I think you need to check who does most of the killing in wars + young men 

 

 

I think you just naturally see being too ideological as just as harmful as other things as you age 

I am not so sure that is true. Just look at the number of older folks down who gravitate to populists like Trump. It seems to me that as you age, you simply shift from one ideology to another.  

[RomanPer]

1 hour ago, Super19 said:

 

 

Oh, how conveniently the start of the conversation is edited off. Are you absolutely sure he's not talking about Hamas militants?

[Optimist Prime]

19 minutes ago, Super19 said:

 beheaded babies that Israel claimed, which was the biggest talking point.

Does it matter if they were shot, stabbed, dashed on the concrete, or beheaded? Is there different levels of outrage based on how babies were throttled or had their hearts cut out? I don't follow what you are trying to say here. 

[Taxi]

3 minutes ago, Riddikulus said:

I am not so sure that is true. Just look at the number of older folks down who gravitate to populists like Trump. It seems to me that as you age, you simply shift from one ideology to another.  

 

Priorities change. Young people don't have to worry about much. No kids. No mortgages. As you age you realize you have to take a more practical approach to life. People tend to vote less for the politician who says he's going to end world hunger and more for the guy who says he's going to keep taxes down and repair the roads. Unfortunately, A-holes like Trump exploit this with a bunch of rhetoric. We have no good options politically. Politicians on both sides have become obsessed with rhetoric, ideology, and conflict. No one even knows how to get anything done anymore.