Hamas attacking Israel

[the destroyer of worlds]

We're going to make little to no attempt to differentiate between civilians or "military" targets.

 

 

Tell me which group has been operating under that premise.  Hamas or the IDF.

 

Plenty of posters, including myself will point out that Hamas doesn't really care about civilians.  Yet, the few posters who will point out that the IDF has had a pretty horrible record as well get all kinds of negativity directed their way.  

 

Again, the IDF has the weapons, technology, military training that they COULD be a lot better in this regard, but are choosing not to.  I don't care what excuses you give, bombing refugee camps is NOT justified.  Indiscriminately firing HE tank rounds into buildings is not justified.

 

And just to be clear.  I want Hamas gone.  Israel should exist.  

 

I'm just one of the many that want Israel to do better.  

[RomanPer]

17 minutes ago, Super19 said:

I've seen way more manipulation from Israel tbh. From fake videos, flat out lies and propaganda. Imagine if Gazans did even 10% of the manipulation Israel is doing right now...

 

"From fake videos"? In plural? There was one video (which, by the way, I didn't post, since, the moment I saw it, I knew something was fishy about it, but the origin of it is still not clear; mentioning of the Israeli actress doesn't mean it was made by the Israeli government). One video of questionable source is a big reach to be converted into "videoS". And this is precisely how anti-Israeli propaganda works. Takes an occasional fact (sometimes unproven) and makes it into a full blown fact.

[Super19]

9 minutes ago, RomanPer said:

 

"From fake videos"? In plural? There was one video (which, by the way, I didn't post, since, the moment I saw it, I knew something was fishy about it, but the origin of it is still not clear; mentioning of the Israeli actress doesn't mean it was made by the Israeli government). One video of questionable source is a big reach to be converted into "videoS". And this is precisely how anti-Israeli propaganda works. Takes an occasional fact (sometimes unproven) and makes it into a full blown fact.

Yes that video makes one (israeli officials had retweeted it as a matter of fact).

 

2. The video of the guy claiming the hospital in Israel is being hit multiple times a day.

 

3. The video of the IDF pointing to paper on the wall saying these are names written by Hamas, when it turned out to be just a calender.

 

we are now in plural territory from just a few days of posts within just this thread.

 

Edited November 14, 2023 by Super19

[Super19]

Even that intercepted phone call from the "whodunnit" hospital strike didn't hold any credibility. If Israel didn't do that strike, why subject itself to suspicion by releasing a very shady piece of evidence at best.

[RomanPer]

10 minutes ago, Super19 said:

Yes that video makes one (israeli officials had retweeted it as a matter of fact).

 

2. The video of the guy claiming the hospital in Israel is being hit multiple times a day.

 

3. The video of the IDF pointing to paper on the wall saying these are names written by Hamas, when it turned out to be just a calender.

 

we are now in plural territory from just a few days of posts within just this thread.

 

 

2 - you are incorrect, hospitals in Israel are being targeted, including Barzilai hospital in Ashkelon. Israel recently made a decision to cut funding on the external propaganda and stopped trying to convince people like you (what's the point, really?).

3 - do you read Arabic to be 100% sure what was written on that calendar?

10 minutes ago, Super19 said:

Even that intercepted phone call from the "whodunnit" hospital strike didn't hold any credibility. If Israel didn't do that strike, why subject itself to suspicion by releasing a very shady piece of evidence at best.

 

Sorry, "didn't hold any credibility" - is that based on your professional opinion? If so, what are your credentials to claim that the audio call was a fake?

[King Heffy]

3 minutes ago, RomanPer said:

 

Sorry, "didn't hold any credibility" - is that based on your professional opinion? If so, what are your credentials to claim that the audio call was a fake?

This is a person who considers Jackson Hinkle to be a credible source.

[RomanPer]

13 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

This is a person who considers Jackson Hinkle to be a credible source.

 

Exactly...

[4petesake]

2 hours ago, stawns said:

 

If the mass killing of innocent civilians isn't genocide, what is it?

 

Honest question- Would you consider  ‘Little Boy’ and ‘Fat Man’ as genocide?

[Mike Vanderhoek]

3 hours ago, stawns said:

 

If the mass killing of innocent civilians isn't genocide, what is it?

 

Its semantics. Most here simplistically look at population growth stats and say you are wrong.

 

It is what is happening but as its just ongoing, slowly while Israel expands territory and destroys Palestinian life versus simply wiping them all out, we must use a different term.

 

 

[Satchmo]

Harsh Visuals of War Leave Newsrooms Facing Tough Choices

 

Digital disinformation and restrictions on photojournalists have complicated decision-making about the visual chronicle of the Israel-Hamas war.

 

Gruesome photographs of Palestinian children killed in rocket strikes and Israeli infants murdered by terrorists. Digitally doctored images that whip around social media before they can be verified. Accusations — since rejected by multiple news outlets — that photojournalists had advance knowledge of the Hamas surprise attack on Oct. 7.

 

The visual chronicle of the war between Israel and Hamas has become its own disturbing case study of the age of disinformation, when photographs, and the act of photojournalism itself, are weaponized by both sides of a highly charged conflict. For newsrooms in the United States and Europe, the question of which images to publish — and which are too graphic or misleading to be published — has rarely been more complex.

 

“Typically, we really avoid publishing imagery that’s distributed by any kind of state-run agency, because we can’t verify the journalistic integrity of those types of images,” said Meaghan Looram, director of photography at The New York Times. “We’re also always very mindful that any particular state or government has an agenda in the images that they are distributing.”

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/14/business/media/israel-hamas-media-photography.html

 

[moosehead]

Heartbreaking to see the good people of Gaza , Iran ,and Israel saddled with such horrific extremist governments.....

 

Heartbreaking....

Edited November 15, 2023 by moosehead

[moosehead]

29 minutes ago, Satchmo said:

Harsh Visuals of War Leave Newsrooms Facing Tough Choices

 

Digital disinformation and restrictions on photojournalists have complicated decision-making about the visual chronicle of the Israel-Hamas war.

 

Gruesome photographs of Palestinian children killed in rocket strikes and Israeli infants murdered by terrorists. Digitally doctored images that whip around social media before they can be verified. Accusations — since rejected by multiple news outlets — that photojournalists had advance knowledge of the Hamas surprise attack on Oct. 7.

 

The visual chronicle of the war between Israel and Hamas has become its own disturbing case study of the age of disinformation, when photographs, and the act of photojournalism itself, are weaponized by both sides of a highly charged conflict. For newsrooms in the United States and Europe, the question of which images to publish — and which are too graphic or misleading to be published — has rarely been more complex.

 

“Typically, we really avoid publishing imagery that’s distributed by any kind of state-run agency, because we can’t verify the journalistic integrity of those types of images,” said Meaghan Looram, director of photography at The New York Times. “We’re also always very mindful that any particular state or government has an agenda in the images that they are distributing.”

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/14/business/media/israel-hamas-media-photography.html

 

 

I first thought you were referring to Israel IDF killing Journalists.... 37  so far...   Hamas killed 4 in their terror attack.....

 

 

 

According to the Committee to Protect Journalists, the Gaza-Israel war has been the deadliest conflict for media workers since the organisation began counting statistics in 1992.

 

At the time of writing, the committee said at least 39 journalists and media workers had been killed in the month since the war began. Reporters Without Borders

 

https://thewire.in/media/palestine-gaza-israel-journalist-media

Edited November 15, 2023 by moosehead

[Satchmo]

2 minutes ago, moosehead said:

 

I first though you were referring to Israel IDF killing Journalists.... 37  so far...   Hamas killed 4 in their terror attack.....

 

 

 

According to the Committee to Protect Journalists, the Gaza-Israel war has been the deadliest conflict for media workers since the organisation began counting statistics in 1992.

 

At the time of writing, the committee said at least 39 journalists and media workers had been killed in the month since the war began. Reporters Without Borders

 

https://thewire.in/media/palestine-gaza-israel-journalist-media

Well no, as  you can see, I wasn't.

[moosehead]

Great news... about  time...  Profiting from killing  innocent civilians is pretty sickening....

Canada is also complicit........

 

 

US President Biden sued for ‘complicity’ in Israel’s ‘genocide’ in Gaza

Federal complaint calls for an end to the US’s $3.8bn in annual military support to Israel.

 

The president of the United States and two of his cabinet members are being sued for failing to prevent and aiding and abetting “genocide” in Gaza.

 

A federal complaint (PDF), filed on Monday against President Joe Biden, Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin, accuses them of “failure to prevent and complicity in the Israeli government’s unfolding genocide”

 

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/11/14/us-president-biden-sued-for-complicity-in-israels-genocide-in-gaza

Edited November 15, 2023 by moosehead

[Super19]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-israel-gaza-civilians-1.7028376

 

Finally! This is huge. A step in the right direction for our PM and our country.

 

"Price of justice cannot be the continued suffering of all Palestinian civilians,' PM says"

 

"Prime Minister Justin Trudeau is urging Israel to use "maximum restraint" to protect civilian life in the brutal war it is waging on Hamas in the Gaza Strip."

 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Super19

[Super19]

4 hours ago, RomanPer said:

 

2 - you are incorrect, hospitals in Israel are being targeted, including Barzilai hospital in Ashkelon. Israel recently made a decision to cut funding on the external propaganda and stopped trying to convince people like you (what's the point, really?).

3 - do you read Arabic to be 100% sure what was written on that calendar?

 

Sorry, "didn't hold any credibility" - is that based on your professional opinion? If so, what are your credentials to claim that the audio call was a fake?

2- source please. Show me the hospitals that are being hit multiple times daily in Israel

 

3- no I don't but it's been thoroughly debunked online from people that do speak Arabic. That IDF soldier in the video that Israeli officials released, clearly didn't speak Arabic and/or lied right through his teeth.

 

This reeks of propaganda as well.

[Elias Pettersson]

She was murdered CTV, why can’t you just admit that?  Our media is just as bad as Hamas propaganda…

 

 

[Satchmo]

4 minutes ago, Super19 said:

3- no I don't but it's been thoroughly debunked online from people that do speak Arabic. That IDF soldier in the video that Israeli officials released, clearly didn't speak Arabic and/or lied right through his teeth.

 

Regarding the calendar as per the NYT:

 

Monday’s video included footage of a piece of paper taped to a wall in the hospital’s basement. Admiral Hagari said the paper — a grid with Arabic words and numbers within each square — could be a schedule for guarding hostages “where every terrorist writes his name.”

 

The paper included a mark that appeared to be an illegible signature, but did not seem to otherwise include people’s names — the Arabic words were days of the week and numbers underneath dates. The Gazan Health Ministry said in a statement that the paper, including days and dates, was nothing more than “a regular work shift timetable, a standard administrative practice in hospitals.”

 

The ministry, however, failed to address one key detail: The calendar begins on Oct. 7, the day of the Hamas terrorist attack on Israel, and an Arabic title written at the top uses the militants’ name for the assault: “Al Aqsa Flood Battle, 7/10/2023.”

[Super19]

3 minutes ago, Satchmo said:

Regarding the calendar as per the NYT:

 

Monday’s video included footage of a piece of paper taped to a wall in the hospital’s basement. Admiral Hagari said the paper — a grid with Arabic words and numbers within each square — could be a schedule for guarding hostages “where every terrorist writes his name.”

 

The paper included a mark that appeared to be an illegible signature, but did not seem to otherwise include people’s names — the Arabic words were days of the week and numbers underneath dates. The Gazan Health Ministry said in a statement that the paper, including days and dates, was nothing more than “a regular work shift timetable, a standard administrative practice in hospitals.”

 

The ministry, however, failed to address one key detail: The calendar begins on Oct. 7, the day of the Hamas terrorist attack on Israel, and an Arabic title written at the top uses the militants’ name for the assault: “Al Aqsa Flood Battle, 7/10/2023.”

Just like that entire video the IDF posted, they are asking for a lot of jumps to be made.

 

Why cant the IDF show clearcut footage of tunnels, and the claims of what, 50k Hamas soldiers... how about sending a few videos of some of them dead? Isn't this what Israel is trying to do? All I'm seeing is a destroyed Gaza and these poor innocent Palestenians being destroyed. 

[Alflives]

23 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

She was murdered CTV, why can’t you just admit that?  Our media is just as bad as Hamas propaganda…

 

 

Seems like there are some people here (Canada) who don’t realize Hamas, in their own charter, would murder us all if they had their way. Anyway the IDF will soon eliminate Hamas. Then we will see (IMHAO) the western world invest a great deal in Gaza and build up the region. We will see a bright future for the people there. But the evil that is Hamas must be eliminated first. And that will happen. It’s just a matter of a little while longer. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Alflives

[Ilunga]

 

 

 

 

 

[Satchmo]

6 minutes ago, Super19 said:

Just like that entire video the IDF posted, they are asking for a lot of jumps to be made.

 

Why cant the IDF show clearcut footage of tunnels, and the claims of what, 50k Hamas soldiers... how about sending a few videos of some of them dead? Isn't this what Israel is trying to do? All I'm seeing is a destroyed Gaza and these poor innocent Palestenians being destroyed. 

I don't know.  All I had was a bit on the calendar -  which people are free to believe to disbelieve.   I found it interesting enough to post.

[Super19]

Just now, Satchmo said:

I don't know.  All I had was a bit on the calendar -  which people are free to believe to disbelieve.   I found it interesting enough to post.

Yes, I did know about the header to the calendar as well. Could only assume as to why thats stated - there could be a bunch of reasons. But the IDF soldier in that video lied about what he saw on that paper and used it to manipulate... reeks of propaganda. It seems to me that Israel is going through a lot of lengths for propaganda for sympathy? Social media points? They're clearly not being precise and accurate. As for the Palestinians, one just needs to see the destruction they see, no propaganda needed. None of us on here is spreading messages from Hamas... which at this point, really what's the difference between a message from Hamas and a message from Nentanyahu? One is a terrorist? Which one? The one that brutally kills innkcent people? ... which one? Even Israelis aren't trusting in Nentanyahu right now as he is fighting for his political life.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Super19 said:

Yes, I did know about the header to the calendar as well. Could only assume as to why thats stated - there could be a bunch of reasons. But the IDF soldier in that video lied about what he saw on that paper and used it to manipulate... reeks of propaganda. It seems to me that Israel is going through a lot of lengths for propaganda for sympathy? Social media points? They're clearly not being precise and accurate. As for the Palestinians, one just needs to see the destruction they see, no propaganda needed. None of us on here is spreading messages from Hamas... which at this point, really what's the difference between a message from Hamas and a message from Nentanyahu? One is a terrorist? Which one? The one that brutally kills innkcent people? ... which one? Even Israelis aren't trusting in Nentanyahu right now as he is fighting for his political life.

Thread title. “Hamas attacking Israel”. 
Hamas did terrible things on October 7. There is no justification for what they did. Now the IDF is eliminating Hamas. Only after Hamas is eliminated can Gaza be free. 

[Super19]

Just now, Alflives said:

Thread title. “Hamas attacking Israel”. 
Hamas did terrible things on October 7. There is no justification for what they did. Now the IDF is eliminating Hamas. Only after Hamas is eliminated can Gaza be free. 

Are they?  Where are the destroyed tunnels under Gaza, holding tens of thousands of dead Hamas? I see Gaza being flattened and thousands of innocent Palestenians dead tho.