(Trade) Sam Lafferty to Vancouver

[aGENT]

22 minutes ago, stawns said:

Are those numbers untrue?  Why is looking at the real picture "hating".  I have nothing against Boeser, I just don't think he's anywhere near worty the money or the opportunity he gets.  It's nothing personal.

 

Never mentioned anything about "hating".

 

You're entitled to your opinion. Like I said, there's a few of you on here.

[stawns]

Just now, canuck73_3 said:

Garland hasn’t even scored 25 goals. If he could do that maybe he’ll get a pp shot 

Boesers only done that twice, and not since 2018-19

[canuck73_3]

2 minutes ago, stawns said:

Boeser is a 45-55 point guy, who doesn't really play a very well rounded game .......that's what he is, in the real world.  He had a solid rookie season and that was fun to watch, but that was the outlier, not the norm

Only knock on Boeser is health if healthy he’d easily be a 60-70 point player. 
 

Garland is a 40-50pt player MAX. 
 

Boeser is a 55pt player in 70 games. 

[canuck73_3]

Just now, stawns said:

Boesers only done that twice, and not since 2018-19

2>>>>>0 

[aGENT]

13 minutes ago, stawns said:

I'd be fine with moving AB, no question......I think that'll happen closer to the tdl when he might have some value.

 

Their points are nearly identical as it stands now.  Over the last two seasons Boes has 101 points and Garland has 98

 

Yup, roughly equal points... While one guy was watching his father die a slow, painful death and the team was in utter disarray... Okie dokie.... Lol

[stawns]

1 minute ago, canuck73_3 said:

Only knock on Boeser is health if healthy he’d easily be a 60-70 point player. 
 

Garland is a 40-50pt player MAX. 
 

Boeser is a 55pt player in 70 games. 

And Garland can stay healthy.  

[stawns]

Just now, aGENT said:

 

Yup, roughly equal points... While one guy was watching his father die a slow, painful death and the team was in utter disarray... Okie dokie.... Lol

So what?  How many excuses are you going to lay out there?  At some point, people have to face the reality of who he is as a player.  

[aGENT]

Just now, stawns said:

So what?  How many excuses are you going to lay out there?  At some point, people have to face the reality of who he is as a player.  

I have, a better player than Garland, who wants to be here. 

[canuck73_3]

2 minutes ago, stawns said:

And Garland can stay healthy.  

And still be outscored by Boeser 

[wai_lai416]

40 minutes ago, stawns said:

I'm not sure I'd say he produces much......46 and 52 points isn't much for the $ they gave him.

His ppg is good closer to 65 points a season if the season ain’t shortened or if he just somehow stays healthy. Injury is luck and it’s part of the game some people can stay injury free their entire career and some people gets injured easily. I take 50 points against good competition over 50 points against garbage team. Take out garlands first year in Vancouver hot streak in April. He was trending 35ish points. Can boeser improve? Sure he can improve his production just by staying healthy and play 82 games 

[Dizzle]

 

54 minutes ago, stawns said:

Boeser is a 45-55 point guy, who doesn't really play a very well rounded game .......that's what he is, in the real world.  He had a solid rookie season and that was fun to watch, but that was the outlier, not the norm

 

Why do you always post numbers without acknowledging context? There’s a world of difference between a guy who has injury issues and puts up 45-55 points in 65-75 games and a guy who plays a full season and puts up that many points. Both have strengths and weaknesses but that context is masssssssively important. 

 

Beyond that…

 

rookie season 17/18: .89 ppg

18/19: .81

19/20: .79

20/21: .875

21/22: .65

22/23: .74

the rookie season wasn’t as much of an outlier as the 21/22 one was. Take away those two and he sits at .80 a game, leave them and he’s at…. Wait for it .79. 

 

over the course of an 82 game season the difference is….. roughly 1 point. 
 

pro rated to an 82 game season his numbers would be (for the sake of a little bit of context)

 

17/18: 72

18/19: 66

19/20: 64

20/21: 71

21/22: 53

22/23: 60

 

Now, if you want to argue that injuries are an issue, great; you’d be right. But the ‘he’s a 44-55 point guy and that’s the end of the discussion’ schtick is just that. It lacks context that’s incredibly important to the discussion.

For the record it would be equally asinine for someone to only ever say, ‘Brock is a .78/.79 point per game player’ without being able to recognize his absence from the lineup means those points don’t ultimately translate into 60+ points every year. 
 

There’s a tension that exists with players like Brock (guys who have injury issues) that needs to be acknowledged from both ends. 

 

[Tusk]

8 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

 

This struck me as inaccurate and I was looking for something to distract me from my surprise tax bill, so I decided to do my own research. I went through every roster and looked at the salary of the 4th highest paid D (including IR, but not LTIR) then I calculated the mean and median averages.

 

Justin Barron got the short straw with a measly 925k. Brady Skjei wins this week's jackpot, taking home a whopping 5.25m (though it’s probably worth mentioning only 50k separates Carolina’s 2nd and 4th highest paid D). Other notable names include Luke Schenn’s 2.75m retirement fund and Guddy’s crazy 4m contract. Across the league the median is $2.925m and the mean is $2.846m. Skej is the only player in the league paid above the bottom end of your estimate for low end 2nd pair, with some guy called Chris Tanev coming a distant second on exactly $4.5m.

 

It's also worth noting the salaries tend to drop off quite a lot after 4th. You'll have to do your own calculations for the mythical 5/6 who can play top 4, but I'm pretty confident it will be a lot less than Soucy's $3.25m.

 

Because I’m a lot of fun at parties, I did the same calculation for the 2nd highest earners on every team. Only Trouba, Hedman, and McDonagh earn over $6.5m. Lindholm comes in at exactly $6.5m as do Faulk and Krug, though they’re paid the joint most on St Louis and the same goes for Sanheim and Elis at Philly at $6.25m each. Spare a thought for Sean Durzi who, not only has to play for Arizona, but does it for chump change of $1.7m. Though he only came second because I broke my own rule and ignored Weber who is only not on LTIR or retired for pure cap shenanigans. The median of the 2nd highest paid D is $5.275m and the mean is $5.587m.

 

I realise this has turned into an excessively long post, the short answer is nope. I hope Soucy works out, partly because he’s definitely being paid top 4 money.

It should put in perspective that Schenn is a top four paid defense on another team, earning way less than Soucy. When Toronto put him up for grabs we should have made the offer. If we dont get the LTIR space for Soucy he better come back and Hit like a Schenn and pass like a Wolanin

[TNucks1]

is he playing tomorow?

[Biff Tannen]

8 hours ago, Tusk said:

It should put in perspective that Schenn is a top four paid defense on another team, earning way less than Soucy. When Toronto put him up for grabs we should have made the offer. If we dont get the LTIR space for Soucy he better come back and Hit like a Schenn and pass like a Wolanin

 

I dunno, I like Schenn and he was great considering the cap hit he had while here. But he's now 33 and earning 3x as much for 3 years, only 500k less than a 29 year old Soucy. It would've been great to bring Luke back as a 6/7 on league minimum, but he wanted to get paid and can't really blaim him.

 

That said I'm slightly nervous Soucy will turn into Poolman mk2, especially now he's injured before playing a game. Hopefully I'm just being pessimistic because I've been hurt before.

[Muscatel Marauder]

Adding more detail to his podcast where he noted the Edmonton Oilers and Toronto Maple Leafs had been in trade conversations this past week, Elliotte Friedman reported in his written 32 Thoughts column that it was the Toronto Maple Leafs who reportedly had their eyes set on moving Sam Lafferty to Edmonton. 

According to Friedman, the proposed deal Toronto pitched would have seen Vincent Desharnais heading to Toronto. Not only was this a strategic move by the Maple Leafs to free up some crucial cap space, but the Leafs were trying to move an expendable forward for a big, physical defenseman — something they badly need.

Lafferty, while a valuable asset, had become a piece the Leafs could afford to move due to the team’s evolving roster dynamics. What they didn’t have was a big man on the blue line like Desharnais.

[DeNiro]

8 minutes ago, Muscatel Marauder said:

Adding more detail to his podcast where he noted the Edmonton Oilers and Toronto Maple Leafs had been in trade conversations this past week, Elliotte Friedman reported in his written 32 Thoughts column that it was the Toronto Maple Leafs who reportedly had their eyes set on moving Sam Lafferty to Edmonton. 

According to Friedman, the proposed deal Toronto pitched would have seen Vincent Desharnais heading to Toronto. Not only was this a strategic move by the Maple Leafs to free up some crucial cap space, but the Leafs were trying to move an expendable forward for a big, physical defenseman — something they badly need.

Lafferty, while a valuable asset, had become a piece the Leafs could afford to move due to the team’s evolving roster dynamics. What they didn’t have was a big man on the blue line like Desharnais.

“Evolving roster dynamics” 

 

What a spin!

 

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by DeNiro

[BC_Hawk]

13 hours ago, aGENT said:

 

Yup, roughly equal points... While one guy was watching his father die a slow, painful death and the team was in utter disarray... Okie dokie.... Lol

Not trying to come off un-empathetic, but that was a good reason in 21/22, not last season. He is an NHL player; he needs to get it together if he wants to remain in the league. Lots of players play the night of losing a family member; it is their job. If I tworked subpar for 2-3 years with a sick parent, I would get fired.

Edited October 11, 2023 by BC_Hawk

[BC_Hawk]

13 hours ago, canuck73_3 said:

Only knock on Boeser is health if healthy he’d easily be a 60-70 point player. 
 

Garland is a 40-50pt player MAX. 
 

Boeser is a 55pt player in 70 games. 

Garland could surpass that number IF he played with consistent larger line mates in the Top 6. His talent is through the roof...he is just short.

 

Boeser, big guy that plays with no intensity. Used to have a great shot....it disappeared in 21/22....was MIA last year too. Hopefully it was his wrist injury, but I doubt it. Every shift looks like a pregame skate for him.

[N4ZZY]

15 hours ago, canuck73_3 said:

Only knock on Boeser is health if healthy he’d easily be a 60-70 point player. 
 

Garland is a 40-50pt player MAX. 
 

Boeser is a 55pt player in 70 games. 

 

Yea, that's true. Garland's career high is 52 points. With that being said, though, major difference is that Garland was a 5th round selection, while Brock is a former 1st round pick. Expectations are different for the players. It's like for Virtanen when he was drafted. Had he been drafted in the 2nd round, hell, even in the third round, nobody would have complained. But because he was a 1st round pick, expectations for him to perform is over the moon, and he never lived up to his selection sadly. 

 

[N4ZZY]

2 hours ago, BC_Hawk said:

Garland could surpass that number IF he played with consistent larger line mates in the Top 6. His talent is through the roof...he is just short.

 

Boeser, big guy that plays with no intensity. Used to have a great shot....it disappeared in 21/22....was MIA last year too. Hopefully it was his wrist injury, but I doubt it. Every shift looks like a pregame skate for him.

 

I think Brock is what he is. If he's going to be a Canuck for life, he'll probably need to take a discount. I can see him moving to Minnesota to play eventually. Whether Minny wants him or not is another question entirely. 

 

[N4ZZY]

2 hours ago, Muscatel Marauder said:

Adding more detail to his podcast where he noted the Edmonton Oilers and Toronto Maple Leafs had been in trade conversations this past week, Elliotte Friedman reported in his written 32 Thoughts column that it was the Toronto Maple Leafs who reportedly had their eyes set on moving Sam Lafferty to Edmonton. 

According to Friedman, the proposed deal Toronto pitched would have seen Vincent Desharnais heading to Toronto. Not only was this a strategic move by the Maple Leafs to free up some crucial cap space, but the Leafs were trying to move an expendable forward for a big, physical defenseman — something they badly need.

Lafferty, while a valuable asset, had become a piece the Leafs could afford to move due to the team’s evolving roster dynamics. What they didn’t have was a big man on the blue line like Desharnais.

 

In other words, they got ripped off by Allvin. 

 

Because the Leafs didn't even get what they badly needed - a big, physical defenseman in return. lol. Jokes on them. 

 

[tas]

garland is a classic tweener without a role. he's an offense-only player who doesn't reliably produce offense. he's not good enough for the powerplay, can't kill penalties, can't hit, can't check, can't defend. 

 

he's mason raymond only worse, because raymond could kill penalties. 

[Goal_thecup]

I'd trade Garland and Beauvillier for another Lafferty.

[canuck73_3]

7 hours ago, BC_Hawk said:

Garland could surpass that number IF he played with consistent larger line mates in the Top 6. His talent is through the roof...he is just short.

 

Boeser, big guy that plays with no intensity. Used to have a great shot....it disappeared in 21/22....was MIA last year too. Hopefully it was his wrist injury, but I doubt it. Every shift looks like a pregame skate for him.

Garland's career high in points is 3 less than "plays with no intensity" Boeser scored last season.

5 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

 

Yea, that's true. Garland's career high is 52 points. With that being said, though, major difference is that Garland was a 5th round selection, while Brock is a former 1st round pick. Expectations are different for the players. It's like for Virtanen when he was drafted. Had he been drafted in the 2nd round, hell, even in the third round, nobody would have complained. But because he was a 1st round pick, expectations for him to perform is over the moon, and he never lived up to his selection sadly. 

 

Draft placement is meaningless once you're in the league for 5+ years. 

[Tusk]

3 hours ago, canuck73_3 said:

Garland's career high in points is 3 less than "plays with no intensity" Boeser scored last season.

Draft placement is meaningless once you're in the league for 5+ years. 

Geez i am loving this game for all the Garlund and Brock haters out there.

Like i always said, Garlund is like a little mouse.....

Boeser always gets open for the pass.