[PGT] Canucks vs Oilers - Oct 11

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

But you’re wrong. Our full roster with everyone is cap compliant. 

 

No it's not, Allvin is just hoping Bettman forgot to check.

[DrJockitch]

We are cap compliant with current roster because of emergency recall rule. 
We couldn’t call anyone up through regular channels because of a couple things if I have this right. First and most important is that Soucy and Blueger’s injuries weren’t serious enough to put them on IR to get cap relief to call someone up. In the process of getting as close to the cap as possible (the right thing to do to accrue maximum cap space) we called up Podz so that his bonus would be under the current cap and he would be available for call up later in the year and this put us in a brief bind because of the two non-serious injuries. 
We are allowed to call up Studnicka on emergency basis because we played last game short a player and did not have cap space to call a player up through regular channels. Player has to be under something like $875k.  I would think Edmonton has likely done the same though haven’t been watching their roster. 
Teams don’t get fines for not being cap compliant because they are not allowed to submit rosters or make transactions that take them out of compliance.  They have been fined and given serious penalties for attempting cap circumvention but that is different. 

[LaBamba]

3 hours ago, TheGuardian said:

 

Soon just making the playoffs will be a reason to plan a parade and another 10 years of "almost there"

 

This isn’t a troll this is a fan that looks at things differently than others. I tend to agree with this narrative.
 

I hope that the new forum protects the people who make valid arguments against the grain. What ends up happening is everyone groups up to assault these opinions and feed off each others upvotes. It seems they have full clearance from mods to get “personal” with someone who has a negative attitude towards the team. The person with the negative view ends up defending themselves against 9 different people’s quick little 1 liners or memes, falls into a trap and gets banned. 
 

This team doesn’t have a fraction of organizational depth to make it through the season and a deep run into the playoffs. The only way this team succeeds this year is with nearly zero injuries and vez caliber goaltending. 
 

the reason why Canadian teams haven’t won a cup in the salary cap era is because they’re pressured to emerge from their rebuilds too early. Toronto/Edmonton did this too early, Ottawa looks like they’re emerging too early, we are likely going to emerge too early.

 

We have an emerging, incomplete core. We will now shift to giving up futures for depth and to patch the holes. Those 2-7th round picks everyone hawkishly attacks when someone complains about trading them are what build you organizational depth for FREE. 
 

This organization will win a Stanley Cup when management learns how to tune out the noise, build their team through the draft and put their pens in their pockets on July first. 

[aGENT]

9 hours ago, Tusk said:

I mean, read the room buddy

Did Soucy REALLY look like he got hurt?

 

9 hours ago, Tusk said:

Personally I would love the whole roster to play, Mik with Petey and Kuz would be awesome.

 

A full Defense without AHL guys would be awesome.

 

I am just trying to point out why we cant have everyone we currently have. 

 

We're actually better off without any injuries as then we don't need to add additional recalled players and account for their added cap (though Studnika is an emergency recall, so counts as zero cap, which is nice).

 

Mik, Soucy and Blueger are all included in our cap hit as none are in LTIR, and we're compliant with them on the roster. Injured or not. Well have a better, deeper roster with them healthy, that's is actually more cap compliant as we'll be able to send Hirose back down.

[Bob Long]

5 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

This isn’t a troll this is a fan that looks at things differently than others. I tend to agree with this narrative.
 

I hope that the new forum protects the people who make valid arguments against the grain. What ends up happening is everyone groups up to assault these opinions and feed off each others upvotes. It seems they have full clearance from mods to get “personal” with someone who has a negative attitude towards the team. The person with the negative view ends up defending themselves against 9 different people’s quick little 1 liners or memes, falls into a trap and gets banned. 
 

This team doesn’t have a fraction of organizational depth to make it through the season and a deep run into the playoffs. The only way this team succeeds this year is with nearly zero injuries and vez caliber goaltending. 
 

the reason why Canadian teams haven’t won a cup in the salary cap era is because they’re pressured to emerge from their rebuilds too early. Toronto/Edmonton did this too early, Ottawa looks like they’re emerging too early, we are likely going to emerge too early.

 

We have an emerging, incomplete core. We will now shift to giving up futures for depth and to patch the holes. Those 2-7th round picks everyone hawkishly attacks when someone complains about trading them are what build you organizational depth for FREE. 
 

This organization will win a Stanley Cup when management learns how to tune out the noise, build their team through the draft and put their pens in their pockets on July first. 

 

how many players does a team have to draft vs trade and free agent signings. Whats the necessary mix to build a contending team? 

 

[PhillipBlunt]

10 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

This isn’t a troll this is a fan that looks at things differently than others. I tend to agree with this narrative.
 

I hope that the new forum protects the people who make valid arguments against the grain. What ends up happening is everyone groups up to assault these opinions and feed off each others upvotes. It seems they have full clearance from mods to get “personal” with someone who has a negative attitude towards the team. The person with the negative view ends up defending themselves against 9 different people’s quick little 1 liners or memes, falls into a trap and gets banned. 
 

This team doesn’t have a fraction of organizational depth to make it through the season and a deep run into the playoffs. The only way this team succeeds this year is with nearly zero injuries and vez caliber goaltending. 
 

the reason why Canadian teams haven’t won a cup in the salary cap era is because they’re pressured to emerge from their rebuilds too early. Toronto/Edmonton did this too early, Ottawa looks like they’re emerging too early, we are likely going to emerge too early.

 

We have an emerging, incomplete core. We will now shift to giving up futures for depth and to patch the holes. Those 2-7th round picks everyone hawkishly attacks when someone complains about trading them are what build you organizational depth for FREE. 
 

This organization will win a Stanley Cup when management learns how to tune out the noise, build their team through the draft and put their pens in their pockets on July first. 

While I don't agree with your total assessment of the team, your opinion is valid and you have every right to it without needing to deal with some posters ganging up on you. I don't see any trolling here.

[Alflives]

11 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

This isn’t a troll this is a fan that looks at things differently than others. I tend to agree with this narrative.
 

I hope that the new forum protects the people who make valid arguments against the grain. What ends up happening is everyone groups up to assault these opinions and feed off each others upvotes. It seems they have full clearance from mods to get “personal” with someone who has a negative attitude towards the team. The person with the negative view ends up defending themselves against 9 different people’s quick little 1 liners or memes, falls into a trap and gets banned. 
 

This team doesn’t have a fraction of organizational depth to make it through the season and a deep run into the playoffs. The only way this team succeeds this year is with nearly zero injuries and vez caliber goaltending. 
 

the reason why Canadian teams haven’t won a cup in the salary cap era is because they’re pressured to emerge from their rebuilds too early. Toronto/Edmonton did this too early, Ottawa looks like they’re emerging too early, we are likely going to emerge too early.

 

We have an emerging, incomplete core. We will now shift to giving up futures for depth and to patch the holes. Those 2-7th round picks everyone hawkishly attacks when someone complains about trading them are what build you organizational depth for FREE. 
 

This organization will win a Stanley Cup when management learns how to tune out the noise, build their team through the draft and put their pens in their pockets on July first. 

We just crushed the Smelly Soilers and made Crysaitle and McWhiner sob like baby whiners. And we were playing without injured players and Demko was sick. 
Our team is great! 105 points this season. 
Them is the facts. Now bow to Alf’s empties. 

[Rip The Mesh]

Our owner needs to cough up for a practice facility, Big Time! It is so terribly over due. The cost in the Vancouver

local area  proper, will be immense. Not sure he's got the balls inclination to spend that dough, but it needs to happen.

 

It would make a tremendous difference. All that is needed would be there for the players and the coaches,

trainers, all of it.  That's a huge step towards a better team..

 

[LaBamba]

51 minutes ago, Bob Long said:

 

how many players does a team have to draft vs trade and free agent signings. Whats the necessary mix to build a contending team? 

 

You need an ABUNDANCE of assets, not just enough to ice a team. When some of these players graduate to lucrative contracts, a gun isn’t held to your head because you already have players on ELC’s waiting in the pen. You can take these pending RFA’s and cash them in for holes in your organizational depth, or futures if you cannot leverage them into your cap. 

48 minutes ago, Alflives said:

We just crushed the Smelly Soilers and made Crysaitle and McWhiner sob like baby whiners. And we were playing without injured players and Demko was sick. 
Our team is great! 105 points this season. 
Them is the facts. Now bow to Alf’s empties. 

Positively and reality are 2 very different things. Congratulations on the upvotes though. 

[Huggy Bear]

4 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

You need an ABUNDANCE of assets, not just enough to ice a team.

 

Can you quantify that to support your opinion?

 

How will you know when the Canucks have the right amount of depth at each position?

[Gurn]

" It takes an army"

[WSAcanuck]

7 minutes ago, Huggy Bear said:

Can you quantify that to support your opinion?

 

How will you know when the Canucks have the right amount of depth at each position?

You can never have enough assets. What you don’t need you use to get what you need. 
 

No idea why anyone is arguing that point. It’s been a main reason the Canucks have been trash for a decade. 

[Bob Long]

6 minutes ago, WSAcanuck said:

You can never have enough assets. What you don’t need you use to get what you need. 
 

No idea why anyone is arguing that point. It’s been a main reason the Canucks have been trash for a decade. 

 

oh there's many reasons we've been trash my friend.

 

Its just an idea I see a lot, that we don't have enough drafted players. I agree this current team is short on some talent and depth. But I don't necessarily agree that we have to wait to draft it all to get there.

 

We have a top pair d, 1C and (probably) top tier goalie. We have an excellent 2C in Miller. We have some good support pieces.

 

Why can't this group complete a contending lineup next year when a lot of cap opens up?

 

[Goal_thecup]

25 minutes ago, Huggy Bear said:

Can you quantify that to support your opinion?

 

How will you know when the Canucks have the right amount of depth at each position?

I'll try:  (otherwise known as "I'll shove my foot in my face now")

First off, you need an AHL team (check).

 

Then you need, per team:

G: 3 

Dee: 8

F: 12

So, 6 goalies, 16 defensemen, and aWhoppingly Yuge 24 artillery systems forwards.

 

That's nice and handy in Abby; I haven't considered the SHL etc.

 

Edited October 13, 2023 by Goal_thecup
unwanted emoji and now I can't spell..

[Inkidu]

27 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

You need an ABUNDANCE of assets, not just enough to ice a team. When some of these players graduate to lucrative contracts, a gun isn’t held to your head because you already have players on ELC’s waiting in the pen. You can take these pending RFA’s and cash them in for holes in your organizational depth, or futures if you cannot leverage them into your cap. 

Positively and reality are 2 very different things. Congratulations on the upvotes though. 

 

In sports, positivity creates reality.

[Huggy Bear]

9 minutes ago, WSAcanuck said:

You can never have enough assets. What you don’t need you use to get what you need. 
 

No idea why anyone is arguing that point. It’s been a main reason the Canucks have been trash for a decade. 

Who’s arguing that?
 

Someone just said we aren’t going to succeed until we have an abundance of assets. I’m just curious if thats something they can quantify.

[LaBamba]

13 minutes ago, Huggy Bear said:

Can you quantify that to support your opinion?

 

How will you know when the Canucks have the right amount of depth at each position?

When they can replace what they have organically. 
 

How we can be one of the worst teams in the league over the last 10 years and be at the bottom of the league in organizational depth? Its absolutely mind boggling. 

The reason is ownership/management is pressured into emerging from a rebuild as soon as you draft the framework of your core.
 

We were in an odd situation. When we drafted Hughes/ EP40 (our franchise players) we didn’t have an abundance of draft picks in their age group. As they emerged, we didn’t have anyone developing at a slower pace to join them when they hit their prime. So we are in this constant cycle of backfilling with un drafted UFA’s or bottom six forwards/D men on July first. 

This is what gets us into perpetual cap problems.
 

All this staying competitive nonsense yielded nothing. We protected these players from nothing. They still learned how to lose, and we surrendered their potential future teammates in draft picks for plugs that came and went for nothing.
 

Now because we’ve wasted the better part of a decade spending as much as Tampa bay with Buffalo results. There is no turning back now. We have to hope we hit home runs on the little draft picks we keep. We have to hope our team stays at near perfect health. We have to hope Demko plays lights out. 

[Bob Long]

1 minute ago, LaBamba said:

When they can replace what they have organically. 
 

How we can be one of the worst teams in the league over the last 10 years and be at the bottom of the league in organizational depth? Its absolutely mind boggling. 

 

 

 

 

[PhillipBlunt]

1 minute ago, LaBamba said:

When they can replace what they have organically. 
 

How we can be one of the worst teams in the league over the last 10 years and be at the bottom of the league in organizational depth? Its absolutely mind boggling. 

The reason is ownership/management is pressured into emerging from a rebuild as soon as you draft the framework of your core.
 

We were in an odd situation. When we drafted Hughes/ EP40 (our franchise players) we didn’t have an abundance of draft picks in their age group. As they emerged, we didn’t have anyone developing at a slower pace to join them when they hit their prime. So we are in this constant cycle of backfilling with un drafted UFA’s or bottom six forwards/D men on July first. 

This is what gets us into perpetual cap problems.
 

All this staying competitive nonsense yielded nothing. We protected these players from nothing. They still learned how to lose, and we surrendered their potential future teammates in draft picks for plugs that came and went for nothing.
 

Now because we’ve wasted the better part of a decade spending as much as Tampa bay with Buffalo results. There is no turning back now. We have to hope we hit home runs on the little draft picks we keep. We have to hope our team stays at near perfect health. We have to hope Demko plays lights out. 

Do you think this is more of the Aquilinis not having the appetite for a rebuild? Or is it more of a Canadian team issue? I do see depth growing in the prospect pool. It's not huge, but better than it's been. As well, Alvin has made some choices/trades that have brought in impact players like Hronek. 

[LaBamba]

1 minute ago, Bob Long said:

 

 

 

 

Fundamentally, what has changed?  We replaced Jim Benning with Swedish Jim Benning. 

[LillStrimma]

11 hours ago, Canuckle said:

 

And Bennings!!

 

Pettersson, Hughes, Demko, Boeser, Miller, Garland (for now), Hoglander, Podkolzin, Giraffe

 

Most the major core pieces all still came from our dearest friend, Jim Benning.

 

Benning had eaten too much pizza and drunk too much wine… Role models only apply.

Look at the honest approach by the new management and coaches.

The old isn’t worthy to be their servants.

And that mirrors the players on theice.

Bad morale, bad ethics…

[Bob Long]

3 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

Fundamentally, what has changed?  We replaced Jim Benning with Swedish Jim Benning. 

 

Our pro scouting is based in actual performance and good contracts.

[Alflives]

31 minutes ago, Huggy Bear said:

Can you quantify that to support your opinion?

 

How will you know when the Canucks have the right amount of depth at each position?

This is a great question. 
I’m pretty sure Vegas had only one drafted player on their Cup winner. Their key guys were traded for (using picks and prospects) or signed as UFAs.

Tampa’s two recent Cup winners had great D. But they only drafted one of those D. The other D were either traded for or signed as UFAs.

 

 

[Inkidu]

2 minutes ago, LillStrimma said:

Benning had eaten too much pizza and drunk too much wine… Role models only apply.

Look at the honest approach by the new management and coaches.

The old isn’t worthy to be their servants.

And that mirrors the players on theice.

Bad morale, bad ethics…

 

3 minutes ago, LillStrimma said:

Benning had eaten too much pizza and drunk too much wine… Role models only apply.

Look at the honest approach by the new management and coaches.

The old isn’t worthy to be their servants.

And that mirrors the players on theice.

Bad morale, bad ethics…

 

Not working creates bad morale so weekdays here are pretty grim. 

[PhillipBlunt]

4 minutes ago, LaBamba said:

Fundamentally, what has changed?  We replaced Jim Benning with Swedish Jim Benning. 

I think that Alvin has been more methodical in building a team. Benning never seemed to have a solid idea as to the type of team he wanted to build and paid way too much for players whose impact didn't match their salary.